PDA

View Full Version : ESTp type and subtype description from socioniko.narod.ru [Zhukov]



Malyshka
10-19-2004, 06:02 PM
What do you think or would like to learn about them?

Malyshka
10-19-2004, 06:35 PM
Sensory-logical extrovert
(irrational)
ESTp
Zhukov, The Legionnaire

Gueorgui Zhukov - Marshal of the Soviet Union, a famous commander during the World War II.

1. The end result. This is the only thing that interests him. All he needs to achieve the final result he considers to be his vested interests. He is a strong-willed, determined person. "If stars shine at night Ė then somebody wanted it". With all his appearance he demonstrates he is far from being ostentatious, does not care for the impression he makes with others. ďI did not understand, please repeat." Ė used to say Sergey Korolyov, the mastermind of the Soviet space technology. Few of Soviet top executives had the guts to ask this from Beria, the head of the Soviet secret police. All The Legionnaire does is performed with ardor, passionately and must be brought to its conclusion. He has the personality of an untamed struggler, who must come out on top no matter what the cost. "One should not avoid difficulties! One needs to learn how to overcome them" is his motto.

2. Die Hard. The expression "severe but just" became already trivial about this sort of persons. Marshal Zhukov was a really tough person, but only he could say to Stalin: "If you believe that the Head of the Chief Headquarters is capable only of talking gibberish, then he has no reason to be here. I ask you to relieve me of my rank as the Head of the Chief Headquarters and to send to the front". He has no back thoughts about his right to manage other people. Even taking into account his love to collegial discussion of issues, he always reserves the last sentence for himself. This is usually compensated by profound passion for his cause and the ability to seed the same enthusiasm in others.

3. A fine tactician. He quickly grasps the current situation and distribution of power, makes a decision and acts. He is capable of political maneuvering but never forgets his line. He possesses powerful logic function, but this kind of logic is determined and thus biased, its purpose isnít philosophical speculations but the creative search for the shortcut to finding a solution. It is easier for him to concede his logic than his goal.

4. Dispassionate. He seldom gives in to fear, hatred, and other negative emotions, rarely gets surprised and rarely envies. The more dangerous the situation, the more self-disciplined and resolute he becomes.

5. He does not like to speak about feelings: this is not his line. And if by chance such words slip out, he feels as if he betrayed himself. He is afraid of emotional love, considering it an undeserved luxury. He is anxious of other feelings as well. Perceiving others to be just like him, he has no doubt that he may be desired, but he is seldom sure he can also be loved. He needs his partnerís emotional support and submits his emotions to him. However, in practical activity he never tends to adaptation, but only to dictation.

Your dual (psychologically complementary type): Yesenin, The Lyricist (intuitive-ethical introvert).

Malyshka
10-19-2004, 06:35 PM
ESTPs generally have either slim figures or firm and solid figures. Slim ESTPs have slow and phlegmatic movements, giving the impression of calmness and self-confidence. Females often have a fragile appearance. Solid ESTPs have free and flexible movements. When standing in one place they tend to wriggle rhythmically as if they have a slight electric current running through them.

Their eyebrows are often asymmetrical. When ESTPs want to show their dissatisfaction they frown as if they are angry. Older ESTPs often become puffy and swollen around the eyes. They also have a tendency to squint. Their noses are usually quite wide at the base and their jaws are also large and square. They may have thick, immobile lips, making their speech somewhat garbled.

ESTPs rarely wear eye-catching clothes. They try to maintain a neutral style of clothes, steering away from fashion. Females prefer not to wear very bright or colourful clothing. Males have an inclination to official styles of clothing such as suits etc. ESTPs generally prefer to remain in the shadows.

When in conversation, ESTPs always show self-restraint and tact. They generally interact in an open and friendly manner, always showing positive emotions. They do not like to openly express their opinions. During interaction ESTPs always try to show that they are paying full attention and that they understand their interlocutor very well. One of the ways they do this is by asking many questions concerning personal problems or opinions. They do this with masterful tact and delicacy, therefore gaining other peoples trust very quickly.

ESTPs have a very characteristic way of behaving when in conversation. They can pause for long periods of time before replying to questions or statements. This can give the impression that they are assimilating the received information. In situations such as these they usually squint. ESTPs are never afraid to show others that they did not understand or do not know something and therefore never hesitate ask people to repeat or to specify what they said. ESTPs enjoy showing their understanding and like to explain things to others. They always do this slowly and methodically giving simple, practical examples. They also prefer to have the last word in conversations, concluding the dialogue themselves.

When in confrontation, ESTPs quickly focus on their opponents weaknesses, usually destroying them with one perfectly placed phrase. If this opportunity does not manifest itself, they have the skills to provoke the reaction they desire. ESTPs are very slow to anger. And when they do become angered it is very difficult for them to calm down. They like games that require quick thinking and tactics and often win these games as they have great skill misleading and provoking their opponents into making bad moves.

ESTPs have cast-iron self-control and nearly always achieve their goals. If required they can step on anyone or anything often ignoring ethics completely if the situation calls for it. If a project becomes too big and difficult for them to control by themselves, they will delegate the less important parts of the project, giving others complete independence to make their own decisions. ESTPs do not care much how people achieve results. They give others complete independence to choose their own method of working, as they consider the end result to be more important.

ESTPs are very tactically minded and know how to adapt to changing situations very quickly. They know how to arrange people according to their abilities and usefulness. They prefer to adopt an informal and unofficial leadership. They also do not like doing their own dirty work. ESTPs are hard working and extremely persevering people. The more obstacles they meet the more obvious these qualities become. They do not react well to unchallenging situations. They truly come alive in the face of adversity. ESTPs are inclined to give ultimatums.

root
10-20-2004, 06:04 AM
????? ????? ?? ????????: ????? ??? ??????!

alexia
11-20-2004, 09:29 AM
These descriptions of ESTP's sound kind of serious. But I've met a few sociable ones also...

Do all sites describe them in this manner?
________
STRESS ADVICE (http://www.health-forums.org/stress/)

metaiwan
11-21-2004, 08:14 PM
Yes, I think ESTPs are usually social too. Almost as social as ESFP... must be the :Se: . I guess a type description isn't going to ever give you the full picture, there are some things which are common to all people, while type descriptions probablly are going to describe things that are unique to the certain type...

CuriousSoul
11-23-2004, 04:26 PM
These subtype descriptions by Valentina Meged - Psychologist (intuitive-ethical extrovert) ENFP and Anatoly Ovcharov - Craftsman (sensory-logical introvert) ISTP, can be confusing and opinions on them are divided but nonetheless they should be worth looking at, in my opinion they can be of some use in typing.

This description was from www.socionics.org
Sotsionicheskaya newspaper: № 01 (01), 22.11.2002

Note of editorial staff.

Attention! Until now in sotsionike there is a large problem because the authors of the different theories of subtypes so did not agree about the general terminology. There exists as the minimum of 3 theories of 32 subtypes (authors of present article, V.V.Gulenko and Ye.S.Filatovoy). In each of these theories the type is divided into two subtypes, as the authors consider, with the "intensive" first or second function (i.e. for example logico- intuitive introvert it can be "logical" or "intuitive" subtype). Problem in the fact that each divides type in in own way own way, and here terms are used the same. We request to consider this with reading of article.

We focus attention on the fact that also the pseudonyms of types all the more subtypes, used in this article, they are not in sotsionike conventional.


Sensory- logical ekstravert: LEADER, ESTP
Appearance SLE is very diverse. This type of personality is not always simple for visual diagnostics as type Eie. It is possible to isolate these common features:

Cold, evaluating view, sufficiently tenacious, entire noticing, but with the light haze or the languishing eyes, which imparts to it at times the expression of innocence, romanticism or pensiveness. Smile SLE does not always correspond to the expression of eyes; therefore it can appear stretched. Most frequently it smiles on the specific occasion, but not in order to arrange to itself.

Motions well coordinated, harmonious, although somewhat irregular can be. Gait usually is smooth, is confident, is flexible, "cat". It is noticeable that man cans himself tax, to emphasize the merits of its body. SLE knows how to easily bear its body, even having significant weight. It dresses, as a rule, with the taste, it loves expensive, rare things. Style on each day of business or sport.

If in a good mood - it is weakened and oars. In the poor mood of lip they are compressed, view sullenly. Poses moderately flattened, gestures important-looking, willingly demonstrates force and confidence in itself. It is time it is impatient, with the unexpected drops in the mood: first it is impulsive and cuttings, then it is ironic and affectionate with the notes of intimacy in the voice.

COORDINATOR

Sensory subtype seems by person ingenious, impulsive, who conceals the concealed threat and by no means reasonable. In actuality it is sharp, sufficiently aggressive and persistent. It can be rancorous and it is sufficient to resourceful in order to make life of the svikh ill-wishers of that of simply not tolerated. Has a nature contrasting and unpredictable. With those, whom it loves, it is periodically is very affectionate and even it is sentimental. It possesses such feeling of humor, which easily passes into the sarcasm or the caustic irony. Is talkative, obayatelen, it is ingenious, critical and cuttings, it loves epithets and slang expressions. Its motions are elastic and rapid, gait only waddle, elbows are slightly bent with walking, which gives cat ingratiating tones to it. Is characteristic the evaluating view with light prishchurom. Usually it follows its health, it is periodically occupied by sport or gymnastics. It dresses dearly and with the taste. The bright impression of confident in itself, flourishing person usually is produced.

ORGANIZER

Logical subtype leaves the impression of calm force and confidence in itself. It is rational and sequential in the matters. It is industrious and hardy. It is usually cold-blooded, sustained and imperturbable, but into the minutes of irritation it does not hide its fury, which is manifested in the view and the sharp, categorical gestures. In the calm state it is polite, amiable, although it holds collocutor on a certain distance. Its humor of cuttings is rather rough. In it there is rapid, distrustful view from under the eyebrows. Form usually is serious, is alerted. Gait and gestures are harmonious, are smooth and are clear. Somewhat monotonous dresses, and it is strict, although with the times of unexpectedly thrust or it is extravagant. It values qualitative clothing, rarely creating ensembles from a few things. In the majority of the cases it has a tendency too not to be separated. This relates both to the behavior and to the clothing. It seems cold and inaccessible, although he tries to be correct, flat and benevolent. It is held with the merit.

