Do AT&T callcenters discriminate against alpha NTs?

[tcaudilllg]

Applied for a position at a local AT&T call center. Took a screening test that had 150 questions. It was one of those "alarm bell" tests where they ask you, blatantly, whether of not you have stolen from work, been late to work, etc. Of course there are right and wrong answers, or else no one would be disqualified.

Used to be, I'd ace these tests pretty easily. In recent years though, the old strategies (strongly disagree with anything that indicates laziness or criminal disposition) aren't working as often. This time I was asked no less than 7 questions which seemed to point towards NT club, even 4 of which pointed directly to alpha NT. "I like to think about theories, possibilities." "I like to test hypotheses." "I am a logical person." And wouldn't you know it, I didn't pass.

Not every LII or ILE works at a university or a lab. How are LII people supposed to find work if they get discriminated against for being them? Nor does being LII have anything to do with taking inbound service requests.

But that's the negative side-effect of type tech: it's being misused, to the point that the society suffers in a way that wasn't possible before.

Next time I'll just respond as if I were an ESFJ.

[krieger]

They want mindless drones that don't criticize the organization and focus on the job without daydreaming.

[Aleksei]

That's dumb. Then they're not gonna get anyone who's genuinely good at customer service (like myself).

[Saoshyant]

Race, Sex, and Age discrimination are things of the past. Welcome to personality discrimination!

[Creepy-bg]

... or they didn't hire you for some other reason.

[CILi]

FWIW, what kinda call-center, tcaud?

Sales?

Customer Service?

Tech Support?

I could sorta see you in the last one, but the other two?

[tcaudilllg]

... or they didn't hire you for some other reason.

Well, given that I got an automated email message right after the test, and they had invited me to take it after reviewing my application, I don't think it could have been any other reason.

I've done tech support, yeah. This one was customer service.

Dad was counting on me getting it. I haven't told him yet, and when he find out he'll be mad as hell. (maybe I won't tell him, cause they didn't call anyway).

[xerx]

customer service.

That's the problem right there. They probably need an extrovered ethical type who can reassure people and pull on their sympathy strings when shit hits the fan. If I were boss that's the type of customer service I'd try to provide as well.

Not saying you can't do it tcaud, but the idea that certain types of personalities aren't cut out for certain jobs is a time and money-saving heuristic, hence the purpose of job interviews. Nobody'd want a greedy, stingy miser to be the boss of a charity, and nobody'd expect a hippy to sucessfully run a multi-national corporation.

Try applying for tech support.

[CILi]

Guess it's kinda rhetorical now, but...

Do you react well to insanely pissed-off people?

(True Story: My Mom calls up AT&T for a good scream, like, twice a week.)

EDIT: jxrtes beat me to it.

[DividedsGhost]

That's the problem right there. They probably need an extrovered ethical type who can reassure people and pull on their sympathy strings when shit hits the fan. If I were boss that's the type of customer service I'd try to provide as well.

Not saying you can't do it tcaud, but the idea that certain types of personalities aren't cut out for certain jobs is a time and money-saving heuristic, hence the purpose of job interviews. Nobody'd want a greedy, stingy miser to be the boss of a charity, and nobody'd expect a hippy to sucessfully run a multi-national corporation.

shattering dreams worldwide...one post at a time...

[Words]

Applied for a position at a local AT&T call center. Took a screening test that had 150 questions. It was one of those "alarm bell" tests where they ask you, blatantly, whether of not you have stolen from work, been late to work, etc. Of course there are right and wrong answers, or else no one would be disqualified.

Used to be, I'd ace these tests pretty easily. In recent years though, the old strategies (strongly disagree with anything that indicates laziness or criminal disposition) aren't working as often. This time I was asked no less than 7 questions which seemed to point towards NT club, even 4 of which pointed directly to alpha NT. "I like to think about theories, possibilities." "I like to test hypotheses." "I am a logical person." And wouldn't you know it, I didn't pass.

Not every LII or ILE works at a university or a lab. How are LII people supposed to find work if they get discriminated against for being them? Nor does being LII have anything to do with taking inbound service requests.

But that's the negative side-effect of type tech: it's being misused, to the point that the society suffers in a way that wasn't possible before.

Next time I'll just respond as if I were an ESFJ.

I used to work for them and it was important to weed out the left leaning political activists. Often we'd just give em the test you mentioned to cover our own backs. There were lots of checks before that test and most often the decision had already been made.

No idea how I got to work there, but yes, I was 'forced' out.

