Are any with you in duality relationships?

[redbaron]

sorry...

I was laughing cause I have an SEI friend married to an EII. They are indeed rather wimpy in many ways.

[Banana Pancakes]

Yes.

SEIs and EIIs are far-and-away the wimpiest types in the socion.

[Creepy-male]

[dinki]

*Hug*

(I'm hugging a lot lately. I might need physical contact... Hmm... Where is Se when I want it? )

The original question....
I've had a lot of SLEs close to me in my life.

My sister is SLE, I have had 2 SLE boyfriends and my son is SLE. With my sister it was a constant battle during childhood. Ugh. We were MEAN, and NOBODY could hurt me as she did. Now, we are really, really close, though.

The SLE boyfriends were all comfortable and everything was good, but it kind of was so comfortable we just drifted apart. I think our minds needed development, and what was "perfect" for the Ego, got boring for the rest of us. But even breaking up was comfortable. Just "natural". No highs or lows, somehow. Hmmmm....

I think Socionics has one part right: For the Ego of a human being it IS comfortable to be with someone who is your dual. But a human being is SOOOO much more than an Ego, and to DEVELOP, you need a lot more than "comfort". To grow as a human being, you need someone to "work with", and I don't think that happens automatically with ANY human beings. In other words, a dual, just like any other type, must be "good for your personal development" - also for parts that are not Ego-related - if a relationship should last. That's linked to spirituality, intelligence, self knowledge, stage of development and a lot of other things that are not really covered by Socionics.

Rant warning:
Somehow Socionics ended up thinking the Ego is the most important part of a human being. It is increasingly irritating me. It's like buying a house and only look at the wall paper or the color of it to decide the value of it, as if what is inside the walls isn't important. "This blue house fits with the yellow one of the neighbour". "This red car will look good outside my white house." Argh. Facade thinking. Stupid. Urk. Yuk. Argh. Socionics doesn't work, cause it only talks about Ego functions. Socionics will never work, as it only scratches the surface of what a human being is. Socionics cannot work, as it sees personality as something "important", as if humans are an entity of individuality, while in reality, the real individuality is within us, and is constantly shifting and developping as we go through the course of life. We are not "like this", - we WERE "like that". How can people not SEE it??? Socionics is either too complex or too simplified. The more complex it explains outer actions, the more it projects internal processes onto the outer, and the more it makes us believe the Ego is what is important. It's the same thing that makes some people end up thinking status or beauty or money will make us happy. It is so utterly stupid. Extroverted science. Yuk. Argh. Idiots. (sorry) /end rant.

Awesome post! I totally agree, so damn true. Yes being with someone who meshes with your ego is important, but you need someone that is interesting and smart, who helps you grow and who is at least on par with you in the spiritual sense.
I get so caught up in this shit, I believe it so matters, but for fucks sake objectively it's not so important as I believe it to be. I wish I could rip out and smash up my belief system.
AWESOME POST BABY

[dinki]

I don't agree IEIs are wimpy. In my eyes, IEIs are among the stronger types. No SLE man I've met is tougher than I am. I might be "feminine", but I don't see how that is wimpy.

Word (now I am looking like a kiss arse, but whatever I like how you roll :wink, taking on a SLE is a slice of pie, I can own any one of them :wink:.
Sigma what are you chatting about? Maybe that is how you are, but it's not how I or my IEI friend are. Just because we aren't in your face BAM-I-WILL-FUCK-YOU-UP, like how many SLEs roll, doesn't mean we are 'wimps', we kick arse!

Oh yeah, people do always seem shocked by how tough we can be, gosh, just because we come across all sweet and lala, doesn't mean you can walk all over us, we can be the biggest bitches ever.

Oh yeah, I don't think how much of a wimp someone is, is type related lol.

[sigma]

Sigma what are you chatting about? Maybe that is how you are, but it's not how I or my IEI friend are. Just because we aren't in your face BAM-I-WILL-FUCK-YOU-UP, like how many SLEs roll, doesn't mean we are 'wimps', we kick arse!

Did I miss expressed something or people just don't pay attention. I said that IEIs man looking for "weak" women are wimpy NOT, and I feel the need to repeat that word, NOT all IEIs.

Also, since we are at toughness. I think SLE toughness is Karate/Kung Fu toughness. IEI toughness is more like Aikido toughness.
SLE can hit and can take the hit. IEI doesn't like neither hitting nor being hit so, they blend with the blow, flowing with it, controlling it, directing it somewhere else.
Of course, I might be wrong.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[FDG]

Saying that an IxFx type is as "tough" as an ExTx is, of course, bullshit. It would defeat all the purpose of being an IxFx.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[Expat]

I've seen a SLE woman looking for a "true man", a macho type that would just f*ck her senseless and treat her more like she treats some of the men. She was so tired of these clingy types of men who just want to adore her. I thought to myself... that's so gonna to not work for her. She is one of the toughest, most independent women I know and she wants someone tougher.

I have known two SLE women who were with LSI husbands; that's probably not uncommon.

[Jarno]

socionics only takes information metabolism into account when determining someone's personality, when clearly factors outside of that is important when considering interpersonal compatibility.

Please tell me where Socionics sais that it explains everything about a relationship.

Since the sources that I've read, clearly do not claim this, actually take into account that age, future plans, and minimum physical attraction are also important factors. It are the people who misread socionics who claim that socionics overestimates things. Not the other way around.

[tiny_dancer]

I'm sort of with my dual right now. Things are at a 'pause' at the moment but not necessarily in a bad way.

Question: should the fact that there are so few successful dual stories in this thread (in a forum where most have known about socionics for some time) cause one to be somewhat baffled? (Either about the validity of socionics, or about the dating strategies of some of its adherents...)

