SEI-ILE duality relations discussion, stories and examples (ENTp and ISFp)

[cracka]

I do not like going out either. It is nice to see things once in a awhile but I like staying home better. Going out makes me tired and if I spend a day off out I do not feel I really I had a day off.

I'm the total opposite. If I stay in on a day off I always feel like I wasted it...lol Unless of course I spent it with someone else that I actually like being around, then it's ok.

[Creepy-bg]

I don't like to drink either... but I really like hanging out in dark smokey bars when I'm high. As long as there isn't anybody around who's too rediculously drunk (actually as long as they're funny I don't care. But when people get depressed or angry drunk I need to leave)

[Blaze]

ISFp's are shy and will probably never make the first move. So if anyone is to date one they need to make their feeling known to the ISFp and be the aggressive one. So just be straight forward. There may be some gender differences as woman can play hard to get or be unsure. I do not like groups so I would not be hanging out in one as was described. I prefer one on one interaction.

I am not encouraging ISFp-ENTp romantic relationships however. I do believe socionics is true in describing relationships. Most people are hoping for the perfect relationship but that does not exist. I do not believe dual romantic relationships are the best. Dual relationships balance our weak and strong personality characteristics and since both ISFp and ENTp are easy going they can enjoy each others company. But that is best for platonic relationships at best if one can put up with being opposites with them in every other way. I believe ISFp's are better off with someone more feeling like an ESFJ. I believe an ISFp will be lacking the feeling side of the relationship with an ENTp. And will not like their analytical side. I find most ENTP's writing hard to understand and boring or rough. To me a romantic relationship is centered around feelings which is the ENTp's weak point. Sure the ISFp can bring feelings into the relationship but will feel burnt out not getting enough back in return. Well, that is my opinon. Every person is different. I think 2 ISFp's get along great but neither one will ever make the first move.

hey isfpman, i remember you! hope things are goin well.

do we think a lot of isfp's look at it this way? could this be a reason why it's so hard for me to even see my dual anywhere? is this why i usually get into relationships with beta types instead?

[redbaron]

I do not like going out either. It is nice to see things once in a awhile but I like staying home better. Going out makes me tired and if I spend a day off out I do not feel I really I had a day off.

I'm the total opposite. If I stay in on a day off I always feel like I wasted it...lol Unless of course I spent it with someone else that I actually like being around, then it's ok.

Right. You know, my husband also likes to go out, but here's the thing--once you're with someone you love, you don't always have to be going out and especially when you know that the person you're with (in his case, me) doesn't like going out or doesn't have the energy, then you learn to strike a healthy balance. I think that age helps too. I'm more likely now to actually want to go out occasionally than I used to be and he's more likely to want to stay in than he used to be. Maybe we've mellowed with age. Like BG, I don't feel like I've had a restful day off unless I've had time to myself. Quiet.time.without.the.kids. So if we go to the zoo as a family, that doesn't count. Too loud, too much energy, too much stimulation!

[mikemex]

I have a close friend who is ISFp, a girl. I've been spending huge amounts of time with her lately and I think that I've figured her out already.

For those who say that ISFp doesn't like to cook, that's a half truth. They don't particurarily dislike cooking, what they dislike is doing it for nothing. They are rather lazy and if they are to feed themselves, they are likely to go out and eat in a restaurant. However, when you're a special person to them, they actually enjoy cooking, not for the cooking itself, but because they enjoy imaginating and observing you to enjoy what they did for you. And they have a really good taste for cooking, I tell you.

That they don't make the first move... that's not true. I met this girl and I didn't pay attention to her but she slowly drew me, by stubly calling my attention and such. Once she invited me to her home with the pretext of fixing her computer. I think she mistaked me for an ENTp because I was raised in a predominantly alpha family (INTj father, ENTp and ESFj siblings) and I'm an inventor and have intellectual interests and such.

I do, however, notice the partial duality frequently as we get along really well over Si/Ne things but not so good around Fe/Fi things. She doesn't value Te things at all and doesn't really enjoy my conversations about business plans and such. I don't value Ti that much, as it seems to me as a black-and-white-ish way of looking at the world that is simply unrealistic. Thing is, her Fe simply annoys me to hell and she ridicules my Fi at times.

But we still get along really well. I think that above functions and such the predominant factor for a friendship is the introversion-extroversion scale. Introverts live dull lives without extroverts and extroverts are empty without introverts.

[detail]

The answer to the question in the thread title seems to be: "Because you are someone who likes intimacy and she is not."

An important question it raises is: "Do you have a problem with being with someone who doesn't share your desire for intimacy?" because above everything that we can appreciate in someone, there is the way it can get to us for us to appreciate it, and if intimacy is the way for a person and is seen as to be avoided by another, then a complete connection will never be possible between the two individuals. Note that by intimacy, i refer to a a state derived from a trait found in the kind of people who don't seem empty when you're alone with them or talk about private, personnal things as opposed those who don't seem as much oriented towards the concept that "an individual lives at our core". There is a clear distinction between people who share this trait and people who don't and the question raised initially concerns this reality. It might not concern you though.

