Retrying this

[Creepy-]

...after my last thread utterly failed. Hopefully, the reasons why it failed are merely situational.

I am dropping all preconceived notions. I will open myself to anything, but some sort of reasoning as to why is preferable.

This is not an argument thread. I am not trying to prove I am a certain type, as I have no idea what my type is. However, there is a high probability of argument in this thread.

NOTE: Poll is public. If you don't want people to see what you voted... well, I can't really do anything about that.

Maybe I'll put pictures or a video up later. Maybe.

Very well, do what you will.

[Jinxi]

Can you tell us about yourself?

[Creepy-]

Can you tell us about yourself?

It is difficult for me to respond to questions which are so general. I need a context. I'll say a little though.

I think I am pretty much defined by apathy/laziness. In mostly all things, I try to find the way in which I can expend the least amount of effort in order to get the greatest returns. To that end, I usually put little effort in my schoolwork and sometimes it turns out fine, and sometimes it doesn't. I only really put much effort into subjects I enjoy/am interested in (this changes rather often), but I would much rather work at my own pace than the pace at which I am expected to work. Because of this, I often turn work in late (more so in the case of my online classes, where I have no external motivation to do anything, rather than my classroom classes) or just don't do work and get zeros.

I enjoy video games (RPG's and RTS's, mostly), and I suppose I play them a fair amount. I also enjoy researching and thinking about topics of interest. I spend a good deal of my time doing that as well. But I actually spend most of my time doing nothing I would consider important or worthwhile in anyway, doing random stuff on the internet or just browsing forums (such as this one). Which, I suppose some of that could also be related to researching topics of interests. Some people have really good things to say. But all of the (perceived) hostility, unrelated jokes/spam, and useless arguing on this forum puts me off. It would be nice if there was more actual discussions on this board.

EDIT: I don't know if this tells you anything like you wanted to know. If you want to know more, more specific questions are preferred.

[April]

Your description above sounds IP temperament-ish, but nothing else is coming to me.

[DividedsGhost]

Nobody wants to touch your type, yeah.

[Creepy-]

Your description above sounds IP temperament-ish, but nothing else is coming to me.

If IP:





For me, I think the likelihood is IP≥IJ>EP>EJ.

Anybody else want to ask questions or offer opinions? I need input.

[Korpsy Knievel]

subjects I enjoy/am interested in

List them.

[Creepy-]

List them.

Mathematics
Natural Science
Computer Science
Philosophy

At the most general. These are major ones I have always liked, but there are a multitude of other subjects I situationally like, in addition to branches of the subjects above.

[silke]

I'll throw in some questions you can answer to help with determining your type:

Think of people you have disliked or admired, what made you like or dislike them? How do you call judgements about other people? What personality characteristics do you value in them?
What personality characteristics do you value in yourself?
How would your friends and parents describe you? What would they never say about your personality?
What kind of things do pay the least attention to in your life?
What do you think the world is lacking in the most?
What tends to stress you out the most?
How do you act when you're stressed out?
When working on a project what is normally your emphasis? Which do you like more: starting up new projects or seeing them to completion?
What motivates you?
Do you spend a lot of time on planning and preparing for the future or do you mostly deal with things in the present moment as they come?
Describe an event you remember that you thought was a lot of fun. What made it be so fun for you?
Describe a situation that made you feel at your finest and a situation that made you feel inferior. What about these situations made you feel so?
When thinking do you tend to see mostly positive possibilities (i.e. how things could possibly be) or negative possibilities (i.e. how things cannot work out)?

[Jinxi]

Video/pics will perk interest.

[Creepy-]

Video/pics will perk interest.

Right... I shall do so tomorrow. It is already too late tonight. Plus, my camera is not charged anyway.

At any rate, here are the answers to (most) of siuntal's questions:

Think of people you have disliked or admired, what made you like or dislike them? How do you call judgements about other people? What personality characteristics do you value in them?

