Autistm, neruodivergence and your experiences. Also for neurotypical's experiences of autism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKYATxJ3DpM\

Discrediting someone's whole based off of sometihng illogical.

It's what people say about narcissists do when they demean someone they've abused because they are hysterical, unstable, insane. Psychopaths aren't hysterical at all. My point here is people would much rather trust the psychopath unless we get to court, then its whoever cries more (which is easily faked too).
Narcs mirror what they learn based on how others treated them. Neurotypicals mistreat the autist because he is insane. Then he turns into a narcissist and returns the favor.

ILIs and IEIs linked to narcisissm.

About INFJs

• Visionaries, oriented toward contemplation
  
• Strongly linked to the Dependent personality
  
• Somewhat linked to the Depressive and Narcissistic personalities
  
• More common in women than in men

About INTJs

• Tenacious visionaries, oriented towards action
  
• Strongly linked to the Narcissistic personality
  
• Somewhat linked to the Schizotypal personality
  
• More common in men than in women

https://www.quora.com/Why-is-it-that...r/Bryan-Bone-1

Neurotypicals have a shorter fuse to anger. They don't care as much so their anger is also weaker at the same time they are willing to hurt you more because again, they don't care that much.

Most autistic's I've observed repress themselves while neurotypicals are much more willing to bully each other be that swearing hitting stealing or ruining the small things in your life.
Annoying petty squabbles that run constantly until someone gives up or a problem occurs where your enemy saves you. Or you get really messed up and now they treat you well. What was that all before about then?
You never anticipated that bad things could happen? Maybe they were even happening without your meddling to make it worse. Hypocritical, nonsense. It's all fine as long as you keep to maintain your delusions of being a good person.

My take:
These types are heavily visual oriented and they really absorb that information making all sorts of meanings. I suppose it might give somewhat lackadaisical meta focus and poor understanding of situational control hence there can be object permanence issues with inappropriate acting [linked to autism and lack of theory of mind]. If they stay on track too much it will give these sorts of issues.

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Neurotypicals have a shorter fuse to anger. They don't care as much so their anger is also weaker at the same time they are willing to hurt you more because again, they don't care that much.

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I know what you mean but you might be confusing 'neurotypical' with 'Karen' too much.

Karentypicals lolol.

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Originally Posted by BandD

I know what you mean but you might be confusing 'neurotypical' with 'Karen' too much.

Karentypicals lolol.

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you ever been around SLEs who aren't some weird enneagram like 4? They kill you over nothing. Other neurortypicals refused to do me favors after I did them favors and refused to help them the last time because they lost some of my items. Those were the most well behaved students in class with the highest grades. All top 2 Si function users.
They never yelled at me with real anger or threatened me with violence. Just one of them pressured me into playing game where u spread ur fingers and he tries not to hit them with a pen (a knife in movies). It's no big deal even he hits me but he slammed it hard on purpose. Couldn't refuse him because that's breaking the social norms. Not the only stupid trick he's pulled.

Another SLI stopped talking to an SLE for another stupid bs. Most SLIs are human garbage. I despise seeing their disgusting little faces. They are all covert low profile kind of Karens. Call them Alberts? I didn't want to bend to Karens so I became a Karen myself. Typical IEI story. Parents also throw tantrums back to their children because the parents feel as victims. So much for autistics lacking theory of mind.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

My take:
These types are heavily visual oriented and they really absorb that information making all sorts of meanings. I suppose it might give somewhat lackadaisical meta focus and poor understanding of situational control hence there can be object permanence issues with inappropriate acting [linked to autism and lack of theory of mind]. If they stay on track too much it will give these sorts of issues.

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I can't comprehend what you mean.

Visual is not accurate. They are overrepresented in musicians too. Or you mean the way (type) the guy is autistic in particular. In fact understanding of object permanence is what drives their behavior. Neurotypical synapses die off while autistic stay. Neurotypicals lie and forget. Similar to sociopathic detachment. Poor understanding of situational control is an incredibly vague term. You could have so many assumptions behind what you say which also contradict each other. (like he contradicts himself too, people like him is why I thought I wasn't on the spectrum. He is also proving simultaneously the way the diagnosis is conceptualized is plain wrong and suffers the same kind of irreconciled assumptions)

"really absorb that information making all sorts of meanings" directly contradicts his example of treating interactions like mathematical equations which even contradicts itself. He made assumptions about how things would go because he failed to absorb the information and see the all sorts of meanings, instead only seeing his immediate bias.
I did everything possible to avoid situations that would mess me up while he was blind to anticipating and curbing them (like other autistics I know). My narcissism is the direct conclusion of my efforts to not be abused.

Neurotypicals lack theory of mind just as much as most autistics do. Autistic actions are taken as lack of theory of mind because the neurotypicals don't have theory of mind and fail to understand them, at the same time project their own flaws on others. Like the guys who used me and then act as if I did something wrong which they now punish me for in my previous response to the thread.

Or the ILE sociopath treating me as if I'm toxic and should be punished, then not wanting to listen to understand me because it's too much, then being mad at me for telling him he is toxic because he is forcing me to abuse myself so that HIS autistic/sociopathic/neurotypical sensibilities don't get triggered by me being "inappropriate". I'm trying so hard to not judge people or just impuslively react as a victim to anything that happens and he is not willing to do the same for me, like most other neurotypicals. He also doesn't have to explain himself in depth because he has nothing but pure entitlement, he never had to think and change himself as a goal. That's no fun. He must have fun. Others don't matter. Only short term solutions until someone gets a stick too short then they deserve to get removed.
Logan Paul did to his dog for it's mistakes even what others didn't do to him for his mistakes.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

I can't comprehend what you mean.

Visual is not accurate. They are overrepresented in musicians too. Or you mean the way (type) the guy is autistic in particular. In fact understanding of object permanence is what drives their behavior. Neurotypical synapses die off while autistic stay. Neurotypicals lie and forget. Similar to sociopathic detachment. Poor understanding of situational control is an incredibly vague term. You could have so many assumptions behind what you say which also contradict each other. (like he contradicts himself too, people like him is why I thought I wasn't on the spectrum. He is also proving simultaneously the way the diagnosis is conceptualized is plain wrong and suffers the same kind of irreconciled assumptions)

"really absorb that information making all sorts of meanings" directly contradicts his example of treating interactions like mathematical equations which even contradicts itself. He made assumptions about how things would go because he failed to absorb the information and see the all sorts of meanings, instead only seeing his immediate bias.
I did everything possible to avoid situations that would mess me up while he was blind to anticipating and curbing them (like other autistics I know). My narcissism is the direct conclusion of my efforts to not be abused.

Neurotypicals lack theory of mind just as much as most autistics do. Autistic actions are taken as lack of theory of mind because the neurotypicals don't have theory of mind and fail to understand them, at the same time project their own flaws on others. Like the guys who used me and then act as if I did something wrong which they now punish me for in my previous response to the thread.

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In the moment
OK, let's say extremely localized thinking. It helps to pick up accurate notes as well. So this Object permanence of course refers to localized moment as well. If everything stays local then it can be a problem and of course it still creates occasional hiccups.

I have problems with too global thinking sometimes. It seems that I might look psychotic or something and focus is therefore hard. When mind bounces everywhere it makes you look very scatterbrained and you have no idea if you just saw a giraffe or a cat because it seems to be same aka a living organism.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

In the moment
OK, let's say extremely localized thinking. It helps to pick up accurate notes as well. So this Object permanence of course refers to localized moment as well. If everything stays local then it can be a problem and of course it still creates occasional hiccups.

