THE FINAL SHOWDOWN

[Creepy-male]

[Brilliand]

I thought you were very logical about that, Gulanzon.

[Creepy-male]

Yeah yeah yeah, that video oozes with



I'm Ne-ILE

EDIT

But you didn't hear it from me

[Brilliand]

Yeah yeah yeah, that video oozes with



I'm Ne-ILE

Here's an idea I came up with earlier today: Perceiving types with Perceiving subtypes use their creative functions to acquire information from their duals.

So for you, that means that you use to learn what an SEI-Si believes so that you can apply for it. Your needs to use someone else as a source, even though you will do much of the work of figuring out what it means.

If you were IEE-Ne, then the same would apply for your .

[Brilliand]

But you didn't hear it from me

Thought it wasn't happy enough, huh?

[Creepy-male]

Thought it wasn't happy enough, huh?

Wut?

No, I meant I don't want to be ILE-Ne. I want other people to disprove the notion

Here's an idea I came up with earlier today: Perceiving types with Perceiving subtypes use their creative functions to acquire information from their duals.

So for you, that means that you use to learn what an SEI-Si believes so that you can apply for it. Your needs to use someone else as a source, even though you will do much of the work of figuring out what it means.

If you were IEE-Ne, then the same would apply for your .

That would neatly explain our interactions then... wouldn't it?

Also, for the IEEE/SSLI, The IEEE would try to align themselves with the SLI's Fi-map of like/dislike, and try to highlight contacts and whatnot?

Also, how would it work for J-sub Ps?

[Brilliand]

That would neatly explain our interactions then... wouldn't it?

Yes, reasonably well.

Also, for the IEEE/SSLI, The IEEE would try to align themselves with the SLI's Fi-map of like/dislike, and try to highlight contacts and whatnot?

Wait, is IEEE ENFp-Ne or ENFp-Fi?

That sounds about right for ENFp-Ne. ENFp-Fi would want to hand down his values to an ISTp-Te.

Also, how would it work for J-sub Ps?

J-sub Ps use their creative functions to provide information to their duals. So, for instance, ArchonAlarion would use his to provide his dual with options that are the result of his analysis.

This provides a way that you are not much like the dual of Archon after all... you want to interact with your dual through and , while he wants to interact with his dual through and .

Js use their creative functions mainly for their own benefit, but P-subtypes use it more to learn whereas J-subtypes use it more to teach.

[Creepy-male]

Wait, is IEEE ENFp-Ne or ENFp-Fi?

That sounds about right for ENFp-Ne. ENFp-Fi would want to hand down his values to an ISTp-Te.

Sorry, I meant IIEE.

My notation is infallible!

A#BC -> AABC / ABBC

Wcterloo?

[Brilliand]

Sorry, I meant IIEE.

My notation is infallible!

A#BC -> AABC / ABBC

Wcterloo?

Ah... yes, that notation makes sense; I just didn't want to use it without being sure of what it meant.

"wcterloo?"?"?"?"?"?"?"?"?

[Creepy-male]

"wcterloo?"?"?"?"?"?"?"?"?

ABBC:

ABBA -> ABBC

Similarly

Wcterloo:

Waterloo -> Wcterloo

[Brilliand]

ABBC:

ABBA -> ABBC

Similarly

Wcterloo:

Waterloo -> Wcterloo

Oh, OK. Most meaningless analogy I ever saw.

[Creepy-male]

Analogy my ass.

You're just envious of my superior . And chickens.

[Brilliand]

Analogy my ass.

You're just envious of my superior . And chickens.

Nah... I just don't have the capabilities needed to benefit from it.

As I recall, you have a similar attitude toward (not valuing it in others)... this is because for Alpha, only can benefit from , and is your weakest function.

[Park]

I will suggest these types: SEI & EII.

[Creepy-male]

Nah... I just don't have the capabilities needed to benefit from it.

As I recall, you have a similar attitude toward (not valuing it in others)... this is because for Alpha, only can benefit from , and is your weakest function.

I don't understand any of that.

Second paragraph, do you mean that I find external usage frustrating because it automatically draws attention to the lack of ?

• generates ideas. Because is coming from this time, it's still somewhat objective; so it only generates a list of possible improvements, not a few definite improvements as Delta does.
• evaluates the ideas for their subjective value, and builds a general idea of what should be done based on which possibilities are the most pleasing.
• takes this general idea and applies it to the physical world, creating a very real atmosphere that is still somewhat subjective due to coming from - this is the "emotional atmosphere" that Alpha SFs create.
• breaks down this atmosphere, makes it fully objective and imposes its structure on the world. Once the is in place, new possibilities open up and the cycle starts again with .

Going by this, in interactions with a SSEI, would it follow a pattern of the others' Super-Id engagements "inviting" Ego responses and nudging the cycle along?

EDIT

I mean, importantly, the the J ego element sounds like it specifically needs to be engaged before it starts working in J-sub Ps (Can we just call them JsP, PsJ, JsJ, PsP?)