Uncle Ave
06-08-2005, 01:22 PM
These descriptions of ESTP's sound kind of serious. But I've met a few sociable ones also...

Do all sites describe them in this manner?

ESTPs really aerent such serious people. Theyre playful in their attitude more than anything else, even though they get competitive all the time about every single thing, which is mistaken for serioussness by some people, I guess.

Herzy
06-08-2005, 08:16 PM
After doing some serious research and long test taking, it turns out that I'm indeed an ESTp, so I was posting in the wrong quadra's turf before. Meh.

Basically, because of our nature, we are usually playful and casual, but I can be serious on some occasions if the situation calls for it.

Because of our strong :Se: , we love almost all kinds of sports, ranging from baseball to extreme sports, and I live for risks.

We usually don't get criticized too much, except when it comes to manners and such, because of the weak :Fi: . I constantly get comments from people saying that I'm not very polite. The problem is, whenever I try to be (to teachers/athority figures in general), it feels so unnatural, and I have to force the words out of my mouth. :?

Hay preguntas?

science as magic
06-09-2005, 06:36 AM
Nooooooooo!!!!!!!!

indigoroom
06-09-2005, 08:02 AM

Uncle Ave
06-09-2005, 04:33 PM
After doing some serious research and long test taking, it turns out that I'm indeed an ESTp, so I was posting in the wrong quadra's turf before. Meh.

Basically, because of our nature, we are usually playful and casual, but I can be serious on some occasions if the situation calls for it.

Because of our strong :Se: , we love almost all kinds of sports, ranging from baseball to extreme sports, and I live for risks.

We usually don't get criticized too much, except when it comes to manners and such, because of the weak :Fi: . I constantly get comments from people saying that I'm not very polite. The problem is, whenever I try to be (to teachers/athority figures in general), it feels so unnatural, and I have to force the words out of my mouth. :?

Hay preguntas?

That pretty much sounds like my ESTp cousin. Yeah ESTps can lack poiliteness but with him its not too bad, its actually kind of natural for him I guess, and thats just how he is and I wouldnt have him any other way. I dont think ESTps ever get too evil towards humanity because of their hidden agenda. They can get rough with other people, but they always seem to impose limits on themselves when it comes to their roughness, and this is when their hidden agenda becomes obvious( if it wasnt already).

Herzy
06-09-2005, 07:39 PM
Nooooooooo!!!!!!!!
No what? :?



That pretty much sounds like my ESTp cousin. Yeah ESTps can lack poiliteness but with him its not too bad, its actually kind of natural for him I guess, and thats just how he is and I wouldnt have him any other way. I dont think ESTps ever get too evil towards humanity because of their hidden agenda. They can get rough with other people, but they always seem to impose limits on themselves when it comes to their roughness, and this is when their hidden agenda becomes obvious( if it wasnt already).
And it's the exact same thing as 2 of my ESTp friends also. :) Sometimes it's fun to be rough, but I know my boundaries.

science as magic
06-09-2005, 11:59 PM
No what? :?

Heh it was just a joke because if you are ESTP then you are my supervisor.

ESTp > INTj > ENFp > ISFj

was saying YES! because if you are ESTP then you are his Dual.

Herzy
06-10-2005, 12:13 AM
Oh, I didn't know that that was what you two were referring to. (I didn't know was INFp either). :o

Hmm, well I have lots of experience with relationships of supervision, as I am my twin brother's supervisor. I found that he gets really irritable when I'm around him for long periods of time, but he's always really happy to see me if I've been gone for a while. Now thanks to Socionics and that I'm finally confident in his and my types, I finally realized why he gets like that. Yipee! :8*

science as magic
06-10-2005, 12:24 AM
Lol sad isn't it? My brother is ENFP so I know what you mean ;)

Herzy
06-10-2005, 12:36 AM
Haha, supervisions can be quite interesting at times. :wink:

Just out of curiosity, Pedro, do you know any ESTp's personally? Because I don't think I know any ISFj's, so I'm not sure what it feels like to be the supervisee.

science as magic
06-10-2005, 12:46 AM
Yep I know one (that I have spent a good amount of time with).

We get along pretty well. The most memorable interaction that comes to mind is when he told me (in a very friendly polite manner) that I needed to buy some deodorant cause I stank :lol: It was useful advice that I have tried to follow ever since ;)

Herzy
06-10-2005, 12:49 AM
Haha, my mom (ESTj) always says that to my brother. Could it be an INTj thing? :lol:

science as magic
06-10-2005, 01:18 AM
Well it seems to be the worst in the Njs because of the weak sensing. *wonders if CuriosuSoul stinks too*

Waddlesworth
06-10-2005, 02:32 AM
LOL! There's no excuse for bein' stinky. But I know an ISTj that always seems to have an odor. I never got the courage to have a one on one about it with him though. like "look man, you kinda reek, alot."

I know an INTj that seems to avoid washing her hair. One time I told her she smelled good (but in an organic way) she went "maybe its because I took a shower" i was like :shock:

Herzy
06-13-2005, 02:20 AM
CHrist, people who don't take showers freak me out. :shock:

Now back on track with the ESTp's: :o

All of the ESTp's that I know (me included) have ridiculous problems with procastination. Heck, I'm doing it right now! Is there a specific function related to this, or is it just Percieving in general?

science as magic
06-13-2005, 03:07 AM
From what I've observed it seems to be related to Te. If you have Te as function 1, 3, 5, or 7 you are less likely to procrastinate. People who have creative Te tend to have it worse especially if they are N.

CuriousSoul
06-13-2005, 04:34 AM
Pedro-the-Lion, I do not stink! (CS sniffing his armpits :lol: ) To be honest, I do have to pay attention. The thing is, if you stink, you will probably be the last one to notice it.

I do not quite see this procrastination theory of yours working. I think if anything it may just be an S/N difference, or maybe Ne vs Ni. Te + Ni works when there is no contradiction...

science as magic
06-13-2005, 05:31 AM
Yeah it was just a sloppy try.

Uncle Ave
06-24-2005, 02:45 PM
From what I've observed it seems to be related to Te. If you have Te as function 1, 3, 5, or 7 you are less likely to procrastinate.

So its a perceiving thing.

Herzy
07-06-2005, 01:19 AM
Hey everyone. :)

Ready to hear a story about my life that you probably couldn't care less about?

So I was trying to teach my ISFj mom a few basics about Socionics (model a, functions, types, etc.) Well, after a while, she goes, "You should be a psychologist!" :o

Well? An ESTp phychologist? How would that work? Anyone here have an ESTp psychologist? :lol:

Sorry for the stupid post. :oops:

Waddlesworth
07-06-2005, 01:35 AM
Well, see, it proves how powerful an understanding of Socionics can be.

But my sister is an ESTp and she he hopes to get a degree in sociology, and in some way help teens with developmental and self esteem issues.

Cone
07-06-2005, 02:05 AM
Ready to hear a story about my life that you probably couldn't care less about?

To tell the truth, I wish more people would talk about useless things. It gives me an excuse to share parts of the wonderous tale that is my life. :wink:

People actually cringe when I tell them I'm going into college for Psychology. Either they think I'm too smart for it (:8*), or they envision the destruction of mankind from putting the image of me and Psychology together. (All my school friends think I'm going to destroy the world someday, and I really don't know why. They even blamed me for 9-11!)


Your INTp friend,

Cone

Herzy
07-07-2005, 02:05 AM
w00t for light-hearted-ness! :D

Anyways, Cone, all of my friends have basically told me the same thing, but to a different extent. :wink: Maybe it's from some kind of lack of :Fi: / :Fe: ?

Uncle Ave
07-07-2005, 04:04 PM
Well among the great socionists there is an ISTP and an ISTJ that I know of. So why not an ESTP :wink: ? I had an ESTP theatre teacher whom I identified as ESTP (although Im not sure) who was training to become a psychotherapist.

08-01-2005, 02:29 PM
sdfs

Herzy
08-01-2005, 08:33 PM
Hey everyone. :)
So I was trying to teach my ISFj mom a few basics about Socionics (model a, functions, types, etc.) Well, after a while, she goes, "You should be a psychologist!" :o





Haha, my mom (ESTj) always says that to my brother. Could it be an INTj thing? :lol:

Have you got two mums? If so, can I have the ISFj one? :P

Well she took a myers-briggs test a few years ago at work, and she came out as ESTJ. However, she came out as a definate ISFj on Dmitry Lytov's Socionics questionaire. Now that I think about it, she's definately my supervisor. :( And I only have one mom, sorry about that one. :P

08-07-2005, 04:06 PM
sdfs

Herzy
08-07-2005, 11:29 PM
That's okay, I only need the one. I'll PM you my address so she knows where to go :P
She's 48 years old! :shock:

08-08-2005, 12:48 AM
sdfds

Herzy
08-08-2005, 12:57 AM
That's okay, I only need the one. I'll PM you my address so she knows where to go :P
She's 48 years old! :shock:

Good, she's old enough to know how to follow directions then :P

...knocks Steve's head with a hammer...

...crickets chirp...

...a tumble weed rolls by...

:P

08-08-2005, 02:06 AM
sdfds

Herzy
08-08-2005, 02:11 AM
Just wait until I'm you're step father young lady! You'll be in for such a grounding once the doctors fix my skull :P

I'll be out of school by then. :D

Oh yeah, and my dad is ESTp also, so you'll be drowned by all of the :Se: !

Angel von Himmel
08-08-2005, 02:14 AM
Drown me out with the :Se: , I am lacking alot of it and need some.

Herzy
08-08-2005, 02:18 AM
I'll share my :Se: with everyone here who needs it! :P

You can be dominated by the glorious :Se: too! Just follow these simple steps:

1: Get glasses or contacts if you have bad vision.
2: Play and watch every sport imaginable.
3: Do lotsa things on impulse.
4: Get inexplicably aggressive (If you want to be an ESTp or ISTj, that is).
5: Go out and buy some sneakers, 'cause you'll be using them a lot. :P
6: Endure the hardships of going outside and possibly seeing the sun and the clouds.
7: Get yourself a parachute and jump off a mountain. Do this because you're such a thrill-seeker.
8: Tease your friends murcilessly for "not having lives."
9: Go to a Science supply store and buy an electron microscope. You'll observe everything with this expensive little bugger!
10: Pull out your air guitar often. Be sure to jump around on the sofa and don't forget those awesome dance moves!
11: Obtain a long, sharp, and pointy item in case an armed man intrudes into your home.

