Conspiracy Theories and Strange Ideas

[meatburger]

So whats your take on conspiracy theories. Other quadras chime in aswell im quite curious about deltas tho.

The two ISTp guys who i know both suggested i watch 911 loose change. They dont know each other. They both seem to thoroughly believe in these things. One of them is now watching Zeigest or something and is talking about how religeon is based on the stars. It makes sense because this guy firmly believes in Astrology. He also talks about how people should look to their roots (ancestory) to tell what they should be doing in life. He thinks thats my ticket. Ive also been told there is a giant base of some description under the denver airport.

So ok. I think its a horde of bullshit. I dont know what happened to me but for a number of years now im quite the skeptic. I dont believe in star signs, aliens, auras, etc etc. My ESTj friend basically thinks exactly the same as me. Ive also noticed some INFj's holding some interesting ideas like this (creative ne?). I suppose for an Ne i just dont have an open mind? Im happy to believe that some of it is possible. One problem i have about Conspiracy websites /theorists is they seem to have conspiracys about everything. They must be right that the twin towers were blown up, they must be right that the contrails seen in the sky are actually genetic testing.. He just said something like "i feel sorry for people who see authority as truth rather than truth as authority".

ISTp's are often a bit rebellious. Can this rebellious nature help them believe that the man is out to get them? This guy got the Zeigiest cd from another guy who im pretty sure is ISTp too lol.

I know some people like force my hand (if you're ISTp) are as critical as me

[xyz]

I do believe the man is out to get me, but what you described sounds like a fat load of horseshit to me.

[Minde]

I try to avoid giving definitive opinions on things like that when people bring them up. Privately I tend toward skepticism unless they can give a really, really good case for whatever they're saying.

[tereg]

I try to avoid giving definitive opinions on things like that when people bring them up. Privately I tend toward skepticism unless they can give a really, really good case for whatever they're saying.

+1

[meatburger]

I do believe the man is out to get me, but what you described sounds like a fat load of horseshit to me.

Yeah. I cant believe how many people believe in star signs. It could be all the bongs hes smoked over the years. Like hes a really smart and practical guy tho. Perhaps he needs a hippie style Ne ENFp.

I try to avoid giving definitive opinions on things like that when people bring them up. Privately I tend toward skepticism unless they can give a really, really good case for whatever they're saying.

Yeah thats a good way to handle it. I seem to be a little more outspoken these days but i definately am not mean in my disagreement im very soft about how i approach it.

[hellothere]

I'm not sure what quadra I'm in but I love to read and hear about conspiracy theories and strange ideas. I love to entertain them, though I try to be a sensible person so I don't take them too seriously.

[hellothere]

I think this is kind of related:

He usually dismisses supernatural claims as being silly, wishful thinking, unless they happen to be related to the very specific religion he feels inclined to believe in and which he may be inclined to make part of his leisure activities.

[meatburger]

I think this is kind of related:

Hello Hellothere

Yeah i can certianlly see the fun in these ideas. In movies etc i LOVE them. Interesting about the Ni as demonstrative. Like my INFj friend i think seems a little into this kind of stuff. Actually he has this amazing ability to make them seem plausible. He was telling me how auras are electromagnetic energy once and different levels of health can be seen due to the strength of this energy or something. INTj's seem to be very critical people. Isn't their description the critic lol? Most of them i have seen would probablly dismiss this as silly.

When i was younger i was very interested in it. I actually frequented a forum called the Astral Pulse. Check it out if you wish its still there. The forum deals with Mediation(i believe thats great), psychic powers, astral projection negative entities etc. I actually used to do things like use Binural Beat programs and try to get my brain into different brain states, alpha, theta etc. I suppose i still believe the theory behind that kind of works. I was also into Lucid dreaming and i must admit i think its 100% true as ive done it! As i got a little older i realised something seemed a little wrong with that forum.

There were people trying to communicate on the astral plane but it never actually worked. The worst part of it though was people who believe in negative entities. They used to fight them and try to ward them off. The problem is i actually see it as a dangerous past time as these people seemed to feel like they were always under attack. It was making them paranoid. Not to mention some of them probablly had dellusional disorders.