[Charismatik]

I encountered a guy who I'm fairly sure is my dual (ENTp), and although I've never held them to be the 'magical relationship' that some people assume, I'm disappointed. We seem to be on the same page about a lot of things and we communicate very well, but something is seriously holding me back from trusting this guy as a FRIEND.

ISFps hold their own rather humanistic values and adhere to them above all else . ENTps are known for being "crafty and sly", and bending their concept of morals through their reasoning quite often. These two things still hold very true for both of us, but even if I've typed one or both of us wrong, I'd still like some feedback on the general question.

This seems like a pretty major catalyst for an argument to me. Anyone care to shed some light on why two 'duals' have such a major stumbling block, and yet are expected to get along so well?

[Suomea]

I encountered a guy who I'm fairly sure is my dual (ENTp), and although I've never held them to be the 'magical relationship' that some people assume, I'm disappointed. We seem to be on the same page about a lot of things and we communicate very well, but something is seriously holding me back from trusting this guy as a FRIEND.

ISFps hold their own rather humanistic values and adhere to them above all else . ENTps are known for being "crafty and sly", and bending their concept of morals through their reasoning quite often. These two things still hold very true for both of us, but even if I've typed one or both of us wrong, I'd still like some feedback on the general question.

This seems like a pretty major catalyst for an argument to me. Anyone care to shed some light on why two 'duals' have such a major stumbling block, and yet are expected to get along so well?

That's sad to hear. I normally view many ENTps as slightly more moral in practice then other types so I hope that you don't view this of all ENTps. I think that ENTps are known for more being harmlessly 'crafty and sly' or crafty and sly in defense of morals normally at least in my mind. ENTps like things where no one gets hurt and really don't want to hurt anyone. (At least this is referring to me) I'm not sure many would call me immoral and I think most people view me as the opposite of that, so hopefully I'm not completely blind to something about myself or something. That being said, no ones perfect. Anyway hope that helps, just my viewpoint.

P.S. I don't know anything about the guy you're talking about so I have no clue whether he is ENTp or not. If you want to see something of an ENTp being crafty and sly watch this....



He's deliberately trying to dumb himself down while the guy in the bow tie tries to get him to use Se arguments and he refuses to. He keeps everything at a Ne level the whole time. This really frustrates the guy in the bow tie I think.

[Suomea]

P.P.S. I think that John Stewarts passive aggressiveness on the show would initially make an ISFp gasp, but it would be something that they would eventually accept. Much like I feel John Stewart would move more towards an ISFp if they said that he needed to be nicer.

[Suomea]

I think this is true, but in conversation and demeanor I would not say many would view us as moral.

Hmmmm..... well it would definitely depend on the person viewing. I think the first thing that people would say about me is that I'm very warm on first contact but with a bite if you cross me. I normally gain people's trust pretty quickly I'd say. I do think that people view me as moral for the most part and look to me for moral guidance a lot of the time. I like to do 'bad' things from time to time, but only when there is almost no chance of anyone getting hurt which isn't always.

I've tried to debate a lot against myself being ENTp but most of the time fail. I always write this whenever I talk about myself as an ENTp, but I'd like to hear arguments in PMs from people who think that I'm not ENTp if they want to make that case. Always like to hear that kind of stuff.

[Suomea]

Yep.

I agree with this in the fact that around ISFps I try to be a nicer better person, but I'm not sure I understand the ruthless deliberate instincts part. Maybe I'm just missing something. Around ISFps I normally take more time in being a better gentler person and I push for a better world, but to push for morals and act immorally are kinda two different things. (is this me bending my morals btw...) Like when I'm around ISFps I want to make the world a better place for them.... when I'm not it's more like I'll just act in accordance with the morals which everyone should act with. Oh well.... I have no clue what I'm talking about anymore......

[Mediator Kam]

This is why I love John Stewart?

he's ENTP? omg lololol I love him.

I have noticed my dual is more civil when I am with him, but not really.

Maybe I'm defective.

[Steve]

Yeah Jon Stewart is definitely an ENTp.

[EllaC]

Any examples... i.e. celebrities, films etc? I need to know!

[xyz]

Me too

[EllaC]

Me too

Sweet!

Ideas people please!

[Elro]

Any examples... i.e. celebrities, films etc? I need to know!

Supposedly Quixote and Sancho were ILE and SEI respectively. I think Timon and Pumbaa could easily have been ILE and SEI (I'm less certain of Timon being ILE than I am of Pumbaa being SEI).

Socioniko description:
http://socioniko.net/en/1.3.rels/dual-1p.html

[ScanDave]

The tv show Spaced. You can find episodes on youtube.

[theMime.]

Supposedly Quixote and Sancho were ILE and SEI respectively. I think Timon and Pumbaa could easily have been ILE and SEI (I'm less certain of Timon being ILE than I am of Pumbaa being SEI).

Socioniko description:
http://socioniko.net/en/1.3.rels/dual-1p.html

meh i dunno about that description.

[ScanDave]

meh i dunno about that description.

The description does not hold much for our generation I think.

