Am I LIE

[Ainfigur]

So I've read some more stuff and I think I may be LIE.


My reasons, in no specific order;


1.I'm pretty sure I have Te + Ni in my ego. I would argue I value Te > Ti because while I have no problem applying subjective theoretical logic if a situation requires it, such as at school, but I tend to see it as a kind of mental masturbation and I don't take it seriously. For me the purpose of applying logic is to produce objective results, and the objective results provide this logic with value. I very much value efficiency in speech. I would argue I have Ni in my ego because I've always had a very strong vivid imagination, which I practically lived in as a child (I actually questioned the purpose of toys as a child. I could have as much fun with or without them), and I plan how everything is going to turn out in my head, all the time. This is something that I find difficult to explain to others, but I'm extremely good at making things go exactly as I want them too, in spite of setbacks of whatever. So i'm going to be rich.


2. I'm very career oriented. Always have been.


3. I'm a rational type, despite the "indecision" and disorganization I described in my member questionnaire, i'm very deliberate in my actions. I beat myself up about this a lot, but I'm not really disorganized. I'm very organized at work in comparison to others, my organization is just messy. My decision making is long term, it's big picture, but I struggle with little things, like deciding what to eat or what to wear. I tend to be overly conservative when it comes to this kind of thing as a result, which leads to my next point.


4. Si Polr makes sense. I'm bad with details, I forget stuff, I make stupid little mistakes in my work all of the time. I always look messy no matter how much I try to look good. I would argue I have strong Se however, because I always know how much effort to use to get stuff done and I have no problem applying this in response to other peoples challenges. I look athletic, I'm physically strong, I think I come across as intimidating to others until they get to know me. I think I have super good spatial awareness but I'm still clumsy as hell and bump into stuff a lot.


5. I'm not ILI. I'm an extremely positive person, I have tons of energy and dislike sitting around doing nothing, I'm externally focused and admittedly not very reflective in the sense I evaluate myself by my external actions as opposed to where I see myself fitting into the world. I like people and get on with most of them, even though i'm clumsy in my relations with others. These aren't typically ILI traits? I'm always looking for value in other people whereas it seems ILI tend to criticize.


6. People who literally think you're a bad person because you're bad at small talk are Alpha SF's right?

Opinions?

[Absurd]

Welcome LIE. Here you will find others like you.

[Beautiful sky]

Hi Welcome.

We have a few ESI who love energy and brainz...not to eat of course

[Absurd]

Heheehhe.

[Amber]

So I've read some more stuff and I think I may be LIE.


My reasons, in no specific order;

1.I'm pretty sure I have Te + Ni in my ego. I would argue I value Te > Ti because while I have no problem applying subjective theoretical logic if a situation requires it, such as at school, but I tend to see it as a kind of mental masturbation and I don't take it seriously. For me the purpose of applying logic is to produce objective results, and the objective results provide this logic with value. I very much value efficiency in speech. I would argue I have Ni in my ego because I've always had a very strong vivid imagination, which I practically lived in as a child (I actually questioned the purpose of toys as a child. I could have as much fun with or without them), and I plan how everything is going to turn out in my head, all the time. This is something that I find difficult to explain to others, but I'm extremely good at making things go exactly as I want them too, in spite of setbacks of whatever. So i'm going to be rich.


2. I'm very career oriented. Always have been.


3. I'm a rational type, despite the "indecision" and disorganization I described in my member questionnaire, i'm very deliberate in my actions. I beat myself up about this a lot, but I'm not really disorganized. I'm very organized at work in comparison to others, my organization is just messy. My decision making is long term, it's big picture, but I struggle with little things, like deciding what to eat or what to wear. I tend to be overly conservative when it comes to this kind of thing as a result, which leads to my next point.