These things certianlly do spice up life. I hope they are true

[hellothere]

Hello Hellothere

Yeah i can certianlly see the fun in these ideas. In movies etc i LOVE them. Interesting about the Ni as demonstrative. Like my INFj friend i think seems a little into this kind of stuff. Actually he has this amazing ability to make them seem plausible. He was telling me how auras are electromagnetic energy once and different levels of health can be seen due to the strength of this energy or something. INTj's seem to be very critical people. Isn't their description the critic lol? Most of them i have seen would probablly dismiss this as silly.

hello

I think "The Critic" is actually INTp

When i was younger i was very interested in it. I actually frequented a forum called the Astral Pulse. Check it out if you wish its still there. The forum deals with Mediation(i believe thats great), psychic powers, astral projection negative entities etc. I actually used to do things like use Binural Beat programs and try to get my brain into different brain states, alpha, theta etc. I suppose i still believe the theory behind that kind of works. I was also into Lucid dreaming and i must admit i think its 100% true as ive done it! As i got a little older i realised something seemed a little wrong with that forum.

Yeah I find these things utterly fascinating... I've even tried things like "contacting my spirit guide". But I don't think I ever truly believed... I lack faith, and I have been educated to be skeptical.

(though for the record I don't believe meditation should be grouped with those other things - probably what you meant by "I believe thats great")

[meatburger]

hello

I think "The Critic" is actually INTp

So they are. Ive been away a little while

I lack faith, and I have been educated to be skeptical.

and rightly so for most of it i think!

(though for the record I don't believe meditation should be grouped with those other things - probably what you meant by "I believe thats great")

Yep thats exactly what i meant. I see it like

Real:
Meditation: is a true and quite proven phenomenon, although i dont seem to get any real benefit out of it.
Lucid dreaming: actually does work if you work at it. Fairly useless experience for all who try probablly though
Brain waves: Proven but using tapes to change waves Probablly doesn't work.

Crap:
Star signs:
Psychics
Negative Entities
Astral Projection
Ki and Dragonball Z powers.
Energy and Crystal healing
Acupuncture
Magic
End of the world in 2012 due to mayan calendar ending
Ghosts / supernatural
Most conspiracy theories

You seem like a delta NF Hellothere

[xyz]

So they are. Ive been away a little while



and rightly so for most of it i think!



Yep thats exactly what i meant. I see it like

Real:
Meditation: is a true and quite proven phenomenon, although i dont seem to get any real benefit out of it.
Lucid dreaming: actually does work if you work at it. Fairly useless experience for all who try probablly though
Brain waves: Proven but using tapes to change waves Probablly doesn't work.

Crap:
Star signs:
Psychics
Negative Entities
Astral Projection
Ki and Dragonball Z powers.
Energy and Crystal healing
Acupuncture
Magic
End of the world in 2012 due to mayan calendar ending
Ghosts / supernatural
Most conspiracy theories

You seem like a delta NF Hellothere

*chortle*

[hellothere]

lol dragonball Z powers

www.2012.com.au <--- I visit that site from time to time, its fascinating as hell to see what the aliens are saying

[xyz]

if i can't feel it, see it, eat it, smell it or hear it it doesn't exist to me. So that's why the sun god gets a +1

[meatburger]

www.2012.com.au <--- I visit that site from time to time, its fascinating as hell to see what the aliens are saying

Haha. Jupiter to become the next sun, chemtrails. Colloidal silver haha a dude turned blue from that that other day - http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...297781,00.html

Who are these people! They are Australian aswell i think we should find them.


