Why idontgiveaf is SEE?

[The Reality Denialist]

Insufficient grounding therefore people use their own rules. It has never been done. Therefore it is not ready for use or even to be validated. So it should be noted that the thing is just infancy waiting for something better.

[idontgiveaf]

You have some good brainz circuits inside of totally reckless SEE brain. It makes helluva difference.

I'm not really SEE. Lol 😂

[idontgiveaf]

if ur good at maths and sudoku what about ILE or SLE

Yes! But people say i am Ti polr.. :/

Like how did i became Ti polr if im good at those right???

[Olimpia]

I'm not really SEE. Lol 

What do you think you are? ENTp or ENFp?

[idontgiveaf]

troll is not that intelligent so i wouldnt listen to him

Who am i gonna listen to??? 🤔

[idontgiveaf]

This thread is full of Fi Creative stuff. It is all about her "heart", inner emotional experience, coupled with Fe Demonstrative emotionality (tons of emojis and exclamations).

All with the background of tangible experiences, valuing being strong and "hardcore", and wanting to know/yearning for a holistic, unified view on how the experiences matter and will turn out in the long run (Ni Seeking).

I find the thread is a good example of an SEE-Fi's inner monologue.

Yes. That's why it's called, "My heart"

It's all about my feelings.. Doesn't mean i use those to decide and make judgments.

[Olimpia]

There are different intelligences out there... They are correlated with type, but there is no strict causation.

So it is possible to be an Ethical type that is good at Sudoko.
Or a Logical type that isn't that great at Sudoko.

(Up to a point)

[maniac]

Who am i gonna listen to??? 樂

god

[idontgiveaf]

Most of Socionics is just circular reasoning. "You're this way because of your PoLR" is just another way of saying "You're this way because you're this way". It doesn't explain the "why".

Here's an interesting article on what an explanation is:

https://www.thoughtco.com/what-is-an-explanation-250313

It says that this is an example of an explanation:

Smoke appears because of fire: a combination of flammable material, oxygen, and sufficient heat.

But this is a bad explanation:

Smoke appears because of smoke-producing events.

"This is not a valid explanation, but why? Because it provides us with no new information. We have not learned anything from it because the supposed explanans is simply a restatement of the explanandum: the appearance of smoke. A good explanation is something which provides new information in the explandum which does not appear in the explans."

(Although I should add that it shouldn't be just new information, but the simplest explanation that can explain what it's trying to explain, without adding more complications that require extra explanations.)

You're right.. I think you nailed what I'm trying to convey..

The problem with other's explanations is their explanation just doesn't seem enough.. Like, yeah. You explained it well.

[idontgiveaf]

Insufficient grounding therefore people use their own rules. It has never been done. Therefore it is not ready for use or even to be validated. So it should be noted that the thing is just infancy waiting for something better.

That makes socionics scientifically inaccurate.


Actually I cannot explain myself and i sou stupid because English isn't my first language 😑

And it is really hard to explain tbh


Like wut the hexkkk whatever 😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑😑

[Adam Strange]

I know this is not the best typing method, but since Day One of your posts I’ve always thought that you’d be fun to hang out with, but not for BF-GF reasons. More for “doing fun things together” reasons. You are practical, sensible, funny, enthusiastic, very real and immediate, you speak your mind and are usually “up” but when you are “down” it seems like the kind of “down” that either I can help you with or you don’t really need help with it, because you’ll figure it out on your own eventually.

If that isn’t Activty, then I don’t know what Activity is.

*EDIT* I could totally see us making a tour of the Tokyo bars together, commenting on the wildlife we encounter and trolling for introverts. If I drank. Which I don’t anymore. Lol.

[The Reality Denialist]

That makes socionics scientifically inaccurate.


Actually I cannot explain myself and i sou stupid because English isn't my first language 

And it is really hard to explain tbh


Like wut the hexkkk whatever 

Yes. This is not standard. It is largely imperfect.
Anyways there seems to be rather large consensus for your SEE characteristics. I think SEE-C (creative) makes sense you give totally different impression than my SEE-N (normative) sister.
It is about your thinking. Strongest ones in your thinking seems to be , , that is SEE. Do not follow stupid stereotypes.