4. Si Polr makes sense. I'm bad with details, I forget stuff, I make stupid little mistakes in my work all of the time. I always look messy no matter how much I try to look good. I would argue I have strong Se however, because I always know how much effort to use to get stuff done and I have no problem applying this in response to other peoples challenges. I look athletic, I'm physically strong, I think I come across as intimidating to others until they get to know me. I think I have super good spatial awareness but I'm still clumsy as hell and bump into stuff a lot.


5. I'm not ILI. I'm an extremely positive person, I have tons of energy and dislike sitting around doing nothing, I'm externally focused and admittedly not very reflective in the sense I evaluate myself by my external actions as opposed to where I see myself fitting into the world. I like people and get on with most of them, even though i'm clumsy in my relations with others. These aren't typically ILI traits? I'm always looking for value in other people whereas it seems ILI tend to criticize.


6. People who literally think you're a bad person because you're bad at small talk are Alpha SF's right?

Opinions?

I doubt ILIs sit around doing nothing, however reflective they may be. Anyway I just wanted to remind you of my initial impression of your being a Serious type.

[Absurd]

Sitting is hardly doing nothing, but Ash is right as always - a very serious type.

[krieger]

6. People who literally think you're a bad person because you're bad at small talk are Alpha SF's right?

that would make alpha quadra implode on itself.

...

if i wanted to be any more direct about my feelings about that statement i'd say something along lines of "fuck off for implying people i'm 'supposed to' like are that dense and fuck off twice for feigning innocence in doing so and pretending there is anything in this theory that could lead you to think that."

and i guess i just did. oh well.

[Amber]

that would make alpha quadra implode on itself.

...

if i wanted to be any more direct about my feelings about that statement i'd say something along lines of "fuck off for implying people i'm 'supposed to' like are that dense and fuck off twice for feigning innocence in doing so and pretending there is anything in this theory that could lead you to think that."

and i guess i just did. oh well.

Caregivers: ESE (ESFj) SEI (ISFp)

These are those types who openly express their need to "protect" and care for their romantic interest. In conversation may often lend a sympathetic ear (which, depending on the person, may be interpreted as insincerity, but it's exactly what the Child-like type is looking for). They are looking for someone who will not only accept their paternal/maternal tendencies, but welcome and thrive on it.

Disclaimer : As one can see even on this forum, many Alpha SFs can hold their own very well talking the deepest and darkest secrets in the lives of movie directors etc. ..depending on their personal interests, I guess.

[krieger]

wtf. how could anything in what you quoted be interpreted to mean they condemn people for having no inclination to small talk.

guess i'll have to add you to my black list. i mean, you seem to very badly want to gratuitously tick me off or you wouldn't post that. i'm not the one being unreasonable here.

[Absurd]

Just nod, labcoat.

[Amber]

that´s something in Socio-descriptions that would justify a connection between Alpha SFs and small talk imo. The erotic attitude itself, the propensity towards "lending a sympathetic ear in conversations" etc. I don´t want to generalize starting from a SiFe aunt who talks physiology and inner organs and wonders if her guests "are alright" , because, as I said, I´ve also met very interesting Alpha SFs.

[Absurd]

Ahh, war again. Right on time.

[krieger]

ashsun, i've stooped to giving you a chance to apologize but yet you persist being a pigheaded oaf. consequentially you are the first person, ever, to land on my ignore list. on any forum. no one before in all my time has descended to this level of insolence. congratulations.

also consider this thread left to fester in its misery.

[Amber]

ashsun, i've stooped to giving you a chance to apologize but yet you persist being a pigheaded oaf. consequentially you are the first person, ever, to land on my ignore list. on any forum. no one before in all my time has descended to this level of insolence. congratulations.

also consider this thread left to fester in its misery.

good decision, too many words. How about considering that small talk huh .

[FDG]

From your description, you being LIE seems possible.