I will suggest SEI.

[Park]

I will suggest SEI.

John Candy (SEI)




George Lucas (SEI)

[Creepy-male]

Oh, you were taking a potshot at my weight, not my hyperactivity

[Simon Ssmall]

Are you aware of distance between people?
Do you find it easy enough to notice when someone is attracted to you?
Do you make big/drastic changes in lifestyle?
Do you find a constant need to change your surroundings?
Have you ever wondered why people can't be fair to each other?
Have you tried finding the reasons for it?
If you would need to give information for someone you do not know what would you say about yourself in two short sentences?
How you normally act when you are down and having problems?
Do you find it easy to spot when someone is down?
How do you deal with people who are very quiet, reluctant to speak?

I could ask probably a few million more questions, but those be dem trick questions out of the top of my head .

[Creepy-male]

1) Are you aware of distance between people?
2) Do you find it easy enough to notice when someone is attracted to you?
3) Do you make big/drastic changes in lifestyle?
4) Do you find a constant need to change your surroundings?
5) Have you ever wondered why people can't be fair to each other?
6) Have you tried finding the reasons for it?
7) If you would need to give information for someone you do not know what would you say about yourself in two short sentences?
8) How you normally act when you are down and having problems?
9) Do you find it easy to spot when someone is down?
10) How do you deal with people who are very quiet, reluctant to speak?

1) Only if I have a tapemeasure! Depends. I can generally pick it up off of the airwaves.
2) No, but I feel when they aren't (I shouldn't be winking at that, actually. It sucks. But you can't read this--it's parenthetical! Seven cheer! Seven cheer! Seven cheer...)
3) Not in a position to. Depends how big and drastic they are, though. I'm pissed off about having to have had to live in stinkin' Sydney for however many years it's been now. Can't wait to move!
4) Sometimes. I feel a need to compulsively change things other than my surroundings, though. Lack of change worries and scares me--trust me, I've been there.
5) No.
6) No. I already know.
7) Turn my head to the side, give a big grin, wink, go "He he!" and deliver a thumbs-up.
8) Ask me when I'm down and having problems. Usually waver between aggressively going Terminator on them and monologuing to skulls about mires and Jesus in purgatory.
9) Yes. You can tell instantly.
10) If they were stupid enough to interest me, give them an orbital strike. If they didn't interest me, or give off BEWARE OF DOG RWARGH vibes, leave them be.

I already know your type.

[Simon Ssmall]

Those questions were about people of different types actually, not that they can be used to type someone correctly but they can answer me what people in my life you remind me of. And i'm not gonna pick out on what you said and dissect it into something that is supposedly type related. All I can say is that your are not exactly a serious person now are you?

Btw ISTp's can unwillingly give out BEWARE OF DOG RWARGH vibes .

[Simon Ssmall]

Oh btw, the way you talked, you reminded me of this actor:
Paul Giamatti
from "Sideways" movie, just a cheerful version

[Creepy-male]

Those questions were about people of different types actually, not that they can be used to type someone correctly but they can answer me what people in my life you remind me of. And i'm not gonna pick out on what you said and dissect it into something that is supposedly type related. All I can say is that your are not exactly a serious person now are you?

Btw ISTp's can unwillingly give out BEWARE OF DOG RWARGH vibes .

No, I'm not very serious at all. I'm a Seven! Since when were we the serious type? You got something to prove, huh, punk?!

j/k *hugs*

Also re: ISTps, I think a few of the ones I know like me. Generally that's when they stop trying to fend off all human emotional contact, isn't it?

They're a special case! I love it when they light up. I'd say most ISTps automatically fall under the "target painted" category.

[Brilliand]

I don't understand any of that.

Second paragraph, do you mean that I find external usage frustrating because it automatically draws attention to the lack of ?

No; just because it doesn't do anything for you. I wouldn't expect it to hurt you in any way - you just don't have any use for it, because you would need for that.

Going by this, in interactions with a SSEI, would it follow a pattern of the others' Super-Id engagements "inviting" Ego responses and nudging the cycle along?

Yes, I suppose an SEI-Si's would invite responses from others. Though from this perspective, it seems like the SEI's hidden agenda "to understand" could just as well be "to be understood."

I mean, importantly, the the J ego element sounds like it specifically needs to be engaged before it starts working in J-sub Ps (Can we just call them JsP, PsJ, JsJ, PsP?)

That doesn't sound right... the element that is your subtype is what you do automatically, and need no help with. The J ego element in JsPs is working as long as there is enough input from the creative function.

[Creepy-male]

Sorry, I had a fail again.

I meant P-sub Ps.

[Khola aka Bee]

FAIL

[ArchonAlarion]

For instance, in Ne ENTp's Ti is an "activated" function. You can "force" yourself to use it if you must, but you'd rather have outside stimulus to use it. It's something that interests you, sure, and you're proficient with it, but you aren't really experiencing it all the time.

