What animes have LIE's as the star of the show? And preferably try not to pick ones that are too weird.
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What animes have LIE's as the star of the show? And preferably try not to pick ones that are too weird.
Light Yagami of Death Note is my personal favorite.
Lelouch from code geas might be one, ohh and maybe Aizen from bleach (not the main guy but whatever).
Completely agreed regarding Lelouch from Code Geass; although characters like him tend to suffer from "good at whatever the plot needs right now" disease, I think in typical situations he exhibits very strong Ni/Te vibe.
Maybe Zechs from Gundam Wing.
Possibly Shoryu from 12 Kingdoms.
Now that I think on it, FMA was pretty darn gamma. Not sure on who was the LIE on the protag side there. Mustang is a strong candidate, but Edward is also a strong case. Can't really nail down Al's type though. I sympathized with him the hardest, but I can't quite tell ya why. Though that scene with Lust really resonated with me hardcore. Dude did what I hope I'd do in that situation. Man, that's some good storytelling. If only current Hollywood could even grasp 50 percent of that...
They won't of course, given as they are all fucking death cultists who hate people like me who just want a good story full stop. But hey, at least they're all about to go just as broke as they see themselves as "woke".
I think the main guy from Bleach (Ichigo) is actually :Te:-LIE.Quote:
Originally Posted by Anglas
Asking which anime's have LIE's as the antagonists would be a much easier question to answer
Very, very true. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by LemurianLo
I actually thought of this myself upon first reading the thread, but I wanted to see if there were any LIE protagonists in anime without diverting attention from the question.
Seems not. At least, not for sure.
Someday, someday, we’ll get credit for something other than inventing Banks, interest charges, and mortgage backed securities.
Hmmm. Guess if we want a better rep, we should try being better people.
This is the darkest, blackest joke I have ever read in my life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Strange
Pretty sure hes ESIQuote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ave
Stereotypes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Strange
"Better" by what metric? IMO, that metric should be defined by the extent to which LIEs (or any other sociotype, for that matter) fulfill our ego functions, first and foremost. If we were meant to be "good" at "people" stuff, we'd be EIEs. We're "good" and contribute to society/humanity/our species in our own niche way (or else we would not exist)--whether we are readily appreciated for that or not is another matter. It's a bit unfair/unreasonable to (generally) hold ourselves to lofty moralistic standards and concerns that may contradict our prime directives--there are many unpleasant chores attached to "living" that must be done, though they may not readily "feel good" to those who benefit. Ultimately, I'm not that concerned with being "liked" and "loved" and I refuse to let that motivate my behavior; I'd rather be perceived as a nasty bastard who is, at the very least, respected and called upon for his effectiveness than being widely seen as a nice person, though objectively "useless."Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Strange
some "mad scientists" can be supposed :)
@Adam Strange, do you think Chara from Undertale was LIE?
I really have no idea. I never played that game, and I believe it is next to impossible to type anime characters unless the writers know Socionics and the characters have some scope to display the characteristics of their types.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterPrincipleTwo
I think Hans Gruber in Die Hard was LIE because he displayed many of the characteristics of LIEs, but he was an antagonist, not a protagonist, and Die Hard is not an anime.
Nah, don't be part of the sheeple. :crying:It's what makes your type so great imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Strange
Erwin Smith (Attack on Titan). Thought him LSE long ago, but this was wrong.
While not 'the' show's protagonist, he's worthy of mention.
IF someone didn't already say, the guy in Berserk is an LIE.
http://i.imgur.com/a8SYJ7c.pngQuote:
Originally Posted by PeterPrincipleTwo
Well, I hate to say it but us Gamma's do make for some darn good villains/anti-heroes. Hopefully somebody will pen a story that reverses this unfortunate fact and brings to the fore the qualities that are most epic and heroic about my quadra. All it takes is one famous/infamous story that the general public learns of somehow to affect a major cultural shift.Quote:
Originally Posted by LemurianLo
For instance, people used to name their girls "Lolita" with some frequency. They don't do that anymore. Why? That one pervert and that book he wrote. That's it really. Just one story told by some random mofo and boom, nobody dares use that name for their offspring again. Even I wouldn't, because defiance for defiance's sake feels a bit too much like I'm imitating Lucifer...
Why do you type him LIE instead of LSE? I also thought of him as LSE all alongQuote:
Originally Posted by mfckrz
Too stoically serious. Affinity for strategic gambles. Prioritizes theoretical maneuvers over established practices.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero
I figure Levi Ackerman for SLI. While unwaveringly loyal to Smith given their history, he's often critical of his decisions—seeing them as too risky, etc. They don't seem like Mirrors at all.