Excessive emotional expression, personally berating insults (crude jokes are fine with me, but whether I find them funny or not depends on the joke), believing in something so heavily that one’s opinion cannot change despite the reasoning or evidence presented, objectification of subjective beliefs. On the opposite spectrum, I value productiveness and the ability to get done what one wants to get done. I like to have someone to talk to who can understand what I am saying and discuss various subjects with. I also hate it when people ask me “How are you” or “What’s wrong?” (cue the monotone “I’m fine.”).

“How do you call judgements about other people?” I’m sorry; I don’t exactly know what that means.

What personality characteristics do you value in yourself?

Intellectual curiosity, philosophical mindset, desire for truth. Also, I can’t help but say I like my laziness because if I wasn’t lazy I would put much more effort into everything I do, meaning my low energy level would be shot most of the time. Of course, this is also one of the things I least like about myself… Hm, I guess it has both its strengths and weaknesses. One more thing: perceptiveness. I would truly say this is one of my greatest strengths. It seems (at least in the circle of people I am acquainted with) that I am able to see things which are not so apparent to the rest and also, I think I can learn how to do things faster as well. I think it complements my laziness. If laziness were present without this, I would be destined to fail in every facet of life, or entirely change my ways and not be lazy at all, ever.

How would your friends and parents describe you? What would they never say about your personality?

Hahaha. My mother would say (actually, she says it quite often) that I am mean, cold, and don’t have/show any emotions (I think she is a permutation of and ). She would also probably say something about how I am intelligent, but not as intelligent as I might seem, and I am sure she would say that I am condescending and arrogant alongside that (in truth, I don’t think I am arrogant, I just know what I know. But, I know what I don’t know too.). My father… I have no idea what he would say.

My friends would probably not be so debasing (they are my friends, after all, whereas my parents, I am stuck with them, and they with me). Intelligent, quirky, and reserved I’m sure would come up. Maybe also some who know me better would say I contain some degree of empathy, despite what my surface conveys.

What kind of things do pay the least attention to in your life?

Things I don’t consider useful (especially in the context of a social situation). Nostalgia and discussions on past occurrences don’t make much sense to me, unless it is done for the purpose of improving oneself in the future. I usually ignore beliefs which have no evidence, or, even worse, ones which have evidence stacked against them. It makes even less sense to me why anyone would believe in this stuff, even if they have some good subjective reason to.

What do you think the world is lacking in the most?

I don’t think there’s much really “lacking” in the world. I can get most of what I want (both materially and mentally) and ignore what I don’t. However, there is something I feel is “missing” from the world. I’m just not sure what it is. I have tried to figure it out many times, but all to no avail. It is just a gut feeling, really, but one I feel rather strongly about.

Hm… if I had to say, though, I would say that the most lacking thing is actual intelligence, and then, to a lesser extent, factual intelligence.

What tends to stress you out the most?

People who are exceedingly loud/rambunctious. I would say not having enough time to finish something I have to do, but that wouldn’t be entirely true. I stress out because I wait until the last minute (see below) and then have to work somewhat hurriedly (at least compared to my normal work rate) to complete the work, but if I know for a fact I cannot get it done in time, then there’s not much point in doing so. I wouldn’t be so careless in a situation I actually consider important (such as college or a job), but still, my work effort in that regard pisses people off who have higher standards, and those who prefer to finish something far before the deadline. I know both people who do it both ways, and neither way is my cup of tea.

How do you act when you're stressed out?

Extremely negative/irritable/reactive. If it’s work-related stress (it usually is), I feel a sense of urgency to get stuff done. This happens often, because I procrastinate so much. I assume that there will be enough time to do it until time almost runs out and then I can put serious concentration to get the work done, though I still do it at my own pace. I actually spend more time thinking about what work I am going to do and when than actually doing it (and I never stick to my schedules, anyway, unless it is direly necessary to do so). I still usually have time left over though.