But yes you want Ti activated by your dual, because they'd give you a reason to use it, but less than you desire them to activate Si.

[Brilliand]

For instance, in Ne ENTp's Ti is an "activated" function. You can "force" yourself to use it if you must, but you'd rather have outside stimulus to use it. It's something that interests you, sure, and you're proficient with it, but you aren't really experiencing it all the time.

But yes you want Ti activated by your dual, because they'd give you a reason to use it, but less than you desire them to activate Si.

Yes... it doesn't quite seem this way for INTj-Ne, because the gap between and drives me to use it often for my own benefit. But I still like having someone else involved.

[Jarno]

My guess after seeing a part of the video, ILE-Ne

I have a question:

Do you like to outsmart people, or do you like to flatter people.

[Creepy-male]

I keep thinking of this every time I see this thread

YouTube - Europe - The Final Countdown

That's what I was thinking of when I made it.

My guess after seeing a part of the video, ILE-Ne

I have a question:

Do you like to outsmart people, or do you like to flatter people.

I dislike doing either.

But I'd dislike outsmarting someone less. It implies a degree of competition, and I naturally see myself losing at some point in the future, so I avoid competition. Flattery reduces the inherent value of people, imo, so I'd never do it... unless you mean a justified compliment. But even then, they're special, and I don't want people knowing my opinion of them.

Buuuuut, short-term competition where it's obviously play for everyone involved is fun. I generally don't believe I have the capacity to outsmart people, but I'm secretly a Johnny on the inside of the layers of Timmy

(And STFU, I can apply those archetypes to things other than MTG.)

[ArchonAlarion]

hmm yeah I finally got to watch the vid.

As I suspected you are a textbook Ne ILE.

Which is cool because they're awesome and frankly I wish I knew more irl.

[ArchonAlarion]

Ne ENTp's have Fe agenda, so they are quite interested in motivations, people's feelings, and inner moods. The Ne and Fe are part of the "P-Block" (project block) and are therefore both "passive functions" being turned on all the time.

Im being a bit vague, but I don't feel like beating a dead horse (Gulanzon being Ne ENTp).

[Brilliand]

IEE > ILE for now. You don't justify your type in a very Ti-ish manner, and you seem extremely sharp and dynamic when using ethics (I don't mean as in dynamic function), even for an ILE-Ne. Just a general impression.

Yes, he has quite strong Feeling. That's the one weird thing about typing him ILE. It's sort of like with the IEI-Ti.

[ArchonAlarion]

Yes, he has quite strong Feeling. That's the one weird thing about typing him ILE. It's sort of like with the IEI-Ti.

Do you mean IEI-Ni who have Ti agenda?

Then yeah that may be difficult because they can go into very "verbose and logical discourses" which many people think is a retarded trait for "ethical" types lol.

[Brilliand]

Do you mean IEI-Ni who have Ti agenda?

Then yeah that may be difficult because they can go into very "verbose and logical discourses" which many people think is a retarded trait for "ethical" types lol.

Yes. I'm trying to keep Model X from clashing seriously with Expatian Socionics. About a year ago, there was a disagreement about whether people with as their most obvious function could reasonably be typed as IEIs - the term "IEI-Ti" arose as a name for what they were debating. Apparently a large number of the IEIs on this forum were typed "IEI-Ti." So there is precedent for typing people HA>Creative.

[ArchonAlarion]

nah, but i don't think its their most obvious function.

idk about all that, but its whatever. I'm just going by what ive come to understand is all.

[Creepy-male]

Feel free to facepalm, but I do practice emotions in front of the mirror frequently.

Unconscious competence ftw!

ALSO

Let's restrict this to Alpha/Delta.

Taken As Troofs:

My thinking pattern moves in rapid, rapid chains. 3-5 hops in a single second is completely natural. Often I don't even consciously register them because Mister Prefrontal Cortex is still spinning on the spot and spluttering in the cloud of dust left by my blazing right hemisphere (most of my thinking seems to be intuitive, in the general sense). Whether this is Ne base or 7w6 can be left open to debate, IMO.

My school is so Beta you'll ionize. I used to frequently get in Seriously Serious Trouble For Not Seriously Taking The Serious Exams Seriously Enough, Seriously. They expect strong Se and Ti and Nothing Else. Ne is instantaneous death, and Si flags you as a possible plague victim.

---

According to Brill, approach evidence from the context of a hypothesis is Ti thinking. In other words, form a theory, bounce evidence/antitheses off it, and improve/cement/ignore.

Te thinking gathers evidence, and takes general patterns it tends to notice As Is. If they're useless, they get chucked out the window. I think.

Brilleru, help me out here >;

[Warlord]

I keep thinking of this every time I see this thread

YouTube - Europe - The Final Countdown

lol I was about to post that video. With the comment:"No, it's the Final Countdown"

But then decided not to.

[Park]