[DirectorAbbie]

Race, Sex, and Age discrimination are things of the past. Welcome to personality discrimination!

Goodie.
I've been wanting to hire people by typing them.

[tcaudilllg]

Goodie.
I've been wanting to hire people by typing them.

Have you considered the implications? Introverts tend to have much more difficulty finding work than extroverts. (or are you guys gonna keep us up? )

[DirectorAbbie]

Have you considered the implications? Introverts tend to have much more difficulty finding work than extroverts. (or are you guys gonna keep us up? )

No, no-that's the problem now. The way I would do it is type them then hire the type that would be good at the job.

[CILi]

I've been wanting to hire people by typing them.

The way I would do it is type them then hire the type that would be good at the job.

As "Queen of HR", what would you hire tcaud for?

[Creepy-male]

They used to have this really reliable method for telling whether they thought someone would be a good employee or not... it was called: AN INTERVIEW

Now they have automated tests to determine such things... great.

While I'm against the usage of these annoying little tests, you can't take them too seriously, just try to be consistent, answer like a mindless work drone would, but don't seem TOO phony and you'll be fine. Apply enough places and you'll get hired, sometimes its not because you failed the test, maybe its just bad timing and a lack of luck, no one will ever actually tell you the reason why unfortunately.

[Brilliand]

They used to have this really reliable method for telling whether they thought someone would be a good employee or not... it was called: AN INTERVIEW

I heard that wasn't actually very reliable.

[Creepy-male]

I heard that wasn't actually very reliable.

Well its more reliable than a test...

Either way some guy has to interpret the results and make a decision. Just when there is a test its more disconnected from reality. Anyone can fake a test, but its a lot harder to act and fake an interview although still possible.

[tcaudilllg]

No, no-that's the problem now. The way I would do it is type them then hire the type that would be good at the job.

I don't think you understand the situation: there is less need in the market for LIIs than for say, your type. So there are fewer LII-specific opportunities. Basically your approach makes it harder for LIIs to get a job. (probably EIIs as well)

[Sir Knight]

, you can't take them too seriously, just try to be consistent, answer like a mindless work drone would, but don't seem TOO phony and you'll be fine.

I actually saw the little e-dossier that my online application had generated from when I got my current job. My boss had left it open on her monitor so I took a looksee while she was rooting around for the little training pamphlet package jamboree. Based on your answers you got one of three colors, RED for, "Oh hell naw!" YELLOW for, "Geez, I dunno, guy's a mess. Maybe. Maybe." And then GREEN for, "This guy's legit, hire him."

So, basically, assuming most systems are the same (and I have no reason to think they wouldn't be), the HR guy never even gets to see how you answered. He just deletes out all the reds, and gives all the greens first call for interviews. So really, be as fake and phony as you like. All that experience from taking personality test after personality test has finally found an outlet!

[size=2](True Story: My Mom calls up AT&T for a good scream, like, twice a week.)

Really? But why?

[xerx]

Well, maybe you can see what the job actually requires and answer accordingly? I mean, you don't *have* to tell them you like theory and such (sorry, simplifying here). I mean, that's none of their business so long as you can actually do the job.

I don't see why Alpha NT can't do customer service - the calls you get are of a technical nature, usually anyway, or related to user plans. Don't see why they'd be looking for extroverts. Yeah, it's pretty formalized though, as tasks go.

Anyway, you don't need to tell them everything, like, where you keep your soul, for instance lol.

Anyway, sorry, that sucks.

Unfortunately, the job market is packed with people who're better qualified than Alpha NTs (though I don't think tcaud is one, but that's for another thread) to handle this kind of work. It's not a question of whether we can do it because anyone can certainly pass, but whether someone can do it well - i.e. appears to show more sympathy towards the customer and act as the polished and pristine face of the company.

That's coming from an Alpha NT whose first two jobs were customer service btw.

[1981slater]

This time I was asked no less than 7 questions which seemed to point towards NT club, even 4 of which pointed directly to alpha NT. "I like to think about theories, possibilities." "I like to test hypotheses." "I am a logical person." And wouldn't you know it, I didn't pass.

Not every LII or ILE works at a university or a lab. How are LII people supposed to find work if they get discriminated against for being them? Nor does being LII have anything to do with taking inbound service requests.

But that's the negative side-effect of type tech: it's being misused, to the point that the society suffers in a way that wasn't possible before.

Next time I'll just respond as if I were an ESFJ.

It's hard being an alpha NT. Normal people hate us. So what? Nothing wrong with that.