Gamma SFs tend to be heroes quite often, especially in anime, it's primarily the NTs that are made into villains (though SEE's seem to be very common as both heroes and villains). I'd say LIE's tend to rival EIE's for the major super villain/big baddie type characters, at least the most interesting one's that immediately come to mind when you think of a good villain (something about creative Ni and activating Se makes one want to rule the world/leave their mark in a story). And when I think antihero, I think Beta STs. On a side note, does anyone ever see Delta STs or Alpha SFs as major villains? Like minor sure, especially for LSE's but major? Can't think of any at all. An SEI for a major antagonist just sounds wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by End
On a further side note, Lolita is an amazing novel, cried real baby tears at that ending. Plus the prose is simply beautiful, excluding the story.
Oh I intend to read it sometime. Kinda thinking of becoming a reviewer of fiction recently. Key part of that is enduring trash/shit so that others don't have to. So, if anyone has an idea as to what fiction of any type would prompt me to the deliver a most entertaining critical or enraged rant in your eyes let me know. Because, again, I'm willing to suffer so that you, random strangers (here and everywhere), don't have to. Plus hey, who knows, maybe I make a viral something and become famous enough to finally attain "fuck you" money :).Quote:
Originally Posted by LemurianLo
Then best prepare yourself for some 50 Shades of Gray because there certainly is no better book for that purpose. Also a looot of popular teen fiction. Enduring terrible films or games for review is one thing but books? I gave my hats off to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by End
Terrible films are a passive experience (boring thing I can walk away from). Terrible games are a frustrating experience (frustrating thing I can also just walk away from). TV series are a kind of middle ground between those in my eyes. Books, however, for some reason, are a line for me. Probably because I know full good and well how important they are. The first stories were just words. Eventually, those words got so darn "good" that someone felt the need to find a way to preserve those words beyond the time spent with the speaker of them, perhaps even beyond their death. Hence, writing.Quote:
Originally Posted by LemurianLo
The written word, then, is the seed. It is the genesis of an enduring culture and, thus, a true civilization as most anyone with half a brain would conceive of one. If a civilization neglects writing, it will die an inglorious death. I mean, imagine a culture/civilization without writing (i.e. an alphabet/cuneiform/hieroglyphs/etc) that endured to the modern era. It... kinda didn't. If it did, well, that's because it never drew the attention of those true civilizations to itself. Even then, it's probably known to them, but just showing up and conquering some rando tribe of stick and rock using hunters is just being a dick to them at their level of advancement (which is trying to find ways around the "rocket equation" so that colonizing other planets will become accessible to the average working class schmuck).
Also, never gonna review smut (that is but pure smut, the weaboo anime nerd in me is compelled to mention that most all well known/popular VN's contain about 20 minutes of smut and 50+ hours of plot, world building, and character development for some God only knows reason). It's a sin after all and well, let's be honest here, the "great" pornographers of the modern era are oh so very, very poor at their craft. Most of them think that a hot girl flashing her... well y'know, is just the best so just have her do that as much as possible. Fools can't even approach the levels the real life Casanova reached. For him, sex was great and all, but to simply have a conversation with a beautiful woman was pretty much the same as bedding her in his eyes. A lesson to be learned there I'd think for those men who thirst for a beautiful woman in their bed :).
Try and get at her character, who she is as a person. Beauty, after all, can be a curse if you really think on that. To be a perfect 10 hottie, now that I think on it, may be to experience the curse of Midas from a newfound angle...
Maybe Picard from Star Trek? I don't know how well-written the character is because I haven't seen that much of TNG, but his ethical speeches, relatively easy-going nature, and acceptance of diversity reminds me of ENTjs. I know people type him LII and ESI, but he's way too conceptual for ESI and not very Ti rules and logic and or very Alpha either.
Star Trek is kind of cool. It seems to take different personality archetypes and shows how positive they can be, even possible Gamma types. I think TNG is essentially Te/Fi valuing and Star Trek: The Original Series is Ti/Fe valuing by the way.
Picard from Star Trek always seemed LIE to me as well, @Dalek Caan.
Agreed.Quote:
his ethical speeches, relatively easy-going nature, and acceptance of diversity reminds me of ENTjs
I've seen people type Picard as LSI and ESE...but to me he can only be LIE.
I think Kirk from the original series seems like the LSI.
Wasn't this supposed to be about anime?...Oh well.