When working on a project what is normally your emphasis? Which do you like more: starting up new projects or seeing them to completion?

I prefer to finish projects that I start, but rarely do. Then again, I also don’t really start dedicated projects much either. My interests come and go over periods of time, so I just let whatever I do with them come and go as well. I may start something only to finish it years later. Though, oftentimes, I formulate things related to my interests in my head and never actually write them down, and eventually just forget them. So many things come up all the time that I only really bother writing down ones I consider extremely important. Insights come often, out of seeminglynowhere.

What motivates you?

Not having much to do motivates me to do what I have.
No, but really, my chief motivation to do something that I have to do is knowing that I can get what I have to do done without wasting too much energy on it. That’s why I don’t do some of my school work, it would just take too much damn time compared to the returns. However, this has rarely significantly impeded my ability to get good grades (well, depending on what you consider good grades).

Do you spend a lot of time on planning and preparing for the future or do you mostly deal with things in the present moment as they come?

I plan somewhat if I know something is going to happen in the future, but not excessively so. In normal, everyday situations, I can adapt to new situations which are introduced. But if I plan, I never do so with great amounts of time to spare.

Describe an event you remember that you thought was a lot of fun. What made it be so fun for you?

Describe a situation that made you feel at your finest and a situation that made you feel inferior. What about these situations made you feel so?

When thinking do you tend to see mostly positive possibilities (i.e. how things could possibly be) or negative possibilities (i.e. how things cannot work out)?

Hm… I’m not sure. I would have an inclination to lean toward the latter, but I cannot qualify that.

I will have the other two...er, later. They are exceedingly difficult to think about.

[silke]

You sound like an introverted intuitive that uses Ti+Fe. LII would be my guess.

[Creepy-]

You sound like an introverted intuitive that uses Ti+Fe. LII would be my guess.

Interesting. I can understand easily enough, but not so much DS/ PoLR.

Oh yeah, pictures and maybe a video later today.

[Jinxi]

Waiting.

[Creepy-]

Waiting.

Yeah, you're gonna have to wait just a little longer.

[Creepy-]

K, I added, um, one picture. I expect to make a real video tomorrow because I will have time to do so during the day and not so much homework. They are worth much more than any amount of pictures, I think.

[Jinxi]

Someone, reply to this guy's thread. Really, he's given us pictures to work, he's replied to all our questions and he's making a video. Someone, give him some input.

[ashlesha]

a lot of stuff in the answers sounded like textbook Ip-Te to me.

[Creepy-Snaps]

This not an argument thread.

That doesn't sound very fun!

[Computer Loser]

Assuming you're IP,

Definitely a T type. So ITP.

You seem more of a researcher (NT) than pragmatist (ST).

So INTP

[Creepy-]

Someone, reply to this guy's thread. Really, he's given us pictures to work, he's replied to all our questions and he's making a video. Someone, give him some input.

That worked well. Thanks for that, then.

I will probably have the video closer to 7 Eastern time.

a lot of stuff in the answers sounded like textbook Ip-Te to me.

xLI.

Which do you think is more likely, though?

That doesn't sound very fun!

Hehe. I can understand what you mean. Also, thanks for pointing out that typo to me.

Assuming you're IP,

Definitely a T type. So ITP.

You seem more of a researcher (NT) than pragmatist (ST).

So INTP

Alright, but do you think I am IP temperament? Some people think I am LII.

[Creepy-Snaps]

Hehe. I can understand what you mean. Also, thanks for pointing out that typo to me.

In the other thread you mean? And you're welcome!

[Pa3s]

Well, since I know that you are pretty sure you're INTx (and I agree with that), I'd definitely lean to ILI according to the things you said about yourself. I found several facts like your behaviour if stressed, your motivation and how you get things done points to it, imho.