[silke]

1.I'm pretty sure I have Te + Ni in my ego. I would argue I value Te > Ti because while I have no problem applying subjective theoretical logic if a situation requires it, such as at school, but I tend to see it as a kind of mental masturbation and I don't take it seriously. For me the purpose of applying logic is to produce objective results, and the objective results provide this logic with value. I very much value efficiency in speech. I would argue I have Ni in my ego because I've always had a very strong vivid imagination, which I practically lived in as a child (I actually questioned the purpose of toys as a child. I could have as much fun with or without them), and I plan how everything is going to turn out in my head, all the time. This is something that I find difficult to explain to others, but I'm extremely good at making things go exactly as I want them too, in spite of setbacks of whatever. So i'm going to be rich.

LIE could be it but I'd also suggest that you look into LSI-Se as an alternative. This type uses logic for concrete, practical applications (Ti as mental masturbation is mostly for intuitive types), typically is energetic, go-getter personality with upward (+Ti) orientation (like career advancement), positivist, rational type, that can be terse on words - and in general overlaps quite a bit in traits with both LIE and SLE and your description of yourself: http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?t...ubtype_ISTj-Se

[blackburry]

what.

I love sitting around doing nothing.

[blackburry]

that would make alpha quadra implode on itself.

...

if i wanted to be any more direct about my feelings about that statement i'd say something along lines of "fuck off for implying people i'm 'supposed to' like are that dense and fuck off twice for feigning innocence in doing so and pretending there is anything in this theory that could lead you to think that."
and i guess i just did. oh well.

oh dear lord. relax. pretty sure he made this thread as a type thread not for you or at you or to piss you off. way to be wayyyyy too sensitive. take a motrin.

[Whoobie77]

I doubt ILIs sit around doing nothing, however reflective they may be. .

From the ILI profile on Wikisocion, Suggestive section:

"ILIs are often characterized by their inertia. If left to their own devices, they may choose to do relatively little to interact with the outside world."

Base and Creative manifest very differently. Ip temperament is notorious for periods of laziness.

[Amber]

Periods of inertia, fluctuations ...maybe, but for some reason I think that means reading or watching films or exploring new stuff in town, not sleeping or doing absolutely nothing.
Te as Creative Function
It is manifested as a preference for factual accuracy over ideological consistency, and for objective, "harsh" communication over careful words that avoid a negative atmosphere. A view of the external environment being efficient, reasonable, and making sense is essential to their well-being and sense of inner peace, but they do not feel a pressing need for being proactive or productive themselves in that area.
- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/i....Vifms1sV.dpuf

[Whoobie77]

Periods of inertia, fluctuations ...maybe, but for some reason I think that means reading or watching films or exploring new stuff in town, not sleeping or doing absolutely nothing.
Te as Creative Function
It is manifested as a preference for factual accuracy over ideological consistency, and for objective, "harsh" communication over careful words that avoid a negative atmosphere. A view of the external environment being efficient, reasonable, and making sense is essential to their well-being and sense of inner peace, but they do not feel a pressing need for being proactive or productive themselves in that area.
- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/i....Vifms1sV.dpuf

Te also has to do with productivity; Ej's with Te are inclined to be working often. That's why ESTjs are stereotyped as the middle manager, and ENTjs are stereotyped as the CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor. Ip's with Te are governed first by their internal state. For instance, my uncle, an ILI, once just stopped working for 6 months and used up all of his savings while he was in this period of "slackness".

As for what an ILI does during a period of inertia, I think this has to do with which of their ego functions they are employing and subtype differences. Ni-ILIs or just in general ILIs using Ni might be inclined to contemplate the progression of time without external stimuli, while Te-ILIs or ILIs using Te would be inclined to stochastically tinker with external systems.

(Also, I'd be inclined to say you're Fi Ij and not ILI, from our interactions.)

[Reficulris]

you might be living one!

[Amber]

Te also has to do with productivity; Ej's with Te are inclined to be working often. That's why ESTjs are stereotyped as the middle manager, and ENTjs are stereotyped as the CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor. Ip's with Te are governed first by their internal state. For instance, my uncle, an ILI, once just stopped working for 6 months and used up all of his savings while he was in this period of "slackness".

