Subtype me (niffer)

I’m starting to doubt whether Ti subtype would be the better fit for me, if there is one.

Lots of people have suggested all sorts of types for me, from gamma SF (although these are frankly the more retarded and non-serious of the suggestions IMO :biggrin:), to xLI, and everything in between. Based on my observations and theirs now I’m not sure which is better, so please give me feedback.

Btw not a thread for disputing my main type. If you’re not sure by now it’s safe to say you’re a retard and can GTFO.

I've told you this before, but I think you're Se-SLE. Perhaps, that is why some people have mistyped you as SEE or some other type. My reasoning is that I just think you fit the Se-SLE descriptions better than the Ti-SLE descriptions overall.

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Originally Posted by Raver

I've told you this before, but I think you're Se-SLE. Perhaps, that is why some people have mistyped you as SEE or some other type. My reasoning is that I just think you fit the Se-SLE descriptions better than the Ti-SLE descriptions overall.

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:thumbsup:

Out of curiosity, since you’ve mentioned having two SLE brothers of different subtypes, could you go into some detail about them? Am I more similar to the SLE-Se one there too, because I think I had remembered you comparing me to the other one more before as initial reasoning to being previously considered the Ti subtype by you before @Raver . If I’m not mistaken, that is.

I was just wondering, how is it even possible to be a SLE Ti -H subtype? What a mix! I feel blessed I know someone special like that : p

seriously tho, I don't get DCHN theory but I don't see w9 too fitting for how you move around here, often chasing action and won't step back from saying right away what you think, maybe w7?

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Originally Posted by ooo

I was just wondering, how is it even possible to be a SLE Ti -H subtype? What a mix! I feel blessed I know someone special like that : p

seriously tho, I don't get DCHN theory but I don't see w9 too fitting for how you move around here, often chasing action and won't step back from saying right away what you think, maybe w7?

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Well Ti and H are both introverted subtypes. They also coincide better with w9. I have no idea what you’re referring to here about that being impossible or unlikely.

I have always tested pretty heavily as 9 wing subtype, just because I’m mouthy on here doesn’t mean much lol. I am not looking for ideas on that either (either DCNH or enneagram). I’m sorry I didn’t specify that before.

You're not logical. Lol. You believe in crap like astrology.

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Originally Posted by Singu

You're not logical. Lol. You believe in crap like astrology.

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Gimme kiss :love:

Btw ironically, the entire reason I got into astrology was because of the Strati SLE description which said that SLE women often get into it... so I got curious after reading that. Power of suggestion.

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Originally Posted by niffer

Well Ti and H are both introverted subtypes. They also coincide better with w9. I have no idea what you’re referring to here about that being impossible or unlikely.

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Yes Ti is Normalizing and H is represented by Si/Ni. So a SLE Ti -H is something like a SLE/LSI with his ignoring/ds activated. It's too cool to be true. I just don't get DCNH at all, truth be told : )

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I have always tested pretty heavily as 9 wing subtype, just because I’m mouthy on here doesn’t mean much lol. I am not looking for ideas on that either (either DCNH or enneagram). I’m sorry I didn’t specify that before.

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No problem, sorry you for the enneagram suggestion lol, I don't mean to impose any number on you, and shame on me for not getting it beyond the surface... 8w9 makes sense for a SLE Ti -H, yeah I can see that.

Your direction seems to be rather expansive. If I use two subtype system then I would say 'Se' sub.

DCNH:
SLE-C is supposed to have attacking attitude with fragmentary logic. Can be lots of things.
SLE-N is supposed to be honing in traditional methods via role to gain status (investments etc).

I think those two might qualify as Ti sub.

SLE-D is probably the person in charge when it comes to traditional ways of managing maneuvering forward in a society.
SLE-H is a person who works to get somewhere via pushing forward on their own path and being prone of having self searching and depressive episodes more frequently than other subs.

Those two make it sound more like Se subs.

@ooo If you have any comments on my sociotype subtype I’m still curious though lol :)

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Originally Posted by Troll Nr 007

SLE-D is probably the person in charge when it comes to traditional ways of managing maneuvering forward in a society.
SLE-H is a person who works to get somewhere via pushing forward on their own path and being prone of having self searching and depressive episodes more frequently than other subs.

Those two make it sound more like Se subs.

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What do you have to say about it being contradictory with H being an introverted subtype, with theoretically boosted Ni though?

How would you explain or account for this?

@Troll Nr 007 I agree with your observations and how you’ve pinned them to the different subtypes btw. I’m just pointing out how the structure of these systems make things problematic in light of each other (maybe the concept of subtyping is flawed in the first place).

I have tried to figure it out myself and I have noticed the contradictions.

Boosted :Ni: (and :Fi:) in H probably means something to engage in privacy and in terms of interaction it probably just means getting more into one's mind and weighing things more carefully. H is supposed to be quite similar to D descriptively (which is the closest to type representation) whereas C is the most dissimilar. This might suggest 'Se' sub for both of them.

Boosted just means how one would see functions manifesting in very general sense. :Ni: would be just wait and see approach. So if the person holds him/herself back it would point toward 'boosted' :Ni:.

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Originally Posted by niffer

@ooo If you have any comments on my sociotype subtype I’m still curious though lol :)

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Ahhhh Idk, to me there's just one subtype, the contact one. You're either a SLE or a SLE-Ti. Contact types should resemble their mirrors (and their quasi), because of the importance given to the creative function. An SLE- Ti should look something like a LSI, but he's still a SLE, just more in contact with his subconscious functions; this should follow in one's better grasp of their demo functions, for a SLE it's Te, a D element, but maybe for a SLE- Ti it's their ignoring, Si, H element. The DCNH dichotomies that are in the reach of our subconscious, say your case, H/D for a SLE, or C/N for an EIE, etc, should be accessed through the creative (from Jung), so yeah it makes sense to be a SLE-Ti-H, totes. It's a rather well balanced mix, sort of the ultimate perfection of a SLE, so yeah, there's that :D

Now as Troll said, it could be instead that the H actually belongs to the Se subtype, so that it could be in one's own typical SLE's ways to reach for their ds in ds ways, or ignoring ones, but I'm not sure it works like that, unless you just make the DCNH descriptions mean something separated from the model altogether. Or maybe you can access your unconscious from your base function, I don't know.