[ashlesha]

Which do you think is more likely, though?

if i had an opinion i thought was worth sharing i would, lol. i slightly favor SLI atm, but i don't have a good reason and this could easily change. i'd rather hold out and see what else you might say. i'm not sure what to ask, though. unless you want to just jump in and talk about your views of Ni/Se vs Si/Ne?

[Pa3s]

i slightly favor SLI atm, but i don't have a good reason and this could easily change.

Hmm, where do you see the S priority?

[Creepy-]

In the other thread you mean? And you're welcome!

Well, omission rather. I left out the "is".

Well, since I know that you are pretty sure you're INTx (and I agree with that), I'd definitely lean to ILI according to the things you said about yourself. I found several facts like your behaviour if stressed, your motivation and how you get things done points to it, imho.

I understand. While my original premise was that I am either LII or ILI, for the purpose of this thread, I operated under no preconceptions so that I would have no bias. But thanks for the input.

if i had an opinion i thought was worth sharing i would, lol. i slightly favor SLI atm, but i don't have a good reason and this could easily change. i'd rather hold out and see what else you might say. i'm not sure what to ask, though. unless you want to just jump in and talk about your views of Ni/Se vs Si/Ne?

I don't have much to say about that. While I think I am starting to learn how to gain understanding of the elements, I don't think I am there yet. I have only what I have been told/read, which I am not sure are truly indicative of the "actual" definitions (oh, who I am kidding?)...

For a large part of my time in studying Socionics, I have felt that I value Ni/Se rather than Si/Ne. Si has been described as "health", "relaxation", and "bodily desire", among other things. As I said before, I'm not sure if these associations actually get into the essence of Si, but based on them, I don't think I am Si-valuing.

"In contrast to introverted intuition (Ni), Si is about direct interaction and unity (or discord) with one's surroundings, rather than abstract process and causal links. "

http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...SEI_and_SLI.29

Hm, I'm not sure, I could actually kind of relate to this. But I do think I relate to Si as Role better. Also, I don't really see my dual as IEE.

I still think I am Ni/Se over Ne/Si.

[ashlesha]

Hmm, where do you see the S priority?

i don't have a good reason, this is why i didn't say until i was pressed! lol. partly because of the getting stressed out and doing things at the last minute (idk if this is just a typical Ip thing or not really type-rel though). and also because the vibe i get from him is pretty cool and mild where other ILIs on the forum give me a more volatile impression for some reason. but like i said, this is a slight favoring that could easily change. i don't give these reasons much weight. i'd rather hear more from him first.

edit: ok, still don't know. NT seems to be obvious to everyone else though...what am i missing? nil, why could you not see IEEs as your duals? what about SEEs? (i'm not a big fan of the health and aesthetics to Si correlation, but this is debatable blah.)

[Computer Loser]

Alright, but do you think I am IP temperament? Some people think I am LII.

LII has Fe-Dual seeking. Your description didn't really sound like that, unless there's something you're not telling us?

What do you think is a better match for dual seeking? Se or Fe?

If Se, +1 for ILI. If Fe, +1 for LII.

--

As for IP temperament... If that's difficult, why not just break it up to dichotomies then.

(I) Introverted- Obvious

(P) Irrational - Some evidence:

I prefer to finish projects that I start, but rarely do.

Personally, I always finish what I start.

You also mentioned that you feel okay at completing things at the last minute because you feel adept at whatever it is. I commend you, I would fall apart.

--

I still think I am Ni/Se over Ne/Si.

So ILI > LII here.

[silke]

hmm may be you're IEI? male IEIs can emphasize their logical function making them appear more alike NTs, IEI type combines both Ni/Se and the philosophical slant/search for truth that Ti usually yields ... Te is pragmatic logic while Ti is the philosophical logic and you definitely are leaning towards the later ... so the question do you relate more to Te/Fi rather than Ti/Fe?

