Hilarious Beta Quadra Description

[Pallas]

All of these quadra descriptions are so over-the-top, but I thought you might find this entertaining: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...tratiyevskaya?

This is literally makes the Beta quadra sound like a bunch of Klingons or something. Beta Quadra is literally 1/4 of the human population and it would be absurd for it to work exactly like that, although I think there's definitely sort of a warrior streak in Beta. Also, the bit at the end with "Gamma displaces Beta" is wrong, as it's usually the other way around in terms of order of domination, and in order of descent Delta comes from Beta, not Gamma IIRC (hence the names).

[Pallas]

Also, since Betas are now Klingons:


Klingon Hamlet:
http://youtu.be/CiRMGYQfXrs

Klingon Yesenin:
http://www.math.bas.bg/~iad/bommugh.html

I couldn't find the others.

[darya]

It's quite correct actually, although written in over the top style.

[Sol]

Stratiyevskaya has bad types descriptions. The may be entertaining, but not accurate.

[Singu]

Propensity of the "decisive" types to act operatively, effectively and quickly, to be "brutal" and "swift" in retaliation (to act rashly and bluntly), allows for all possible and extremely harsh punishments for the convicted. In Beta Quadra he won't get off by mere ostracism (expulsion from the community). Penalties viewed as severe in Alpha Quadra here are considered to be too soft. In a closed and self-sufficient society of Beta Quadra the "enemies of the system" are not released into an exile ("this is too great a gift for them!"), but finished off on the spot, decisively and harshly, as a warning to others. Because too much is at stake. Namely, - the social and political well-being of the system, its combat capability and resilience, its unity and its solidarity – that is, all guarantees of its current existence and future development are at stake.

Don't mess with Betas... or you will be vaporized! But seriously, I think this can be genuinely worrying at times. Betas sometime need restraint, because they can go too far.

I think this is more of an example in extreme situations like communist dictatorship regime that Russia went through.

But this might be why Betas feel more at home in political environments. But it can get seriously nasty and cut-throat. All sorts of nasty attacks and cunning maneuvers and duplicities are employed by Betas and other Quadra members.

[Myst]

Stratiyevskaya has bad types descriptions. The may be entertaining, but not accurate.

They work very well for me...

[The Reality Denialist]

Beta Quadra doesn't tolerate attacks on their social standing, on their rank, position, rights and privileges: they don't tolerate when their rights and rank advantages are being challenged, they don't tolerate familiarity in attitudes of others, in jest or serious, and can't stand ridicule that could create false impression of their inability to fend for themselves.

Not that far off from what I have seen. Aristocrats... (I like to make fun of that like if I was promoted during military service I would have marched to captain's office and demanded of lowering my rank.)

[Singu]

I don't really understand this part:

"they don't tolerate familiarity in attitudes of others, in jest or serious"

[niffer]

I don't really understand this part:

"they don't tolerate familiarity in attitudes of others, in jest or serious"

I'm not going to bother to search for the context that this was extracted from and just going to take this at face value (woot Se superficiality).

IME a lot of betas aren't comfortable with expressing uncloaked indications of closeness/familiarity/kinship with people as a result of Fi devaluing. IEIs would be the one type that would be most able to potentially "turn this on" temporarily if needed due to having Fi demonstrative, but I've seen some IEIs who generally seem averse to this form of communication anyway. If the relationship is expressed and made known to both parties, what results from that is a sense of being beholden to each other; a sense of responsibility -- overt Te-Fi valuing and expression in other words, and this can make betas uncomfortable. We of course do create deep ties, as gammas and other quadras do, but there's an initial reluctance or aversion to it from inside which clashes with the desire to keep things merry and upbeat on the surface. Just my 2c.

Tldr: When familiarity is expressed, it breaks out from the aristocratic hierarchical social structure into something less controllable and predictable by those externally structured means, instead moving into the underlying relationship dynamics and genuine feelings people have for each other.

[squark]

I don't really understand this part:

"they don't tolerate familiarity in attitudes of others, in jest or serious"

A couple weeks ago a telemarketer called me. When I answered the phone they said, "Hey squark, how ya doin'?" Their tone and manner made it sound like they were someone I knew, but the voice was completely unfamiliar, and that made me uneasy, so I said, "Who is this?" and again in this overly-familiar tone, they said something vague and I hung up. A few days later this same person with a different area code now called again, and again with that tone like we'd been friends forever greeted me in the same way. It seriously creeped me out. Who does that? They kept calling from different area codes, and I kept hanging up. Someone asked me, "Why don't you find out what they want?" And I said, "Because they're creepy." It was entirely their tone that made them creepy to me, acting like they were my friend rather than adopting a more professional or formal tone.

Anyway, that's an example. People being all buddy-buddy when you don't even know them is uncomfortable to me.

[Mr inappropriate]

I'm not going to bother to search for the context that this was extracted from and just going to take this at face value (woot Se superficiality).