[Khola aka Bee]

[ScanDave]

Hahaha. I love cats!

[Khola aka Bee]

Dude, I didn't mean for you to take it that literally.

[Khola aka Bee]

UR DoiN iT WroNG!!

[ScanDave]

Dude, I didn't mean for you to take it that literally.

LOL. That is always my repsonse when I see kitties.

[xyz]

Explanation:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rgbtPmLY6uE

[xyz]

Yeah. it's a serious problem, don't belittle it.

[Creepy-bg]

lol

It WAS a horrible vegetable joke...

I hope it wasn't something about "dualizing" with a vegetable

[Creepy-bg]

Nah, talk of baby carrots made me feel bad about neglecting the other baby vegetables... and how much I enjoy them... and I wondered if it made me a foodaphile?

...Cause I like anything, baby.

that's hot

[Steve]

Any examples... i.e. celebrities, films etc? I need to know!

I know a lot of people have them typed differently, but in truth Pitt is Ne ENTp and Jolie Si ISFp (according to whatever theory accurately describes inter-type relations) - I mean seriously if you look at them its pretty freaking obvious that they're both Fe valuing. You can see Pitt's Fe emphasis like JRiddy and Jolie's Ti emphasis. Pitt is not Gamma. He's got the whole Ne-spaced out look going on, among other fairly noticeable Alpha NT signs. Jolie looks a lot like Claire Forlani who is also Si ISFp:

[JRiddy]

I mean seriously if you look at them its pretty freaking obvious that they're both Fe valuing. You can see Pitt's Fe emphasis like JRiddy and Jolie's Ti emphasis. Pitt is not Gamma. He's got the whole Ne-spaced out look going on, among other fairly noticeable Alpha NT signs.

Sweet, if only the ladies would realize how well I compare to Brad Pitt.

[ScanDave]

I agree Jolie is likely ISFp. But Pitt. Hmmm I was thought he was ENTj. On further inspectation of him valuing Fe, which I agee, I must reconsider. He does seem to value Fe. I'm Ti subtype so maybe that is why I have a hard time recognizing Ne subtypes as my identical.

[Steve]

Sweet, if only the ladies would realize how well I compare to Brad Pitt.

lol

[Steve]

I agree Jolie is likely ISFp. But Pitt. Hmmm I was thought he was ENTj. On further inspectation of him valuing Fe, which I agee, I must reconsider. He does seem to value Fe. I'm Ti subtype so maybe that is why I have a hard time recognizing Ne subtypes as my identical.

Yeah Ne subtypes are a bit different than us Ti subs.

This illustrates the difference between the Ti and Ne sub quite well:

Ben Stiller - Ti ENTp
http://www.reelzchannel.com/video/18...th-ben-stiller

Brad Pitt - Ne ENTp:

[Steve]

Here's another Ti ENTp

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/2105595/6625105

[JRiddy]

I've never thought that Ben Stiller would be Ti-ILE. I've never really thought about it that hard, but that kinda makes sense now, especially for his over-the-top roles, like Derek Zoolander or...



Anywho, I don't know how you concluded that he's ILE. I'm not saying it's a bad typing, but I just don't know how you got that. In respect to the topic of this thread, I don't get the impression that Christine Taylor is an SEI, but not all relationships or marriages have to be duals (apologies to Aushra).

[Logos]

The tv show Spaced. You can find episodes on youtube.

Good example.

Some have typically typed Brad Pitt and Ben Stiller both as LIEs, but Claire Forlani is most likely an SEI.

[JRiddy]

Good example.

Some have typically typed Brad Pitt and Ben Stiller both as LIEs, but Claire Forlani is most likely an SEI.

Stiller actually reminds me more of an LIE in his portrayal of his more neurotic characters. It's not that LIEs are all neurotic, but that his particular kind of anxiety always seems similar to some of my LIE friends, albeit in a more exaggerated way. I don't know if that has any impact on the actor's actual type. Maybe the anxiety thing is just something he learned from his dad...



I do think Pitt is an ILE, though. I agree with Steve that the Fe value is fairly obvious, and from what little I know of his personal life (Inner Monologue: Why are you trying to undermine your own point, idiot?), he seems to have a great fascination with the concepts behind the movies, and is much better at explaining them than most actors. He also appears to have more of a "boyish" charm than the more directed charisma that would likely characterize an attractive LIE.

Additionally, I'm not sure celebrity couples are all that often a good example of duality. The most highly publicized couples seem to break up a lot.

[ScanDave]

Incase you have not seen Spaced. Here is part of an episode.







The male lead (Simon Pegg) and female lead (Jessica Hynes) is a fine example of ILE/SEI duality. I find it eerily similar to the interaction I have with my female SEI friends.

[Rubicon]

Incase you have not seen Spaced. Here is part of an episode.

The male lead (Simon Pegg) and female lead (Jessica Hynes) is a fine example of ILE/SEI duality. I find it eerily similar to the interaction I have with my female SEI friends.

Yeah - I relate to how she acts. Unfortunately, I don't have any ILE friends , so I can't tell whether their interaction is typical.