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ESEs have been much more manipulative *ime* but the ones i've known like that have been unhealthy 2s and i think it was more about that. i have a hard time separating ESEness from 2ness so i struggle with typing ESEs who aren't the typical 2 type. that said, with ESEs i get the impression they want to put themselves in my life and with SEEs its more like they might invite me into theirs. meh thats really subjective i guess. as far as leadership, with ESEs i get the impression they actively work to put themselves in that role and with SEEs it seems more like it just happens. the ESEs i've known have been more put together fashion wise but idk if thats type related. this is all subjective and based on my experience so yeah 2 cents.
You make it sound as though 2's are always unhealthy which is SO sad. . . because healthy 2's are about the awesomest people out there IMO, of course, unhealthy two's are terrible. . .
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ESE are good at being manipulative and they can try to be, but they usually end up giving more then they get back in return. This is one of the reason a lot of people like them, since nobody feels they got ripped off in the social interaction.
They mostly like being paid attention to and being needed by others for some reason or another.
SEE's are friendly but I feel like they're trying to get something from me usually, usually money, influence, sex, whatever they happen to want. I've found quite a few of them to be horrible at paying back their debt, which I view is untrustworthy.
Pretty good general description. :)
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I'm glad someone else has trouble differentiating the two. Personally I still haven't figured it out, but here are the observations I use in telling the two apart (not saying that they're all that accurate though).
ESEs and SEEs are both imo social leaders. Either type will be the visible ones in group interactions. Energy levels will differ however. ESEs tend to exhibit a consistent high level of positivity. Most I know subscribe to the idea that emotions are transitive so they want to keep the atmosphere up if it kills them. Lots of negativity disturbs, annoys, and throws them off kilter. They aren't exactly impulsive but are led by their emotions in a way that often doesn't have a clear sense of what will happen as a result. To an extent, they will say things they suspect to be false merely as a way of keeping moods high. That isn't the same as lying, they aren't really fantastic judges of what will happen and tend to err on the sunny side. ESEs are more practical imo and are concerned with how people around them are doing in a manner more immediate and transitory than how an SEE would look at it.
The energy level of SEEs alternates from low relaxed states to hyperactive raucous behavior. They're more image driven than ESEs. They desire to be seen as important, influential, or at least like up and comers if they aren't yet. SEEs will talk about the things they want to be, without extremely clear ideas of the route that will get them there. They can be prone to get rich quick kind of thinking. They are also deeply impulsive individuals and, in the case of at least one SEE I know well, not very practical in money matters. Lending money to an SEE is tricky business. It's not that they don't have every intention of paying you back. In fact, they'll consider it something important and reassure you even if they can't afford to get your money back yet. However, they have difficulty differentiating between vital needs and simple desires, coupled with their proclivity to look good status wise, their discretionary income has a tendency to hit a paycheck to paycheck kind of living in the worst cases. Mired in the present, they poorly sense what needs to be done now to achieve later. SEEs are not the kind of person you want planning anything. SEEs are concerned about people around them as well, but it tends to take the form of being worried if people are trying to distance themselves from them. They'll go to significant lengths to maintain important relationships, which may not be merely personal nor professional but both. Frequently, SEEs try to establish friendships with people that have something tangible to offer them in return, though I'm not sure this is a distinction they are all that aware of, that they try to get close to people they want something from. What tends to bother SEEs most is when others get bogged down too much in all the different ways something could go down, when others expect their words to mean precisely what they implicate, or when others around them are uncertain or not possessed of clear and direct wills.
Because of their need to be seen as potent, SEEs respond very poorly to anything they perceive as attempts to 'make them look bad'. This isn't always the intention, but take this example of my roommate: He invited a girl to come over and hang out with him while he, I, and a coworker of his were drinking. While watching a movie (No Country For Old Men), the three of us get into a discussion about attack dogs. The coworker and I are talking about how dangerous they would be (70+ pounds minimum, relentless, animals that have been bred for generations to hone their most aggressive, violent instincts) and my roommate is adamant that no dog could ever kill him or even seriously hurt him. This other guy and I were kind of laughing about it, trying to show him the realistic side of the scenario (they'd likely be faster than you, etc) and he just keeps getting louder and louder about, "NO! NO! I'M NOT GOING TO LET A DOG KILL ME! WHY WOULD YOU GUYS LET A DOG KILL YOU?" It's obvious he's actually getting riled up by the discussion, since this girl is sitting right next to him, and he makes the claim that all you have to do is stick your hands in its mouth and rip its jaw open while it leaps at your throat, which makes us bust out laughing. He gets so upset at this that he jumps off the couch, leans over me while I'm sitting, grabs me by the shoulders, shaking from adrenaline and anger and sort of growling/grunting, "I'M AN ANIMAL TOO!" I gently pushed him back and chuckled since I could tell he wasn't actually trying to be violent, gestured for him to take a seat and tried to placate him by saying, "Look, man. I'm not saying you couldn't kill an attack dog in one on one, but you've got to admit the dog's got a serious fighting chance." He just keeps shaking his head and saying things, jokingly, but still kind of serious like, "Do I really have to go kill a dog to prove I'm right?" The other guy wanted to keep the conversation going, but by then the girl and I tried to drop the subject and get back to the movie. Sort of a long anecdote there, but I thought it was worth mentioning.
You have SEE's down to a "t"! :biggrin: I've noticed all of these tendencies in their type and they bug me greatly. . . :8* btw, what type are you? :content:
