Gilly is not EIE and certainly not IEI

[Kim]

What is the case for beta NF?

[Joy]

He seems to have Beta values?

[implied]

What is the case for beta NF?

so tell us what he is?

[Kim]

He seems to have Beta values?

Like what?

[olduser]

hmm. you have a point. i think bulletsanddoves is a great example of EIE-- bordering on stereotypical, and i don't see much in common between gilly and bnd. maybe gilly is entp or enfp?

[Kim]

Heath, I think he is far more likely to be either ENTp or ENFp. Those are my top choices for him and I think I made an elaborate case for ENFp at some point in the past.

I just don't see it beta NF.

[Kim]

so tell us what he is?

I am not sure, but ENTp or ENFp are far more likely IMHO.

I was asking the way I did because I am curious as to why people think he is beta.

[implied]

hmm. you have a point. i think bulletsanddoves is a great example of EIE-- bordering on stereotypical, and i don't see much in common between gilly and bnd. maybe gilly is entp or enfp?

i actually could reasonably see gilly and bnd as similar types, if not the same. the only difference is that gilly isn't gay. their "rants" remind me of each other a lot.

anyhow i got pretty set on gilly being an NF over the course of meeting him. i'm not sure about although i think it somewhat makes sense, and some type would be my next guess for him, after a beta.

[olduser]

Heath, I think he is far more likely to be either ENTp or ENFp. Those are my top choices for him and I think I made an elaborate case for ENFp at some point in the past.

I just don't see it beta NF.

it's cause he's just a little sunshiney huh?

[Joy]

Like what?

Hmmm... It's sort of a colorful, larger than life, animated... idk, I guess to me Betas just seem like the "edgiest" types?

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Joy]

Well... edgier than most Ne/Si types, in any case

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[Joy]

I think there are a lot of types who would say that.

[Joy]

Just out of curiosity, why do you put people's names in bold?

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[Joy]

To be more clear and visible. It's polite to make easier for people to notice their names in the fragments.

lol, in that other topic I thought you were doing it to show disdain.

Excitement comes from emotions, not declarations. What does this have to deal with the fact that Fe types are more excited about presents than other types - "often excited"?

Oh.

I'm still not sure how relevant it is. "Excited" means different things to different people.

[Creepy-Pied Piper]

Removed at User Request

[Gilly]

I'm fairly set on IEI for now; there were specific reasons for thinking that I was ILE, SLE, and EIE, and they weren't always bad reasons, but they pale in comparison to how well IEI fits me overall.

[Park]

Gilly is everything and everywhere. He's God, basically.

[misutii]

ENTp

ditto

[Creepy-Cyclops]

I feel I should be making some big post here, but it doesn't matter, Gilly's decided what type he roughly is, although I would consider ESTp as well as Beta NF.

He's an obvious Beta imo.

I haven't given it much more thought than that (except Beta seems to be most obvious for him).

[Kim]

If they both admit they are often excited to offer (especially BulletsAndDoves) and receive (especially Gilly) meaningful presents to/from friends, would you agree to reconsider the opinion that they are Beta Fe types?

I don't think so. How is that related to Fe?

I don't think Gilly has the beta edginess, tbh. My relationship with IEIs is always the same: we hit it off fabulously, become great friends with a "special connection," then I feel it's all a bit too close psychologically and back off a little OR they do their push and pull thing and I don't know what the hell is going on. In the end, things usually crumble and it's always very sad. This is true for romances as well as friendships (I have been told I am cold by IEIs, which baffles me to this day).

Of course that is just me and this refers to real life people (except for krae ), but in my interaction with Gilly it has never been remotely like that and it's because Gilly does not have the broody IEI self-centeredness ALTHOUGH it might feel like it to him. When I was in my teens/early twenties I would have self-typed as IEI in a heartbeat. I was moody, emotional, wrote poetry, was introspective, emo, and all the rest of it and I have heard from a lot of -leading types that it was the same for them. It's working through a sort of adolescent confusion I think (I really don't want to sound condescending in a "wait until you get to my age and you will figure it out" kinda way ).

I could be talked into considering EIE, but I IEI I just don't see. IEI are not goofy the way Gilly is goofy. They are very concerned about their grace and dignity (at least the ones I know irl) in an artsy sort of way. I would never consider strrrng, krae, Auvi, or most other IEIs around here to be goofy in a silly Gilly way. His humor seems alpha and he reminds me more of BG than of the IEIs. I have considered IEE because he reminds me of myself a lot of times, but that could just be the Ne and E7 (which he doesn't believe).

Bleh, it's hard to describe what I mean.

[Kim]

I am quite sure that he is not SLE.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

I am quite sure that he is not SLE.

Kim, my impression of Gilly appears to be rather different from you.

He seems to participate in conflict on the boards, he participates in baiting other people, and I don't get the impression that he's adverse to conflict.

If you view the language and his confrontation manner in this post, it seems rather unothodox behaviour for someone outwith Beta.

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...3-post105.html

And

You're a fucking idiot. Seriously, you are either incredibly stupid and devoid of virtually any interpersonal intelligence, or you are just trying to start shit. I see no other explanation. Just shut the fuck up.

There will never be a word filter of any kind as long as I own this forum.

Alright, I've seen enough.

I don't care what other people say, you are a textbook fucking SEI.

You're a fucking idiot.

IMO, Serious over Judicious, it seems he simply makes his mind up too quickly to be Ne/Si. Ne/Si types need to take in a lot of information before they come to a decision (even then they may not speak with absolute certainty on an issue) [look at Ezra for instance, who would change/make up his mind so much on such a compariatively small amount of information (to us), he's been describes as a ping pong ball, or the forwardness and finality of LSI's]. Gilly also appears to be rather mobilised to be a Judicious type.

I will due anyone, except people who feel too peaceful, like SlackerMom and tereg; I mean if they came at me, it would be all good, but I don't think I could...

Gul, you are a fucking whore.

These quotes are also rather confrontational.

I'm not saying he's definately SeTi, i'm saying it's possible, I am saying he's Beta. I fail to see how he's Judicious (ruling out Delta and Alpha) or Serious (ruling out Delta and Gamma), therefore Beta is the only one left.

BTW, I didn't go hunting for these links or quotes in depth, they were pretty easy to find, I really just picked off the top few.

[implied]

oh wow. i would basically rule any sensing type out after meeting him. especially SLE.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

Thanks for your post, interesting clarification re ESTp, sounds good!

I'm on a cell phone just now so I can't really post this so well so i'll maybe post later. Oh, fwiw, I don't think the behaviour is bad in anyway! Just maybe different from mine, it's maybe more along the lines of playful confrontation, or banter or such, which if anything is *maybe* more Beta? Eh, I still think he's Beta from my interpretation and the kinda small reinin outlook, some Beta NF them? lol, i'll maybe re-phrase this, or something when i'm at the pc, tricky to type here, but i'm bored and commuting just now and felt the need to type this, as maybe irrelevant as it may be, ha.

[Gilly]

Ugh, doubt ;_;

You people suck. But I need this. But you still suck. Thank you. FUCK.

[Gilly]

I am beginning to lean towards EIE, but I'm still not sure.

[Kim]

I am beginning to lean towards EIE, but I'm still not sure.

Why do you think you are beta?

[Gilly]

Most of the people I have developed friendships with quickly have been Betas; Betas seem attractive to me in terms of who I would like to associate myself with; my best friend is SEE, and my roommate, with whom I am very close, is either LSI or LIE; I tend to get along best with Betas; I think I need Se more than any other function; I think I am naturally aware of Fe dynamics and Ni is pretty well descriptive of my natural state; Si role makes sense for me in terms of being something that I "try but overdo;" Te PoLR makes sense of my particular kind of forgetfulness/spaciness; Ti-seeking makes sense of my approach to having an objective, logically cohesive worldview that I take a form of arrogant pride in; I tend to see SLEs as a kind of distant ideal, someone I wish I could be more like but just don't really have it in me. I gravitate towards having a small, tightly-knit group of friends who are openly competitive, like to live risky, have strange or controversial ways of seeing the world, like to talk about off-color or taboo things, and are unafraid of conflict or speaking their minds. The people I tend to ignore or have the least interest in are people who I see as satisfied with a boring, commonplace life, who are afraid of letting intensity or unfamiliarity into their lives, who try not to think about things too much and just go on living the life that's been set in front of them without considering what else might be out there for them; I enjoy controversy and emotionally volatile exchanges because I like the discharge; I tend to pen shit up too much, I need someone who I feel safe arguing with and am not afraid of them being too offended by my directness, someone who I don't have to worry about, who can take my anger simply at face value and not as something that is a direct reflection of how I feel about them.

[Kim]

Most of the people I have developed friendships with quickly have been Betas; Betas seem attractive to me in terms of who I would like to associate myself with; my best friend is SEE, and my roommate, with whom I am very close, is either LSI or LIE; I tend to get along best with Betas; I think I need Se more than any other function; I think I am naturally aware of Fe dynamics and Ni is pretty well descriptive of my natural state; Si role makes sense for me in terms of being something that I "try but overdo;" Te PoLR makes sense of my particular kind of forgetfulness/spaciness; Ti-seeking makes sense of my approach to having an objective, logically cohesive worldview that I take a form of arrogant pride in; I tend to see SLEs as a kind of distant ideal, someone I wish I could be more like but just don't really have it in me. I gravitate towards having a small, tightly-knit group of friends who are openly competitive, like to live risky, have strange or controversial ways of seeing the world, like to talk about off-color or taboo things, and are unafraid of conflict or speaking their minds. The people I tend to ignore or have the least interest in are people who I see as satisfied with a boring, commonplace life, who are afraid of letting intensity or unfamiliarity into their lives, who try not to think about things too much and just go on living the life that's been set in front of them without considering what else might be out there for them; I enjoy controversy and emotionally volatile exchanges because I like the discharge; I tend to pen shit up too much, I need someone who I feel safe arguing with and am not afraid of them being too offended by my directness, someone who I don't have to worry about, who can take my anger simply at face value and not as something that is a direct reflection of how I feel about them.

I think there has been a tendency lately to associate thrill-seeking and non-boring with the beta quadra. As a delta (supposedly the most boring quadra) it is starting to annoy me greatly because I don't think adventure-seeking and non-conformity is quadra related. Adventure can be as Ne-related as Se-related and so forth. We all need someone we feel safe arguing with, especially in a partner and if you are indeed idealizing SLEs, they are most likely not your dual. Believe it or not, I also enjoy controversy and I am known to have had rather volatile discussions with people.

It seems as if you attribute your quest for adventure and an interesting life to beta, but those are not specific to beta although this has lately been perpetuated, unfortunately. I don't know...you could just be an E7 :tongue:

[Kim]

How do you experience your relationship with your SEE friend?

[Gilly]

As far as risk and thrill seeking go, let me just say, I don't think I ever met Deltas any deeper than distribution in the drug world. I don't think that kind of risk-seeking is Beta specific; that would be ignorant to propose. I do think it's more likely to attract Betas than any other quadra though, and thus is "points" for Beta more than anything. The kind of ambitious mentality, contempt (not just disregard) for authority, inclination towards social climbing, etc that are required to "make it" in the world of crime definitely lends at least a slight bias to Betas.

As for Enneagram, I'm pretty blatantly identity triad

[Gilly]

How do you experience your relationship with your SEE friend?

He keeps me in the real world, essentially. He knows me better than anyone, he knows "who I am," he understands me. He is able to get me to do things, to get out and be active, like nobody I know; really the only time I feel totally comfortable going to things like house parties or bars is with him, partly because I know that, to him, I take priority over other people at the party, and the knowledge that we can "escape" at any time helps me to relax and enjoy myself more. In regards to my drug addiction, he acts as my "master," in a sense: I have made a personal promise to him that I will not do drugs, and whenever I am having doubts, I call him, and he can "straight talk" me to my senses, help me get a grip, and remind me where my priorities lies.

He keeps in touch with me on a fairly regular basis, keeps me grounded in our friendship; even if, for some unthinkable reason, my interest in him as a friend were to slip, he would always be forcing himself into my life, reminding me what we have been through together and showing me how much I really do need him. He often calls me when he is depressed, and I am one of the only people capable of really giving him the perspective he needs; I can make him feel better almost without fail. He likes my snarky wise cracks and blase attitude, which are parts of myself that I'm really only totally comfortable letting loose when I'm talking to or around him. He is the one person who, when I'm with him, I HAVE to be myself, no matter how many people I feel the need to impress; I can't betray his trust, it's just not in me to be someone I'm not, because it would be embarrassing for him to see me being fake, since he knows who I REALLY am.

I could rant for hours about this, but I think this is a fair picture.

[Kim]

SEEs!

[Gilly]

Indeed.

[Kim]

Well that settles it: you are ILI! Congratulations - you have the best dual!

[Gilly]

lmao, if only it were that easy...might as well turn me into a gay guy, I'll just marry him and all of my troubles will be over