Yeah i can believe that. It just seems to me that no one really masters it or can regularly do it

Like demons that are basically making someones life shit.

really? I can make smoke come out of my ass hehe

Like charmed and harry potter. ouiji boards etc

Ive never seen it myself so i tend to believe its fake

[meatburger]

Yeah no worries i dont want this to get into a belief bashing thread. Obviously im pretty arrogant also. I always used to say to myself that if i saw a ghost i wouldn't be scared because i would be so happy that theres proof of something more. I would probablly still wee in my pants tho

I tend to enjoy believing things like the new particle accelerator being opened at CERN in the next few months will create black holes that will kill us all.

[force my hand]

I know some people like force my hand (if you're ISTp) are as critical as me

Haha, yeah, unfortunately you got me dialed there!

It's my belief that by and large the general populace is given a skewed version of reality by the time stories pass both government and media filters, so I'm open to a certain measure of the strange. However, I think that aspect of reality is far removed from the idea that there are powerful cabals operating in secret to keep the population in the dark, be it over the existence of aliens on Earth or cars that can travel 1000km on a litre of gas.

I've heard stories that, for example, the spread of HIV/AIDS into the human population happened as a result of companies cutting corners with respect to innoculation efforts in Africa where a prescription derived from some species of primate was tainted (I forget the specifics). When you hear about Canada's tainted blood scandal from the 80's, or as a current example, toys and lead paint, that sort of story sounds plausible. What doesn't, however, is the government creating the virus to kill off blacks and/or homosexuals.

My biggest pet peeve in this regard are the conspiracy theories where some miracle cure/technology exists, but is being suppressed in the name of economic interests. I'm sorry, but the company that holds the cure to cancer (notice it's Cancer(TM), as if there was just one kind) stands to make trillions from it - why the hell would they not release it?

'Cui bono' - or, 'who benefits'? What possible benefit - short or long term - could the CIA expect to gain from orchestrating 9/11? Especially when there is a plethora of evidence suggesting that there are extremists more than willing to kill themselves for a purely destructive end. I'm sorry, but with Jim Jones and Heaven's Gate, I'm pretty convinced that 9/11 being the actions of religious fruitcakes from the middle east is the likeliest scenario.

I'll stop ranting now, but I guess the point in all of this is to consider the evidence and really look at it to see if it makes sense. I think our biggest mistake is actually having the faith that those in power are competent enough to pull this shit off.

[hellothere]

Haha. Jupiter to become the next sun, chemtrails. Colloidal silver haha a dude turned blue from that that other day - http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/...297781,00.html

Who are these people! They are Australian aswell i think we should find them.

hahahah! I'd never heard of this guy.... how hilariously strange

and yeah, how odd that that 2012 site is Australian...

[Slacker]

I like reading about stuff like that and I do keep an open mind if new information comes which makes it seem more likely, but I don't generally follow conspiracy theories. On the other hand, governments do conspire - most have at some point - so I don't dismiss them out of hand either.

I do agree with Meatbuger's list of "crap".

[meatburger]

@force my hand - Thats exactly how i see it. Governments aren't generally good enough to pull of minor things let alone these huge cover ups. If 9/11 was orchestrated it would have taken a good number of people to pull it off. Im sure something would stuff up. Plus there has to be a lot of really evil people all in on it at once!

Yeah some of them almost seem plausible:

Moonlanding faked to beat russia
Cars are being withheld that can run for 1000's of k's to keep the oil companies in business.
Apparently denver airport has all these masonic symbols in the airport and the land its on is humungous.

But again we believe the governments are really smart and the general populace is really dumb. I heard aids started from people having sex with monkeys. Now that i would believe =)
I am actually open to the possibilitiy of extra-terrestrials. Just not ones that actualy visit us.

@thundy
dont worry i see Positive entities as crap too. I just didn't construct my list with much care

[hellothere]

I am actually open to the possibilitiy of extra-terrestrials. Just not ones that actualy visit us.

So am I - definitely. Though I think it is certainly possible that some have visited us in the past, though not in the way that everyone makes out as if we are the most interesting planet in the universe

[hellothere]

+1

It's kind of arrogant to think that we're alone in the universe, but even more arrogant to suppose that other lifeforms would be so interested in us.

yeah that's what I mean - it's possible that some lifeforms may have visited us, but the number of supposed visits which have been reported make it seem like we're way too interesting than is the case

[Smilingeyes]

My relationship with the supernatural is along the following lines...