There! :D I shared some of my :Se: !

Angel von Himmel
08-08-2005, 05:00 PM
Heartblood, that was cute ...

Sonst: Herzblut, das war aber huebst!

Herzy
08-12-2005, 12:59 AM
What's that last word? It's not in my dictionary. (hŁbst)

Angel von Himmel
08-12-2005, 01:05 AM
What's that last word? It's not in my dictionary. (hŁbst)

It is german slang for "cute"

Herzy
08-12-2005, 01:42 AM
Ohh. :o

Danke!

Angel von Himmel
08-12-2005, 02:00 AM
Ohh. :o

Danke!

Woher hast du denn erst deutsch gelernt?

In der Schule?

Herzy
08-12-2005, 02:14 AM
I'm teaching myself with a few books, although I'm still a beginner.

They don't teach German at the schools in my town. :(

Angel von Himmel
08-12-2005, 02:38 AM
I'm teaching myself with a few books, although I'm still a beginner.

They don't teach German at the schools in my town. :(

Schade, hast du noch dort jemand mitzusprechen?

08-14-2005, 12:11 PM
sdfs

Angel von Himmel
08-14-2005, 03:12 PM
Reich und roll!! :P

Haha ... Du bist immer ja komish, Steve ...

IcEPiCk
08-26-2005, 05:11 PM
can we start talking about ESTP qualities again?

damn

Five
08-26-2005, 07:42 PM
can we start talking about ESTP qualities again?

Jawohl!

Woops, sorry.

I meant "Yes." :wink:

Herzy
08-26-2005, 10:13 PM
can we start talking about ESTP qualities again?

damn

Sounds like a great idea! :o

Anyone: Ask me a question and I'll answer it on behalf of all (most) ESTps in the socion! :wink:

HarryBottom
08-26-2005, 11:13 PM
Sure. What got you personally interested in socionics? Doesn't seem like a thing that ESTPs really get interested in all that much. Since you said you were up for questions, I was just kinda wondering anyways. :D

Herzy
08-27-2005, 01:07 AM
Well one day I was really pissed off at my mom for some reason or another. I googled "personality" to see why the hell this was happening and came across MBTI, and then Socionics soon after that. I liked Socionics better (for obvious reasons :P ) and I guess the interest in it just stuck with me. It turns out that she's my supervisor (ISFj) and that's why all of this was happening.

HarryBottom
08-27-2005, 01:28 AM
What would we do without google? lol.

I'm my mom's supervisor, and my dad's benefactor.

Herzy
08-27-2005, 01:32 AM
Look at this: My mom supervises my dad and I. Then, both my dad and I supervise my twin brother. So we have 4 relations of supervision in my family. :shock: Beat that. :wink:

Angel von Himmel
08-27-2005, 01:40 AM
Ouch! I bet you hate relations of supervision as much as I do ... :(

Herzy
08-27-2005, 01:47 AM
Well I kind of don't talk to my brother all that much, so I guess that makes it a little easier on him. He's by far the worst off, though. He still has two supervisors and a super-ego in the family. I'm a little better off than him though because my dad and I have identical relations. :D

HarryBottom
08-27-2005, 01:52 AM
My brother has a conflicting and a quazi, but he does fine with it. Heh, you got me beat.

Herzy
08-28-2005, 02:43 AM
Well at least I have an identical! :wink:

Holy crap. I began teaching my ISFj mom about Socionics. Well I told her about how relations of Supervision work and how her dominant :Fi: always hits my PoLR. Well the next day, I was going swimming at the pool. We were walking through the parking lot when she spotted this Buick with an old fart in it partially blocking the sidewalk in front of the building. Well she started bitching about how the car "shoudn't" be there and how it should be in a parking space like the rest of the cars. I just replied with a simple "Whatever. :8* " Then she goes, "OMG, your lack of " :Fi: is showing!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: . Remember, Socionics?" I mean, WTF? How do I get her to not deliberately call me to it whenever my lack of :Fi: shows?

Herzy
08-28-2005, 02:47 AM
Oh yeah, and she also told the neighbors about Socionics. Now I get to teach them too! :o w00t. They should get it a lot easier than my mom, though, seeing that they're all :Ne: and :Ni: dominants.

HarryBottom
08-28-2005, 03:17 AM
lol, true. Sounds like a hoot. :D :wink:

Angel von Himmel
08-28-2005, 03:29 AM
Socionics is addicting, one person in a family learns about it and he or she gets his or her whole family hooked ... I have my mom interested in it right now.

Rocky
08-30-2005, 11:48 AM
Look at this: My mom supervises my dad and I. Then, both my dad and I supervise my twin brother. So we have 4 relations of supervision in my family. :shock: Beat that. :wink:

Oh yeah? Well I have two conflicts, two supervisons, a look-alike and a comparative and that's only with four people in the family.

I'm in conflict with my Mom, my sister's in conflict with my Dad, my Mom supervisees my Dad, my sister supervisees me... sheesh.

Functianalyst
03-03-2006, 06:16 PM
Is there a "Stratiyevskaya: ESTP" description? If so, where can I locate it?

Scrummy
03-03-2006, 07:48 PM
Is there a "Stratiyevskaya: ESTP" description? If so, where can I locate it?
Why yes, yes there is! Here you go:

Zhukov (ESTP)

Representatives of the type: Peter I, G. K. Zhukov, Aleksandr makedonskiy, Napoleon Bonaparte, Fidel Castro, al to kapone, V. i. Lenin, Benito Mussolini, Laurentius Beria, Yemel'yan Of pugachev, Chingiskhan, khan batyy, Stepan Razin. Nathan shcharanskiy, Acad.. S. Korolev, Acad.. I. Pavlov, V. Mayakovskiy, Andrey Voznesensky, William Faulkner, Nikolai rerikh, Ernst neizvestnyy, Richard Wagner, Maykl Douglas, Robert de Nier, Jain fund, Bruce uilis, Mikhail Ulyanov, Cyril Lavrov. Nona mordyukova, Nina ruslanova, Alisa Freundlich, Tatiana dogileva, The hope Of obukhova, Irina arkhipova, Lydia ruslanova, Klavdiy shul'zhenko, Sergey Krylov, Tatiana bulanova, Mikhail shufutinskiy, Stanislav govorukhin, Aleksandr lebed', Pavel grachev
The block Of ego*y-ya position is program function * "volitional sensorika"

"to the strong they listen further when he speaks in a whisper" (Aleksandr lebed'). Force, authority, purposefulness, perseverance and persistence - basic program values it is representative this type. For this very reason they magnificently evaluate force and the "volitional potential" of each person. Special attention on those is focused, who strive for authority, and they try no one not to be inferior "volitional initiative". Basic orientator, which occupies Zhukov's attention, power relationship in the prevailing social structure and its own power priority. In other words, during entire its life osoznanno or is subconsious, independent of the kind of occupations and interests a representative of this type is constantly assigned by the question: "who - whom?". Entire "volitional sensorika" of Zhukov is examined in the aspect: "either 4 - them or they - me". ("I it was small - me the father" of tyukal ", now I it grew - 4 to his" tyukayu ".)

The sensation of their physical force, the sensation of its own authority, its own authorities have for Zhukov exceptional significance. It respects authority, respects force, respects any hierarchical system, because there everything is held on the "correct", in its understanding, to the arrangement of forces. Zhukov always tries to have an application within the framework of the already existing, predominating system. This is - the first stage in any undertakings of him, these are its "minimum program", its first purpose. the "volitional" program of Zhukov consists in sequential achieving of the real, rapidly attained goals by all possible means. ("purpose it justifies means".) The final goal of Zhukov - to occupy in the system of hierarchies the predominating place.

It is not important, whom it is now, by the leader of opposition, by division head or the "commander of asterisk": it always oshchushchayet itself by person, allotted by authority and authorities. Within the framework of the section trusted to it it is invulnerable, it - implicit authority, it - god tsar. Even working in the division as series employee, Zhukov, who set before himself as a "high goals", can within the shortest period subordinate to his influence authorities (sometimes this to him more advantageous than very to head division).

Organization of primary structures and leadership in it - one of the social functions of a representative of this type. Introduction into the system, the search for adherents within the framework of system, introduction into the sphere of the most important influences and most important business interests with the subsequent introduction of there "its people", whose activity it will check, coordinate which at the necessary moment will be to it subordinated, all this nothing else but the creation of its own structure within the framework of the already existing system: the sequential and step by step assumption of power by the method of the "gradually compressive iron belt". To the purposes, which do not correspond to final tasks, Zhukov does not exchange. Moreover, he will not give himself to confuse. (for example, his oppositional system will interest only in such a case, when it has real chances to take authority. The dissidentskomu motion it will join, if it sees for itself the real and safe possibility to earn "political capital" or the subsequent possibility to head opposition.)

The position of "six" for Zhukov is absolutely unacceptable - this it most of all fears and it will try by all forces not to allow. Zhukov is not completely capable to request someone about the service: he oshchushchayet himself at this moment by that humbled Therefore it he tries to always so build situation in order to force others to make that which to it is necessary (method of the "iron belt" in the miniature). The situation, when him "hold for frayera", is completely unthinkable for Zhukov - this is greater than impact on the pride, this is the crash of its entire program. Impression frequently is created, what it "zatsiklen" on the concept "respect - disrespect". It constantly and everywhere requires the acknowledgement of its own priority (what by itself is already the sign of its internal uncertainty in itself). The more it internally oshchushchayet itself "six", the greater the attention and the respect to itself it requires.

Greatly it fears to be dependent. Dependence for it - the index of weakness. It knows how to make it necessary to depend on itself - this is considered the index of force. (it loves to propose its "valuable" services, it loves to be "necessary" person, it knows how "to recollect" the shown service it knows how to claim small debt.) Its constant tendency to take large authority and to enlarge the region of its influence is dictated not only by the dissatisfied ambitions, but also by the internal requirement to insure itself against the situation subordinate to forced authority. ("either 4 - it or it - me".)