IME a lot of betas aren't comfortable with expressing uncloaked indications of closeness/familiarity/kinship with people as a result of Fi devaluing. IEIs would be the one type that would be most able to potentially "turn this on" temporarily if needed due to having Fi demonstrative, but I've seen some IEIs who generally seem averse to this form of communication anyway. If the relationship is expressed and made known to both parties, what results from that is a sense of being beholden to each other; a sense of responsibility -- overt Te-Fi valuing and expression in other words, and this can make betas uncomfortable. We of course do create deep ties, as gammas and other quadras do, but there's an initial reluctance or aversion to it from inside which clashes with the desire to keep things merry and upbeat on the surface. Just my 2c.

Tldr: When familiarity is expressed, it breaks out from the aristocratic hierarchical social structure into something less controllable and predictable by those externally structured means, instead moving into the underlying relationship dynamics and genuine feelings people have for each other.

Agreed %100 how a clear expression of the relationship puts burden on myself, as a defence I try to hang out with different people at times/sort of rotation of "buddies". However, I sometimes see Fe leads also do this, especially ESE's. "OMG YOU GUYS ARE MY BEST FRIENDS WHAT WOULD I DO WITHOUT YOU ? " .Maybe its more to do with Quadra values rather than Fi/Fe clash ?

[niffer]

Maybe its more to do with Quadra values rather than Fi/Fe clash ?

What do you mean?

[niffer]

Also, the bit at the end with "Gamma displaces Beta" is wrong, as it's usually the other way around in terms of order of domination, and in order of descent Delta comes from Beta, not Gamma IIRC (hence the names).

Btw I'm wondering what the OP meant by this. If anyone has any idea, please enlighten me, thanks.

[Singu]

Btw I'm wondering what the OP meant by this. If anyone has any idea, please enlighten me, thanks.

I think he's saying Delta > Beta and not Gamma > Beta, which I don't necessarily think is true. Beta probably is displaced by Gamma.

[niffer]

@Singularity @Encrustacean

Yeah, I don't see how that's possible at all. (Delta>Beta .. they're at opposite ends of the continuum).

I believe whenever power is discussed in socionics in relation to interquadral movement, it's always described as being an eternal struggle between Beta and Gamma where things tend to shift back and forth between these two, with things temporarily "settling" into Alpha and Delta on rare occasions.

[Singu]

@Singularity @Encrustacean

Yeah, I don't see how that's possible at all. (Delta>Beta .. they're at opposite ends of the continuum).

I believe whenever power is discussed in socionics in relation to interquadral movement, it's always described as being an eternal struggle between Beta and Gamma where things tend to shift back and forth between these two, with things temporarily "settling" into Alpha and Delta on rare occasions.

Yeah, I was reading this socionics article for some reason, and it describes how power held by Beta STs are notoriously difficult to usurp (using Russian politics as an example):

http://www.socionikaskola.lv/en/actu...umfa-noslepums

Gammas are not authoritarian, they are anti-authority but they create another kind of power structure that rivals Beta power by accumulating wealth and creating oligarchies, I think (I think this is exemplified in the capitalist revolution that happened in Britain).

I tend to think that Deltas "pick up" on whatever chaos that was left behind (from the end of Beta and Gamma struggle for power, like after major wars) and take advantage of that. Stability is needed in such times, so they create extremely stable but possibly stifling systems and structures, where everything is working perfectly, but it's so stale and stagnant that nothing ever happens and there's no passion for anything. It's kind of a depressing end-state.

[Mr inappropriate]

What do you mean?

I wouldnt expect such behaviour from ESE's if its about Fi.

[Myst]

Agreed %100 how a clear expression of the relationship puts burden on myself, as a defence I try to hang out with different people at times/sort of rotation of "buddies". However, I sometimes see Fe leads also do this, especially ESE's. "OMG YOU GUYS ARE MY BEST FRIENDS WHAT WOULD I DO WITHOUT YOU ? " .Maybe its more to do with Quadra values rather than Fi/Fe clash ?

I don't see Fe leads doing this randomly like that. At least to me their way of expressing these positive attitudes is less chaotic.

[niffer]

I wouldnt expect such behaviour from ESE's if its about Fi.

Oh, I see what you mean now I think. I see it as the same phenomenon. ESEs aren't showing "familiarity" in the same way when they're doing that; they're doing the opposite to an extreme because it's like "fake" Fe stuff. The kind of familiarity thing that I was talking about was more like Gamma style direct genuine expressions of it, and by expression I don't mean Fe emoting.

[Mr inappropriate]

Oh, I see what you mean now I think. I see it as the same phenomenon. ESEs aren't showing "familiarity" in the same way when they're doing that; they're doing the opposite to an extreme because it's like "fake" Fe stuff. The kind of familiarity thing that I was talking about was more like Gamma style direct genuine expressions of it, and by expression I don't mean Fe emoting.

Well, then its safe to say I have no idea what that Gamma style direct genuine expressions look like, maybe they fly under my radar or they never show that kinda thing towards me.

I don't see Fe leads doing this randomly like that. At least to me their way of expressing these positive attitudes is less chaotic.

I want to meet with your Fe doms just to compare with mines.

[Jerdle]

Penalties viewed as severe in Alpha Quadra here are considered to be too soft.

This is actually probably correct. A severe penalty in Alpha is being blocked. No, really.
As soon as actual power dynamics arise, it is too severe for Alphas.

Imagine there was an [insert evil thing here] on social media. If you would report them, and find blocking too soft, you are an example.