As for what an ILI does during a period of inertia, I think this has to do with which of their ego functions they are employing and subtype differences. Ni-ILIs or just in general ILIs using Ni might be inclined to contemplate the progression of time without external stimuli, while Te-ILIs or ILIs using Te would be inclined to stochastically tinker with external systems.

(Also, I'd be inclined to say you're Fi Ij and not ILI, from our interactions.)

I agree subtypes can make a difference. I don´t know what to say about stochastic tinkering. Just as an example, a sure ILI-Te I know is very devoted to the idea of work, although not a Te dominant -- I might risk passing for "aristocratic" in Reinin, but all of the Te-EJs I know are concerned with productivity and getting stuff done and appear (are) quite professional in what they´re doing. Now this ILI is a software developer and he left his (well-paid) stable job in a company because he said he prefers to have his own schedule and not depend on anyone. Currently he´s an entrepreneur, has his own business with 2 other guys and it´´s apparently going well, combining work and pleasure, so to speak. What I´ve noticed nonetheless is that he values his time very highly, avoids chit-chat, empty socializing for the sake of it and so on. He can even get to extremes ...such as organizing his birthday party and turning it all into a 4-hour philosophy discussion with some of his colleagues. (he was studying that for a 2nd BA). I´ll keep looking into other types... but now this one makes most sense to me, thanks for your input.

[Absurd]

ILI philosophist, trulululu.

Aristocratic vs. Democratic is the easiest dichotomy.

[Narc]

All I could say against LIE for you is that you seem to write a lot for one, something I associate more with irrationals.

[FDG]

and ENTjs are stereotyped as the CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor.

ftr, socionics' LIEs are stereotypied as entrepreneur / pioneer. I don't really think CEO is a very fitting role for them (us), unless it's CEO of their own company.

[Amber]

ftr, socionics' LIEs are stereotypied as entrepreneur / pioneer. I don't really think CEO is a very fitting role for them (us), unless it's CEO of their own company.

As if only one role fit a Sociotype. So yeah, pioneer, not CEO in a company , just cause someone of that type here happened not to be such a thing. The LIEs I know irl (only 3 - not all doing the same thing, but all going on the long run for the same basic purposes) must be very just career-oriented SLEs ....although rather "classic" specimens of this Sociotype boil down to DJ arendee, youtube starlet.

Just cause it fits the "pioneer stereotype" so well : http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/LIE-ENTj/
**
LIEs are often concerned with matters of efficiency and optimization of their environment and may be inclined to offer suggestions as to its improvement. LIEs do not always seek leadership roles, but nor do they shun them; LIEs most commonly step up to the challenge of leading others if they feel that others are unqualified or that nonintervention would lead to a vastly inefficient state of affairs. - See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/t....zPiYhV0L.dpuf

[FDG]

As if only one role fit a Sociotype.

I didn't say so.

So yeah, pioneer, not CEO in a company , just cause someone of that type here happened not to be such a thing.

Do you have troubles with reading comprehension? I listed BOTH pioneer AND entrepreneur, as opposed to "manager". And it's not me saying so, but rather the descriptions - which surely you may disagree with...

The LIEs I know irl (only 3 - not all doing the same thing, but all going on the long run for the same basic purposes) must be very just career-oriented SLEs ....although rather "classic" specimens of this Sociotype boil down to DJ arendee, youtube starlet.

Just cause it fits the "pioneer stereotype" so well : http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/LIE-ENTj/
**
LIEs are often concerned with matters of efficiency and optimization of their environment and may be inclined to offer suggestions as to its improvement. LIEs do not always seek leadership roles, but nor do they shun them; LIEs most commonly step up to the challenge of leading others if they feel that others are unqualified or that nonintervention would lead to a vastly inefficient state of affairs. - See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/t....zPiYhV0L.dpuf

Yeah, so?