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Extremely localized thinking, I think is just a form of cognitive dissonance and conceptual blindness. It's not a specifically autistic phenomenon, that's pretty much all neurotypicals (hence they lack theory of mind) and majority of autistics, as they are all my inferiors.

I would imagine people would appreciate a typology theme in this, but the thread is under psych/miscellaneous category…

I just can give my own experience with autism, having of it, and knowing some other people with autism…

For starters, as you already know, I am most likely the IEI, and EII is my alternative. With my life circumstances, and not being yet that old, it is possible to meet changeability in my type, given the prefrontal cortex is indicative of personality to a degree.. It has both inherent/genetic and environmental implications, the personality.

Jung and Victor Gunelko had linked Ni, mostly Socionics Ni (since Socionics is actually supposed to be closer to Jung’s original theory than is MBTI whereas DarkAngelFireWolf69 is a Model G Socionist)…

I have had a very hard time, with my autism. I think this is expected for most neurodivergent people.

I have faced serious abuse, including from my mother and father, some people on this forum already have seen how some of the emotional abuse is, but I never have really entailed the physical abuse, and I never have gotten into his terrorizing behavior.. I did briefly when I had replied to Tim, about this behaviors, to explain his enneagram 8 unhealthiness. Most of the abuse, of course, results from my autism— my parents thinking I can help the behaviors and thus viewing me as disrespectful, getting stressed out and just breaking, exploding, on me. Scapegoating me when the entirety of family has own issue (they were raised abuisively their own selves, and my sister gravely is ill) just because it is easier do with my autism, more conspicuous with its “symptomology”, since to neurotypical people, autistic behavior more so will be standing out.

I have never had a real friend. What I mean by “real” in this context, is never have had an in person one, or one in real life who saw me for who I was and had a genuine friendship bond. I had several people “look out for me”, and I tried make one other teenage girl aged as myself, my mother.. It was too much for her, and I did not let her report my father. She left me. I tried killing myself thereafter, devastated I lost what I could call the closest person to at all caring about me. I was screaming, shaking.. In the hospital bed (of the psych ward). And for hours nonstop.

I was bullied since seven, though more consistently beginning at 8, which also is age my father began in his overt abusing of me.. Ironic, when my autism diagnosis should have made him lesser abusive.. It made for the contrary. I guess he could not handle it. He wanted to hard to “fix” my autism, rid me of it… Did not want have special needs daughter.

My bullying had gotten so bad that a bully had plotted take my life at 13, and police made involvement. I also had when eleven, gotten choked at a park.. And in Cathdral Home for Children, my when sixteen, residential treatment center I was put in (beginning to fight my parents on their abuse back, and being violent and “out of control”, to them with pronounced suicidal gesture and attempts, sleeping with knife under my bed) I had gotten whipped with a belt by a roommate, and I got neglected and emotionally abused by staf, including by the therapist who broke my confidentiality in groups, and had groups revolving around me for my autistic behaviors (not knowing what I was doing wrong/disrupting the milieu because of theory of mind challenges) singling me out in the group where every peer would get say something about me, mostly negative they would have say, and sometimes other staff/youth workers would chime in. It made me detest psychotherapy, but that is not my only reasoning for the detest of psychotherapy. It is anyhow flawed. One hour a week on couch ain’t going do shit when your environment is issue, and they when a minor, the patient, will take to mostly parental account.

I never have really rebelled much against society, other than I have refused getting an ID since I had turned 18, to show I do not care for our government and its false conclusions.. But I when 16 1/2 and had come back from Cahedral Home, had lost almost completely, respect for my parents. It was inconsistent though, the trauma bond.. But it was sad, because my trauma had made me so afar from how my innate nature is functioning.. The internal self and self when away from them. I had been sexually abused as well, at 14, and a year-and-a-half ago, and the way my mother blackmailed me to not report it and she (ableist my unknowing of my sister’s molestration until I had faced it my own self from man), had taken me to same man even with my sister having weeks prior sharing her molest experience with Tony.

I have been persecuted online by some, for what they perceive as narcissistic, sociopathic and psychopathic behavior from me, with how I respond to my parents, and am as upfront about my life with my parents.. They don’t know anything about Beta values or anything, of course, and most of the complaining are delta and gammas, maybe fewer alphas.. It just is my style/value of handling my trauma, in regards to my personality, which any beta will understand, yet they deem it as attention seeking, trying break my parent’s reputation rather than just realistically handle my abuse, etc… And many through my autistic miscommunications, have taken wrong idea of me and made hasty judgment of me, thinking I was trying be rude, self-serving, abusive to them, when I just because of my lacking fluency in neurotypicals, did not understand how they would take me and to me, it was fine and not owing of anything that would make one misinterpret of me..

I first had been diagnosed at as an 8 year old, and continued diagnosed at 13, 15 and 16-17 (including 17).. And recently I got accepted under my local developmental disability services, which.. County funded programs are not best and they tend to not avert on the gifted ness that can accompany of autism, yet you also find the contrary in autistic community, where solely gifts make focal point. It need be balanced.

It is most certainly hard being autistic. It guarantees discrimination. People have meager understanding of its overall encompassing, both high and low functioning alike, yet even more so high. It is ten times harder to surmount trauma, with our autistic fixation and vivid memories, which is why I am near daily tormented by my past trauma, though some of it is current as well, like the videos I had shown of my father that had taken place in mid June (this year).

What is especially hard is that the shunning of you socially delays you, from the lack of experiences you face due to exclusion.. So you slag on social readiness and are behind more so, because experiences are half of what will mature someone, and we completely lack this component in most cases…And society anyhow once the stupid arbitrary number of 18 turns, for us to be acting more mature and able, when… We haven’t had the sunlight, water and soil to grow, and we anyhow demand to reach that height, without such resources which ultimately is impossibility.

And then it is hard, because we do have precocious intellectual onset. I had learned to at age 2, for instance, read. But my motor development later on occurred. I had issues presenting with my motor ability since infancy, yet my mother and father had missed signs. I crawled in weird way and it took me longer to be able craw well, but interestingly, I did learn how to walk relatively fast and once I got it my first time, I automatically was able do it.. But I had motor ability tested as an 8-year-old, and it still was slagged.. I did not outgrow wetting my pants completely until thirteen.. In contrast to neurotypical my age, I tested at a 7-year-old social-emotional capacity when nearly 12.. But, intellectually, I always have been far on ahead… Just feel behind in some matter because I never paid any attention at school and would doze off in daydream, leaving me behind in grammar and some math, but I immediately got them once I in my own time realized how it all works. I much better would have been off in home school and begged my parents for it.

I feel like in enneagram, autism will be more prevalent amidst those of us who are 4’s, and maybe 5 and 6’s..

4, 5, and 6 (an ascension of increase), will have childhood [patterns that are most often in an autistic one..

4: feeling misunderstood, as if no one ever could understand you, parents not understanding.. Being victimized repeatedly from the misunderstanding others of you, have.

5: neglected and left to own self, threats, but deals with by retreating and is left to be more independent than would be, 6.

6: repeatedly tormented and threatened in some way, and/or coddled… Babied, infantilized.

Autistic people also are at risk for internalization of issue (which had been my case and it had happened, to point it made me unable to take anymore and I just spit out anything that I could not handle once reached of my threshold, which may be why many perceive me as an EIE, Fe base, but I did not used to be this way, which was documented on my IEP. Matter of fact, it even says I have history of withdrawing:

(There is something wrong with the ability to upload pictures, so I am having do it with discord)
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...112/image0.jpg

May be interesting for @thehotelambush and @myresearch to see.

My point is internalization of issue would make sense all for withdrawn types, which I do feel 4 and 5 are more likely to be found in someone with autism, rather than an autistic person aside from 6, being different types. Maybe 1 also can bear correlation..