Entire its life it seemingly makes additional "safety factor". It not not simply "does oppress at the empty place": he tries to take a little more "advantage" - for the cases, if it they force to yield anything, to it it will be then not offensively - it is inferior like as stranger, and not its. Quality, which is everywhere manifested in representatives of this type, the seizure of administrative, material and, most importantly, territorial advantages.

The achievement of space for Zhukov - task of paramount significance, moreover it is achieved by it by the most natural and therefore by the not always realized means. There will be this the seizure of excess place on the municipal kitchen or excess meter on the linen rope, Zhukov will be deeply not satisfied, if this someone another makes instead of it. For the representatives of this type to fill with itself space - the very natural state. (frequently, that itself without noting, Zhukov is selected for itself central place in the space - it can, for example, advance for itself armchair to the middle of room and, associating with those, who sit along the walls, he very well itself feels - as on the throne) sometimes Zhukov prepares to himself "sphere of action" completely osoznanno. For example, after planning to take a trip "to the reconnaissance" into the strange city or the strange country, collects to himself "commission from his familiar familiar", which gives to it the possibility to pay visit to completely strange people, to question them about life- existence, about itself to describe, necessary acquaintances to tie, to live in someone day- other, and there you look, it already its person, and following time he arrives here as in the close relatives.

In private life Zhukov fairly often conquers space with the aid of it is noise and sonic. To characteristically perekrikivat'sya with the parents through entire court - into this minute he feels for the Zhukov- child, which manages entire surrounding space. For the Zhukov- new settlers (especially the inhabitants of the southern countries) very characteristically immediately on the moving in "to incise" music to the complete loudness, on top of that and the door of its apartment to wide throw open so that in the neighbors it would not remain illusions relative to that, who here owner. For the same reason some Zhukovs themselves greatly have no special liking the "musical" neighbors: they can throughout entire house organize the collection of signatures in order to evict them.

The arrangement of forces in Zhukov is always very primitive: "or - or", there is no other alternative. Is explained this by the fact that it is always concentrated on one, close purpose - either it its beret or no ("either pan- - or propal"). To this, according to the large calculation, and is subordinated entire its system of the relations: "either leader - or" six "; "either owner - or no one". In his system of the arrangement of forces there are only two power poles: strong and weak. Zhukov prefers to be in the strong pole, but after proving to be in the weak, it knows how to recognize its defeat and to be subordinated to his conquered force. Zhukov is characterized by exceptional fitness for work and persistence, which grows proportional to a quantity of obstacles.

No one it makes possible to doubt its right to lead people. He speaks, as it proclaims - in confident, command voice. It does not make possible for itself to be lenient (it considers that this to it can too dearly manage). It prefers only to require, use any possibility to manifest their volitional qualities - resoluteness, persistence, inflexibility, declaring about itself as about a strict, but valid leader. Zhukov magnificently appears as the leader- organizer: the level of the qualification of each accurately is evaluated and each it makes responsible a maximum. It distributes work so that the arrangement of forces would be optimum. The most intensive tempo of work is assigned, in order to obtain the most productive return in minimum time. Under the normal conditions Zhukov feels himself as "not in his regime", but in the extreme situation he is activated and will mobilize. For the same reason it loves to create the atmosphere of psychological stress - this seemingly entertains it. It loves to tell terrible histories, loves "to congeal paints", to spread panicky mood, with the pleasure it extends the rumors, which frequently are exaggerated.

The situation of Zhukov's extremality pleasantly tones up, precisely, therefore it sometimes specially stiffens disciplinary conditions and holds its subordinates in constant stress. Even in the calm everyday work Zhukov- leader frequently introduces situation of the substantiated in no way extremality: so it is more convenient to him very, and consequently, as it considers it, conveniently and as other. The joint consideration of the solutions prefers, but the final solution, just as responsibility for it, assumes itself. "won battle not the one who gave a good advice, but the one who took upon itself responsibility for its fulfillment and he ordered to carry out" (Bonaparte).

Zhukov loves and knows how to take responsibility to himself. It rapidly grips the created situation and the arrangement of forces, decision is made and it acts. It knows how to risk, to go "stake everything". Little it is subjected to fear. The more dangerous the situation, the sobranneye it is and the more decisive. In the extreme conditions its will, resoluteness, courage and practical thinking help to find way out. In the critical situations it calls to the decisive actions, to the "growth of power potential". (lightness and carelessness - quality, with which, in his opinion, it is necessary to fight.) It prefers to act cooly and maximally it is energetic, answering the impact by dual impact. In the case of external physical danger it is inclined to farsightedly retirovat'sya. But if, in view of circumstances, it was necessary to get involved in into the conflict situation, it prefers not to step back, but to fight to the end, even to the detriment of its own interests. (main thing - victory by any price.)

It is not inclined to be adapted to the partner, only to dictate. Usually he tries to be polite and self-possessed, but if its pride is caught, one cannot hide its irritation. Being located in the "pinched" state, internally it is nervous and persistently searches for output from the created position. In the association frequently the beret to itself of the function of nonformal leader, secret controller after the situation, into the critical minute who prefers to remain in the shadow.

On the expediency of actions, about the volitional qualities, about the need for mobilizing his forces he speaks in the tone, which does not suffer objections. Loves to discuss about discipline, about the need for bringing up the volitional and purposeful nature. Constantly holds its environment in the stressed, mobilized state. Demanding with respect to itself and by others: people, which do not carry out their promises, it does not respect. In its eyes they in exact figures nothing mean. Its contempt to them is not considered it necessary to hide. It is confident in its own force and significance, just as in its public destination. It is reckless, inclined to the rivalry and the competition. To all it everywhere and constantly ties its vital values as the certain, not being subject to doubt, absolute truth. Frequently and with pleasure he speaks about the "rough reality", values in itself the skill to receive the life of such, "as it is". It willingly shares its life experience, it frequently too importunately teaches to that, "as it is necessary to live". He always knows "how must" and "as it is not must".
Block Of ego*2-ya Position * Creative Function * The "logic Of relationships"

"knowledge - force". In the system of the basic values, inherent in intellect of this type, the aspect of the logic of relationships is one of the important - it realizes the program of intellect, and consequently, it is entered by quite organic means into it. Competent person, in the opinion of Zhukov, is protected. Person, who does not have the necessary information, is defenseless. Therefore the collection of necessary information for Zhukov is so important as the growth of power potential. (for Zhukov in many instances - this one and the same) information separately important for himself Zhukov can purchase, and obtain by fraud or craftiness. It can secure by its price of "insignificant" (for itself) volitional pressure, for example "take for the fright". Information - this always value, regardless of the fact, it is necessary or not: "travelling around the unknown city, it follows it well to study - in that case, if it it is necessary to sometimes conquer" (Napoleon Bonaparte).

Enormous service in the collection of information renders Zhukov his dual Esenin, who always in the course of all events, has a mass of necessary and unnecessary acquaintances, is capable with the nenavyazchivoy ease to tell quite nekommunikabel'nogo person and with the characteristic of it exceptional inquisitiveness to question in that everything which to it is necessary, and everything, which can prove useful to it. The volitional pressure of Zhukov frequently realizes by the method of logical persuasion. For this it from nature is allotted by the flexible, manipulation logic, which first of all serves purposes and interests of its volitional program.

Vynosya his judgment about any object, Zhukov far from always is objective, since, first of all, he proceeds from his own, "program" arrangement of forces, from the personal interests and his own purposes. Therefore, discussing with Zhukov, it is necessary to constantly have in the form that the facts given by it serve not for the objective explanation of truth, but for the unquestionable acknowledgement of its personal point of sight and its system of views. To argue with Zhukov is unpleasant and it is inexpedient. Immediately become obvious tendentiousness and spekulyativnost' of its reasons, tendency toward the simplified conclusions, the tendency to solve problem by the method "yes - no". Is created impression, that for it there are no semitones. Is only "black" and "white" for example, it is unpleasant to discuss with Zhukov some personal plans, it will always compare them with its own purposes and proceed from the possibilities of its own successes.

Zhukov no one will allow himself to gallop although to polgolovy, no one he will allow "to zastolbit'" that "gold vein", to which in it personally yet did not reach the hands. Entire its logic, all its arguments, entire force of its persuasions it will be directed toward that in order to prove to man that this made must not be. Never not one advice it, Zhukov, will give to the detriment of its own interests. Objective truths are used by it not for the abstract reflection, but as the means of the goal-directed line of reasoning.

Its point of view it will tie and prove despite the general opinion, using for this all permissible and (most likely) inadmissible forms of conducting the dispute: it is capable to increase voice, to use the emotional or physical pressure: in the dispute it searches for not truths - it searches for victories. When it does not find means to convince opponent, it is turned to the witnesses of dispute in order to ridicule or to compromise enemy. Considers itself as that obligated to gain victory by any way. Frequently finds the possibility to leave last word beyond itself, after destroying enemy by one remark or by the phrase, said at the suitable moment.

From nature it is allotted grow prettier by memory. Has its own idea for each question and knows how to base it. Widely use well-known facts, statistical data, examples from the history. With the study of problem it does not forget even the most insignificant details. If it is prepared for the dispute, previously is selected the best version of proofs, he tries everything to provide and to work, frequently even mathematically to count.

Considerable attention is focused on the authenticity of information sources. If it is necessary, it can select information exceptionally accurately and pedantically. It prefers not to use doubtful information sources. Of course knowledge is necessary to representatives of this type not only in order to conquer in the dispute and by any means to conquer authority. Skill to logically think of - the most important tool of its intellect.