[Creepy-]

OK, I just read some more, and IP does seem more likely than IJ to me.

hmm may be you're IEI? male IEIs can emphasize their logical function making them appear more alike NTs, IEI type combines both Ni/Se and the philosophical slant/search for truth that Ti usually yields ... Te is pragmatic logic while Ti is the philosophical logic and you definitely are leaning towards the later ... so the question do you relate more to Te/Fi rather than Ti/Fe?

Forgot about IEI. I had considered that as well, alongside LII and ILI.

Anyway, about Te/Fi vs. Ti/Fe... I still don't have an answer for this. I can definitely understand why one would think I value Ti, but I never really did identify much with Fe either. If I do exhibit Suggestive Fe or Creative Fe, I can't tell.

[silke]

OK, I just read some more, and IP does seem more likely than IJ to me.


Forgot about IEI. I had considered that as well, alongside LII and ILI.

Anyway, about Te/Fi vs. Ti/Fe... I still don't have an answer for this. I can definitely understand why one would think I value Ti, but I never really did identify much with Fe either. If I do exhibit Suggestive Fe or Creative Fe, I can't tell.

From descriptions of Te it sounds like applied logic while Ti is like logic simply for the sake of logic, it's like mental masturbation kind of logic. When it comes to societal issues Te-types seem to concern with justice while Ti-types seems to concern with truth.

I thought that you complaining about yourself being lazy can be sign of DS Se. Yet I have also seen LIIs complain about same thing too, lack of motivation, that they would rather just sit and analyze and talk about current events rather than take action. IEIs and ILIs are described as being outwardly more motivated and productive than LIIs or EIIs. Due to their role-seeking Fe or Te in ego they strive to perform to meet some outside criteria. But I have found that in individual cases it varies. If IEI or ILI can't find meaning in their studies or work, if they are incredibly bored, and their role-seeking Fe/Te isn't engaged, they can be big slackers and just float around life aimlessly.

[Creepy-]

edit: ok, still don't know. NT seems to be obvious to everyone else though...what am i missing? nil, why could you not see IEEs as your duals? what about SEEs? (i'm not a big fan of the health and aesthetics to Si correlation, but this is debatable blah.)

In my musings and study, IEE's just don't seem to appeal much to me. SEE more so, I think, but I'm not positive.

I completely understand you aversion to attributing Si to such things. I am using common association because, for the moment, I could not even begin to think on how to rightly define it. I have a more in-depth understanding of Ni and Se than Ne and Si, but I still cannot really externalize my thoughts toward them.

From descriptions of Te it sounds like applied logic while Ti is like logic simply for the sake of logic, it's like mental masturbation kind of logic. When it comes to societal issues Te-types seem to concern with justice while Ti-types seems to concern with truth.

I thought that you complaining about yourself being lazy can be sign of DS Se. Yet I have also seen LIIs complain about same thing too, lack of motivation, that they would rather just sit and analyze and talk about current events rather than take action. IEIs and ILIs are described as being outwardly more motivated and productive than LIIs or EIIs. Due to their role-seeking Fe or Te in ego they strive to perform to meet some outside criteria. But I have found that in individual cases it varies. If IEI or ILI can't find meaning in their studies or work, if they are incredibly bored, and their role-seeking Fe/Te isn't engaged, they can be big slackers and just float around life aimlessly.

Ok, I understand. But I think Se DS over Fe DS, at least with what I have read about them. If I were to look at all of the IE's and consider PoLR's, the only two I would consider are Se and Fe. This is my one major problem with IEI. I would never look at Te and consider it my PoLR, or look at Fe and consider it in my Ego.

I don't really ever bother with societal issues. I understand the rest of what you say about Ti vs. Te, but I am not sure I completely agree. with all of it. I will have to say more on that later.

Oh yes... on the video. Something else came up and I could not do it at 7. I'm afraid it will have to wait until tomorrow. Ideally, I would wait until Friday since I will be out of school, but I should have no trouble doing it tomorrow. Sorry about that.

[Korpsy Knievel]

Se pertains to things. Ni pertains to stuff.

