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Thread: ESI-LII Superego Relations (ISFj & INTj)

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    Default ESI-LII Superego Relations (ISFj & INTj)

    I seem to get on well with ISFjs. A number of my friends seem to be ISFj, although my contact with them is not frequent.

    If you are INTj, how are your relations with ISFjs.

    Is it worth me starting a business with an ISFj? Are there more cons than pros, or vice versa?

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    it's hard to tell.

    INTjs and ISFjs don't get along too well supposedly, but there's always a thing called exception!!! i think it really depends on what business you two plan to get into. ideally, the business should let you two be responsible in areas you're good at. and i think the most important thing is on trust. do you trust him/her? my experience is that i can never quite understand certain types and thus, i can only see fakeness in them and thus, can never quite trust them.

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    As per my experience with ISFJs, you will face many issues when you start interacting more closely with them.Also you will feel irritated with their tendency to go into details.Also they are very soft hearted people and many not have guts to say no to someone

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    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    that's an isfp/esfj thing. isfjs will say no and do plenty of that estj "enough is enough!" stuff (which might be why they come off as istjs.)
    Agreed. But that applies mainly to sensory subtypes.

    In this forum there has been little discussion about subtypes, perhaps because we tend to think (with good reason) that if even a person's type is seldom -if ever - 100% certain, why complicate it with subtypes? And of course no amount of sub-sub-typing will ever describe each individual perfectly.

    Having said that, I think that in the case of ISFjs the difference between sensory and ethical subtypes is important.

    The apparent view that people have of ISFjs as "devoted housewife" and a person who needs stronger figures, if true at all, applies mainly to ethical subtypes.

    The sensory subtypes appear really like ISTjs or ESTjs in many ways, especially if you don't know them well. But ISTjs will in the end always emphasize logic in their arguments, while ISFjs will soon argue using principles and ethics. A problem is that a sensory subtype ISFj will often think s/he is being objective when s/he is not.

    And the sensory subtypes are the ones more likely to say "no" and stick to it.

    I have been given this a great deal of thought since I know a real, hard-core ISTj very well and had typed a woman as ISTj too - but the differences between the two were also there, until it dawned on me that she was ISFj sensory subtype. Then everything made sense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    My wife is definitely an ISFj sensory subtype, and I agree with your assessment. Another of my wife's friends is also probably an ISFJ sensory sub-type. They're like two of a kind almost.
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    in close relationships, from an intj standpoint they're hard to trust. in day to day interaction i don't think there would be much of a problem.

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    I don't think a Sensory subtype ISFj would get along well with an INTj because the ISFj would end up PoLR slapping the INTj with their and would find the INTj too passive. I'd think an ethical subtype ISFj would work with a generic (no subtype) INTj much better since they're not favoring their Se.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevENTj
    I'd think an ethical subtype ISFj would work with a generic (no subtype) INTj much better since they're not favoring their Se.
    I know one example of an INTj (not sure about subtype) guy with an ISFj ethical subtype woman. I agree with you. I think that in that case the INTj's huge know-it-all quality played a large role.

    They got married but I don't know how it worked out since we did not keep in touch.

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    Default IJ Superego

    this is kind of vague so i don't really expect responses but i'm just curious if my experiences are typical with people i type LII and also sorting out whether my dad is LII or LSI (or something else).

    how would you describe how superego relationships play out among people with IJ temperament?

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    LII will have superego with ESI. But it doesn't matter. It is very difficult. Very painful.

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    I am an LII and my mother is ESI. She is married to my father who is also LII.

    Superego pairs are totally unable to support one another. What one needs help with the other one ignores; what one excels at the other one avoids at all costs.

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    hm. my relationship with my lxi dad is not this bad at all.
    we used to be at eachothers throats, though, and it took awhile to reach an understanding. then again its a parent/child relationship.

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    Default LII interviewed by ESI

    Here's Professor Brian Cox (LII) being interviewed by an ESI:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Agreed. But that applies mainly to sensory subtypes.

    In this forum there has been little discussion about subtypes, perhaps because we tend to think (with good reason) that if even a person's type is seldom -if ever - 100% certain, why complicate it with subtypes? And of course no amount of sub-sub-typing will ever describe each individual perfectly.

    Having said that, I think that in the case of ISFjs the difference between sensory and ethical subtypes is important.

    The apparent view that people have of ISFjs as "devoted housewife" and a person who needs stronger figures, if true at all, applies mainly to ethical subtypes.

    The sensory subtypes appear really like ISTjs or ESTjs in many ways, especially if you don't know them well. But ISTjs will in the end always emphasize logic in their arguments, while ISFjs will soon argue using principles and ethics. A problem is that a sensory subtype ISFj will often think s/he is being objective when s/he is not.

    And the sensory subtypes are the ones more likely to say "no" and stick to it.

    I have been given this a great deal of thought since I know a real, hard-core ISTj very well and had typed a woman as ISTj too - but the differences between the two were also there, until it dawned on me that she was ISFj sensory subtype. Then everything made sense.

    I don't see so much of a difference between the subtypes except for stronger Ni or at least more emphasis on feeling and/or creativity on the side of Fi sbt. But I don't think I know anyone except for the 2 fellows on this site (one of which was lungs) I'd qualify as clearly Fi-leaning subt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amber View Post
    I don't see so much of a difference between the subtypes except for stronger Ni or at least more emphasis on feeling and/or creativity on the side of Fi sbt. But I don't think I know anyone except for the 2 fellows on this site (one of which was lungs) I'd qualify as clearly Fi-leaning subt.
    He is attaching personality to subtype (therefore to function).

    Of course there is *some* sort of relation, but not to the extent the user has themself believing. IE Ne does not stand for new ideas, ethical does not mean happy to be a housewife etc.

    The type of personality attaching to functions led to some unusual typings resulting in for instance someone can't be Delta because they are not peaceful. I didn't realise a quadra had that affect over personality, because it does not.

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    Bumping half a decade later.

    Assuming my type's correct, I tend to get on very well with ESIs, at least in general conversation, general differences in attitudes to life and such notwithstanding. Both ESIs and LIIs are polite and reasonably considerate (to the extent that they are able to think to be, in the case of LIIs), which each appreciates about the other.

    I haven't worked with any in long-term projects, though. In the context of a business, I don't know that I'd be entirely comfortable with any ESIs I know handling, say, money, or logistics, and not because I think F types are necessarily just bad at this kind of thing. I think the ESI should handle the "people" side of things, and the LII the paperwork.
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    Well, sometimes what you don't express is far more impolite than acting proper. (IMHO calling me absolutely disgusting douche bag is less bad than trying to cover it up). This is quite typical Ij stance in the end - the infamous anal retention. I suppose in shared household their toilet paper expenses are significantly lower than in others.
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    Superego are second to duals as far as working relationships go, but they're so much easier to start than duals because there's a significant amount of innate familiarly with each others behaviour. Duals tend to appear somewhat strange or foreign upon first meeting and some extra effort seems to often be needed to overcome this barrier. The weakness in ISFj-INTj relationships is that both partners need to operate independent of one another so communication can break down and they can grow apart especially when neither needs the other for survival or some other benefit; and of the rare few that I've seen fail, it's been the ISFj who runs away......

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    Whatever you do just be nice to the ISFj, or I will come after you. Thems my buddies for life.

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    I get along with LIIs reasonably well. Except one coworker I dislike and mistrust because I see him as opportunistic and untrustworthy. TiNe at its worst.

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