A responsible know-it-all

[Minde]

There's a kid I know and work with sometimes. At first I wasn't sure I liked him. He seemed quite the know-it-all, and acted sometimes like he was trying too hard to be perfect and impress. That was a year ago. Since then either he's changed some or my understanding has grown (or both).

Now he's still a know-it-all, but he really does know quite a bit. And can do a lot. But he seems a little less like he needs to show that off to everyone (although, if he thinks you need correcting in your understanding or technique, he's still more likely than not to take that responsibility on himself and correct you, complete with a thorough explanation of why). He's a little more likely to be accurate in assessing who actually needs his help and who doesn't really want it. In other words, he seems a little bit more secure in himself and his understanding of people than he was a year ago.

He really likes the concepts of leadership and serving others. He's still fairly young, but he's taking on responsibilities of people much older than himself - and doing it pretty well, I might add. He's not perfect, of course - far from it - but he does seem open to correction and teaching and will politely listen to you even if he doesn't particularly think he needs to hear it. He'll especially listen, though, if he thinks you have some expertise or knowledge that he doesn't have.

He's always one of the first to arrive, and if things need setting up or fixing you can pretty much count on him either already doing it or being ready and willing to help. He'll put in extra time if he thinks there's a need for it, too, even if it's not required of him. From what I've seen, the work he likes is where he can make things work better and where it'll help other people. (Although, again, while he's gotten a little better about it, he'll still kind of emphasize how helpful his work is.)

Some descriptive words another person gave me when I asked how they'd describe him: Confident, almost to the point of arrogance, but not quite. Cheerful (although, I would take exception to this one because I don't think he is always especially happy - not unhappy, just perhaps not as happy as some might see). Very self-motivated. Gregarious and friendly. Helpful. Mature for his age.


I have an idea, but I'd like to hear some opinions. From that short description, what type(s) do you think he might be?

[Bardia]

My guesses, in order, would be:

1) LSI
2) ESI
3) EII
4) LSE

[DirectorAbbie]

Sounds like my type: LSE.

[UDP]

There's a kid I know and work with sometimes. At first I wasn't sure I liked him. He seemed quite the know-it-all, and acted sometimes like he was trying too hard to be perfect and impress. That was a year ago. Since then either he's changed some or my understanding has grown (or both).

Now he's still a know-it-all, but he really does know quite a bit. And can do a lot. But he seems a little less like he needs to show that off to everyone (although, if he thinks you need correcting in your understanding or technique, he's still more likely than not to take that responsibility on himself and correct you, complete with a thorough explanation of why). He's a little more likely to be accurate in assessing who actually needs his help and who doesn't really want it. In other words, he seems a little bit more secure in himself and his understanding of people than he was a year ago.

He really likes the concepts of leadership and serving others. He's still fairly young, but he's taking on responsibilities of people much older than himself - and doing it pretty well, I might add. He's not perfect, of course - far from it - but he does seem open to correction and teaching and will politely listen to you even if he doesn't particularly think he needs to hear it. He'll especially listen, though, if he thinks you have some expertise or knowledge that he doesn't have.

He's always one of the first to arrive, and if things need setting up or fixing you can pretty much count on him either already doing it or being ready and willing to help. He'll put in extra time if he thinks there's a need for it, too, even if it's not required of him. From what I've seen, the work he likes is where he can make things work better and where it'll help other people. (Although, again, while he's gotten a little better about it, he'll still kind of emphasize how helpful his work is.)

Some descriptive words another person gave me when I asked how they'd describe him: Confident, almost to the point of arrogance, but not quite. Cheerful (although, I would take exception to this one because I don't think he is always especially happy - not unhappy, just perhaps not as happy as some might see). Very self-motivated. Gregarious and friendly. Helpful. Mature for his age.


I have an idea, but I'd like to hear some opinions. From that short description, what type(s) do you think he might be?

Sounds similar to me, though I don't think I'd be considered gregarious and friendly (No one would ever say I am more people oriented than task oriented), and it would probably be more advantageous if I tried to schmooze people more and "impress them".