Representatives of this type willingly and with the pleasure learn entire life - constantly and everywhere. They approach very thoroughly any undertaking, they gather and analyze entire necessary information, they increase the level of their qualification. Much and with the pleasure work at itself. They have the widest circle of interests. Far from always scientific searches of Zhukov are stimulated by the expectation of ranks and rewards, although the documentary confirmation of his authority - diplomas, certificates and other decorations undoubtedly are very important. (Zhukov greatly he is suggested by the acknowledged authorities and greatly it loves to confirm its authority documentary, although the quality of the obtained formation for it is much more important than testifying about this document.)
Block Of superego*e-ya pozitsiya*Normativnaya function * the "intuition of possibilities"

The program of "power priority" constantly requires from Zhukov the skill to be foresighted, farsighted and prudent in all its actions. Any oversight turns around for it by the defeat of its own plans, by wreck quarries and by deposition from the leaders into "six". Zhukov, playing "on- large", "on- large" loses.

To it, as to any sensoriku, is characteristic the tendency to speak out maximally concretely and clear that it unavoidably forces it to make a slip of the tongue anything excess, which then can be wrapped up against it. Frequently he says: "language is my - enemy my". It can as much as desired develop such qualities as circumspection and caution in the contact with the unfamiliar people in itself, but it never will learn to speak concretely, to sosredotachivat' its attention in the concrete account of thought, in the concrete reasons and the facts. For example, Zhukov- mediator speaks: "our firm gives you reduction to the payment of the expensive and reinlisted medical services. For this you to us will be monthly pay... "-" make it possible, objects opponent, I must pay only for the reduction to the payment of the services, by which 4 within the next few years and use- that I am not gathered?! So in how much me will manage this "reduction"?!"

Somewhere in his arguments Zhukov compulsorily gives "trump" against himself. His logic is weak intuitively, at least because it is too strong by its volitional pressure. Its arguments - this is always some immediate benefit. And its persuasiveness is based not on the real, but on the desired, podtasovannoy data base. (because of its skill to convince with the aid of the ordered podtasovannykh facts, representatives of this type they magnificently work as mediators in any doubtful commercial measures, they can very Boyko deal in "holes from the boubliks", in what and they are frequently they are exposed.) However, if with this crushing volitional sensorike, Zhukov would be still and it was invulnerable by intuition... Fortunately, in nature such is impossible.

However Zhukov tried to develop this function, it in it not will be never sufficient strong. It occurs, it by these even weakens its program: it begins to wait and to check chances, where it is necessary to act by volitional pressure and by strong pressure. Alas, one excludes another. In any event for Zhukov it is necessary to take into consideration calculations according to the aspect of the "intuition of possibilities", especially at the early stages of contact.

Zhukov very carefully ties new contacts. It is stressed and alerted in the contact with the new people: from one side, is checked its behavior, trying to produce a maximally favorable impression, with another - constantly it controls collocutor, trying to correlate his volitional potential with its own. Frequently itself creates the situation, which makes possible for it to rapidly determine the possible arrangement of the forces,: it will try in any manner to state its rights on the leadership and to look, which there will be reaction. Sometimes he tries to turn situation so as to immediately place collocutor in the dependence on itself. Sometimes this is done on the habit - such has already been formed the style of contact, sometimes - for purposes of the "reconnaissance" of the permissible possibilities.

With his external straightness Zhukov is capable to manifest the miracles of adaptability. Very konformen. It knows how so rapidly to imitate the predominating public ideology, that even in those, who know its brief time, appears confidence in his absolute unscrupulousness. After outlining to itself purpose, never it goes immediately right through. On the contrary, it can play the role of the absolutely disinterested person, simultaneously estimating the possible methods of action. It will try to use personal charm or it will influence through the friends and the familiar, briefly, it searches for the "levers of influence", relying on the already prevailing systems of communications and hierarchies, trying to find "necessary person" in the "necessary clan". (strategy of the "compressive iron belt".)

Its force in vain it does not expend - it uses only if necessary. It loves to develop the role "of patron- benefactor". Such "cross father" (generally, the "father of native" - "Lenin children"...) Being professional politician, magnificently it knows how to maneuver and to maneuver, but never it loses "its line". Further short-term concessions does not go. It erects its strategy, designing for the skill to improvise and for the success: the "main thing - to get involved in in the battle, and let us there look".

It does not love to work in the conditions of the rigid framework. The freedom of actions and scale are necessary to it. Its plans are dynamic, they are constantly corrected by real circumstances. It fears late actions, as far as possible, it conducts expectant tactics, saving up initiative for the decisive breakthrough at the necessary moment. It listens all, from whom it is possible to obtain efficient council. It loves to converse with the specialists and in them to learn. On the plans for the future he tries to speak confidently, also, with optimism, although it is far from always confident in the happy outcome.

It does not make possible for itself to tell about its own neudachlivosti and to nevezuchesti even in the circle of the closest friends. (in the dual pair Zhukov - Esenin unlucky wretches very highly they do not quote; therefore Zhukov it will do entire possible so as this to hide.) No one it allows to its connections on no account it reveals its acquaintances, although it attempts to produce the impression of man, in whom "everything is gripped". In it actually "everything is gripped", but only for itself and for "its" - the quality, which greatly assigns on it its duala of Esenin.
Block Of superego*ya-ya the pozitsiya*Mobilizatsionnaya function * the "ethics of relations"

Relative to personal ethical qualities Zhukov does not construct illusions, since knows after itself such unpleasant features as original suspiciousness and the habit to assume the worst motives in behavior of people (consequence of the fact that the aspect of the "ethics of relations" and the "intuition of possibilities" they are located in it on the very weak and vulnerable positions). On the basis of its own ethical "complexes" - is insurance, distrust and lack of understanding, Zhukov exactly and forms his personal interrelations and this one of its most serious problems.

Zhukov constantly worries, that his own ethical "imperfections" it is too noticeable with that surrounding and destroy that "positive" means of a "strict, but valid leader", whom it diligently erects in accordance with the program of its intellect. (A relatively of "etichnosti" of personal "volitional" program Zhukov does not actually construct illusions - about what ethical rights and with what freedom of choice can deal the discussion with "Zhukovskiy" autocracy and yedinovolii? With its obstinacy and dictates with respect to the partner?)

The relation to his opinion and his authority is exceptionally important for Zhukov - for it this is much more important than for the representatives of other psychological types. Since mind and force - its principal values, for Zhukov it is very important so that this would be evaluated not only by it, but also by others. It is also important for Zhukov so that him they would receive not only by such, such as it seems, but also such, such as it can be, if we relate ourselves well to it. It is important so that they would receive and was evaluated not only its very and not such, which it is, but its positive ethical potential. (precisely that which sees well and evaluates its dual Esenin.) About that, such as it can be good, Zhukov usually says immediately, but in polunamekami.

He is sufficiently clever and farsighted in order not to speak about this in the plain text. Furthermore, to praise itself to it seems and neskromnym, and indecent (indeed subconsiously it is disposed to its duala, which this and so sees well). To Zhukov it is very important to be correctly understood, especially those people, which it intends itself to draw nearer. It willingly can describe to this person about its nature, about how it usually reacts to these or other behavior, which it pleases itself in the people, that no. To Zhukov it is very important so that in his behavior people would not assume bad intentions. Cruelty and suspiciousness it saves up for the enemies, and to friends it is ready into any minute to prove its good relation by the matter. Even if its friend is required the aid, after showing which, it risks to bring serious troubles on itself, Zhukov can from his side propose equivalent service, but already without the consequences for himself. (for example, if for its friend it is necessary to sign guarantee obligation, Zhukov most likely it will refuse, but instead of it can lend the large sum of money for the prolonged period.)

Zhukov is ready to help not only his friends, but also friends of his friends, it goes without saying, calculating, that at a convenient time people to it will pay back to the same. And nevertheless to Zhukov to little be respected, importantly still and to be dear. "to be fallen in love not main thing, the main thing - into itself to fall in love". The basic problem of the personal interrelations of Zhukov exactly in that consists that it believes to far from every proof of love. Erecting his relations relatively several understated ethical self-appraisal, Zhukov greatly fears to reduce psychological distance, fears, that on closer examination him they will consider as not very attractive subject. This approach to the matter forces it to act in the ethical plan very napryazhenno, it is unnatural and it is illogical.

Frequently, hardly after attaining arrangement, it first itself destroys the relations (man of this type actively reduce distance physically, but not ethical). To representatives of this type it is sufficiently difficult to form its personal relations still and because, according to the large calculation, they have very distant idea about how this it is necessary to make. (in the indeterminate ethical situation they feel itself by completely helpless and disoriented.) Following his rule of control of any initiative, Zhukov creates to himself the mass of ethical problems at least already fact that he does not allow freedom of choice for its partner (it is implied the psychologically incompatible partner).

Zhukov begins to too strongly press to it by his opinion, his authority, authority: he solves everything for the partner, everything for it thinks over, is placed it in the merciless terms, allowing not the least objections from its side. (for example, it can immediately rigidly specify time and duration of meetings - "on Tuesdays and Thursdays to hour to two - otherwise to me inconveniently!"; it can insist on the specified conditions of the encounters: "if randomly somewhere we are encountered, we with you are not familiar. No one must know that we are encountered ". Zhukov can so act completely not because he, for example, is married. But even if he now is free, it is possible that in the future it is married someone other, but now it fears, that its present connection possibly will influence its future family relations.

As any irrational sensorik, Zhukov develops his intuition and tries to be farsighted, even to the detriment of his immediate relations. But that that by this behavior it deeply offends and disappoints its partner, this already the second question, but precisely he turns around by problem.) Zhukov accomplishes serious error, attempting to take ethical initiative upon himself. To it it is not enough that it desires to be perceived not such, such as it exists, but by such, such as he wants to seem. It even on this, sufficiently unstable basis attempts itself to simulate its relations. And, it goes without saying, he wants so that they would be developed precisely in the manner that to it it is necessary. For this very reason Zhukov (especially woman) not away once more to povyyasnyat' relation. Oh, it is not necessary to it this to make! Nothing good it for itself will explain. Indeed good relations to Zhukov and are so clear - he feels them, and poor and to explain unnecessarily. Why to it to listen about itself unpleasant things? - indeed to tell it about that, such as it by poor, which means, to aggravate its complexes, to understate its self-appraisal and to convert it into that monster, such as to it it is described. To Zhukov it is not possible to give occasion to realize itself to "poor" - to nothing this will not lead good. It is not possible it "to poke by nose" into its own ethical deficiencies - this only hardens it.