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Extremely localized thinking, I think is just a form of cognitive dissonance and conceptual blindness. It's not a specifically autistic phenomenon, that's pretty much all neurotypicals (hence they lack theory of mind) and majority of autistics, as they are all my inferiors.

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It is said that winners write the rules. So, what would happen if the vast majority of the humanity was autistic from the beginning? Would anyone survive if everyone is boxed? I'm going to guess that you want to make a contradiction but do not think in terms of black and white as I'm sure that some of the rules in the book were written by autistic individuals. Our functional reality is closer to a composite and it is important to realize it. I'm sure that there are individuals who are still extremely off the balance and that is not great.

(I also had bad experience with medical professional, one doctor telling my mother to medicate my food. I had somehow intuitively at 13, known it was bad for you, that synthetic feel goods to your brain and enforcing their staying in, is bad for your brain, counter to nature.. He convinced my mother to medicate my food with Lexapro when 14 and she did it for a few months and I eventually had found out after a major headache I had, that was severe and I thought I was dying because it was that severe and sharp, and abnormal, and my mother’s aura felt so guilty, I grew weary with suspicion and the next morning I had found on computer, her email open.. I in her sent, had found how she had told the special ed teacher about it, and to monitor my effects at school).. I instantly lost trust for her, and even more so I had, when she had sent me to Cathedral Home for Children in middle of night where I was taken out of my house at 3Am by youth transporters and forced to board two planes. One to Denver, a propeller to Laramie, Wyoming. That is when my secondary fix, my 6 behaviors, manifested.

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Originally Posted by Braingel

I never have really rebelled much against society, other than I have refused getting an ID since I had turned 18, to show I do not care for our government and its false conclusions.. But I when 16 1/2 and had come back from Cahedral Home, had lost almost completely, respect for my parents. It was inconsistent though, the trauma bond.. But it was sad, because my trauma had made me so afar from how my innate nature is functioning.. The internal self and self when away from them. I had been sexually abused as well, at 14, and a year-and-a-half ago, and the way my mother blackmailed me to not report it and she (ableist my unknowing of my sister’s molestration until I had faced it my own self from man), had taken me to same man even with my sister having weeks prior sharing her molest experience with Tony.

I have been persecuted online by some, for what they perceive as narcissistic, sociopathic and psychopathic behavior from me, with how I respond to my parents, and am as upfront about my life with my parents.. They don’t know anything about Beta values or anything, of course, and most of the complaining are delta and gammas, maybe fewer alphas.. It just is my style/value of handling my trauma, in regards to my personality, which any beta will understand, yet they deem it as attention seeking, trying break my parent’s reputation rather than just realistically handle my abuse, etc… And many through my autistic miscommunications, have taken wrong idea of me and made hasty judgment of me, thinking I was trying be rude, self-serving, abusive to them, when I just because of my lacking fluency in neurotypicals, did not understand how they would take me and to me, it was fine and not owing of anything that would make one misinterpret of me..

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Not because you lack fluency with them (Im assuming you are attempting to be honest with them). They are not misinterpreting. They genuinely do not care about us , each other or themselves due to being stupid and blind and it's not a neurotypical thing but most people thing. If you miscommunicated for real, if they cared to understand they would ask further questions to figure out how they should feel instead of making assumptions. A lot of other IEI's also think they miscommunicate and others misunderstand them, but they are actually narcissistic self absorbed and abusive, as you know from personal experience. This could also be true for you in some instances and you being blind to it.
Example could be ignoring my messages while trying to practice telepathy and suggestions because you think I'm crossing your borders and stealing your time and attention. Part my fault for not being able to order my thoughts and say everything concisely and figure out exactly what's relevant to you. I think your oversharing (superfically described) is an attempt to find others who would connect with you. I really think you need to read the book in my second to last message, as it is a matter of health and cognitive functioning, and in case you have I don't think you've understood some implications and the information is not full I need to tell you more. It's not about just a little bit of health, not about just a little bit of cognitive functioning and not about just a little bit longer life. It's not about specific particular case scenarios or rules that you get to just dodge the consequences off.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

It is said that winners write the rules. So, what would happen if the vast majority of the humanity was autistic from the beginning? Would anyone survive if everyone is boxed? I'm going to guess that you want to make a contradiction but do not think in terms of black and white as I'm sure that some of the rules in the book were written by autistic individuals. Our functional reality is closer to a composite and it is important to realize it. I'm sure that there are individuals who are still extremely off the balance and that is not great.

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Autism is not about boxes? Everyone would fare better if they were better it's how it works. A lot of autistics are stupid and don't deserve to breathe. The dumb ones who suck up to the majority get to write the rules, which, suck up, to, the, majority. You can have better, you can have worse, and you can be in the middle because thats how you think is not just "black and white". If there was no better and worse there wouldn't be any meaning or necessity in doing anything. Being gray is a false virtue.

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Originally Posted by Braingel

(I also had bad experience with medical professional, one doctor telling my mother to medicate my food. I had somehow intuitively at 13, known it was bad for you, that synthetic feel goods to your brain and enforcing their staying in, is bad for your brain, counter to nature.. He convinced my mother to medicate my food with Lexapro when 14 and she did it for a few months and I eventually had found out after a major headache I had, that was severe and I thought I was dying because it was that severe and sharp, and abnormal, and my mother’s aura felt so guilty, I grew weary with suspicion and the next morning I had found on computer, her email open.. I in her sent, had found how she had told the special ed teacher about it, and to monitor my effects at school).. I instantly lost trust for her, and even more so I had, when she had sent me to Cathedral Home for Children in middle of night where I was taken out of my house at 3Am by youth transporters and forced to board two planes. One to Denver, a propeller to Laramie, Wyoming. That is when my secondary fix, my 6 behaviors, manifested.

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HAHAHAHAAA yeah they always feel guilty after it's too late. Never before never trying to think and to fix anything BEFORE they have messed up so bad nothing can be done anymore. And they say they tried their best. No. They were liars. They were covert. They were ignorant on purpose. I hope their every waking moment is stretched into inifinity with hellish agony. THen they rewrite history and pretend it never happened. Their nasty descendants forget about it because they didn't do it. Just to do the same thing in principle, the same pattern, to someone else. And then deny it too.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

HAHAHAHAAA yeah they always feel guilty after it's too late. Never before never trying to think and to fix anything BEFORE they have messed up so bad nothing can be done anymore. And they say they tried their best. No. They were liars. They were covert. They were ignorant on purpose. I hope their every waking moment is stretched into inifinity with hellish agony. THen they rewrite history and pretend it never happened. Their nasty descendants forget about it because they didn't do it. Just to do the same thing in principle, the same pattern, to someone else. And then deny it too.

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indeed, they did not look hard enough. Stupid society and its conditioning of people..

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

HAHAHAHAAA yeah they always feel guilty after it's too late. Never before never trying to think and to fix anything BEFORE they have messed up so bad nothing can be done anymore. And they say they tried their best. No. They were liars. They were covert. They were ignorant on purpose. I hope their every waking moment is stretched into inifinity with hellish agony. THen they rewrite history and pretend it never happened. Their nasty descendants forget about it because they didn't do it. Just to do the same thing in principle, the same pattern, to someone else. And then deny it too.

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Most of them are group thinkers and blindly will entrust to authority..

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Autism is not about boxes? Everyone would fare better if they were better it's how it works. A lot of autistics are stupid and don't deserve to breathe. The dumb ones who suck up to the majority get to write the rules, which, suck up, to, the, majority. You can have better, you can have worse, and you can be in the middle because thats how you think is not just "black and white". If there was no better and worse there wouldn't be any meaning or necessity in doing anything. Being gray is a false virtue.

