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LSI-Ses are still sticklers but are more impulsive and a bit more freedom-seeking, while SLE-Tis are still showboats but in a more principally sound and long-term rewarding way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantasmagorical
I'm just joking about the sticklers/showboats. Both types are great people, of course.
Actually showboats and sticklers isn't far off.Quote:
Originally Posted by William
Too funny. Before you typed IEE, then IEI...now SLE....I've never laughed so hard at how off somebody was.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantasmagorical
Most people don't have a subtype, you should keep this in mind also if you are trying to decide your type/sub-type.
On subtype - DarkAngelFireWolf69 mentioned subtype can change (or form) but it is a gradual shift rather than something quick.
Myself I am a slight Ti sub type, not as heavily pronounced as others, but the way things are going I wouldn't be surprised if I move to being balanced ego function preference rather than leaning towards the Ti.
What would be a situation with too much raw potential? I don't disagree with you, I'm just wondering.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Foundation
Yeah, but this doesn't stop LSI from being an asshole or from offending people. I meant more in the sense that, if they threw their weight around and people were affected, this would be a variable that they hadn't accounted for, and it might ruin the bigger plan (this is what I consider Ne-phobia). Then they might have to conjure up some Fe to smooth things over, which is less comfortable than following the original plan in the first place.Quote:
I like this. It illustrates the :Fe: accepting element (affecting people emotionally) of the LSI and how it is a major influence on the overall directive of the type (:Ti: directive), whereas the SLE with :Fe: as a producing element might find it as a sort of side dish or nice touch to :Ni:.
The LSI is wary of situations that don't have a direct plan to how they will go. To them, there must be a plan, there must be instructions, so to speak, for the LSI to follow. Without a sense of direction, the LSI is somewhat lost. This is best understood through weak :Ne: devaluing and :Ni: valuing:. Weak :Ne: forces the LSI to be wary of things that are completely ambiguous, due to the fact that they generally deal with absolutes and certainties (as introverted static types, they focus on what isn't changing, the absolutes and certainties to anchor themselves to reality). The LSI seeks out :Ni:, direction, guidance, something that tells them what is going to happen. :Ne: is the counter-perspective to this, "anything can happen, do whatever you want, the possibilities are limitless", there is no inevitability or laid-out plan, there is only chaos to them in :Ne:.Quote:
Originally Posted by maithili
Agreed on this point as well. :Fe: is still a major influence on the type, but it is still a weak element, they seek :Fe: from others, while generally being fairly bad at it themselves considering the fact that they are always in a :Ti: perspective concerned with establishing order.
Lol. An SLE friend I have never actually "scored" as ESTp on any test he took (I made him take at least 3). He was self-conscious at the time of being a people-whore, and refused to accept that he was "E". It's funny when people who are obviously extraverts, in both normal English and socionics, suddenly decide they are introverts bc they saw a Buzzfeed listicle on how being an introvert is cool. I don't think that was the reason for him though, I'm just saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kill4Me
Anyway my point is that all the types he did score as were solidly ST. I don't think an SLE would ever see the option "is attracted to unrealized potential and abstract ideas over concrete reality" and decide, yep! That's me.
Subtypes change just about everything and that's exactly why there has been so much confusion between LSI and SLE, other than that LSI-Se are slightly less sociable than SLE-Ti and have fewer friends, LSI-Se are more selective than SLE-Ti and take a bit longer to sort out who they want to be friends with.
LSI-Se and SLE-Ti are pretty similar, there really isn't all that much difference between the two, other than LSI-Se are more creative/original, more eccentric, think somewhat more deeply, and slightly more able to invent systems.
Both have that laser focus, both are impersonal and not into empathic/emotional/very personal contact with others (if they hang out with someone, there has to be some good Fe and some good hands-on or intellectual activity), both are logical and cerebral and think clearly, both make jokes often especially the LSI-Se. Both have good, gentle voices
~LSI-Ti are kind of impulsive and pretty surface level about things, they don't understand things in as much depth and details as the Sensory subtype (and SLE-Ti).
~They have smaller heads on average.