It is not possible to it to pack in good with the cams - it does not believe in this "good". In view of his pessimism and his weak intuition Zhukov does not assume for himself also the idea of original pacifism, universal benevolence and universal love. Zhukov will believe only into first, to what itself there was witness, and into the fact that was developed in it on the eyes, namely - in the concrete relations with the concrete person, with which he personally felt itself well.

With all partners Zhukov feels himself by such, such as it is evaluated. Moreover about this it to entirely not necessarily tell in the plain text - Zhukov very well feels the estimation of partner in the view, in the intonation, in the smile, in the expression of face. Therefore partner can disappoint Zhukov by his understated estimation still earlier than that will begin to disappoint by its his behavior. Zhukov very well feels lack of promise and predestination of relations and behaves in accordance with this. Zhukov can continue relations purely physically or purely formally, while in the spiritual and intellectual plan they for it already had long ago been ended. Demonstratively overstating its ethical estimation, attempting to present itself better than it, as it it seems, there is, Zhukov attempts to prompt to partner, as it is necessary to be turned with it, how it is necessary to form the relations with it: only in an amicable way, only in most benevolent form. It is necessary from the morning to the evening to tell Zhukov about that, such as it good and good: this only possibility soak to it to manage your ethical problems. For this very reason good relations in Zhukov are added only in the partnership to his dualom by Esenin, which, from nature being it is allotted by strong intuition and optimism, makes possible for itself luxury to receive people precisely by such, such as they themselves present.

Being sincerely enraptured by talents and merits of Zhukov, Esenin sharply overstates his self-appraisal, than it raises the authority of Zhukov in his own eyes. Zhukov will be deeply grateful to that, who will convince him of that, such as he in actuality good; to that, who will suggest to it, what he - the best. Zhukov by all forces will try to confirm this opinion.
Block OF SUPERID*SHCH-YA pozitsiya*Suggestivnaya function * the "intuition of time"

Zhukov with the characteristic of it pressure and the strong pressure does not organically transfer uncertainty. For example, when the explanation of any urgent for it question is involved to the indeterminate period. It greatly is nervous in this period, it survives. It seems it that entire its life is set on the map. The forced idleness in the period of uncertainty very heavily survives. It is very vulnerable at this moment.

Greatly we suggest by any forecasts. It always fears gloomy forecasts. For this very reason many representatives of this type are inclined to any superstitions, which are based on the predictions, guess-works, signs. Many of them (especially woman) believe to astro-logical forecasts and try in accordance with them to coordinate its plans and actions. Moreover this even sometimes them helps. (especially, when in the forecast it is said: "on this week it is not necessary to explain relations and to be disturbed on the trifles, but it follows to live quietly, a little more to rest and to be occupied by its health". Approximately the same will say to Zhukov his dual Esenin, who always feels well his emotional state and he always accurately knows that to it it is necessary; and even the gloomiest news Esenin presents with the encouraging smile, as if speaking, that all these are temporary troubles and soon they will pass.)

Zhukov heavily transfers the forced expectation. Especially to him are unpleasant the ethical relations, which force to the heavy expense of the time: for example, when it "dinamyat" or "untwist" to the prolonged and futile care. This Zhukovs do not love and some of them immediately warn its new familiar how can for them be wrapped up such "games". It does not love the unforeseen expenditure of time. (for example, when to it tie strange problems, since this occupies in it excess time and forces.) To Zhukov generally it is difficult to represent what reserve of time it has available, as it can use this time, than it can itself at this time engage. That seems it that it is expended very unproductively, and then Zhukov uplotnyaet his graph, it sometimes it seems that his time is too oversaturated by some matters, which got stuck on dead center, and in order to move their, in addition is necessary time. In Zhukov the problems with the time allocation for fulfilling the entire necessary work constantly appear. (many of the representatives of this type very thoroughly is planned its day, they try entire that outlined to carry out, everywhere to have time, anywhere to not be late, and nevertheless constantly appear some unforeseen circumstances, which shift their plans first into one, then to other side.) As any of sensorik, Zhukov attempts himself to alter the maximum of the matters per unit time, which, it goes without saying, leads to the overloads and the overvoltage.

But, to the happiness for Zhukov, it has this splendid consultant as Esenin, who excellently opportunely investigates of any matter and any work, who always can resemble to Zhukov that the "work is not wolf, it will not run away" into the forest, and Zhukov here notes that he actually earned and to him it is time to rest. Furthermore, Esenin always sees well "critical" time - the time of active action, time of "decisive impact", time, when the "delay of death is similar". Esenin, as no one, knows how to see the development of the ethical potential of man in the time. He always can accurately answer the question: "what to expect from this person?", "it is frank?", "friend it or enemy?". In all these vitally important for himself orientators Zhukov rests on the prompt of his duala of Esenin.
Block SUPERID * the 6th Position * Activation Function * The "ethics Of emotions"

Subconsiously Zhukov tries to subordinate his feelings to reason (as any logician). For example he tries so that its mood would not affect neither work nor its interrelations with the subordinates. He tries to hold flat, affable tone with all. To k.sozhaleniyu, Zhukov does not always succeed himself in expressing his emotions adequately of situation and this to it greatly hampers contact. The weak and vulnerable ethics of relations creates problems, also, for its ethics of emotions. For example, falling into awkward ethical situation, Zhukov sometimes for a long time suffers psychological discomfort, and because of this his accumulated emotions with the doubled force issue themselves in completely different situation, at the most inappropriate moment, on another occasion and to in nothing not the guilty person.

Zhukov greatly suffers from the emotional contradiction meanwhile to what it itself it oshchushchayet and to what he tries itself to present. Zhukov - this is always deep and ardent emotionalism under the mask of severe restraint and imperturbability. The positive emotions of Zhukov - this is his deepest, most intimate secret, which it to the nearest partner will not give out. Negative emotions issues as much as desired, whereas on whom it is convenient with the first opportunity.

Positive emotions frequently it is troubled: it fears to seem by ridiculous, absurd, weak, dependent, vulnerable. For the unbridled negative emotions it also itself scolds, fears unpleasant for himself consequences, fears after his authority, it can regret about the fact that it offended man incorrectly. Zhukov is inclined to the compassion, but also egotism by noble impulses for it is also very characteristic. Moreover, for it it is much more important to precisely demonstrate its ethical potential: indeed so to it much more easily to focus attention on its merits and to assign necessary tone to its relations. (for this very reason, observation about the fact that good it is necessary to make nedemonstrativno, Zhukov it can receive very painfully - as reproach in its address as the criticism of the motives of its behavior as "stone into its vegetable-garden".)

Fortunately, for the representatives of this type, there is this "ethical vent" as religion, their that encourages to the best motives, activating to the most positive emotions and making possible for them to create good in that form, into which for them this entire more convenient and is more natural. Furthermore, religion helps them to realize their deep and therefore the still unspent feelings. If next there is no worthy of their love of man, then it is good what to eat whom to believe its most secret thoughts and desires. Moreover the expression of its feelings in this case it is possible and not to be troubled. One additional possibility not to be troubled the expression of its feelings - this is creation in the actor's and musical field: here Zhukov appears in the complete luster of his force and his temperament.

Although for actor- representatives of this type it nevertheless is necessary itself to sometimes limit: "I came to the conclusion that the actor must live it will emotionally sparingly, otherwise have enough emotions neither to the work nor to the life" (Alisa Freundlich). Zhukov frequently oshchushchayet himself by lonely and misunderstood person; therefore he is troubled to manifest its true emotions in the society of people unfamiliar to him, most frequently it attempts to connect its mood to the general emotional tone, but also this in it is not always obtained - frequently "it dissembles", which is very noticeably and it is not always pleasant to those surrounding. Sometimes, falling into the new company, Zhukov frequently inopportunely beret to himself the role "of mass organizer- joker" (characteristically for the men) and does not always successfully joke, which leads to the very unpleasant consequences.

It occurs, which is completely unjustifiable beret to itself the role of leader and greatly it is offended, when it "put in place"; it can flare up and even climb into the fight. Sometimes - vice versa: it does not demonstratively yield to general merriment, it is held apart, fills to itself unapproachable- imperturbable form, "it sits as priest's daughter on the bride-shows" (characteristically for the women). It is unpleasant to tell Zhukov about its feelings and experiences - this for it deeply personal and intimate theme. He does not know, as about this to speak: it fears to dissemble, fears to seem by ridiculous or that too not bridled. Actually, any attempt to behave unnaturally (not in accordance with its mood) almost always turns around for Zhukov by the unpleasant consequences: it is worthwhile for it to too be absorbed in by its role, as its behavior immediately begins to appear absurd, inappropriate, and sometimes and to exceed the scope of decency.

By the way, about the decency: serious difficulties frequently appear with this in Zhukov. And not because he does not know, as itself news or is insufficiently well brought up - here exactly everything it proceeds satisfactorily. (everything that it should know, it it always knows.) But it is worthwhile for Zhukov although a little to be weakened (but in the guests this most frequently and it occurs), as it immediately begins "to fall out from its role" and by very this circumstance to confuse and, consequently, also to react to any observations very acutely. It suffices someone of that being present inadequately to react at its joke or statement, and its emotionalism here passes the boundaries of that permitted. And if we precisely at this moment resemble to Zhukov about the decency, it is capable to completely lose control over its words and behavior. (possibly; therefore many Zhukovs they try not to weaken in the guests, but they prefer to assume them at home, where they feel itself much calmer and it is more confident)

Zhukovs themselves suffer from our own hot temper, they will always regret about their impetuosity: about the fact that talked rashly much excess, about the fact that someone they offended and someone about them now badly will think. Many, especially women, try to faster smooth out their fault. They frequently for a long time scold itself for its own "difficult" nature, they do not know, to whom to run to be advised on this question. They understand, that this is the most serious problem of their communicability. Position saves the presence of duala of Zhukov - Esenin, whom whose- that always knows how to assign the light and unconstrained tone of contact, knows how to discharge situation, knows how to smooth awkwardness and to switch attention to something more pleasant and more interesting. Esenin for each will find tactful compliment and affable word. Only in the society of Esenin Zhukov can properly be weakened and obtain necessary ethical support. Next to Esenin Zhukov literally rests by soul.
Block ID*"-ya Position * Observant Function *" sensorika Of sensations "

In this aspect some differences between the men and the women, who represent this type, are observed. Man- Zhukov it is hardy and nepriveredliv; does not expend time on the creation of special cosiness. He tries so that in its room it would be more- less purely, thing - at its places, food - nourishing and healthy. And this to it it is completely sufficient. It dresses conveniently and inconspicuously. It adheres to the specific neutral style, immune to the fluctuations of mode. (in recent years in Russia was formed the new style of representatives of this type - style of "new Russian": raspberry-colored coat, the smoothly combed hair, radiotelephone, the "Mercedes" of last model and so forth.)