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OK then... 0 Kelvins for all of us. My decision.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

OK then... 0 Kelvins for all of us. My decision.

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That's what I like to see.

About ILIs and narcissism to some extent I agree. Actually I only care about me and people I love and no one else matters tbh. At my worst when I consider you an enemy I even reject the fact that you exist. I just did a quick look at covert narcissism and lol about “putting oneself down to gain admiration”, I’d say the woe is me attitude is a mating call more than anything else. “I’m weak someone save me please!!!” But anyway I like this thread, makes me consider the fact that I might be a covert narcissist. I’ll reflect on this. Out of all signs I would say fake empathy is not very ILI-ish though. When I don’t like you you’ll know. ILI hate fake niceties in general, even to the detriment of their own personal status. It’s probably common of them to argue against person of authority when they consider the authority as dumb. It’s kind of a downfall/weakness. Schizo is spot on though I think, ILIs are the typical reclusive scholars (or just plain reclusive).

Edit: Now that I think about it an ILI could also act narcissistic specially if they are more focused on Te. If they don’t treasure deep bonds with people they’ll probably see the world as bleak and with their abilities they can just end up using people for gain.

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Originally Posted by one

About ILIs and narcissism to some extent I agree. Actually I only care about me and people I love and no one else matters tbh. At my worst when I consider you an enemy I even reject the fact that you exist. I just did a quick look at covert narcissism and lol about “putting oneself down to gain admiration”, I’d say the woe is me attitude is a mating call more than anything else. “I’m weak someone save me please!!!” But anyway I like this thread, makes me consider the fact that I might be a covert narcissist. I’ll reflect on this. Out of all signs I would say fake empathy is not very ILI-ish though. When I don’t like you you’ll know. ILI hate fake niceties in general, even to the detriment of their own personal status. It’s probably common of them to argue against person of authority when they consider the authority as dumb. It’s kind of a downfall/weakness. Schizo is spot on though I think, ILIs are the typical reclusive scholars (or just plain reclusive).

Edit: Now that I think about it an ILI could also act narcissistic specially if they are more focused on Te. If they don’t treasure deep bonds with people they’ll probably see the world as bleak and with their abilities they can just end up using people for gain.

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ILI's look down on people because ILI's fail to understand them, seeing them as dumb. They also walk over others a way that they are fine with being walked over themselves so they consider it fair because they don't understand that the other side has other qualities problems etc that makes it more problematic for them instead.
Even if you are not a "narcissist" it's very likely you exhibit some behaviors, regardless if you are ILI or IEI too. It's always good to scan for your flaws. ILI's dont treasure bonds because they have to sacrifice them for the "greater good", which is a biased (introverted intuition) worldview. He might even be right. Anyway Thanos is an example. Kaczynski too.

Kaczynski: "Art forms that appeal to [leftists] tend to focus on ... defeat and despair ... as if there were no hope of accomplishing anything through rational calculation." He is very smart and can accomplish anything. No problem significant enough he can't solve (seeing real problems as "small" or "irrelevant" because he said so.
Kaczynski: "The leftist is anti-individualistic ... He is not the sort of person who has an inner sense of confidence in his own ability to solve his own problems and satisfy his own needs." Confidence is narcisssitc by default. There's always chaotic elements and you are not perfect you will always make mistakes and they carry their consequences.
Kaczynski: "It is obvious that [leftists] are not cool-headed logicians systematically analyzing the foundations of knowledge. They are deeply involved emotionally in their attack on truth and reality." Carl Jung criticized Nietzsche's Zarathustra because his truth was HIS particular view and reality he deems absolute. Relating to the previous point, if your cognition is limited, so is the scope of your reality by default. Also he can't be criticized, hence he refers to someone questioning him as an "attack on truth and reality", also called gaslighting. Posturing, to instill a sense of facts and logic, of something inarguable (invulnerable), ironically, through appealing to emotions and biases, "cold-headed logicians ...", while also implicitly criticizing the left as emotional and irrational. Ironically, Peterson criticized the left as being too rational which culminates with death, referencing communism.

@one

Anders Breivik Terrorist and manifesto-writer Breivik: "It's human nature to be selfish, to seek admiration. ... We strive to be as perfect as we can be."
Breivik: "I sound quite self-righteous at times and I don't like admitting it when I'm wrong."
Breivik: "I have a relatively inflated ego, with a constant need to feed on an intellectual level."
Breivik: "I've generally been perceived as quite arrogant ... [because] I do not care ... for creating or preserving social relationships." Arguing with someone who's authority is disrespecting them, resulting in your relationships being bad. Ironically INTJs also do try to maintain them, but it's for sake of utility (this includes emotions and avoiding drama). Wait I realized the ILI i was talking to wasn't faking being nice. He is autistic and thinks he is actually being nice but he is faking it because he doesn't see the consequences and implicaitons of how he is demeaning me. He thought me criticizing him was me hating him. Or he has really bad double standard as the narcissistic piece of shit he is.


Vladimir Lenin Dictator of the Soviet Union, mentor of Stalin Lenin: "Trust is good. Control is better."
Lenin: "Thought is by its nature capable of giving, and does give, absolute truth."
Nina Tumarkin: "Lenin was a very ... bossy, self-centered, competent and smart child."
Leon Trotsky: "[Lenin] was irrevocably controlled by one ... idea: the goal. He was probably the most extreme utilitarian ... history has produced."
Hans Mortensen: "[Those] who did not share Lenin's interpretation [of Marx] were showered in insults and abuse and pronounced to be absolutely worthless. He would break even with his closest friends if they did not share his vision entirely."

ILI's totally fake niceties when they don't know someone yet tho. And they do you favours but also expect the same in return it's about utility. At the same time they do it if they think it would be detrimental not to it's about utility. And sometimes they really do think about treating people right. Hmm you care about yourself and the people you (love) care about. Wouldn't have expected it. I'm just pointing it out don't take it personally, you autist. Now I'm having fun with banter which you may get offended by and deny being offended cuz u actually weren't until I said that u were.

Do you care aobout someone who would be someone you'd love but u just don't know them yet? Or you base your love on utility primarily? @one

@bryanbone Irl at my worst I mostly see other people as either a nuisance and/or someone I need to tolerate because I’m stuck in a situation. Other than those people some I consider a person worthy of liking, and once I like you I’ll do anything for you in a way. Sounds very evil I know but I just don’t register the idea that people are actually people, they are some receptacles of information and entities I can share an info with. I’m too engrossed with my thoughts. But I have a need to be good and moral. But daily niceties and regular caring about people I can’t do, I don’t even talk to most of them other than work. But when I have to interact with people, I do the best I can to be kind and accommodating. I don’t fake it, I do it because I know that it’s the right thing to do and that I actually want to care about people. Also when I decide that I like you, you matter a lot and I’ll probably die for you. I don’t ask for return. When the feeling is strong it’s just easier for me to act more vulnerable.

In short - I act like I don’t care sometimes but it’s because I have bad people skills. I actually want to care. I want to love people unconditionally but it’s hard and it’s even harder to show it sometimes.

ILI autistic localized thinking also translates into narcissistic, egocentric, lack of awareness of what others could be thinking/feeling/problems and dispositions, and black and white thinking. They tend to judge people very harshly from few impressions. In both directions. Like the guy in the vid would think someone being nice is someone caring about him, believing lies. Them they learn that any communication that fits a certain pattern is lie. For example the "woe is me" mentality is a manipulative tactic always. Very smart very perceptive. Very distrustful ILIs.