Example 1.
Angels.

I believe in angels. Angel, originally, greek 'angelos' = messenger. That is I believe in messengers. That is I believe sometimes information is transmitted and the things that transmits that message can be called an angel if one feels like doing so.

Likewise:
Acupuncture.

I believe it is possible that a person can stick a needle in someone else and make that person feel better. Placebo is a powerful effect. I also believe there are parts in the body in which a needle is more likely to do good than other parts. In the eye would be an example of a particularly bad spot.

Likewise:
Negative entity:

Mmm... Dick Cheney? Naomi Campbell? Kuklinski? Well... maybe for some definition of "negative entity". Maybe they're even positive entities for someone. Who knows...

I'm far more concerned about willful and malicious lying than about metaphor and attempts to create a bit of magic in one's life.

I guess it could be said that I see the supernatural and extraordinary as trite.

[force my hand]

Re: aliens

When I was a kid I was fascinated with aliens. I had tons of books about UFOs, taped radio shows about 'close encounters', knew the exact specifics of the so-called Zeti Reticulans... Hell, my dad even saw two UFOs one morning when he was out hunting, and that was enough to keep me spinning for a week straight. When my family got online at about 12, I quickly found the transcripts featuring Bob Lazar and his supposed experiences with studying an alien craft at Area 51/Groom Lake.

The interest is still there, but it's evolved a bit. I'm fascinated with popular cosmology books. I'm studying geology, but am secretly wishing I could be an astrobiologist. I read Centauri Dreams daily and recommend Rare Earth every chance I get.

(As a side note, scientists are now proposing spectroscopic techniques for detecting the presence of photosynthesizers on extrasolar planets - all from a single pixel. Do a search for 'Tinetti' on Web of Science or some similar database if you're interested.)

I believe life exists elsewhere, but in my gut I also believe the speed of light cannot be broken or circumvented. I don't believe we've ever been visited, and I think the fates of all races are closely tied to their parent star. We may one day find a way to store the energy needed to power life-support systems for long-term (thousands of years) interstellar flight. Transhumanists talk about the 'singularity', but I'm thinking that if (a portion of) humankind chooses to retain physical form, we could conceivably live millions even billions of years past the death of the Sun by hopping from star to star. After all, what is planet Earth but a huge-ass spaceship?

[mikemex]

The two ISTp guys who i know both suggested i watch 911 loose change. They dont know each other. They both seem to thoroughly believe in these things. One of them is now watching Zeigest or something and is talking about how religeon is based on the stars. It makes sense because this guy firmly believes in Astrology. He also talks about how people should look to their roots (ancestory) to tell what they should be doing in life. He thinks thats my ticket. Ive also been told there is a giant base of some description under the denver airport.

Zeitgeist is one of the best documentaries I've seen to date, and believe me, I've seen quite a lot. Another documentary I would highly recommend is The Corporation.

Of course they are subject to interpretations, but to say that Zeitgeist is simply another conspiracy theory is ignorant, to say the least. Zeitgeist, like it name implies in german, means "the spirit of an age" and in broad terms what it tries to explain how lies, based on ignorance, have grow to become the central part of our culture.

So when ISTp are excited about it, it's because they tend to have a great respect for the truth based on facts. And another reason for me to love them

[meatburger]

Hey Smiling eyes! Haha yep i suppose you could look at it like that. I mean im partially open to the idea that acupuncture releases some healing energy etc. Evidence seems to be showing that the placebo affect is the thing causing it. I agree the power of the mind should not be underestimated!

Needle in the eye to fix coin purse pain? hmm no thanks =)

@ force - You certianlly sound like a smart and interesting bloke. I dont know anything about Astronomy but its a facinating subject. Theres a big observatory in the middle of Australia i really must go up there one day. Im still amazed that we can deduce certian things so far away and so long ago. Some very smart people out there.