LSX, SLE, LIE,

What is he like away from work. What does he do with his free time?
And, why is he working at the place he is working at?
What does he want to do with his life, and why does he see himself as having to be in leadership positions?

[FDG]

LSE, LIE

[Christy B]

LSE
I am watching a little boy these days who I would describe in a very similar way and I also think he is LSE.

[Ezra]

Te ego seems about right. I'd be more inclined to say LSE than LIE, because he seems to have this Caregiver approach.

[Creepy-Cyclops]

ESFj or could be ESTj

[idolatrie]

Not to rain on the LSE parade going on here, but a lot of that description reminded me of myself too. Which I think goes more to it describing things which may be attributed to the strong functions of either type, rather than any specific functional preferences.

(although, if he thinks you need correcting in your understanding or technique, he's still more likely than not to take that responsibility on himself and correct you, complete with a thorough explanation of why).

It depends on how he does this, it could demonstrate Te or Ti. Te would be if he sees your factual inputs as wrong. But since you mentioned understanding or technique, I would argue it could be Ti - he's looking at the way in which the person has erred in understanding and wants to fix a Ti structure.

He's a little more likely to be accurate in assessing who actually needs his help and who doesn't really want it. In other words, he seems a little bit more secure in himself and his understanding of people than he was a year ago.

The first line seems to be suggesting this is concerned with Fi. But if it is actually referring to being able to read people and their level of interest in a situation, that could be referring to Fe. Either way, it seems to be a function which he is developing, rather than one which he is naturally competant in.

He really likes the concepts of leadership and serving others. He's still fairly young, but he's taking on responsibilities of people much older than himself - and doing it pretty well, I might add. He's not perfect, of course - far from it - but he does seem open to correction and teaching and will politely listen to you even if he doesn't particularly think he needs to hear it. He'll especially listen, though, if he thinks you have some expertise or knowledge that he doesn't have.

Seems to indicate aristocratic values. Respects hierarchies. I can't see how any of these details could differentiate between say LSE and LSI. I would think the manner in which he is open to correction is important. What prompts him to change his mind?

He's always one of the first to arrive, and if things need setting up or fixing you can pretty much count on him either already doing it or being ready and willing to help. He'll put in extra time if he thinks there's a need for it, too, even if it's not required of him. From what I've seen, the work he likes is where he can make things work better and where it'll help other people. (Although, again, while he's gotten a little better about it, he'll still kind of emphasize how helpful his work is.)

I've put in extra work for projects I'm committed to, even though that indicates against introversion in the socionics sense. Preferring work with a clear purpose seems indicative of Beta > Delta, as it is is the physical actualisation (Se) of an imagined goal (Ni). Then again, I'm sure Deltas can also argue as to why this is actually a Delta manifestation.

Some descriptive words another person gave me when I asked how they'd describe him: Confident, almost to the point of arrogance, but not quite. Cheerful (although, I would take exception to this one because I don't think he is always especially happy - not unhappy, just perhaps not as happy as some might see). Very self-motivated. Gregarious and friendly. Helpful. Mature for his age.

The appearance of cheerfulness which is not necessarily a reflection of his inner state could be explained as Fe valuing - wanting to be able to control the Fe expression. How does he react to the emotional mood of a situation? Does he mirror it back, get swept up in it and seem that his own mood is affect by the group one? I think both LSEs and LSIs can come across as mature for their age.


I'd go LSX pending more information.

[Minde]

First of all - Idolatrie, I thought you were LSE! What happened?

Sounds similar to me, though I don't think I'd be considered gregarious and friendly (No one would ever say I am more people oriented than task oriented), and it would probably be more advantageous if I tried to schmooze people more and "impress them".

LSX, SLE, LIE,

What is he like away from work. What does he do with his free time?
And, why is he working at the place he is working at?
What does he want to do with his life, and why does he see himself as having to be in leadership positions?

I haven't worked with him that closely yet, so I can't answer these questions with confidence.

Although, where we work is the school I teach at. He was a student last year and is doing some student- and co-teaching this term, as well as taking classes.