They don't care aobut vicitms because they treat everyone as an enemy, until proven otherwise, until proven otherwise otherwise, at which point the conclusion is not that humans have many layers and understandings, but that they are being manipulated. Good job ILIs. They also get ahead by stepping on others, aggressive mentality in general. someone crying for help is having empathetic caring mentality, and they ask others to give them because they are forced to take by force otherwise.

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Originally Posted by one

@bryanbone Irl at my worst I mostly see other people as either a nuisance and/or someone I need to tolerate because I’m stuck in a situation. Other than those people some I consider a person worthy of liking, and once I like you I’ll do anything for you in a way. Sounds very evil I know but I just don’t register the idea that people are actually people, they are some receptacles of information and entities I can share an info with. I’m too engrossed with my thoughts. But I have a need to be good and moral. But daily niceties and regular caring about people I can’t do, I don’t even talk to most of them other than work. But when I have to interact with people, I do the best I can to be kind and accommodating. I don’t fake it, I do it because I know that it’s the right thing to do and that I actually want to care about people. Also when I decide that I like you, you matter a lot and I’ll probably die for you. I don’t ask for return. When the feeling is strong it’s just easier for me to act more vulnerable.

In short - I act like I don’t care sometimes but it’s because I have bad people skills. I actually want to care. I want to love people unconditionally but it’s hard and it’s even harder to show it sometimes.

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So you struggle with your immediate disposition in the moment as your general disposition towards the person. If you could tell them to fuck off with the bs and them being understanding and you would care and help them otherwise it would be way better right.

Even if I would use the person, I probably wouldn’t be able to fake being nice. It’s just obvious. I wish I could share some snippets of my life to here so it will be shown in full detail. But just a simple example I had to get into an interview for college and I just had to go along the interviewers (which were the heads of that college) and I would surely pass because I got high scores from the initial test. A lot of them were religious and they commented the fact that I don’t go to church and pray to god. I ruined that interview by having quite a long speech about no religion =/= no faith in god or anything. When people ask me how I am I always answer it honestly- I feel bad, I’m sleepy, I’m not doing so good, etc even if it’s negative.

Edit: I passed though so it was okay but when I was given the results they gave the comment: Needs to work on personality. That stung to be honest

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

So you struggle with your immediate disposition in the moment as your general disposition towards the person. If you could tell them to fuck off with the bs and them being understanding and you would care and help them otherwise it would be way better right.

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Yeah I guess though I know most people won’t and I’ve read that I can only work on myself so I try harder when it comes to people sometimes.

About being understood - I don’t care anymore to be honest. Lol. I consider coming from wanting to be understood to knowing you are precious even if no one understands you is a big revelation and a big part of ILI’s redemption arc.

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Originally Posted by one

Even if I would use the person, I probably wouldn’t be able to fake being nice. It’s just obvious. I wish I could share some snippets of my life to here so it will be shown in full detail. But just a simple example I had to get into an interview for college and I just had to go along the interviewers (which were the heads of that college) and I would surely pass because I got high scores from the initial test. A lot of them were religious and they commented the fact that I don’t go to church and pray to god. I ruined that interview by having quite a long speech about no religion =/= no faith in god or anything. When people ask me how I am I always answer it honestly- I feel bad, I’m sleepy, I’m not doing so good, etc even if it’s negative.

Edit: I passed though so it was okay but when I was given the results they gave the comment: Needs to work on personality. That stung to be honest

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that's their personality fault not urs in this example really. Things like this make me double down on my narcissism. They need to work on their cognitive capacity and awareness.

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Originally Posted by one

Yeah I guess though I know most people won’t and I’ve read that I can only work on myself so I try harder when it comes to people sometimes.

About being understood - I don’t care anymore to be honest. Lol. I consider coming from wanting to be understood to knowing you are precious even if no one understands you is a big revelation and a big part of ILI’s redemption arc.

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Being understood is of utility here. It's annoying to deal with bs. They are supposed to learn because if they don't Im gonna be exhausted and not help them as much with other things. You can't be the only one working on themselves. They are so used to being sucked up to and forcing everyone into their way of interaction and lifestyle. If I don't fight I'm teaching them it's ok. They need to be shaken up their mind needs to break so they can reform (literally change form, break > rebuild itself). If they're gonna be annoying Im gonna send that back and actually be in the right. It's interesting you say the submissive route is the ILI redemption arc while I have seen IEIs start to take the offensive route instead.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

that's their personality fault not urs in this example really. Things like this make me double down on my narcissism. They need to work on their cognitive capacity and awareness.

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In a way yes, because the ideal situation is that I’ll tone down the rudeness and just state my views, and that they acknowledge other viewpoints. But that didn’t happen, and I think what works is to not let yourself get sucked to the negativity of other people. It’s difficult though I know, I get into situations where I just want to own people who deserve it. For now I consider being forward and saying things as a matter-of-fact is rude but not that evil, focusing only on myself and people that I like while not harming people is the way, but using people deliberately and making them feel inferior is bad

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Originally Posted by one

In a way yes, because the ideal situation is that I’ll tone down the rudeness and just state my views, and that they acknowledge other viewpoints. But that didn’t happen, and I think what works is to not let yourself get sucked to the negativity of other people. It’s difficult though I know, I get into situations where I just want to own people who deserve it. For now I consider being forward and saying things as a matter-of-fact is rude but not that evil, focusing only on myself and people that I like while not harming people is the way, but using people deliberately and making them feel inferior is bad

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Their toxicity spreads if you leave them I don't see preventing them from using others like they are using me as their narcissistic supply as using them. I'm harming more people if I let them go. Although I know I can never win against them like that. The game is rigged. Am I really that bad if I get happy when they're sad? Reverse vampirism is fun.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Being understood is of utility here. It's annoying to deal with bs. They are supposed to learn because if they don't Im gonna be exhausted and not help them as much with other things. You can't be the only one working on themselves. They are so used to being sucked up to and forcing everyone into their way of interaction and lifestyle. If I don't fight I'm teaching them it's ok. They need to be shaken up their mind needs to break so they can reform (literally change form, break > rebuild itself). If they're gonna be annoying Im gonna send that back and actually be in the right. It's interesting you say the submissive route is the ILI redemption arc while I have seen IEIs start to take the offensive route instead.

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Yeah maybe it’s different for IEIs. I’m thinking maybe the Fe position is important here. ILI don’t need to be liked and they focus on the Fi - select people they care about are enough. For IEIs it’s different. Maybe tapping into Ti and integrating it with Fe saves you. The same way that even if I with creative Te like to treat people as utility, with Fi it turns out that there are people who can be the exception.
Plus Se. So you can just see how SLEs and LSIs deal with those kinds of problems. I’m imagining - I’m kind but if you cross this territory I’ll fight you. Which is exactly what you’re doing

Basically don’t give too much of yourself, focus on Ti more

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Originally Posted by one

Yeah maybe it’s different for IEIs. I’m thinking maybe the Fe position is important here. ILI don’t need to be liked and they focus on the Fi - select people they care about are enough. For IEIs it’s different. Maybe tapping into Ti and integrating it with Fe saves you. The same way that even if I with creative Te like to treat people as utility, with Fi it turns out that there are people who can be the exception.
Plus Se. So you can just see how SLEs and LSIs deal with those kinds of problems. I’m imagining - I’m kind but if you cross this territory I’ll fight you. Which is exactly what you’re doing

Basically don’t give too much of yourself, focus on Ti more

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Ti is about trolling which is what I'm doing through vampirism. Analysing them and criticizing them through mockery.