I'd say SLE-Ti C fits you better than H.

For more articulation around your subtype you should ask @Olimpia. I get lost around all those shades : )))

ps, I realize it's a rather useless post for your subtype but articulating it made me think better of the DCHN thing so thank you for that.

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Originally Posted by Troll Nr 007

H is supposed to be quite similar to D descriptively

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Why?

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(which is the closest to type representation)

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Did DarkAngelFireWolf69 say that?

@ooo Why C though?

why not? considering forum's activity, you're always in the mood to do something, either it's stirring the muds, participating in discussions, taking the side of someone, or of some ideas, it's a very "out there" behaviour, fits an Ep. you're even propositive, creative, involving people, caring that everyone participates actively in your ideas, and you've often shown a good amount of good ideas, perspectives and analysis that can support your leaning to Ti... I think C fits this side I see of you, but then it's probably just a tiny glimpse of what you are in this big world :o

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Originally Posted by ooo

why not? considering forum's activity, you're always in the mood to do something, either it's stirring the muds, participating in discussions, taking the side of someone, or of some ideas, it's a very "out there" behaviour, fits an Ep. you're even propositive, creative, involving people, caring that everyone participates actively in your ideas, and you've often shown a good amount of good ideas, perspectives and analysis that can support your leaning to Ti... I think C fits this side I see of you, but then it's probably just a tiny glimpse of what you are in this big world :o

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Thanks ooo :) btw I think you have 4D Ne Fe and 2D at minimum Te lol ;p ... what you said about me there could easily apply to you too. Idk though if I’m normal Ep vs. ‘extra Ep’ though..

or normal creative Ti vs extra that for that matter

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Originally Posted by niffer

Why?


Did DarkAngelFireWolf69 say that?

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It is from Vera Borisova's article. Borisova made empirical portraits while DarkAngelFireWolf69 did something else. I think DarkAngelFireWolf69's work describes boosted IE's in more general metaphorical form and it is up to reader to figure it out. It truly is source for confusion.
Anyways DarkAngelFireWolf69 says that naturally C tends to like C and N goes well with N by default. Sometimes D's might want to go after H for some reason. Subtype "duality" takes time apparently.

For example LSI-C and EIE-H: fireman meets Nostradamus.

Good stuff @Troll Nr 007.

I think the same as Raver, that you are SLE-Se type and because of that you sound like SEE.

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Originally Posted by falsehope

I think the same as Raver, that you are SLE-Se type and because of that you sound like SEE.

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What about me do you think sounds SEE?

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Originally Posted by niffer

What about me do you think sounds SEE?

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Well I think introverted subtypes are far more soft when approaching other people. Yet here you are demoralizing me. So I have the same urges. Or maybe it's just your SLEsness :-) But I know a woman who is SLE-Ti and she's very quiet for most of the time unless she starts telling a story then she's talkative, demonstrative and so on. But she's dominated by her IEI-Fe husband who doesn't treat her super-well, but he got better recently, at least he doesn't do it in front of other people.
Or maybe it's just you being like that in writing. But the SLE-Ti I know in writing is well moderate but at work she constantly forgets about something. Maybe too much weed (she takes one puff a day).
Not sure if these traits are related to socionics subtype but might be related to DHCN subtype. She's submissive, calm, quiet, and barely initiating. But at work is super-quick and effective, any job takes her 10-20 minutes. Would never tell a person to GTFO even conditionally. Not a chance.

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Originally Posted by falsehope

Well I think introverted subtypes are far more soft when approaching other people. Yet here you are demoralizing me. So I have the same urges. Or maybe it's just your SLEsness :-) But I know a woman who is SLE-Ti and she's very quiet for most of the time unless she starts telling a story then she's talkative, demonstrative and so on. But she's dominated by her IEI-Fe husband who doesn't treat her super-well, but he got better recently, at least he doesn't do it in front of other people.
Or maybe it's just you being like that in writing. But the SLE-Ti I know in writing is well moderate but at work she constantly forgets about something. Maybe too much weed (she takes one puff a day).
Not sure if these traits are related to socionics subtype but might be related to DHCN subtype. She's submissive, calm, quiet, and barely initiating. But at work is super-quick and effective, any job takes her 10-20 minutes. Would never tell a person to GTFO even conditionally. Not a chance.

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How am I demoralizing you? :lol: I’m just looking for concrete justification.

I’m very quiet and docile in IRL most of the time too actually, unless I’m alone with an introvert, and even then... I’m not very good at maintaining conversational rhythm. If you were a workmate especially, I would never let on that I have any kinds of outbursts (actually in general these are rare for me in irl—hence w9 typing for myself).

I relate to the part of the Ti subtype profile where I rarely snap, but when I do it’s more disturbing. DCNH-wise I think that could fit any of the SLE DCNH types except for​ C.

I don't see a problem with SLE-Ti and H together

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Originally Posted by Myst

I don't see a problem with SLE-Ti and H together

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I kept your typing for so long mainly because I'm sure you know me the best out of everyone here. :lol: It seems like lots of others have some different impressions of me though.