[EyeSeeCold]

Se pertains to things. Ni pertains to stuff.

wtf lol

[Korpsy Knievel]

Nil: Since you mentioned philosophy it'd be instructional if you'd provide us with a brief synopsis of why you resonate with select thinkers and why you don't with others.

 

This is a fruitful topic to address if you've yet to make your video, especially if you're short on material.

LIISeeCold: "Things and stuff" was an obvious wisecrack about Se and Ni's respective orientations to objects and fields.

 

[Creepy-]

Nil: Since you mentioned philosophy it'd be instructional if you'd provide us with a brief synopsis of why you resonate with select thinkers and why you don't with others.

 

This is a fruitful topic to address if you've yet to make your video, especially if you're short on material.

Perhaps I should not have put philosophy as one of my interests. I think that gives off the wrong impression. Though I would say I enjoy it, I have not actually taken any time to read philosopher's published works (I will do so at least somewhat soon, however, in the day when I have near limitless time and nothing to fill the void: also known as, summer). But, currently, my philosophy is created through personal experience and named through wikipedia articles.

You got it exactly right when you said I have no material. I suppose I might could discuss another one of my interests. Hm. I will have to think on that. My original intent for the video was merely to not have any material and just say random things. That would probably end up being a very boring video, but perhaps no less boring than me talking about one of my interests. At any rate, I communicate far better in writing than I do in speech, so... don't expect something fantastic. It seems to me that a good deal of my time in verbal communication is trying to determine which word to use. It's there, but I have trouble remembering it. In writing, the fast-paced, moment-by-moment discussion erodes away, and I am left with much time to have things exactly as I want them.

Basically, what I am saying, is that whatever way one looks at it, the video is likely going to suck.

[Jinxi]

Do you prefer ILI or LII?

[Korpsy Knievel]

Perhaps I should not have put philosophy as one of my interests. I think that gives off the wrong impression. Though I would say I enjoy it, I have not actually taken any time to read philosopher's published works

We all start somewhere, right? Allow me to suggest two good introductory titles by Bertrand Russell:

The Problems of Philosophy - Examines general terms and concepts.
The History of Western Philosophy - Analyzes notable thinkers from the pre-Socratic era to the mid-20th century.

A philosophical dictionary is also valuable (and fun to pore over), and unlike Wikipedia it's edited by a smaller number of peeps and so has a more cohesive and regular tone. I enjoy the one published by Cambridge University Press.

My original intent for the video was merely to not have any material and just say random things. That would probably end up being a very boring video, but perhaps no less boring than me talking about one of my interests.

Fair enough. If extemporaneous speech isn't your bag then read one or two of your school essays while standing before the camera and addressing it as if you were before a live audience (you might even scare up a few family members or friends so you aren't simply jabbering at yourself). That way we'll get an idea of how your gesticulations and other body language imply additional layers of meaning to your words.

[Creepy-]

Do you prefer ILI or LII?

ILI.

We all start somewhere, right? Allow me to suggest two good introductory titles by Bertrand Russell:

The Problems of Philosophy - Examines general terms and concepts.
The History of Western Philosophy - Analyzes notable thinkers from the pre-Socratic era to the mid-20th century.

A philosophical dictionary is also valuable (and fun to pore over), and unlike Wikipedia it's edited by a smaller number of peeps and so has a more cohesive and regular tone. I enjoy the one published by Cambridge University Press.



Fair enough. If extemporaneous speech isn't your bag then read one or two of your school essays while standing before the camera and addressing it as if you were before a live audience (you might even scare up a few family members or friends so you aren't simply jabbering at yourself). That way we'll get an idea of how your gesticulations and other body language imply additional layers of meaning to your words.

Very well. I shall keep these things in mind. And thanks for the links.

[Pa3s]

ILI.

It's surprising to me that you have such a clear answer to this question. May I ask why you prefer ILI over LII? I'm genuinely curious.