Again I think woe is me can be manipulative because it’s a call for help from duals or some people who like victimy qualities. Maybe ILIs enjoy the attention, but it starts first from the victimy feels lol. Basically ILIs really are like that. It could give them good or bad attention or none at all but either way the ILI would still have the woe is me mentality

ILI cannot read people -> see patterns, any hint of bad would be used to consider someone an enemy. It’s all in the place of defensiveness and scare. Good thing you mentioned this because I’m in a specific situation like atm and I realized I’ve destroyed the bridge just because of the same reason. It’s always like that though: Any small event that ILI cannot read: The person’s bad!!! Get away from him/her! -> woe is me I’m lonely -> contemplate and/or explain situation with someone who knows better -> Oops I’ve totally misread the situation, sorry

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Ti is about trolling which is what I'm doing through vampirism. Analysing them and criticizing them through mockery.

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Ngl I searched vampirism just to make sure I get what you mean. I assume that means using people

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Originally Posted by one

Ngl I searched vampirism just to make sure I get what you mean. I assume that means using people

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LSI said I was sucking his blood because I was arguing with him. IEI's give their blood through Ni Fe. Blood is the fluid of life, it means healing, sharing and caring. When that's not appreciated (or we think it's not,) we turn to sucking blood (vampirism). Also "draining" someone emotionally and mentally. Done through criticism. Analysis means to pick apart and is related to masculinity, as the opposite of empathy which means "to bring together". Destructive vs creative. Ti is analysis/deconstruction and Se is physical dominance, movement and aggression.

SEI and ESE turn to Ti + Ni which is a plan to destroy someone through social networks and manipulation instead of more physical direct and personal confrontation.

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Originally Posted by one

Again I think woe is me can be manipulative because it’s a call for help from duals or some people who like victimy qualities. Maybe ILIs enjoy the attention, but it starts first from the victimy feels lol. Basically ILIs really are like that. It could give them good or bad attention or none at all but either way the ILI would still have the woe is me mentality

ILI cannot read people -> see patterns, any hint of bad would be used to consider someone an enemy. It’s all in the place of defensiveness and scare. Good thing you mentioned this because I’m in a specific situation like atm and I realized I’ve destroyed the bridge just because of the same reason. It’s always like that though: Any small event that ILI cannot read: The person’s bad!!! Get away from him/her! -> woe is me I’m lonely -> contemplate and/or explain situation with someone who knows better -> Oops I’ve totally misread the situation, sorry

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Oh so ILI's accuse others of victim mentality because they are projecting their own insecurities and flaws on others. Their own way of victimizing themselves as if someone else is doing it to manipulate because they themselves are doing it to manipulate.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Oh so ILI's accuse others of victim mentality because they are projecting their own insecurities and flaws on others. Their own way of victimizing themselves as if someone else is doing it to manipulate because they themselves are doing it to manipulate.

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Most weird behaviors are due to projection. You don't have to see it as deliberate manipulation though.

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Originally Posted by one

Most weird behaviors are due to projection. You don't have to see it as deliberate manipulation though.

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It's in part deliberate if you don't even make the effort to understand, making assumptions instead, letting urself pass judgements you haven't verified. I thought I was LII or EII due to constantly doubting my ideas, instead of just assuming the most immediate and biased bs that comes to me as true while neglecting so many possibilities and factors. Like you said when ILIs realize they messed up, why won't most of them make the effort to see where was their flaw in principle, the pattern that they repeat, that results in the same kind of mistake. Most IEIs are the same like the ILIs all of this feeds into my narcissism. I'm obviously a better person because I'm trying to anticipate and fix my mistakes before they happen. They just let them and push their own shit on someone else.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

I'm obviously a better person because I'm trying to anticipate and fix my mistakes before they happen.

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Can you prove this? Because it misses gazillion viewpoints. Starting from the most fundamental basics of existence of which I assume you are part of.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

Can you prove this? Because it misses gazillion viewpoints. Starting from the most fundamental basics of existence of which I assume you are part of.

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I don't understand what you mean. I said so many times now there's not even such thing as proof. If what I say is true and you have the cognitive abilitites necessary to deduce it and understand it, the proof is right in front fo you. If you don't, you are blind and say I have no proof. Like @Braingel deduced pills are toxic. U have to be a moron to not figure it out.

ok stupid autistic ILI be damned to hell
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8rN-_qjmik
here's your localized thinking

banking partners want less of it they
take porn away men
become frustrated
jealous assholes like him make fun of them and degrade people and
take safer self management opportunities for income away so that the girls get exploited way worse instead
forced into toxic porn business models and supporting toxic sites
and he and his degenerates in the comments are happy for it. I wish him all the worst.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

I don't understand what you mean. I said so many times now there's not even such thing as proof. If what I say is true and you have the cognitive abilitites necessary to deduce it and understand it, the proof is right in front fo you. If you don't, you are blind and say I have no proof. Like @Braingel deduced pills are toxic. U have to be a moron to not figure it out.

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There are proofs. It depends on the axioms you choose. I greatly doubt that autism lends itself to this because they talk about spectrum. Of course you can claim to be your own discrete solipsistic entity with your definitions but why the hell you even communicate?

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

There are proofs. It depends on the axioms you choose. I greatly doubt that autism lends itself to this because they talk about spectrum. Of course you can claim to be your own discrete solipsistic entity with your definitions but why the hell you even communicate?

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Everyone's their own entity? That's exactly why we communicate, we understand reality differently so we communicate to educate each other. When you say you want proof u mean u need an explanation for why I think the way I do. but saying proof and "your own definitions" implies you have assumed some kind of rule that your particular axioms and understanding are in the right and I should accommodate to them without you even needing to communicate them because you are somehow entitled to objectivity (your particular subjectivity being objective). I have always had this problem with ILEs. Also me referencing what happenned with the sociopath.

Aximos are rules derived from observation or just assumptions that you go off of being true. This makes them wrong by default. There are many ways to redefine ur axioms to break your conceptual illusions, because a particular way of conception makes it very hard to conceptualize some other things. Like concepts have no strict borders between them so u make borders artifically to help urself understand which also has consequences on you not understanding other things because ur borders (boxes you put things in) get in the way. U need to change the way you think and redefine everything as you go that's a basic axiom. Learning more results in you breaking your previous conceptions (mind blown, opening your mind, by opening the borders) so you can understand more complexity of reality.

You want me to deliver everything to you, translating it to your particular bias, while you are not willing to make the effort to understand it as it is, I have to walk you through your personal conceptual barriers which u need to communicate which will take a lot of time and effort on both sides. And I have never met an ILE who was willing to walk that distance. It's the same for IEIs and ILIs too most of the time really.

And then there's the specifics of the situation. I have believed many people who others claimed were delusional, because I anticipated they would be rejected and because it happenned in the past, and on purpose am trying to listen and understand and figure out what they are talking bout. ILIs and IEIs demeaned them included. By reasoning I can figure everyone else is a complete bafoon. Example is pills being toxic and destroying brain and cognitive function. Example is me telling them sleep depravation also results in brain damage and cognitive decline which they said I'm just making excuses and there's no way it would be allowed or oblige people to sleep deprive if what I said was true. Then came studies proving me right. However the studies are still not proof since everything is just assumptions and relations you never know for sure. You jus always make assumptions and try to verify them to figure out right from wrong. Studies are always inconclusive and when they are regarded as conclusive it's due to factor analysis failure, where there were factors not even considered, due to lack of imagination and understanding of other areas. Since there COULD be something that's missing, and we don't know what it is, I can't prove there's such thing. And then I may know and understand there's such thing, and explain it to them. and they will just say I'm delusional and it's not verified, when the fucking hypocrites, are just as delusional and unverified, even mrore so, due to lack of understanding complex factor relationships and being conceptually blind to things. Cue the fcking bullies trope of abusing a nerd telling him what he says makes no sense in kindergarden when he later proves to have been right all along and intellectually advanced. It's no different except the kid has adults proving him right, as an authority figure, just because they are authority means they are in the right of course. That's how most people function with proof. Proof is just something someone sees as a reason for something to be true. It's completely subjective and biased.