IEI subtype

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Originally Posted by Sol

IEI subtype

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Fuck off lol

@niffer I usually read your posts in my SLE friend's voice and it works pretty well. He's an inert subtype :Se: :Ti:

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

@niffer I usually read your posts in my SLE friend's voice and it works pretty well. He's an inert subtype :Se: :Ti:

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You read them in a guy’s voice?

@nefnaf also what about him is inert to you over contact?

Honestly I usually read my own voice in a guy’s voice too.

It’s not far from reality lol.

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Originally Posted by niffer

You read them in a guy’s voice?

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Initially did when I didn't catch your gender. Didn't stop after I found out lol.

Also might be at a [7] rn

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

Initially did when I didn't catch your gender. Didn't stop after I found out lol.

Also might be at a [7] rn

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Err.. bracketed 7?

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Originally Posted by niffer

Err.. bracketed 7?

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btw I just typed Swedish female pop star Ängie as SLE. But I haven't been able to find any video interviews to confirm

I'm curious about your thoughts

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

btw I just typed Swedish female pop star Ängie as SLE. But I haven't been able to find any video interviews to confirm

I'm curious about your thoughts

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that doesn’t answer the question of mine that you quoted lol

but yes I agree she does seem very SLE to me

@niffer I usually identify subtypes based on the Meged-Ovcharov type portraits

The portraits don't always "fit," but they do in a surprising number of cases

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Originally Posted by niffer

Fuck off lol

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women are charming :love:

ok. IEI type, <anything you wish today, honey> subtype

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

@niffer I usually identify subtypes based on the Meged-Ovcharov type portraits

The portraits don't always "fit," but they do in a surprising number of cases

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Based on both these subtype styles (that and DarkAngelFireWolf69’s) I do think I fit the Se subtype a lot more when I’m doing well in life, healthy etc., now that I’m reading through them again. Some points of these descriptions seemed very odd though. For instance: “This is a person of action and not reflection.” <— This was a part of the Ti subtype description but not the Se one. Why? Other parts also made it seem unclear as to why inert/contact would exert such an influence on the personality too.

I’m pretty interested in theory and meta or philosophical thought. I spend a lot of time on pondering and daydreaming, fantasizing etc. But according to these subtype descriptions, it makes it more like Se subtype, when that goes against theory. The Ti subtype should be the more theory-oriented, NT-like one.

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Originally Posted by niffer

that doesn’t answer the question of mine that you quoted lol

but yes I agree she does seem very SLE to me

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I know a few girls who dress almost exactly like her and have the same facial expressions/body movements. I tend to friendzone SLEs though, because while they're too much fun not to like, they're much too crazy to become my waifu.

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Originally Posted by niffer

Based on both these subtype styles (that and DarkAngelFireWolf69’s) I do think I fit the Se subtype a lot more when I’m doing well in life, healthy etc., now that I’m reading through them again. Some points of these descriptions seemed very odd though. For instance: “This is a person of action and not reflection.” <— This was a part of the Ti subtype description but not the Se one. Why? Other parts also made it seem unclear as to why inert/contact would exert such an influence on the personality too.

I’m pretty interested in theory and meta or philosophical thought. I spend a lot of time on pondering and daydreaming, fantasizing etc. But according to these subtype descriptions, it makes it more like Se subtype, when that goes against theory. The Ti subtype should be the more theory-oriented, NT-like one.

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If neither of those portraits really clicks, then it's fair to disregard them. In my experience, inert SLE is often smiling and trying to charm his conversation partner, while contact SLE is more serious and seemingly practical. Inert subtype is also much more "catlike" in movements

Ahh, nix what I said earlier about the thing I related to SLE-Ti more with because I was wrong, it was a part of the SLE-Se description posted (and I think written) by silke:

”Has sharp sharp mood swings and 'fallouts' (characteristic of all Pe-EPs). Can all of a sudden become angry, flare up, become very suspicious and negativistic. Generally, these flare-ups are less frequent with Se-SLEs than with Ti-SLEs, but they are much more intense and disturbing. It's like the Se-SLE holds his Ti in reserve for a while, then it suddenly it bursts out of him in a tirade.” ... I don’t really see how this is related to “holding in Ti” though... you’d think “holding in” would be a more introverted behaviour ... but ok.

From http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post745529 #59.

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

If neither of those portraits really clicks, then it's fair to disregard them. In my experience, inert SLE is often smiling and trying to charm his conversation partner, while contact SLE is more serious and seemingly practical. Inert subtype is also much more "catlike" in movements

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Alright, well it’s safe to say IMO that I match all the descriptions of SLE-Se more when a healthy individual at least. The reasoning behind these descriptions is still non-obvious for much of them to me though, so I’m reluctant to subscribe for that reason still.

Having met me irl what subtype am I @HERO

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Originally Posted by niffer

Having met me irl what subtype am I @HERO

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I don't have a strong opinion. I like SLE-Ti. Maybe ESTp-XXTj or ESTp-ISFj. If you think SLE-Se makes more sense for you, then that might be right, though.

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Originally Posted by HERO

I don't have a strong opinion. I like SLE-Ti. Maybe ESTp-XXTj or ESTp-ISFj. If you think SLE-Se makes more sense for you, then that might be right, though.

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w h y :) :) :) :)

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Originally Posted by niffer

w h y :) :) :) :)

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I'm not sure. I asked the Tarot cards and I got two different cards (both Pentacles/Disks) which represent the XXTj types. And then regarding the 16 court cards, for your subtype I got the Queen of Wands (ISFj).

Yet not taking that into consideration, at least to me, you don't seem like a stereotypical Beta Extravert with an extraverted subtype (e.g. Se-ESTp's like Courtney Love and Brody Dalle). I don't think I know many SLE's in real life, so I could be wrong. I think people can seem more extraverted online than in real life. I don't really like subtypes too much (they're way more subjective than just the basic 16 personality types). I'm not convinced that the system of just two subtypes can always be combined with DCNH in a straightforward way. Ultimately it's up to you what subtype you prefer; I'm not an expert at all.

