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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Default Dual or Individual?

    the dual interaction seems to be the cause of the absence of the social complex. not danielle herself.

    but hey, just my opinion '-)

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    liveandletlive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    the dual interaction seems to be the cause of the absence of the social complex. not danielle herself.

    but hey, just my opinion '-)
    i can see what u mean by this, but idk if there were more Fe-valuers there if this would still hold water.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    the dual interaction seems to be the cause of the absence of the social complex. not danielle herself.
    no. you're wrong. you're a moron. go away.

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    Thanks for sharing the material, niffweed. You can of course dismiss Jarno and me as much as you like, but at least I understand what you are talking about much better than you might think. What you describe confirms that you are an ILI, and it confirms that you have Asperger. If you want to read more about that phenomenon, here is a link that I personally like, written by a person who in many respects is rather similar to both of us: http://home.att.net/~ascaris1/index.html

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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    no. you're wrong. you're a moron. go away.
    if this is your way of dealing with people, then I might I know the reason why you have no friends '-)

    ofcourse socially inept is a nice excuse to justify insulting... IMO you're just an arrogant idiot.

    I happen to have experienced a lot dual interactions, and I can tell you, those things you describe, you would experience them with all SEE.

    So it's probably not just Danielle, it's a dual thing.

    Hope you understand this. probably not because of your inexperience.
    Last edited by Jarno; 02-16-2008 at 11:33 PM.

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    god what a moron.

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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    god what a moron.
    You see me as a threat because you try to devaluate me? '-)

    I'll try to see it as a compliment.

    please continue your life in denial.

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    what was irritating about rick was his constant focus on Si issues. for example, we moved from one restaurant to another because rick disliked the atmosphere of the first restaurant; the tables and chairs were green, red, and blue, and according to rick we had to leave because there were "too many primary colors." it was annoying how he kept caring about his surrounding environment. but it was tolerable.
    Heh, I guess I was lucky then, since Rick seemed to like the places I picked, both in London and Duesseldorf.

    Something else -- I confess I'm at a loss at the point Jarno is making. The way I see it, niffweed's goal was to present a truthful, accurate description of his experiences in Boston, and as they relate to his life experiences so far. The interactions with Danielle were particularly worthy of reporting and so report them he did. So far, it is not even necessary to include socionics analysis one way or the other -- that can come later, if at all.

    Sure, socionics does provide an explanation as to why, precisely, niffweed felt particularly comfortable when interacting with Danielle, and since they had been both independently typed as ILI and SEE, it confirms that socionics works -- unless they were consciously "forcing themselves" to be comfortable around each other as in "gee, this person is my dual, I have to be comfortable around him/her" - a notion that I mention to illustrate its ridiculousness.

    But, be that as it may, I find Jarno's comment to be a bit of a stretch. The way I see it, he's essentially dismissing the relevance of Danielle and niffweed as individuals, and saying that it would have been exactly the same with any dual. That does sound to me a bit of a stretch. For instance, was reyn_til_runa feeling exactly the same way and interacting the same way as niffweed to Danielle to everyone else? Is every interaction with a dual exactly the same? Do individual personalities and circumstances play no role?

    It seems to me that niffweed's point was:

    "I had this interesting experience to report, with a particular person; this may provide useful information for socionics".

    And then Jarno:

    "The particular person was not important. It would have been exactly the same with any other SEE".

    I see that as two views (and I stand corrected if wrong, but then I'd like to ask why it is wrong):

    niffweed: "I met a person, Danielle, and she happens to be SEE which helps to explains our interactions".

    Jarno: "You met a SEE, which explains everything. She happens to be a person called Danielle, but that's not important".

    Is this an unfair analysis?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Sure they do.

    But I'm referring to the effects that he describes, which are the result of being with his dual.

    But Niffgod is making an error to adress these effects to an individual, instead of "a dual".

    For example:

    "Interacting one-on-one with Danielle was as comfortable as it was for two main reasons. One of these reasons is that Danielle is a highly kind, trustworthy, individual. The other reason... she took the initiative"

    So I just wanted to point that out.
    You do realize that not all ESFps are highly kind and trustworthy, no? This interaction could have taken place with a kind and trustworthy XXXx. It is perfectly reasonable to emphasize the individual over type.
    “Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage.”
    ― Anais Nin

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    It is perfectly reasonable to emphasize the individual over type.
    Not in this context. For example, if Danielle would have been an ESE, niffweed would not have felt as comfortable as he did. In that case the type would have been more important than the individual, at least after a couple of hours. That is inevitable.

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    I think in order to feel that comfortable, she needed to be at least a compatible type, and a dual worked very well for that obviously. But I don't think a person would be equally comfortable with any dual. A dual with very strong and contrary political or religious beliefs, etc., wouldn't be that great a match no matter what types the people are. They'd just argue very effectively.
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    Creepy-Diana

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    .

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    wow this is the most retarted, useless thread i think i've ever read. first of all to anyone who cares- r u kidding?!?!?!?!
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