Other matter woman- Zhukovs: they expend the mass of forces, time and attention to the creation of domestic cosiness. In the house exemplary order strictly is supported (especially to the arrival of guests). Everything "washed -naglajeno", all "blestit". High-quality furniture "under the old times", many decorative additions - porcelain- cut glass, salfetochki-zanavesochki, large pictures on the walls, large "ficuies" in the tubs - in a word, everything as "in people", all as is fitting. Magnificently they prepare, wonderfully they bake, adore to store pickles and jams advantage. (many have its summer-resort sections, where they carry out all output) needle women and "to all hands of umelitsy". To themselves sew, they follow the mode, but also adhere to its own style, preference is given to bright, but noble tones. They love music, skill. Woman- Zhukov - this always and "good female worker and sing- to dance fancier".

"zhukovskaya" aesthetics most brightly is manifested in the national Russian folklore. This is always the high-quality worn and well dressed- fanciful decorative- applied skill, vividly rastsvechennoye, richly finished by gold. This the unique song folklore, where the special position is given to the "sore" ethical problems, contemporary "urban romance", where passes the theme "of love- villain" and "mischievous devchonochki", which like and by all is good, but in the love does not here convey.

Zhukovs do not know how to speak about the love, but they cannot about it but sing. Woman- Zhukov - this that which "horse to skaku will stop, into the burning cottage it will enter". It is capable to the exceptional self-sacrifice. It manifests the miracles of endurance and patience. Is capable humdrum of pulling its "strap" without any objection and not on what complaining. It does not love whining, it does not love to be ill, it does not love to become limp. (during the disease to Zhukov especially difficult to associate, it itself it is frightened its own indisposition and its own weakness - it it seems that it now similar will forever and remain.) He always tries to be cheerful, energetic, pulled, what it this not cost.
Block ID*8-YA pozitsiya*Demonstrativnaya function * "business logic"

Zhukov - most practical of all types of personality. Any its action attempts to explain by the considerations of expediency. "4 never I make useless things" (Bonaparte). It is demonstratively practical. No one better and more precise than Zhukov knows how to evaluate the commodity qualities of things, no one better it he will see their advantages and disadvantages. Zhukov possesses best memory of the "commodity" qualities of object - its price, form, color, smell, taste and so forth it is not possible to force Zhukov to pay for the thing more than it that stands. Moreover, Zhukov never will make it possible himself "to untwist" to the excess, in its understanding, expenditures.

Never it will make unfavorable acquisitions. Independent of income level Zhukov always lives in to harmony with his budget, because of what sometimes are produced the impression of man of that provide ford, but "close-fisted". Economy very economically conducts, he tries so that it would be "wasteless" so that nothing excess it would be ejected. (for example, mistress- Zhukov can gather the remained pieces of soap in order to use them in the washing together with the washing powder. Mistress- Zhukov can attempt to find the method to use a single-time thing for a second time, but if this does not come out, nevertheless will find by it any application in the economy)

About ejecting of products, Zhukov and think cannot! Zhukov buys the products on cheapest price and only such, which are used into the food with a minimum quantity of withdrawals. Very with great care it relates to its things, it for a long time and accurately bears clothing, strictly dividing it into the relative and the output. Well dressed and high-quality clothing "to the output"; plain, unpractical - "for the house". Zhukov knows how and loves to work. He tries in any matter to dostich' highest qualification, work is carried out very rapidly and qualitatively. "greatest of all depravity - this to undertake the matter, which you do not know how to make" (Bonaparte).

It loves to demonstrate its skill to always act accurately and conformable to circumstances. Zhukov - this that, which it always knows "how must". Giving any commission or task, it is always maximally clearly explained. If colleague understands not all from one time, it will explain as much, as is necessary, until him they understand (subconsious calculation for the weak business to the logician Esenin). It will not make it possible to enter despite its explanations. Greatly it is offended, if to it once more they are not turned for the explanations. Receives this as the understated estimation, carry ouied to its business qualities.

To Zhukov it is very important so that they would praise his work and they placed in the example to others. It sometimes it seems that it only for this works. With the fact that Zhukov suffer sloppinesses and carelessnesses cannot, he is capable to leniently relate to the errors of his employees, when they manifest in the work zeal or at least his visibility (by these Zhukov it helps its dualu to Esenin to appear at least the visibility of business initiative, although to somehow realize its business qualities) when Zhukov intends to attain whose- or arrangement, he does not wait until, until they ask him about the aid - it itself with the readiness proposes its services. (model of "zhukovskoy helpfulness" - character, Tatiana dogilevoy's played in the film "blond around the corner": "is necessary abonementik into the pond? - there are no problems!", "is necessary imported set? - there are no problems!" In Zhukov will always be located "necessary person", who can all this arrange.)

Zhukov adores to solve the everyday problems of people, whose appreciation and friendship he would want to deserve. It greatly it pleases itself to appear by man, in whom "everything is gripped". Being that oriented to the weak business to the logician Esenin, Zhukov assumes that the best method to conquer confidence and love of man - this to propose to it very effective help in the solution of its concrete everyday problems. Therefore, if Zhukov's helpfulness to someone seems too obtrusive or it is not entirely correctly received by those surrounding, it always this very painfully survives and it considers this its sequential ethical oversight. (Therefore sincerely it's a pity the "blond" of Tatiana dogilevoy, whose business qualities so remained underestimated and unrealized.) Esenin - only of all types of personality, who with the enthusiasm and by deep gratitude will perceive the generous and sincere concern of Zhukov; who never ceases to be enraptured by its business qualities and its selfless labor.

Functianalyst
03-03-2006, 11:02 PM
Thanks Baby. Boy, it would be nice if someone translated these better. They are good reading and comprehensive. Still unsure of my MBTI type, but clearly ENTj under Socionics.

Since Se-Ti can superficially resemble Te-Ni, all ESTPs (notice the capital P) that I have been around are quite serious when handling task, yet can be playful. They are always task oriented, not closing oriented as Js, but nevertheless want to finish the project and move on. I don't know any ESTP which will shirk their duties, but may procrastinate, when not quite sure what is expected to complete a project. I started a thread (ENTJ/ESTP) here, but no one has responded.

Functianalyst
03-22-2006, 07:29 PM
I finished reading the "Stratiyevskaya:ESTP" description thoroughly and still question why most people consider this type be some wild party animal with uncontrollable impulses. Even the description says the type does not like appearing this way. BEST FIT TYPES (http://www.bestfittype.com/estp.html) has one of the best descriptions of this type, in the first person.
I make it happen. How I workóI have a picture in my head on how things will be, and Iím totally involved in the here and now. I am go, go, go. And that creates a lot of successes. I just dodge my way through the sparks and problems. Iím very task oriented. I like to do something, get it done, and move to the next thing. I love circumstances where itís a challenge. Iím a doer. Whatís the mission and how are we getting there? Letís work together. Letís go. Throw any obstacle, Iíll find a way.

New stuff, thatís the thrill. I love to learn. I can take a prior experience and lay it right on top of what Iím doing today and carry it all forward, and itís a snap. I do a lot of brainstorming on my feet, organizing the points in my mind mentally. Whatís to worry? Just adapt. But draw me a picture, get me a list, or put it on my calendar. Sitting still is hard for me. I am really activity oriented and I donít need lots of supervision. I look for variety in most positions. If itís not there, I tend not to stay. Iíd rather go out there and do it, just get on with things, and I can communicate that without having to spend a lot of time explaining. People know that if I have something that needs to be done, I do it. And I ask for help when itís needed.

I am totally a people person. Working through people is the way to get things done. All of my energy, fun, and most uplifting experiences are focused around people. I donít beat around the bush. Sometimes I have to tone it down a little bitópeople may read me the wrong way. Iím very comfortable working either together as a team or individually. I like having flexibility, options, negotiating points. Some people need somebody to be very clear, very direct, and very to the point. Thatís how I operate. And work needs to be mutually enjoyable for all of the parties involved. Celebrate achievements. Recognition or reward runs very high in my value system.

I love the challenge of creating something pleasing to the eye. I like the order, to walk into a place thatís totally chaotic, nothingís happening, and thereís a great opportunity to straighten things out. I like to get the job of placing all the stuff, making it right so it works.

I like somebody with a little sizzle. The most important thing in relationships is absolute autonomy and independence. I admit I like to be in control and yet Iím kind of easygoing in that I just want freedom. Freedom to me is leave me alone, let me do it. Anything that constrains me around that I donít like and kind of rebel against. I donít like to be told what to do or what to think. And although I know itís good for me, I donít like feedback either. It takes a lot to rattle me, and even then I just go on. I tend not to dwell on things, but sometimes I have a tendency to imagine worst-case scenarios, especially when I am stressed.

Family is very important. Just getting together and being close with the family, I think thatís satisfying. I donít have a whole lot of really deep friendships, but yet I like to think people would describe me as dedicated, determined, and loyal. I sometimes have difficulty concealing what I am thinking or feeling. I donít like the pressure of having to say no. I can be somewhat cool but a genuine friend as a personal relationship evolves. Trustworthiness in personal relationships is very important, that we can disagree and still be friends, and if our backs were ever to the wall, Iím there and I would expect the same.

If I donít respect someone, I avoid them. If I can find another way to do business I will. I surround myself with people that I feel comfortable with, but theyíre totally my selection.

I like taking on something that I want to do and getting it done and seeing results, keeping things moving along just to see that I have met some goalsóa feeling of accomplishment in a day. Iíll always take bigger risks if I feel confident enough. Then Iíll work with it for a while, and if I see itís not going anywhere, I just move on and go from there. I guess that summarizes how I deal with situations.