[Soupman]

Te also has to do with productivity; Ej's with Te are inclined to be working often. That's why ESTjs are stereotyped as the middle manager, and ENTjs are stereotyped as the CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor. Ip's with Te are governed first by their internal state. For instance, my uncle, an ILI, once just stopped working for 6 months and used up all of his savings while he was in this period of "slackness".

As for what an ILI does during a period of inertia, I think this has to do with which of their ego functions they are employing and subtype differences. Ni-ILIs or just in general ILIs using Ni might be inclined to contemplate the progression of time without external stimuli, while Te-ILIs or ILIs using Te would be inclined to stochastically tinker with external systems.

(Also, I'd be inclined to say you're Fi Ij and not ILI, from our interactions.)

CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor. are aristocrats EST, both of them are control freaks, for the most. ENT are both scientists, being NeTe orientated

[Amber]

ouch, a new dichotomy.

So the only LIE I know who has an executive position is an "aristocrat". And evil to boot! He´s LIE-Ni sp/so and he´s not exactly a scientist, but into a branch of Economics. True Ni may be responsible for a love of abstractions and synthesizing and spotting trends. But he´s definitely a control freak.

[Ainfigur]

Apologies for not responding to stuff sooner, I've been busy and I was having trouble with my internets on Monday. All is well now.

that would make alpha quadra implode on itself.

...

if i wanted to be any more direct about my feelings about that statement i'd say something along lines of "fuck off for implying people i'm 'supposed to' like are that dense and fuck off twice for feigning innocence in doing so and pretending there is anything in this theory that could lead you to think that."

and i guess i just did. oh well.

I've known people who fit well into the Alpha SF type temperament who have had a real problem with me, and I don't really understand why. To deal with this I just like to think they're stupid. Obviously I don't really mean this, you're taking it way too seriously.

LIE could be it but I'd also suggest that you look into LSI-Se as an alternative. This type uses logic for concrete, practical applications (Ti as mental masturbation is mostly for intuitive types), typically is energetic, go-getter personality with upward (+Ti) orientation (like career advancement), positivist, rational type, that can be terse on words - and in general overlaps quite a bit in traits with both LIE and SLE and your description of yourself: http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?t...ubtype_ISTj-Se

I don't think Se is in my ego. I think that typical "Se" type behavior is something I've learnt more recently becoming an adult from Se types, rather than it being something that comes naturally to me. I wish I was a sensing type though in many ways.

you might be living one!

Ha.

All I could say against LIE for you is that you seem to write a lot for one, something I associate more with irrationals.

Not true actually, I just thought that particular post required more detail. That's interesting though.


Decided on LIE then.

[Absurd]

Hope yo have brain for ESI. Not necessarily for consumption - I agree with Maritsa.

[Ainfigur]

Hope yo have brain for ESI. Not necessarily for consumption - I agree with Maritsa.

wut?

[ashlesha]

i dont think youre ready for this jelly

[Absurd]

Thanks for posting that, lungs. Now I am officially out of this thread. Guilt can be terrible.

[Whoobie77]

CEO/Warlord/Evil Emperor. are aristocrats EST, both of them are control freaks, for the most. ENT are both scientists, being NeTe orientated

socionics is srs business. "evil emperor" obviously meant to be taken deathly srsly.

[Soupman]

socionics is srs business. "evil emperor" obviously meant to be taken deathly srsly.

The point is that the stereotype is for ESTX actually, I understand that its exaggeration

[blackburry]

i dont think youre ready for this jelly

for some reason this ^...
reminded me of this:

[lemontrees]

I'm extremely good at making things go exactly as I want them too, in spite of setbacks of whatever. So I'm going to be rich.

I wish I were LIE too. ;___;

[blackburry]

I wish I were LIE too. ;___;

ditto.