Lol those stereotypical Se-ESTPs are literal rockstars too so it’s not like there are too many people at their level either :lol:

pretty easy to fall short of matching with the stereotype there

@HERO btw what would you type the card Justice? That’s one I’ve felt an affinity towards before.

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Justice is ruled by Libra and the card number is 11. The figure of Justice sits in her chair, cloaked in red and holding a sword in her right hand and scales in her left. She wears a crown with a small square on it representing well-ordered thoughts. Notice the clasp holding the cloak together. The square is the law protecting the circle and the eternal state of oneness within us all. The sword is double-edged, cutting both ways, signifying impartiality. It is point-up, signifying victory. The sword in her right hand demonstrates the logical, well-ordered mindset necessary to dispense fair justice. The scales are in her left, intuitive hand, showing that logic must be balanced by the intuition. A little white shoe pops out from beneath her cloak, reminding us of the spiritual consequences of our actions. The purple cloth draped behind her signifies compassion and the grey pillars represent the constraints of the physical world.
Put simply, the Justice card represents justice, fairness, truth and the law. As an outcome, the Justice card indicates that the fairest decision will be made. You are being called to account for your actions and be judged accordingly. Notice that Justice’s scales are balanced, thus its appearance indicates that events have worked out as they were meant to work out and that what is happening to you comes from the decisions you have made and the actions you have taken in the past. You have what you deserve. Justice represents a conscious awareness that your decisions and actions have long-term consequences and your present and future circumstances are most likely a result of these decisions and actions. At the same time, Justice shows that your actions in the future can be changed by a lesson learned in the present situation. You cannot become honest without extending that honesty to yourself and others. Justice reflects the search for truth. You need to know and speak the truth and perceive it in the words and deeds of others. Be fair and just with all and you will soon be able to detect dishonesty in yourself and others. Learn the rules that govern what you are involved with. This is a time to remain objective and to base your judgement on fact and not on heresay.

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Originally Posted by niffer

what would you type the card Justice?

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justice relates to Ti
being a card changes nothing

P.S.
It's funny to see how the conformism leads people to do not notice the evident, that your type is not even close to SLE. What you understood yourself previously when typed yourself to NF.

I agree that the Justice card is primarily Ti. Regarding sociotypes for the Justice card, I'd say LSI, LII, and LSE.

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Originally Posted by Sol

justice relates to Ti
being a card changes nothing

P.S.
It's funny to see how the conformism leads people to do not notice the evident, that your type is not even close to SLE. What you understood yourself previously when typed yourself to NF.

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Regardless of your intentions, I’ll just take this as a huge compliment from you saying I’m super self-dualized lmao.

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Originally Posted by niffer

Lol those stereotypical Se-ESTPs are literal rockstars too so it’s not like there are too many people at their level either :lol:

pretty easy to fall short of matching with the stereotype there

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I agree with @HERO here. I've known SLE-Se girls IRL and while they are not rockstars, they are really obviously extraverted, they have a very open look about them and are higher in and more consistent in displaying emotionality (Fe), and if I'm to analyze the emotional expressions for SLE-Ti, I'd say SLE-Ti instead has bursts of the emotionality and they do look more serious by default and less open. With SLE-Se, I can almost type the girls Fe bases (but I don't actually mistake them for Fe base for long, it's just almost like that sometimes). So I do think @nefnaf's summarization of SLE-Se vs SLE-Ti is good too, fits the experiences I've had with various SLEs. I would say both subtypes are practical though lol

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Originally Posted by niffer

”Has sharp sharp mood swings and 'fallouts' (characteristic of all Pe-EPs). Can all of a sudden become angry, flare up, become very suspicious and negativistic. Generally, these flare-ups are less frequent with Se-SLEs than with Ti-SLEs, but they are much more intense and disturbing. It's like the Se-SLE holds his Ti in reserve for a while, then it suddenly it bursts out of him in a tirade.” ... I don’t really see how this is related to “holding in Ti” though... you’d think “holding in” would be a more introverted behaviour ... but ok.

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I think the Ti is just the judgment part for the anger? What bursts out isn't Ti per se, just the judgment they make then will be executed via the anger and whatnot. That's how I interpret it anyway. BTW I never had the luck (?) to experience these flare-ups with any SLE-Se yet. So it really is just a guess. :)

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Originally Posted by Sol

It's funny to see how the conformism leads people to do not notice the evident, that your type is not even close to SLE. What you understood yourself previously when typed yourself to NF.

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No conformism in my typing her SLE. The only other types I ever considered are still ST types, there is no way she's got the perceptions of an NF :lol: You may be mistaking her Fe HA for that.

PS: I didn't forget the previous topic with you, I'll finally have more time for the forum sometime later this week.

@Myst I am by default more stoic and only open and social in bursts like you described. However, as I mentioned earlier in the thread I feel like I match the Meged and DarkAngelFireWolf69 Se descriptions a lot more over their Ti ones, and I know some other SLEs who are like this as well (default more stoic with burst of openness but otherwise fitting the Se descriptions more).

By contrast I don’t think I’ve matched up well with the Ti sub descriptions since 2016 or early 2017 when I was undergoing a lot more pressure and pissy and grumpy more of the time. I don’t think that’s my default when not under pressure though, aka most of the time (hopefully).

I’m open to the idea of these socionist-written descriptions being inaccurate in the first place too though of course. I’m interested in digging deeper to find out how the real differences really work, but since everybody just uses these accepted subtyping methods already it feels futile to try to discuss it.