The majority of my friends are dual couples. I'm a little older, though, and a lot of people have recently settled down and gotten married. They dated all sorts of people before they found their spouses. That being said, I know several activity and mirror, and a few semi-dual, illusionary, and supervisory. So far, the illusionary and supervisory seem to be the rockiest, but not necessarily unhappy. I think they love each other very much. They just have a lot of misunderstandings and tense moments. Not sure how those will play out over the next 20+ years. Other people have a far higher tolerance for fighting than I do.

[Jarno]

I don't think Socionics has it "wrong", but as I said, it only scratches the surface of what a person is. It's so limited, and it can't become anything but a theory of the conscious mind. Any attempts to make it explain more, is, imo, ridiculous, and then, it's sad that people spend so much time on making it sound important for humanity. It isn't. Unfortunately. Imo, socionics is a theory of only a small part of a human being - the conscious mind.

hmm, just to get things in the right perspective, which theory of psychology is more important for humanity and/or individuals?

You might have to high expectations about social theories. They will never reach the same detailed explanation level as natural sciences, but they don't need to. I would say a theory that helps you with great accuracy in your love life and your job choice like socionics does, is the KING of social theories.

[Jarno]

I am no specialist on pscyhology theories, unfortunately, so I don't know. My point is that Socionics is limited, and only explains a limited part of a human being, and will never manage to explain more than that. Socionics is not meant to explain more, by all means, and the conscious IS important, of course, as it is what we "consciously" know about ourselves, but it is only the tip of the ice berg. I find Socionics to be a VERY good theory for the conscious. Just don't forget that the ice berg is a lot bigger under the surface. That's my point.

i was a bit to late with editing my former post, so here's a copy and some additional info.

You might have to high expectations about social theories. They will never reach the same detailed explanation level as for example natural sciences, but they don't need to. I would say a theory that helps you with great accuracy in your love life and your job choice like socionics does, is the KING of social theories.

So you are right, socionics explains just some small part. But that's oke, for example we only need to know a small part of physics to let 5 billion people drive a car. Complete knowledge of something isn't that much of a gain.

[Ritella]

Yes! (Since 2 weeks ago.)
I'm really

[idolatrie]

I've seen a SLE woman looking for a "true man", a macho type that would just f*ck her senseless and treat her more like she treats some of the men. She was so tired of these clingy types of men who just want to adore her. I thought to myself... that's so gonna to not work for her. She is one of the toughest, most independent women I know and she wants someone tougher.

Sometimes I feel like that, but I don't know...I think an EIE could manage to do what I'm looking for.

There's so much more to attraction and relationships than psychological compatibility, though. Which I'm sure has already been said a hundred times in this thread, lol.

@ OP: I'm not in a romantic relationship with my dual. One of the most important relationships in my life is with my dual, though. I'm not dating my identical, but we're involved in something - some slow slide into dating - which I really do have to end, and soon, for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with socionics. But the last thing I want to do is talk to him about feelings, lol.

Yes! (Since 2 weeks ago.)
I'm really

Rock on, R!!!

[Jarno]

There's so much more to attraction and relationships than psychological compatibility, though. Which I'm sure has already been said a hundred times in this thread, lol.

yes, but...

if you would make a pie diagram of what factors involve a happy relationship, the biggest slice would consist of psychological compatibility as described by socionics.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[idolatrie]

yes, but...

if you would make a pie diagram of what factors involve a happy relationship, the biggest slice would consist of psychological compatibility as described by socionics.

Once you are in a relationship, sure, I completely agree. But in terms of getting into a relationship, that requires you to have compatible duals within your social sphere. Right now, I can't say that I know (and hence am in a position to date) any male EIEs whom I am compatible with in terms of age, relationship status, family background and direction in life.

So while dual relations make the most sense within the theory, it is very different to say 'you should only date your dual' in reality. I don't think that one is exclusively attracted to one's duals. That would imply a level of healthiness in relationships which I really don't think exists generally, lol. And sometimes it is worth balancing off and weighting other considerations with psychological compatibility, if overall it works for you.

[sigma]

I don't think that one is exclusively attracted to one's duals.

People are attracted to images. Most of the time it is an image of an ideal partner that somehow gets into one's head.

I think that duality in socionics translates to something like: the probability that the one before you meets the criteria of your image over time is higher and if they fail to meet your image, the way they fail might not hurt you all that much.

Also, if we pay a little attention to the other people studying relations we see something like this: “love is marked by the sharing of aid, comfort and acceptance.” (Seligman and Peterson)

The aid is way better from someone compatible; the comfort that a dual can create is of greater quality (not every type of comfort is perceived as comfort); as for the acceptance... again... socionics can provide clues.

If you take an imperfect compatibility where the 2 persons involved do take the time to understand the other and ACT in the direction of providing aid, comfort and acceptance, I think you will get dualization!

[redbaron]

I have known two SLE women who were with LSI husbands; that's probably not uncommon.

I know an SLE woman with an LSI husband. Together for 25 years.

[redbaron]

I just wanna say... most of you already know this but I am in a supervisory marriage (I'm the supervisor) now for 15 years, which some think to be one of the worst intertype relations and I LOVE my husband dearly. We have some occasional fights mostly revolving around a lack of Ti and I am heavily Se-seeking lately (and finding it with friends & producing it on my own) but overall it's pretty darn good and we love our life together. Before I married him, I dated IEI, SLE, SEI, EIE, ESI and SEE. And I still wouldn't trade him for any of those.

[Creepy-male]

My SLI uncle is married to an ESE.

So, you know, supervision marriages aren't that weird.

Unless you're an ILE and it "doesn't accord with reason"

[Kritik]

I've been married to a dual for 8 years. It didn't work for reasons beyond socionics, but it was great while it lasted.