The appearance of cheerfulness which is not necessarily a reflection of his inner state could be explained as Fe valuing - wanting to be able to control the Fe expression. How does he react to the emotional mood of a situation? Does he mirror it back, get swept up in it and seem that his own mood is affect by the group one? I think both LSEs and LSIs can come across as mature for their age.

The emotional mood of a situation? Mm, I can't say I've really payed attention to that. I'll look more closely next time I see him, though.


So far, it seems most of you are seeing EJ, perhaps ExSj, and some strength in Te.

[Expat]

I think LSE is the best bet, followed by LIE.

[idolatrie]

First of all - Idolatrie, I thought you were LSE! What happened?

Went though a massive retyping process. In brief, unefille had her type questioned, and once we stopped being defensive about it, she started seriously considering EIE. When she did that, we also looked at my type since it was possibly, but highly unlikely we were from opposing quadras. I talked to some people about Te and Ti, and had some epiphanies about how I use Ti, which was what really convinced me. Typing thread, if you're interested: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...ad.php?t=21004.

Aaaand, I'll stop going off topic in your thread now.

[Minde]

Went though a massive retyping process. In brief, unefille had her type questioned, and once we stopped being defensive about it, she started seriously considering EIE. When she did that, we also looked at my type since it was possibly, but highly unlikely we were from opposing quadras. I talked to some people about Te and Ti, and had some epiphanies about how I use Ti, which was what really convinced me. Typing thread, if you're interested: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...ad.php?t=21004.

Aaaand, I'll stop going off topic in your thread now.

No, it's quite alright. I asked the question.

I thought you were just fine as LSE and unefille as IEE. I'm sorry to see you've changed your minds. You seemed to fit so nicely in Delta.

Although, you both seem like nice and intelligent people, so you could probably fit anywhere.

[Ezra]

Gee, what a surprise, me too!

You've been coinciding with others' correct opinions a lot, recently, it seems. Before long, people will no longer be gobsmacked to find that you are making intelligible claims about a person's type.

Although, you both seem like nice and intelligent people, so you could probably fit anywhere.

Exactly.

[cracka]

Just my $.02... which we all know doesn't mean much in socionics...lol... but there's nothing that I can see that would really rule out ESE either. Is there?

[idolatrie]

Although, you both seem like nice and intelligent people, so you could probably fit anywhere.

Thank you Minde. The continued good regard of you and others in Delta means a lot to me.

[Ezra]

Just my $.02... which we all know doesn't mean much in socionics...lol... but there's nothing that I can see that would really rule out ESE either. Is there?

Maybe the "know-it-all" status? Could contradict a Te role type.

[Minde]

What is he like away from work. What does he do with his free time?

I think I can answer this one now: He seems to be quite busy all the time. He's involved in a lot, has a wide variety of interests, and is quite accomplished. I think he puts pressure on himself to achieve and work hard and earn money. As far as I can tell, his goal in earning money is not so much for status or fun, but for his family, both the one he has now (I'm pretty sure he at least in some ways contributes to his parents' and younger siblings' income) and for the one he wants to have someday. For example, we were talking about computers and he said how he'd like to have a Mac, but that they're a bit too expensive, that he's saving up money. When asked what he's saving for he said, "A house" and then when questioned on that, "a wife and family."

Seems to indicate aristocratic values. Respects hierarchies. I can't see how any of these details could differentiate between say LSE and LSI. I would think the manner in which he is open to correction is important. What prompts him to change his mind?

When he's wrong.

The appearance of cheerfulness which is not necessarily a reflection of his inner state could be explained as Fe valuing - wanting to be able to control the Fe expression. How does he react to the emotional mood of a situation? Does he mirror it back, get swept up in it and seem that his own mood is affect by the group one? I think both LSEs and LSIs can come across as mature for their age.

My first thought when reading that question was "emotional mood of a situation?" then "Oh, right, that." Um, as far as I can tell... I don't know if he notices it all the time. He just kind of... does what he does. Unless it's obvious, of course, like somebody's crying.

Just my $.02... which we all know doesn't mean much in socionics...lol... but there's nothing that I can see that would really rule out ESE either. Is there?

I don't know. Why? Do you relate to the description of him?