ESI




























Se subtype :cool:

sigh

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Originally Posted by niffer

@Myst I am by default more stoic and only open and social in bursts like you described. However, as I mentioned earlier in the thread I feel like I match the Meged and DarkAngelFireWolf69 Se descriptions a lot more over their Ti ones, and I know some other SLEs who are like this as well (default more stoic with burst of openness but otherwise fitting the Se descriptions more).

By contrast I don’t think I’ve matched up well with the Ti sub descriptions since 2016 or early 2017 when I was undergoing a lot more pressure and pissy and grumpy more of the time. I don’t think that’s my default when not under pressure though, aka most of the time (hopefully).

I’m open to the idea of these socionist-written descriptions being inaccurate in the first place too though of course. I’m interested in digging deeper to find out how the real differences really work, but since everybody just uses these accepted subtyping methods already it feels futile to try to discuss it.

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OK, I don't know what you feel matches you more in Se descriptions (might've missed the post if you elaborated on it), I just think you are way more into analyzing with Ti than the SLE-Se's I've known and your brand of Fe matches up with that. I'm not following the descriptions word by word or anything like that, just what makes sense in terms of IE definitions and trends for manifesting those IEs. The rest is superfluous detail to me that's not even specific to type.

SLE women are a bit more difficult than men (from a typing pov). Did you post a video? The SLE-Se woman I know is more flashy than you but it may depend on culture.

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Originally Posted by Number 9 large

ESI




























Se subtype :cool:

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Esi se women and sle women share some similarities ime.

But ExTx vs IxFx interaction style should be easy to identify in ones self.

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Originally Posted by Myst

OK, I don't know what you feel matches you more in Se descriptions (might've missed the post if you elaborated on it), I just think you are way more into analyzing with Ti than the SLE-Se's I've known and your brand of Fe matches up with that. I'm not following the descriptions word by word or anything like that, just what makes sense in terms of IE definitions and trends for manifesting those IEs. The rest is superfluous detail to me that's not even specific to type.

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Yeah that’s what I mean. Just going by IEs it’s ambiguous and I do spend a lot more time on Ti and Ni stuff than even the average SLE-Ti I would imagine, but based on the descriptions word for word I match the Se ones a lot more anyway. There must be some error in all of this but idk where it is.

@FDG I would PM you pics/gifs or video chat with you if you wanted sometime lol but I’m not gonna post a video. Several members have seen me on video (chat) or have met me irl.

I'm starting to think that Se-ESTp could be the right subtype. Yet I'm still thinking a Gamma Rational subtype for you, in this case ESTp-ENTj. Yet that might conflict with your DCNH subtype. The cards didn't seem to have anything to say against your being Se-ESTp and Harmonizing; yet what do you think of (DCNH) Dominant subtype descriptions (especially with a bit more of an emphasis on Te)?

@HERO not to put you on the spot but could you give a quick/brief descriptive summary of your impressions of me so far from our meetings irl and (or vs) on here (can be like one sentence :lol: ) besides “yea u could be SLE” lol, I haven’t heard it yet actually. It’d be helpful here.

Beneficiary that looks like dual. :thinking:

I can kind of see that happening in short periods....

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Originally Posted by HERO

I'm starting to think that Se-ESTp could be the right subtype. Yet I'm still thinking a Gamma Rational subtype for you, in this case ESTp-ENTj. Yet that might conflict with your DCNH subtype. The cards didn't seem to have anything to say against your being Se-ESTp and Harmonizing; yet what do you think of (DCNH) Dominant subtype descriptions (especially with a bit more of an emphasis on Te)?

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Lol @kopyk and couple of others have suggested LIE for me before too. Idk how I feel about whole sub-sociotype subtypes though :lol: haven’t seen anyone use them until now

The dominant subtype would fit the second most for me out of all the SLE DNCH subtypes probably, followed by normalizing. I definitely qualitatively fit the harmonizing one the most word for word though.

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Originally Posted by Troll Nr 007

Beneficiary that looks like dual. :thinking:

I can kind of see that happening in short periods....

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Wot

It is like look some one needs bit help.... OK... you need even more... oh crap you turned out to be my beneficary.

Like EIE who had million things in his mind and all of it turned out to be unstructured constantly flowing at me waiting for systemization and now kitchen is a mess. I already did annual cleaning last month.:crying:

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Originally Posted by niffer

Regardless of your intentions, I’ll just take this as a huge compliment from you saying I’m super self-dualized lmao.

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My intention is to help others to understand the truth.
That "dualization" is your selfperception and mb the intention, tries for personal improvement. But if you'll need the relations, it will be better for you to choose SLE, not IEI.
More of the communication with people typed by you should to show you your real type by IR effects. Duals/semiduals give you more of what you want and need, you'll feel it. Identity are easy but boring, do not inspire so good.

Fi.subtype..

You will suffer from.inner feelings for the rest of your life. Good luck

I you are in fact Harmonizing, what more is there to say?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

@HERO not to put you on the spot but could you give a quick/brief descriptive summary of your impressions of me so far from our meetings irl and (or vs) on here (can be like one sentence :lol: ) besides “yea u could be SLE” lol, I haven’t heard it yet actually. It’d be helpful here.

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I’ll try, although I’m not really good at describing people. Maybe that’s one of the reasons I’m a mediocre writer. My mother sometimes draws her own accurate conclusions about people by looking at one or more pictures of them.

You seem pleasant, you use current slang expressions (which I’m not always familiar with), yet you also have a pretty good vocabulary (you’re probably more articulate than I am). There are at least a couple things about you that seem like they could be SLE and Fi-PoLR, I guess. You don’t seem like someone who likes to delve too deeply into the roots of complex psychological and/or social issues. [Then again, I could be wrong about this. I think you’re more interested in what you (and/or others) can actually do in the world as it is, in a realistic and practical way or something.] I think you’re better at making small talk than I am… and you also say certain things out loud that wouldn’t be typical of most types as a general rule (e.g. ESE, EIE, etc.), yet make sense for SLE. Yet you’re also quite open-minded and tolerant, yet not always punctual; and perhaps you sometimes make judgements about people based on surface/superficial clues and tells (surely everyone does that to a certain degree, yet it seems more Se.) You seem quite stable politically and otherwise, so a static type like SLE makes sense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HERO

There are at least a couple things about you that seem like they could be SLE and Fi-PoLR, I guess.