Your existence begun when there was enough of particles that interacted. You did not compile your own existence.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

You want me to deliver everything to you, translating it to your particular bias, while you are not willing to make the effort to understand it as it is, I have to walk you through your personal conceptual barriers which u need to communicate which will take a lot of time and effort on both sides. And I have never met an ILE who was willing to walk that distance. It's the same for IEIs and ILIs too most of the time really.

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What makes you assume that you don't also have particular bias? That you can see 'what it is'?

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

I don't understand what you mean. I said so many times now there's not even such thing as proof. If what I say is true and you have the cognitive abilitites necessary to deduce it and understand it, the proof is right in front of you.

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Deduce it from what? Assumptions? Perceptions?

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by bryanbone https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...post-right.png
I'm obviously a better person because I'm trying to anticipate and fix my mistakes before they happen.



Well, if you know they are mistakes beforehand, you wouldn't make them at all, right? But I don't think it's possible to know for sure because you'd have to be omniscient. Of course, it's important to doubt oneself and stay cautious and not be too rigid in one's "knowledge".

While this is an interesting topic, I can't make out where this thread is going and what it's actual purpose is.

@bryanbone I think it's all hate because some ILI might have hurt you. I hope you find an ILI who is different. I mentioned reasons why ILI could be perceived as narcissistic, I'm mostly talking from personal experience and the type itself. Maybe the ILI that you have met is narcissistic and have done bad but it could be not because they are ILI but because of other reasons. Any type can be evil. I do agree that there is a high tendency for ILIs to be narcissistic because they start with the trends/patterns and with their weak ethical functions they just blow things out of proportion. That could lead them to think that people are only a means to an end or that people are out to get them. But I'm going to say not all ILIs.

Just a note, you might be judging the ILI's actions without understanding where they are coming from, while you give leeway to yourself because you know your intentions. You mentioned you've been doing vampirism and other things - these actions can be perceived as evil as well and based on what you said you know that you do it to others. Now you might think that you are doing the right thing even though if we would just take your actions, we harshly judge them as evil. But you wouldn't want others to judge, because you know that you are just trying to defend yourself. How about the ILI who has done wrong? Maybe he has his own battles. Maybe we need to give a benefit of the doubt here and be open to forgiveness.

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Originally Posted by lkdhf qkb

What makes you assume that you don't also have particular bias? That you can see 'what it is'?



Deduce it from what? Assumptions? Perceptions?

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by bryanbone https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...post-right.png
I'm obviously a better person because I'm trying to anticipate and fix my mistakes before they happen.



Well, if you know they are mistakes beforehand, you wouldn't make them at all, right? But I don't think it's possible to know for sure because you'd have to be omniscient. Of course, it's important to doubt oneself and stay cautious and not be too rigid in one's "knowledge".

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What makes you assume I assume I don't have a particular bias. I know I have and been trying to fix myself that's my point. Did u miss the rest of the conversation? I'm better than others because I'm trying to fix myself while they prefer to cling to their bias because it's easy.

Assumptions are perceptions. Perceptions are cognitive processes lining up to form a perception. Assumptions are ideas that come to you which you perceive. You also create them. You are also created through them. And the world creates itself through you while creating you while your mind also creates reality u haven't been faced this those ideas before?

I don't know what is a mistake and what is not, since I'm not omniscient, which by default, implies, I will make mistakes, so Im wrong by default. And I try to find what I'm missing to get the correct idea. Which is wrong most of the time but it has truth in it because it's still an attempt to get at the whole truth. Which is growing myself and growing my awareness to make myself more right, better. To grow. To have better ideas which are also perceptions and assumptions.

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Your existence begun when there was enough of particles that interacted. You did not compile your own existence.

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@PseudoRandomBSGenerator

If energy can't be destroyed nor created.

If I'm the particles interacting and they compiled themselves then I compilled myself. Does anyone really do anything. If I shoot a gun, and the bullet kills someone, what killed him was the wound, was it physics, was it the bullet, was it the gun, was it the trigger, was it pulling the trigger, was it pulling the trigger in the specific moment and direction and everything lining up perfectly. But it was no me because I do not exist. It was my innervation too. We don't make choices. Choices make us. Was there even a beginning and can you prove my existence either. Can you prove the existance of particles. And how is this relevant to what I said before way anyway? Can you prove your particle theory? What if my existence came before that and the particles are just it's manifestation instead. What if there's no difference between before and after. Have you looked into causality and synchronicity? What are ideas? You have no proof for anything at all. Jung is describing implicit meanings in ideas

https://carljungdepthpsychologysite..../#.YSALvOhfiUk

If my CONCEPTION, is implicit in something else in the world, it could be caused by it. Like when you have an idea. And externalize it in the real world. Did it only start existing there? It existed somewhere else before. As things in the past can cause things in the future, so can things in the future cause events in the past.
If I have schizophrenia, is it caused by misfiring of neurons, or is misfiring caused by it?

If I create the future by ideas given to me by particle interaction, then it was implicitly the future from the start. And it comes through me as manipulation of reality so that others act a certain way to lead to that future.
https://carljungdepthpsychologysite..../#.YSAStuhfiUk

Existance compiles itself. That's what energy can't be destroyed or created means. If everything is caused by something else. That's an axiom for you. Specific scenario in a localized thinking way taking out of context would be saying the bullet killed him, not me. Saying I don't compile my existence because particles come to manifest it and saying I killed him is also localized thinking and it's lateral thinking. You are moving ideas on 1 level. You need to ascend beyond that. Like the Earth used to have borders in the minds of people, it turned out it was a sphere. Like the universe must have an edge, it turns out it loops on itsellf, repeating, like a pattern. WAlking a line until you go the distance to realize it was a circle. But if your processing poweri s not sufficient you keep forgetting the road you have already travelled and repeating the same mistakes. Becoming self aware is getting yourself out of your own current cognitive limitations. Like becoming aware of the other loops. A dog chases it's tail causing it's own misery? Or is the trap caused upon him. You are suffering has another meaning, you are the suffering itself. That's why you are not the same when suffering. You are never the same unless in the exact same situation including time events memories everything and for a particular moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytz04GTkMBw

Im not clear as I wish to be because I'm cognitively impaired. So my ideas are something I'm unaware fully of since I experienced them across a long time and very intense moments after which I lost my insight they gave me as a whole. I've been trying to trace them back for so long. I never took LSD or any substance for the protocol. Others who took it also had realizations like theres no difference between objecitve and subjective. Jung also admitted that when he realzied it later but I can't find his texts about it.

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Originally Posted by one

@bryanbone I think it's all hate because some ILI might have hurt you. I hope you find an ILI who is different. I mentioned reasons why ILI could be perceived as narcissistic, I'm mostly talking from personal experience and the type itself. Maybe the ILI that you have met is narcissistic and have done bad but it could be not because they are ILI but because of other reasons. Any type can be evil. I do agree that there is a high tendency for ILIs to be narcissistic because they start with the trends/patterns and with their weak ethical functions they just blow things out of proportion. That could lead them to think that people are only a means to an end or that people are out to get them. But I'm going to say not all ILIs.