Correct me if im wrong though but you said when you were younger your dad saw a couple of Ufo's. Now that you're older you believe that the speed of light cant be broken (which i tend to agree with aswell). So do you think your dad was

a) Mistaken
b) just playing with you as he knew how much you loved it?
c) He did see them?
d) Ufo = Unidentified objects so perhaps your dad just thought they were weather baloons or something?

Zeitgeist is one of the best documentaries I've seen to date, and believe me, I've seen quite a lot. Another documentary I would highly recommend is The Corporation.

Cool. Yeah i didn't mean to bag that particular one because i haven't seen it. I actually tuned out quite quick when he started talking. I might ask him if i can borrow it. Will check out Corporation too

So when ISTp are excited about it, it's because they tend to have a great respect for the truth based on facts. And another reason for me to love them

Well to be honest thats what gets my back up. Generally they are quite rational beings. I really think the "facts" of starsigns, 911 conspiracy theories & ancestral dna seem quite dubious to me. "Truth based on fact" seems to remind me more of my ESTj friend who just lke the description wont believe anything that cant be backed up by science.

That being said i certianlly am not bagging my dual. I lurrve them. Even holding what i think are crazy ideas would not stop me from being friends. ISTp's have amazed me before just with some of the things they have said. They are a diverse group of people each very different from the next

[hellothere]

I dont know anything about Astrology but its a facinating subject. Theres a big observatory in the middle of Australia i really must go up there one day. Im still amazed that we can deduce certian things so far away and so long ago. Some very smart people out there.

I think you mean Astronomy :wink:

[meatburger]

I think you mean Astronomy :wink:

lol. Yep. Glad your here. I type too fast!

[force my hand]

Correct me if im wrong though but you said when you were younger your dad saw a couple of Ufo's. Now that you're older you believe that the speed of light cant be broken (which i tend to agree with aswell). So do you think your dad was

a) Mistaken
b) just playing with you as he knew how much you loved it?
c) He did see them?
d) Ufo = Unidentified objects so perhaps your dad just thought they were weather baloons or something?

There were two objects shaped like rotated teardrops, one slightly in front of the other, with wispy trails trailing behind them as they moved across the sky for about 5-10 seconds before disappearing.

He can spin a pretty damn good yarn, but in this case he definitely wasn't lying. At the time he mused about experimental government aircraft (he doesn't believe ETs/aliens exist). I'm inclined to think it was some sort of atmospheric sundog conditions, or perhaps some sort of an aurora borealis effect (it was just before sunrise, facing north).

[Christy B]

There were two objects shaped like rotated teardrops, one slightly in front of the other, with wispy trails trailing behind them as they moved across the sky for about 5-10 seconds before disappearing.

He can spin a pretty damn good yarn, but in this case he definitely wasn't lying. At the time he mused about experimental government aircraft (he doesn't believe ETs/aliens exist). I'm inclined to think it was some sort of atmospheric sundog conditions, or perhaps some sort of an aurora borealis effect (it was just before sunrise, facing north).

Your dad's sighting sounds like Jung's ideas about UFO archetype, how they were teardrop shape.

I have seen a UFO. Although I would not say it was "aliens", it was like nothing I have ever seen before and whatever technology it was I have never seen before. I was with my friend at the time so I am pretty certain I didn't just imagine it.

[Wittmont]

So whats your take on conspiracy theories. Other quadras chime in aswell im quite curious about deltas tho.

The two ISTp guys who i know both suggested i watch 911 loose change. They dont know each other. They both seem to thoroughly believe in these things. One of them is now watching Zeigest or something and is talking about how religeon is based on the stars. It makes sense because this guy firmly believes in Astrology. He also talks about how people should look to their roots (ancestory) to tell what they should be doing in life. He thinks thats my ticket. Ive also been told there is a giant base of some description under the denver airport.