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Quote:

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you also say certain things out loud that wouldn’t be typical of most types as a general rule (e.g. ESE, EIE, etc.), yet make sense for SLE. Yet you’re also quite open-minded and tolerant, yet not always punctual

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XD ...

Was it when there were huge groups of black guys and chads in front of us and I told you to look??

Thanks!! I think your description is good!! Lol. And I promise I’ll be on time next time :x Thanks for waiting for me!!! (HERO probably waited over an hour for me in total :lol: :lol: ) Considering he doesn’t even like pussy this makes him a true HERO!

I'm not a @HERO, but understand the difference between SLE and IEI types unlike the local noobs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGcsIdGOuZY

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

:thumbsup:

Out of curiosity, since you’ve mentioned having two SLE brothers of different subtypes, could you go into some detail about them? Am I more similar to the SLE-Se one there too, because I think I had remembered you comparing me to the other one more before as initial reasoning to being previously considered the Ti subtype by you before @Raver . If I’m not mistaken, that is.

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The Se-SLE one is very outgoing and charismatic. The Ti-SLE is much more conscientious and goal oriented than the Se-SLE. The Ti-SLE is also outgoing and charismatic as well, but not to the same extent that the Se-SLE is. I find the Ti-SLE is often more callous than the Se-SLE one generally speaking. The Se-SLE tends to be more emotional and boisterous as well. On the surface, there is a lot of crossover and similarities, but the differences are notable nonetheless. If I was forced to choose, I'd say you would resemble the Se-SLE more than the Ti-SLE. However, you do share traits from both and overall I think you're kind of different from both of them too for non-Socionics reasons.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Raver

The Se-SLE one is very outgoing and charismatic. The Ti-SLE is much more conscientious and goal oriented than the Se-SLE. The Ti-SLE is also outgoing and charismatic as well, but not to the same extent that the Se-SLE is. I find the Ti-SLE is often more callous than the Se-SLE one generally speaking. The Se-SLE tends to be more emotional and boisterous as well. On the surface, there is a lot of crossover and similarities, but the differences are notable nonetheless. If I was forced to choose, I'd say you would resemble the Se-SLE more than the Ti-SLE. However, you do share traits from both and overall I think you're kind of different from both of them too for non-Socionics reasons.

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Ok lol :lol:

I was obviously curious because of what you’d mentioned SLE-Se’s occupation was before lol.

EIE ftw Fi subtype

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

Yeah that’s what I mean. Just going by IEs it’s ambiguous and I do spend a lot more time on Ti and Ni stuff than even the average SLE-Ti I would imagine, but based on the descriptions word for word I match the Se ones a lot more anyway. There must be some error in all of this but idk where it is.

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It doesn't seem ambiguous to me going by IEs (not sure I was following you there but nvm), I'm curious what main points from the Se ones fit you that much?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Raver

The Se-SLE one is very outgoing and charismatic. The Ti-SLE is much more conscientious and goal oriented than the Se-SLE. The Ti-SLE is also outgoing and charismatic as well, but not to the same extent that the Se-SLE is. I find the Ti-SLE is often more callous than the Se-SLE one generally speaking. The Se-SLE tends to be more emotional and boisterous as well. On the surface, there is a lot of crossover and similarities, but the differences are notable nonetheless. If I was forced to choose, I'd say you would resemble the Se-SLE more than the Ti-SLE. However, you do share traits from both and overall I think you're kind of different from both of them too for non-Socionics reasons.

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I think SLE-Ti are still pretty boisterous in bursts and that's what seems to fit niffer IMO :) But I think I already stated this. Not sure if I can add anything else atm.

Oh one thing: yeah the goal orientedness also fits.

@Myst a lot of people seem to have been thinking gamma SF could work for me. I don’t think it’s for no reason.

I’ll go through the descriptions and highlight what I feel works for me in a bit so you can look.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Myst

It doesn't seem ambiguous to me going by IEs (not sure I was following you there but nvm), I'm curious what main points from the Se ones fit you that much?




I think SLE-Ti are still pretty boisterous in bursts and that's what seems to fit niffer IMO :) But I think I already stated this. Not sure if I can add anything else atm.

Oh one thing: yeah the goal orientedness also fits.

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Yeah, they are. Overall, I think niffer is Se-SLE, but I wouldn't completely rule out Ti-SLE as a possibility mind you.

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The harmonizing Marshall subtype (SLE), of course, is inferior to the other subtypes by the manifestation of the power sensorics and differs from them in the direction of greater sensitivity. But this subtype of SLE surpasses them by their intellectual abilities and the ability to solve practical problems in a combinatorial way instead of direct pressure.

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source

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Originally Posted by nefnaf

If neither of those portraits really clicks, then it's fair to disregard them. In my experience, inert SLE is often smiling and trying to charm his conversation partner, while contact SLE is more serious and seemingly practical.

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Generally true. Ti-subtype seems to have this practical less of head-in-the-clouds feel, though this would seem counter-intuitive but I think this is due to them being "contact" sub thus they are more present in any given situation, which gives Ti-sub more of a realist no-nonsense presence.