Just a note, you might be judging the ILI's actions without understanding where they are coming from, while you give leeway to yourself because you know your intentions. You mentioned you've been doing vampirism and other things - these actions can be perceived as evil as well and based on what you said you know that you do it to others. Now you might think that you are doing the right thing even though if we would just take your actions, we harshly judge them as evil. But you wouldn't want others to judge, because you know that you are just trying to defend yourself. How about the ILI who has done wrong? Maybe he has his own battles. Maybe we need to give a benefit of the doubt here and be open to forgiveness.

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I talked bad about IEIs as well. Most humans are trash. If they want to be treated well then they should reciprocate first. If they see me trying to communicate honestly as offensive then they should be offended and I'm gonna offend them further. If they don't want to reconcile and make me eat their shit I'm not gonna have that.

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Originally Posted by Uncle Ave

While this is an interesting topic, I can't make out where this thread is going and what it's actual purpose is.

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We did get sidetrack but others can always return to the original topic, right? We went off of autism's relationships with narcissism, abuse, cognitive lapses, bias, localized thinking.

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Originally Posted by Uncle Ave

While this is an interesting topic, I can't make out where this thread is going and what it's actual purpose is.

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I think it revolves around starter's God complex.
So... the next thing we need to tackle is if it has some sort of weak interactive polytheism going on (I'm detecting some signs). If he ever chooses to talk to mortals.

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

I think it revolves around starter's God complex.
So... the next thing we need to tackle is if it has some sort of weak interactive polytheism going on (I'm detecting some signs). If he ever chooses to talk to mortals.

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I'm trying my best you know. I'm not trying to be obscure on purpose. Like most people think dreams dont have profound meanigns because they can't make the necessary analysis and associations. Like I also said ILEs are not willing to walk that distance.

I had to bother writing and coming up with all that. For years fighting to understand it myself mind you. But I want too much of others I guess.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

What makes you assume I assume I don't have a particular bias. I know I have and been trying to fix myself that's my point. Did u miss the rest of the conversation? I'm better than others because I'm trying to fix myself while they prefer to cling to their bias because it's easy.

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That's very grown of you :)

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

Assumptions are perceptions. Perceptions are cognitive processes lining up to form a perception. Assumptions are ideas that come to you which you perceive. You also create them. You are also created through them. And the world creates itself through you while creating you while your mind also creates reality u haven't been faced this those ideas before?

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That's a very Ni way of seeing the world. I get the the "mind & world interact to create reality" part, yet there is a danger of going into solipsism as @PseudoRandomBSGenerator has justly remarked. If you think those perceptions are not different from who you are, then what makes you assume that other people don't have other perceptions? If the world creates itself through you, then wouldn't other people have another, different world created through them? Why should those worlds coincide? Or worse, maybe those people only exist in your mind?

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

I don't know what is a mistake and what is not, since I'm not omniscient, which by default, implies, I will make mistakes, so Im wrong by default. And I try to find what I'm missing to get the correct idea. Which is wrong most of the time but it has truth in it because it's still an attempt to get at the whole truth. Which is growing myself and growing my awareness to make myself more right, better. To grow. To have better ideas which are also perceptions and assumptions.

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If you don't know what is a mistake, then how can you find the correct idea? If you don't know what's wrong, how can you know what's true?

It is strange to put value on localized existence when you can not be sure of the foundation (especially out of scope temporal viewpoint related to object permanence). Anyway, this seems rather trollish and I'm getting tired of trolling back [because there are no actual solid answers].

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Originally Posted by PseudoRandomBSGenerator

It is strange to put value on localized existence when you can not be sure of the foundation (especially out of scope temporal viewpoint related to object permanence). Anyway, this seems rather trollish and I'm getting tired of trolling back [because there are no actual solid answers].

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Originally Posted by lkdhf qkb

That's very grown of you :)



That's a very Ni way of seeing the world. I get the the "mind & world interact to create reality" part, yet there is a danger of going into solipsism as @PseudoRandomBSGenerator has justly remarked. If you think those perceptions are not different from who you are, then what makes you assume that other people don't have other perceptions? If the world creates itself through you, then wouldn't other people have another, different world created through them? Why should those worlds coincide? Or worse, maybe those people only exist in your mind?



If you don't know what is a mistake, then how can you find the correct idea? If you don't know what's wrong, how can you know what's true?

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What makes u think I assume other poeple don't have other worlds and percpetions? I don't understand what u mean why should those worlds coincide. If they don't we end up both sides self righteously abusing each other. Even if they exist in my mind I want to treat them well, especially since I'm not sure if they really do exist in my mind. So I will do the best no matter what because it's the best thing I could do. It's implicitly so. If you think about it more, "exist" and "mind" just doesn't make sense. It's all ideas you try to juggle. It changes nothing if it exists in a mind. Suffering also exists only in your mind does that make it less meaningful? If they exist in my mind how do I know I don't exist in someone else' mind? Also your mind doesn't create the reality you want to. You wanting is your particular bias, or localized existance too. It may not even make sense at all like a kid asking for something that makes sense to them but it's just unintelligible. MAybe everyhting u do is unintelligible and you just are not aware because that's your cognitive limitation. YOu have all seen someone do something really stupid and it was really obvious to you then why wasn't it to them? Why do you think you'd have any secure foundation at all then? Now that's narcissistic and delusional.

I don't know what I can and can't do (regarding mistakes) I just do my best to do the best that's how it works. You guys are used to being comfortable in certainty. bsgenerator wants his stable solid reality he doesn't want to admit to himself the world is way more insolid because being surrounded by unknown darkness makes him anxious. You want to be secure because delusions and filling the gaps of the unknown with them is reassuring.
You never know if what you're doing is a mistake or not. You just try to make assumptions and test them and learn from the experiences and create more complex mental models of reality exponentially and then you also see your own mistakes in them or patterns/repetitions like a math equation you can cross the "X"es off of. Most people teach thmeeslvs not to think because it's hard and painful to keep realizing you are wrong, how little you know and understand anything and to figure out how to fix it.

Its not strange because it's all you have. The foundation is elusive and difficult doesn't mean it doesn't matter. Thats your own weakness and hopelessness.

Autism, HSP, and high intellectual potential could all be grouped under the neuroatypical umbrella.

I think it is difficult for people to understand when they don't share these traits, they think you're trying to be "special" or a snowflake. But there really differences between people from this point of view.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

You guys are used to being comfortable in certainty. bsgenerator wants his stable solid reality he doesn't want to admit to himself the world is way more insolid because being surrounded by unknown darkness makes him anxious. You want to be secure because delusions and filling the gaps of the unknown with them is reassuring.

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Why does it matter that some people look for truth by using assumtions or speculation? What does it matter that the motivation is a need for certainty, since it exists in their minds? Here your own answer:

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

It changes nothing if it exists in a mind. Suffering also exists only in your mind does that make it less meaningful? If they exist in my mind how do I know I don't exist in someone else' mind? So I will do the best no matter what because it's the best thing I could do. It's implicitly so.

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Originally Posted by bryanbone

You never know if what you're doing is a mistake or not. You just try to make assumptions and test them and learn from the experiences and create more complex mental models of reality exponentially and then you also see your own mistakes in them or patterns/repetitions like a math equation you can cross the "X"es off of. Most people teach thmeeslvs not to think because it's hard and painful to keep realizing you are wrong, how little you know and understand anything and to figure out how to fix it.

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So you also have a way of confirming your assumptions. Those experiences you talk about are what most people would call "empirical proof".

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Originally Posted by lkdhf qkb

Why does it matter that some people look for truth by using assumtions or speculation? What does it matter that the motivation is a need for certainty, since it exists in their minds? Here your own answer:

So you also have a way of confirming your assumptions. Those experiences you talk about are what most people would call "empirical proof".

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No they are not what people call empirical proof. They are called delusions. Whatever appeals to the bias of authority is called empirical proof.