Oh yeah, oops. heh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Ave
In authors’ defence, Gammas are ruthless and goal-oriented. Betas are pretty ruthless and goal-oriented too, but Betas are very good at getting people to join their side and care about people joining their side; they like and need this validation for their movement. Gammas on the other hand will not go through the process of gathering forces unless it is absolutely necessary. Even when it is necessary, we believe our internal values (Fi) trump valuations of societal values (Fe) and rules (Ti) so we can be a bit underhanded. Not because we are evil, but because we truly believe the end (Fi) justifies our pragmatic means (Te). We might move our forces around like pawns (ESFp using their Fe to gain support or Gamma NT seeing the forces as chess pieces) , betray allies when they are no longer useful (ISFj: “They were never with us, so why fake sentiments when there is a bigger goal at hand”), break the law or use loopholes to get the upperhand (Gamma NT understand society’s rules (though don’t care about them) and use that to our advantage), etc. It is very hard to paint this approach to life in a good light.Quote:
Originally Posted by End
A good Gamma leader, though pragmatically uses their forces, actually cares about them. The only reason they would use forces in a cold manner is because they believe that this way will lead to less of them (their forces) getting hurt (Ni-Te planning). A good Gamma leader will be volitional (Se), but will have genuine concern for their people’s worries and not forget the values they championed to get their title (Fi). This leader will rarely ever be rovolted against as most revolutions are due to strict adherences “bad” societal rules (Ti, “unfair” hierarchies). If there is a revolt on the account of cold methods: 1. It would be most likely be small due to strong loyalty because they (Gamma leaders) don’t “brainwash” their followers (Fe), but just put our ideas out there (Te) and followers came naturally. 2. Those same cool methods will destroy any spark of a revolution.
A good example of this type of leader is Otto Van Bismarck, the Iron Chancellor of Germany and an ENTj.
Did anybody say Berzerk already. I heard the main char is a good example of LIE.
Senku from the science shounen Dr. Stone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZlSC7NghaU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCZ2fts91cI
I have not watched any of stuff where Erwin Smith is but just by reading about his appearance and character it is hard not to think LSI. It is like perfect fit in abstract.
Ah, a fellow fan of the Iron Chancellor @Investigator. Too bad nobody heeded his warnings about that damned fool thing in the Balkans, especially that idiot Kaiser Wilhelm II. I'd bet money he was an Alpha. Firing from the hip on that one so I'm also curious to see if I'm calling it on a lark :).
Having just said that I think I heard of an anime that was basically Fantasy WWI a few months back. Isekai trash I believe but if it followed through on that basic concept despite that negative point I'd give it a chance.
Terrible CG, especially when you compare it to the work done by Ufotable in "Kara no Kyoukai" and "Kimetsu no Yaiba" (Tanjiro might be a consummate SEE now that I think about it, dude's pretty gamma IMO). Or in "Houseki no Kuni" where I could only tell because I know how it tends to work. They could have done so much better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Pixel
Not a bad manga to get into though and will agree that Guts is almost certainly a Gamma. Artwork there is superb as well. Hope the creator manages to complete the story before they die though. There's legit reasons to worry about that happening...
Yes the CG was horrible. I see Tanjiro as more of an introvert.Quote:
Originally Posted by End
He's an SEE-Fi IMO so I get the introvert vibe. Still, glad to know I'm not the only one watching that show. Hope it gets a second season and more. Episode 19 was only entry level in regards to the emotional nadirs the mangaka manages to pull off later on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Pixel
Sometimes villains/anti-heroes are way cooler than the heroes themselvesQuote:
Originally Posted by End
I have a hard time telling apart LIE inventors from ILEs, like Senku, or Mei Hatsume.
You get this vibe from them that they're very focused on "building their brand" but I don't know if that's enough.
Esay: LIE's are seeking for science in utilization perspective. ILE's just do it for discovery. I think seeing science as a tool to get something out of it seems like a blasphemy at first glance but it helps to discover new things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Accipiter
Senku’s followers seem like serious types (SEE or IEE for Chrome, ESI for Kohaku, LSE for Taiju)Quote:
Originally Posted by Accipiter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwfnhRLQXko
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VoMcCeeLp4
I think Rock in Black Lagoon might be LIE, could also be ILI though.
Kintaro Oe, the protagonist of Golden Boy, is probably a LIE-Ni. It's a comedy series, but it's the only instance I can think of. LIE's are underrepresented in anime and media.
Bruno Bucciariti - Ni-LIE or LSI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4NL8y5T3GQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSZ8dBHS67U