Se-subs can almost resemble a Fe-EIE at times, and become randomly romantic an elevated due to extra emphasis on Fe HA. The few male ones I've met are quite outgoing and sociable and do like to pose themselves as charmers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

Ahh, nix what I said earlier about the thing I related to SLE-Ti more with because I was wrong, it was a part of the SLE-Se description posted (and I think written) by silke:

”Has sharp sharp mood swings and 'fallouts' (characteristic of all Pe-EPs). Can all of a sudden become angry, flare up, become very suspicious and negativistic. Generally, these flare-ups are less frequent with Se-SLEs than with Ti-SLEs, but they are much more intense and disturbing. It's like the Se-SLE holds his Ti in reserve for a while, then it suddenly it bursts out of him in a tirade.” ... I don’t really see how this is related to “holding in Ti” though... you’d think “holding in” would be a more introverted behaviour ... but ok.

From http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...l=1#post745529 #59.

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Enneagram reactive triad could also give that feel. But with socionics subtypes these flare-ups really happen once every blue moon on the average. The holding in refers to them holding in insisting on their judgement and personal opinions (Ti) which happens in favor of extraverted functions Se-Fe i.e. they are basically go-with-the-flow, irrationality personified refraining from judgement until something subconscious hits them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by silke

But with socionics subtypes these flare-ups really happen once every blue moon on the average. The holding in refers to them holding in insisting on their judgement and personal opinions (Ti) which happens in favor of extraverted functions Se-Fe i.e. they are basically go-with-the-flow, irrationality personified refraining from judgement until something subconscious hits them.

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How would you describe an SLE-Ti acting by contrast?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bertrand

”The harmonizing Marshall subtype (SLE), of course, is inferior to the other subtypes by the manifestation of the power sensorics and differs from them in the direction of greater sensitivity. But this subtype of SLE surpasses them by their intellectual abilities and the ability to solve practical problems in a combinatorial way instead of direct pressure.”
source

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I feel like I’m just being racially profiled

(:lol:)

I disagree that H’s Se manifestation would be weaker than the others per se (because Si, another sensing IE would be boosted supposedly)... in the same way it’d be strange to say an IEI-C’s Ni manifestation would be weaker. I think it’s more like the nature of how it manifests would be displaced kind of.

I’m not sure what the intellectual abilities thing comes from. It’s like he’s trying to indirectly say he thinks Se is dumb without openly admitting it.

That reminds me, one time on the way home @HERO and I went to pick up groceries. I’m not sure if he was trying to be politically or culturally sentitive towards me but he bought fortune cookies LOL :lol: :lol: :lol:. He has a very calming vibe, and it was a very chill time, nature of duality?? Anyway I’ll take you out to eat proper Chinese food next time :lol:.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

That reminds me, one time on the way home @HERO and I went to pick up groceries. I’m not sure if he was trying to be politically or culturally sentitive towards me but he bought fortune cookies LOL :lol: :lol: :lol:. He has a very calming vibe, and it was a very chill time, nature of duality?? Anyway I’ll take you out to eat proper Chinese food next time :lol:.

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I don't think I was trying to be politically or culturally sensitive, at least not consciously. I guess I just saw them and decided to buy a box of fortune cookies, especially since I don't remember ever buying them before. I also bought some sweets with matcha/green tea and peach-flavored Coca Cola. I'll probably have to buy another box of fortune cookies before 2018 is over. I get 6/49 (lottery) numbers from them. I've only had two so far, and they said "THE CURRENT YEAR WILL BRING YOU GREAT HAPPINESS." & "YOU ARE HEADING FOR A LAND OF SUNSHINE AND FUN."

@HERO XD

In the description what am I supposed to be looking for? It is long lol. Did you want me to highlight what works and what doesn’t or something?

I think overall this description focuses on what the Meged descriptions would classify as being Ti subtype. I’m not as aggressively grumpy and steely as this description would suggest and I’m sure you could agree. Sometimes I get into darker moods where I do have that side of me, but I am much more focused on being personable and fluffy if I can be, especially when around people in person.

You don't have to highlight what works if you don't want to or don't have the time. I don't mind. I remember sending that description to someone who's probably Se-ESTp, and that person didn't really like the description too much, so I guess it is kind of a Ti-ESTp description more than anything. I'm not really a fan of that description either; I was just curious as to how you'd respond to it. I think your response makes it seem even likelier that you are Se-ESTp and not Ti-ESTp.

@HERO Lol that being said, when I AM a bit grumpier some people who are more sensitive towards emotions or who know me well can really pick up on it. I think I do have a sort of drill seargent-like vibe sometimes based on people’s reactions some of the time to me (and without it really being intentional). Like I am frequently told that I seem really serious and that I should smile more.

Like I’ll never forget the time when I was living at a shared house in Japan last year, one morning I came back from a run with my hair tied back and rushing around all intense, I went into the kitchen to get my water bottle and said good morning, and all the guys who were watching TV in there suddenly sat upright really straight and said “GOOD MORNING” to me in unison in Japanese (this was the only time this happened lol, most of the time things were much more chill).

But in reality when things like this happen, internally I’m feeling like this guy:
https://youtu.be/Q9zvgcOrTtw

But then again people tell me once they get to know me a bit better they realize I’m essentially a laid-back unserious person.

I had a SLE (idk about subtype) "harmonizing" classmate @ college. He was quite intellectual, in some ways more than me, I was quicker but he had a deeper understanding of some specific contexts. He was male though so it´s hard to compare.

There was also a Se-SLE woman and she had an almost SEE feel to her, except more abrasive - you don´t seem similar.

So overall I vote for mixed subtype.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FDG

I had a SLE (idk about subtype) "harmonizing" classmate @ college. He was quite intellectual, in some ways more than me, I was quicker but he had a deeper understanding of some specific contexts. He was male though so it´s hard to compare.

There was also a Se-SLE woman and she had an almost SEE feel to her, except more abrasive - you don´t seem similar.