[CILi]

My Mom calls 'em up for a good scream, like, twice a week.

Really? But why?

I think it's some sorta Fe-cathartic thing (i.e. "I feel bad. Must make someone else feel bad with me.").

If she drops it on me, I'll likely kick a hole in the wall.

If she drops it on Pradesh halfway around the globe, well, everybody's happy.

(And if she drops it on tcaud...)

[tcaudilllg]

I'm not AT&T. I had nothing to do with it. Just wait until she is done and read the script, lol.

[CILi]

Add a couple "Upsells" post-lol and the job woulda been yours!

[munenori2]

FedEx is always hiring, tcaud.

[Words]

You could get a job cleaning toilets, you don't need people skills for that.

[Sir Knight]

You could get a job cleaning toilets, you don't need people skills for that.

I was told once that janitors have the highest amount of job satisfaction, since they get to see the tangible results of their work immediately after they do it. Well, tcaud, being in a Si-valuing quadra, there may be something to that.

[Words]

I was told once that janitors have the highest amount of job satisfaction, since they get to see the tangible results of their work immediately after they do it. Well, tcaud, being in a Si-valuing quadra, there may be something to that.

I'm not being entirely facetious. I don't mind doing jobs others might look down on, and you are right about the satisfaction from seeing results of your labour.

There's another thing, and that's while your hands work your mind is free to theorise, which tcaud says he likes.

[Sir Knight]

Hell, now that you mention it, with my poor sense of smell, I might find a janitorial job pretty enjoyable.

[07490]

I would take a janitor/ cleaning the toilet job and have everyone know about it than dealing with people work or need to play politic games with team members or the public, assuming the pay is the same. I am a E-3 and I can deal with people much better than others and I would prefer not, so for others who is more introvert or NT it would have been even harder for them. Manual labor doesn't scare me as long as I don't work in a sweatshop or factories with no bathroom break.

[07490]

I was told once that janitors have the highest amount of job satisfaction, since they get to see the tangible results of their work immediately after they do it. Well, tcaud, being in a Si-valuing quadra, there may be something to that.

I am a Si-polr but you're right that I don't pay much attention to my final result of works that I have done, since my mind would jump into the next thing, like trying to improve the next aspect.

[DirectorAbbie]

As "Queen of HR", what would you hire tcaud for?

I'd let him try my job. If he's good at it, he can have it.

[Sir Knight]

I am a Si-polr but you're right that I don't pay much attention to my final result of works that I have done, since my mind would jump into the next thing, like trying to improve the next aspect.

Yeah, the stereotype I read of Si-valuing types is a preference for physical labour and a desire for short-term, tangible results over long-term, intangible ones. Though the more I read about Socionics, the less useful these kinds of stereotypes seem.

Edit: See this is what I mean. Reading back over this I think, "Well hell, who doesn't like short-term tangible results?" I mean, I'm going to assume there aren't any types that prefer to never see the results of their work that will take them many years to accomplish.

Still, scrubbing toilets and mopping floors is a hell of a way to earn money!

[Creepy-male]

I actually saw the little e-dossier that my online application had generated from when I got my current job. My boss had left it open on her monitor so I took a looksee while she was rooting around for the little training pamphlet package jamboree. Based on your answers you got one of three colors, RED for, "Oh hell naw!" YELLOW for, "Geez, I dunno, guy's a mess. Maybe. Maybe." And then GREEN for, "This guy's legit, hire him."

Yea obviously, so basically you just got to get into that green zone, computers aren't smart though there are pre-established criteria the test uses and just play to that pre-established criteria.

[The Exception]

I got rejected from various retail jobs that I applied for a while back. I know some of them involved these weird ethical integrity tests. One of them had a bunch of hypothetical scenarios and asked what you would do but several of the options sounded right. Either I have weak ethics or I overthought the questions. Because I was told that I failed at least one of the tests.

[MatthewZ]

A literal reading of Alice in Wonderland made more sense...

[Words]

I got rejected from various retail jobs that I applied for a while back. I know some of them involved these weird ethical integrity tests. One of them had a bunch of hypothetical scenarios and asked what you would do but several of the options sounded right. Either I have weak ethics or I overthought the questions. Because I was told that I failed at least one of the tests.

I may have had something similar in the past. I remember one of the questions was what would I do if I saw a collegue steal something belonging to the workplace, and I said I'd do nothing. For whatever reason I somehow passed.

I suppose realistically who HASN'T stolen something from work, even if it's just a paperclip, so I suppose I was honest in a way, lol.