~They are less emotionally self-controlled (especially women) and more internally emotional than SLE-Ti and LSI-Se.
~They're also not socially permissive, and they're pretty easily offended, sometimes they show it loudly sometimes they don't.
~They're pretty unaware of their surroundings, not as visual as SLE-Ti and LSI-Se.
~They're more likely to over-react and see things as problems than LSI-Se and SLE-Ti; they wouldn't make good police officers (partly because of their slow visual processing speed, their lower emotional self-control, and them not thinking things through, they make decisions without evidence, usually instinctively--their Ti is pretty instinctive and makes snap judgments pretty quickly).
~They're also more perfectionist than the Se subtype and go by external standards more rather than their own, or they mix external standards with how they personally want it to be.
~They have stronger likes and dislikes towards people than the Sensory subtype does.
~Less gentle than SLE-Ti and LSI-Se.
~LSI-Ti are slightly needier than SLE-Ti.
~LSI-Ti are louder and less smooth/more abrupt in speech than SLE-Ti.
~LSI-Ti are worse with math, deductive logic, and spatial awareness and analysis and less articulate than SLE-Ti. LSI-Ti have a more serious, urgent vibe than LSI-Se do.
~LSI-Ti have louder, more abrupt, commanding voices with more intonation, emphasizing words than LSI-Se and SLE-Ti.
~As can be concluded from what else I've said, LSI-Ti aren't anywhere near as good with equipment as LSI-Se and SLE-Ti.
~LSI-Se women are more sexually aggressive/initiating than LSI-Ti women, it's vice-versa for men.
~SLE-Ti women are also more sexually aggressive/initiating than SLE-Se, it's vice-versa for men.
~LSI-Ti parents are stricter, much more punitive and demanding than LSI-Se parents.
~LSI-Ti have more sympathy and more willing to help out of compassion or personal like than LSI-Se.
~LSI-Ti views on justice (justice is arrived at subjectively), are a bit less interested in self and based on sympathy rather than reason compared to SLE-Ti and especially LSI-Se.
~LSI-Ti are less likely to be aware that they're logical types; many think or ask if they're ESI at first or can't decide between that and LSI and SLI. Ti isn't really conscious for them/they aren't aware of it (which makes sense since they have Ne-PoLR and since they're more likely to make decisions based upon their feelings than the Sensory subtype), they rely more on observations, external standards, and are more inductive than the LSI-Se and SLE-Ti.
~SLE-Ti and LSI-Se look more feminine, have wider faces, more red and blonde hair, paler skin, have smaller buttocks, larger breasts, and wider, stronger looking shoulders, longer tibia, have smoother movements, and more physical stamina than LSI-Ti and SLE-Se.
SLE-Se men are kind of pushy and attention seeking and pretty emotional and kind of nervous when dealing with people. They have a harder time focusing than SLE-Ti, they're also less creative than the SLE-Ti. Their vibe is a bit heavier/less gentle. Any gentleness from the Ti sub is lost with the SLE-Se.
SLE-Se and LSI-Ti keep their homes in order, everything has to be clean, no disorder is allowed; LSI-Se and SLE-Ti (especially LSI-Se) leave things around, don't care about cleanliness as much, things don't always match, dishes are left on the counter, lights aren't turned on, etc. IEE-Ne, IEI-Fe, and EIE-Ni are similar to SLE-Se and LSI-Ti in that regard; ILE-Ti, IEI-Ni, and EIE-Fe are similar to LSI-Se and SLE-Ti in that regard.
I suspect a huge reason why just about all data about performance IQ subtests favor males (especially picture arrangement and block design), is because LSI-Se tend to not participate in samples; they're often homeschooled and gently turn down requests for assistance or can see ahead and avoid whoever's going to ask them. Most LSI-Se are females, whereas most LSI-Ti are males. Most ILE-Ti are females, and I suspect they didn't participate in samples much either. The only thing I can really think of as to why the IQ data would be representative of everyone is that males have visibly achieved more throughout history. But even then that's not really enough to conclude that the data is representative of everyone.
Differences between IJ and EP temperament should be obvious enough to tell the difference. LSI will be more careful with Ti.
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