So overall I vote for mixed subtype.

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By mixed subtype do you mean in between Se and Ti? It’s not that clear to me how you got to this conclusion based on what you shared above there.

Since you don’t seem to think I seem similar, what do you think others here could be seeing when they do think I am Se subtype?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

By mixed subtype do you mean in between Se and Ti? It’s not that clear to me how you got to this conclusion based on what you shared above there.

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Yeah, mixed between Se and Ti. Thus no subtype.

I perceive you as different from both the Se-SLE woman I know, and a bit similar to the SLE-H male I know. The natural conclusion would be that I would type you as SLE-Ti (since you´re not similar to the Se variant imho), but since:

Quote:

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others here could be seeing when they do think I am Se subtype?

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Then I settle on mixed since there´s other people who see you as Se.

Overall a pretty crappy typing from a logical pov, I must admit yeah.

But you are saying you see me as similar to the “SLE-Ti-H” male then right @FDG ? But then are only diluting your final opinion based on others’ opinions :rolleyes: typical Te valuing asskissing victim shite! Don’t pussyfoot around lol.

So what about me do you think matches with this guy and what is different?

@Adam Strange What do you think?

without ass-kissing please, if it’s even possible

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

But you are saying you see me as similar to the “SLE-Ti-H” male then right @FDG ? But then are only diluting your final opinion based on others’ opinions :rolleyes: typical Te valuing asskissing victim shite! Don’t pussyfoot around lol.

So what about me do you think matches with this guy and what is different?

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You are more business-purposeful than him at least from the impression you give here. He is also quite stable in terms of mood and you seem somewhat more moody.

Similarity: both intellectually inclined, both have a family-oriented side.

my2c

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FDG

You are more business-purposeful than him at least from the impression you give here. He is also quite stable in terms of mood and you seem somewhat more moody.

Similarity: both intellectually inclined, both have a family-oriented side.

my2c

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>.> Where does the family-oriented come from?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

>.> Where does the family-oriented come from?

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Some stuff you wrote here and there, don´t ask me to quote now though...

If I´m wrong just say it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FDG

Some stuff you wrote here and there, don´t ask me to quote now though...

If I´m wrong just say it

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:lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

@Adam Strange What do you think?

without ass-kissing please, if it’s even possible

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Hi, @niffer.

Tough question. I work with two SLE's, one is Ti and the other is Se.

The SLE-Ti guy has a PhD and an MBA and can't tell you why he got them. He is very good at writing in a way that fantastically impresses me, but has a hard time with strategic thinking. He doesn't seem to get the big picture and doesn't really do much. He looks like a Business God, though. Great for impressing customers and getting them to sign contracts. He has executive hair and is tall and thin at 52.

The SLE-Se probably didn't finish college but if you give him a rock and some twine he will build you anything you ask for. He doesn't seem to think past the next twenty minutes, but he can tell you if someone moved something in a room which he last saw a month ago. He seems to need to be doing something every minute. If he's not pointed at a task, what he does is worry about whether or not he's still needed or he does busy-work, like organizing his work space. If you walk in to "his" area (which is a common area he has claimed, not strictly his), he's right there asking you why you are intruding on his space.

Both of these guys have this underlying insecurity about whether or not people like them, but they never state that in an obvious way. Both of them are personally assertive one-on-one, to the point of being really annoying sometimes. The SLE-Ti guy is gay (he looks like that white-haired guy on Mad Men, or like a thinner Mike Pence) but is smart enough to know that advertising that fact would hurt his image and so never talks about his private life, but he basically finds a lover where ever he happens to be. The SLE-Se is married but he serially cheats on his wife, because "she is an unstable, unreliable bitch and doesn't understand" him, and he devotes all his efforts towards his daughter.

So the question seems to be, do I see you as being smarter with facts and systems or more active in the world? I'd say smarter with facts and systems, so I'd lean toward SLE-Ti.

Your low-dimensional Fi and Fe (which I share), and your plain and refreshing assertiveness and bluntness would be common to both sub-types.

Thanks @Adam Strange

Lol the SLE-Se guy sounds like a wild animal. I guess I have trouble seeing how people like that can exist in modern society. My SLE landlord sounds kind of like this guy but isn’t that extreme. He’s a software developer, who seemed pleasantly amazed when I broke a glass bottle on the cement outside a few days ago. It doesn’t happen very often though, mind you (I don’t think ever before :lol:).

I just wonder where the line needs to be drawn for it to be considered one and not the other. Because I am out and about a lot, but that’s obviously not going to be very visible through the internet.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Adam Strange

do I see you as being smarter with facts and systems or more active in the world?

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Like I’m quite literally constantly going to and living in different places moving around the world, of my own volition.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niffer

Thanks Adam

Lol the SLE-Se guy sounds like a wild animal. I guess I have trouble seeing how people like that can exist in modern society. My SLE landlord sounds kind of like this guy but isn’t that extreme. He’s a software developer, who seemed pleasantly amazed when I broke a glass bottle on the cement outside a few days ago.

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Yes, he's kind of a beast. The only thing that restrains him is his need to be liked.
The police have been to his house (his wife called them), he has real problems working in most places (but LIE's can see his usefulness and aren't bothered by 1D Fi and 2D Fe) and he simply can't be beat for getting things done in the physical world, although he can take a really random approach to a job if things aren't spelled out for him.
He showed me a picture of one of the women he was cheating with, and she VI's as a beastly SEE. I think he said he had to break things off with her because she was too crazy for him, whatever that means.
From his description (I've never met her) his wife seems to be extremely introverted and is on anti-depressants. I sometimes wonder if she's IEI-Ni, but really, I have no idea. It seems unlikely, since I'd assume if she were, they'd mesh better than they do.

@Avebury what do you think?