So ok. I think its a horde of bullshit. I dont know what happened to me but for a number of years now im quite the skeptic. I dont believe in star signs, aliens, auras, etc etc. My ESTj friend basically thinks exactly the same as me. Ive also noticed some INFj's holding some interesting ideas like this (creative ne?). I suppose for an Ne i just dont have an open mind? Im happy to believe that some of it is possible. One problem i have about Conspiracy websites /theorists is they seem to have conspiracys about everything. They must be right that the twin towers were blown up, they must be right that the contrails seen in the sky are actually genetic testing.. He just said something like "i feel sorry for people who see authority as truth rather than truth as authority".

ISTp's are often a bit rebellious. Can this rebellious nature help them believe that the man is out to get them? This guy got the Zeigiest cd from another guy who im pretty sure is ISTp too lol.

I know some people like force my hand (if you're ISTp) are as critical as me

Here is the movie. The part about astronomical cycles and their conncetion to religion about 12 minutes into it is very interesting Check it out before you judge your friend

http://zeitgeistmovie.com/

[snegledmaca]

I'm not particularly interested in conspiracy theories. I admire that people are questioning reality, but I'm not really that much of a person, seeing all these various alternative possibilities, explanations of the same event. I prefer to stick with what makes sense and is most readily acceptable to me, that is, what fits within the context of my life. When I hear of these conspiracy theories I'm reminded of when people use to describe strange looking being in distant lands. I think that is essentially what happens, since people cannot see "what is around the corner" they reach into and pull all kinds of wild possibilities of what could be. The only problem here that I see is when people make no attempts to critically approach these possibilities, like they do in sciences, but instead opt for belief in them, or use instead of . That is just wrong. My biggest problem, in general, is people opting for belief instead of reality. That is just wrong. I think the reason you're SLI friends are so into conspiracy theories is because they're, in my opinion, an expression of + .

[meatburger]

I think the reason you're SLI friends are so into conspiracy theories is because they're, in my opinion, an expression of + .

Yeah i think what you said has some truth to it. The only thing is i have far stronger Ne and Fi than him and i dont believe in them at all. He also has stronger Ti than me. Perhaps its his Ne dual seeking or something?

To be honest my other Sli friend isn't really into them he does believe the loose change video but is nothing like this other guy. The other guy is a strange one though. He smsed me the other day telling me that we should buy a house together and pay it off. When i declined he told me thats its unfortunate that i dont understand life.

:/

[meatburger]

Just posted one about Tom cruise and Scientology here http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...359#post292359

Check it out

[tiny_dancer]

That is a really bizarre video. After 3:00, the guys who are grilling him... "What are you afraid of?" weeeeiiird.

[Christy B]

Perhaps its his Ne dual seeking or something?


:/

I think this is probably right. I have seen it with SLI friend.

[normal]

when i was a child, i collected a ton of books about UFO's, telekinesis and pseudo-science. I have book science too. I can believe in something because somethings im so jork and rebel with people when they don't see (for example) that we are not alone in the world. I love astronomy space-related and futurist games. A lot, my favourite game was always Mega Man and Doom.
I don't know, but i was a great fan about paranormal and future space-like. Movies like Alien, Terminator, Robocop and Blade Runner were my high influency.

I can explain that because im so rebel, even today when im over my 23 years. Moreover i was interested with a lot of strange theme.

[xyz]

I try to keep an open mind about conspiracy theoriest, but honestly most come off as a bunch of emotionally charge speeches. When I come across a conspiracy I try to look at it much closer than any assumed "fact".

[iAnnAu]

Whenever I come across a conspiracy theory, I'm liable to give it just as much consideration as the official story - because I place no expectation on myself to decide what really happened. But usually there's stuff that doesn't seem to add up on both sides, so why reject something out of hand?
While the true causes of the kinds of things people bother to construct conspiracy theories over are usually incomprehensibly complex, human explanations will always focus on some things that are either irrelevant or otherwise unconnected. Thus no matter how convoluted a theory becomes, it BOTH becomes less rationally defendable AND probably still falls short in the facts/connections it gets right. This reflects both the limitations of our awareness in receiving data as well as the very thing that brought all of us to this site: the peculiar ways we process the received data.