Fermi
03-22-2006, 07:41 PM
I mostly sit still during my day..

I've had bad experiences working with other people.. I don't like it
I don't spend much time with my family.. I don't really like it, neither with other relatives.

and doing things then go to the next.. I've had this english task infront of me the whole day and I always wait until the late night until I get things done.

Herzy
03-22-2006, 07:46 PM
Post a picture, and we'll VI you!!!!!111 :o

Fermi
03-22-2006, 07:54 PM
hey! I've got enough dirty mails already! :o

But sure.. but it got to be for the weekend, I got no camare now.. I think

FDG
03-22-2006, 07:59 PM
I can relate to that description functionalist posted. Except for the people person thing.

Fermi
03-22-2006, 08:17 PM
OMGOMGOMG

I got some pics now... haha... :lol:

now where to put up 'em?

they are a few

Fermi
03-22-2006, 08:29 PM
Well

here we go.. I post them on the other thread I got.. or no.. I post them only there... :P

Herzy
03-22-2006, 08:43 PM
http://www.tinypic.com/



PUT THEM UP PUT THEM UP!!! :D

Functianalyst
03-22-2006, 09:21 PM
FDG, here is the ENTJ description.
Not organizing and not problem solving is hard for me. I am most comfortable in the idea development stageóthe push for putting things together, new solutions, and improvements to take us to the next step. I have several dimensions I work in.

My focus has always been on finding whatís preventing us from doing what we need to do. If itís lack of confidence or motivation, the solution is building that. If itís lack of skills, itís building skills. If itís rules or other inhibitors, I work to eliminate those. I value people, but I am quick to judge their value to the system and quick to judge my personal desire to be involved with them. I stand off if they donít meet my standards quickly, which can make me hard to know, and I think I am unwilling to get into other peopleís motivations.

My response to making a mistake is, ďDid you learn anything? If so, great, it was worth it, and donít make the same mistake again.Ē This kind of critiquing is easy for me, and I admireóand like to have around meópeople who have a real, genuine concern for others and who see the positives. But then there is a time when I sit back and say people have to get on board with the way I see things because itís the right way to go. It took me a while to learn the value of cutting people some slack. Although I appear to dominate, when people get to know me, I really donít. I let them do their own thing. With people I judge as friendly or want to get to know, I open up quickly, although I donít actually go out and do things to make others like me.

I respect wisdom and kindness and competent, knowledgeable people who are willing to share with others. I wonít buy into anything just because the person who says it is the leader. It has to make sense to meóconsistent and free of contradictions. If itís a plan, I have to believe itís doable. If itís a philosophy, it must match mine from the outset. I think integrity means keeping oneís word and sticking to my espoused principles even when itís easier not to. Honesty is important.

I really value progress, learning, and knowledge and have an intense need to know things. Probably this is where I get myself into a lot of projects because it is the opportunity to try something new. I tend to over research, and I have an innate ability to handle a great number of diverse things almost simultaneously. I can watch TV and finish a project and read a magazine all at the same time. I think I donít know how to relax. I can sit down and actually go through and identify the problem and gather alternatives and do a mental brainstorm by myself to come up with different alternatives. I force myself to see if I am not looking at something disjointedly or parochially before I come to a conclusion. And I try to look at the small things in order to look at the big picture, just using plain logic and connecting the dots to prognosticate what the likely outcomes are. Often the first conclusion was the right one anyway.

I actually believe you can do anything if you set your mind to it and are willing to pay the price. I will ask myself if I am willing to pay the price.

I tend to push to get the job done, sometimes without regard to othersí feelings, and I hate repeating myself. Listening is a problem for me because I have probably already thought out things thoroughly, done my homework, and reached an answer before I even get to the stage of presenting it to other people. Similarly, I may get upset with othersí behavior, but it is almost never personalized, which can be a drawback because then I havenít considered what caused the behavior and if I should make some kind of reconciliation.

I am my own worst critic. I want perfect achievement of myself, and sometimes I have a fear of suddenly waking up and being known as someone who doesnít really know anything.

I love to discover new approaches and really prefer creating and beginning things, organizing projects and programs, and then teaching someone else how to do them and handing them off. Although if someone has a better idea, then letís go with it, and if the systemís values and mechanisms line up for me, whoever the leader is, then I guess I am probably one of the most loyal. Probably my goals are patience, wisdom, and disciplineówisdom to focus on the right priorities and correct decisions and patience to take the time to listen.

FDG
03-23-2006, 04:58 AM
This one fits me perfectly, though. I think I have read this before - probably only the ENTJ one, and not the ESTP :)

Functianalyst
03-23-2006, 05:37 PM
Thinking out loud here, but which of the types get into more trouble, due to appearing too calloused and matter of fact (when it may come to basic CSR skills), ENTJ or ESTP? In retrospect, I can always recall being in hot water, not because of performance, but due to lacking compassion and empathy. I can be abrupt when the whining and finger pointing of why something has gone awry. My thoughts are, if you want a viable solution, ask, if you are in need of someone to just listen and let you know it will be alright, find a fucking counselor and move on! Nevertheless, it always gets me into trouble with supervisors.

Fermi
04-24-2006, 05:19 PM
Is saying "it wasn't me!" a commonly used sentance for ESTps? I've heard someone whining about it before.. and now the the finali what's wrong in saying so?! It wasn't me! What should one else say? It was me! it was me! It was him! bah! I hate ppl that say "ooh It wasnt me! superman said so it wasn't me (saying it with a childish obnoxious voice to! :o )

Herzy
04-24-2006, 07:08 PM
Sometimes, but not really in a defensive way.
For example, if someone said, "Who did this?" I'd most likely say, "Superman did it," rather than, "It wasn't me!"
However, if someone accuses me of doing something, and it wasn't me (or if I'm lying :wink: ), I'd more likely say "It wasn't me," in a calm and rational tone, to make the other person feel like the butthead for supplying the false information and making a fool of themselves. :P

dreamer
04-25-2006, 01:20 AM
A couple of my online friends keeps pressuring me to be with (serious or not) with someone I have never really thought of as my type but I made him take the quiz from here and guess what, he turned out to be ESTP. I just about had an heart attack. Not that I think of him romantically now but it's so like surprising. If he is ESTP which I'm not positive aside from his interest in sex, he's one of the nice ones which is surprising as well...nice ESTPs...wow!

Herzy
04-25-2006, 01:27 AM
Haha, maybe about 1 out of every 3 people considers me "nice." :lol:
Nice SLEs do exist, seriously!

taz
05-24-2006, 01:29 AM
ESTP's rock. THey just made it my day.

Herzy
05-24-2006, 02:35 AM
:D

aurora_faerie
05-27-2006, 02:19 AM
ESTP's rock. THey just made it my day.

>:[

ChristiRB
05-27-2006, 08:31 PM
I just went on a 6 hour date with an ESTp last weekend. WOW! He was so much fun! It was one of the best dates I have ever been on! And I didn't even kiss him!! Haha! He gave me space when I needed it and he came in close when he saw I desired company. He also spent most of the dinner talking away about some subject he was passionate about. Two hours! After one hour he asked me if I was bored (he doesn't read body language very well). I wasn't- I was fascinated (love that :Te:)! He is an amazing guy. I was nervous before the date but he made me feel so comfortable and at ease that after 2 seconds we were acting like long time friends.

I really like ESTps. :)

Expat
05-27-2006, 09:26 PM
If he was really ESTp, what he was using on you wasn't :Te: , but :Se: .

FDG
05-27-2006, 10:50 PM
Uhm, probably :Ti:

BTW, seems a bit too much enthusiasm after just a date.

ChristiRB
05-28-2006, 06:51 PM
Haha! I know! I am the enthusiasm queen!

Well he does have :Se: but also a lot of :Te: (which are the two qualities I like most about him).

I used to be so intimidated by ESTps. But, he's just so awesome. I'm still vigilant though. Those ESPs can be flighty- fun for now type of people. Taking my time, but still enjoying it while I can. :)

Herzy
05-28-2006, 08:39 PM
:D at activity relations!


Well he does have :Se: but also a lot of :Te: (which are the two qualities I like most about him).

The :Te: that you're seeing is probably just more :Se: . Most ESTps don't really care about the :Te: , which is one reason why INFps like us. :P

ChristiRB
05-29-2006, 05:12 AM
Yeah, I know. I read it. It fits us perfectly actually. :wink:

This is a very cool relationship dynamic .... but realistically it's probably best kept on a friendship level rather than a romantic one.

taz
05-29-2006, 06:00 AM
ESTP's rock. THey just made it my day.

>:[

If I'm reading it right :P . INFP's rock too!!.

Hanging out with an INFP and ESTP's are the best.

meatburger
05-31-2006, 07:54 AM
If he was really ESTp, what he was using on you wasn't :Te: , but :Se: .

Hmm.. What he was really thinking about using was his

:Se:
:Te: :Te: :Te: :Te: :Te:
:Se:

Function

:lol:

Expat
05-31-2006, 08:35 AM
The :Te: that you're seeing is probably just more :Se: . Most ESTps don't really care about the :Te: , which is one reason why INFps like us. :P

Exactly.


Hmm.. What he was really thinking about using was his

:Se:
:Te: :Te: :Te: :Te: :Te:
:Se:

Function

:lol:

Exactly.

Herzy
05-31-2006, 10:12 AM
Hmm.. What he was really thinking about using was his

:Se:
:Te: :Te: :Te: :Te: :Te:
:Se:

Function

:lol:

Yeah, that too. :lol: :lol: :lol:

ChristiRB
06-02-2006, 06:16 AM
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! :8*

Herzy
06-02-2006, 10:15 AM
:D

discourse
06-02-2006, 07:32 PM
I don't know how many of you know this, but there are lots of famous ESTp scientists in the World. One who I can remember is Susan Blackmore who has a reputation of being good memetician. At least I typed her so. ESTps can learn to use their :Ne: to get into the essence of scientithic theories.
More older they get, the stronger teir interest will grow to understand such things. And you can find them in any field of science, even in psychology, which is their dual's playground.