[Sol]

You are doubtful to be Se. Too much of negative reflexion about sensory themes.

If you want aguments for some type - you should give normal typing material, which includes at least your videointerview. Without this your type is much unidentified and hence nothing to argument.

[Sol]

Insufficient grounding therefore people use their own rules. It has never been done. Therefore it is not ready for use or even to be validated.

Any method can be used and described to others. It's usage is reasonable until there is no objective proof it's bad or significantly worse by results/efforts. Its describing to others and studing them by some way is reasonable until there is no objective proof it does not allow them to get good results.
Any method can be checked on validity by its results and only such, despite how much speculative it looks and by how many words you may describe the proccess.

For N methods, - they use not much words, mb studed by examples.
Also as typing by nonverbal gives typing matches higher than random and even close to interview, so there is the basis to think nonverbal is important info for typing. Those people used VI without detailed explanation how to do this, without special studing - they were random forum members. And got average typing match 15-20% with 16 typed persons and 5-10 typers.
Intuition is the same function like logic. It also can be used in typing and my experiment have shown this objectively. Such way of typing - intuitive-nonverbal - was decribed since Augusinavichute texts. And was used unofficially seems by most typers for all this time. IR effects are perceived through nonverbal when you never had deals with someone, - you just see his/her eyes, smile, some minor behavior and get impressions about his personality and how it matches with yours - you get the sympathy to other human related to IR since the first minutes. My IR test gave clearly nonrandom, often useful results and there is no other explanation besides IR impressions were gotten from nonverbal.

[WinnieW]

So it is possible to be an Ethical type that is good at Sudoko.
Or a Logical type that isn't that great at Sudoko.

I doubt that you need much logic to solve Sudoko puzzles. You can also do a lot of try and error (attempts) to solve it.
Yes, using logic does help and speed up to solve that puzzle.

Sudoko puzzles can be easy or difficult. For the most difficult ones having strong does help to find where to start.
It's basically set theory.

But anyway. Ethical types can be good at math, and logical types can be empathic and social.
But I guess there are very few LII or EII bouncers or ESE technical engineers.

I know a SEE guy who is very skilled at repairing cars. He disassembles the engine and recompose it fully functional.

Most people shy away from relying on their weak(est) functions on a daily basis, I reckon.

[Delilah]

I don't recall if you have considered a Ne/Si type? You seem to go on a lot of different tangents frequently which seems imo more Ne/Si.

[Number 9 large]

I don't recall if you have considered a Ne/Si type? You seem to go on a lot of different tangents frequently which seems imo more Ne/Si.

yeah she considered ILE i think

[idontgiveaf]

I know this is not the best typing method, but since Day One of your posts I’ve always thought that you’d be fun to hang out with, but not for BF-GF reasons. More for “doing fun things together” reasons. You are practical, sensible, funny, enthusiastic, very real and immediate, you speak your mind and are usually “up” but when you are “down” it seems like the kind of “down” that either I can help you with or you don’t really need help with it, because you’ll figure it out on your own eventually.

If that isn’t Activty, then I don’t know what Activity is.

*EDIT* I could totally see us making a tour of the Tokyo bars together, commenting on the wildlife we encounter and trolling for introverts. If I drank. Which I don’t anymore. Lol.

Lol!! That seems fun though!!! We can actually do that.. Lol 😂

[The Reality Denialist]

Her responses are very similar to @Without Warning. Congrats. She has just turned up recklessness in action and in thinking bit higher. I have no idea why that makes someone .

Always putting to use to get out of something like learning a system.

[Adam Strange]

Lol!! That seems fun though!!! We can actually do that.. Lol 

It would be a lot of fun, I’m sure.
BUT, the last time I was in Tokyo was over ten years ago, so don’t wait around for me. It might be another ten years before I’m back.

I had a buddy in college who might have been SEE. He and I did some pretty crazy things together. We would get his guitar and some alcohol and some weed and would go over to the girl’s dorm and knock on doors randomly, asking women if they wanted to go out in the woods and party. We had amazing success with this method. I mean, amazing.

He went through many more girls than I did, and they all viewed him favorably after they broke up.

Not too long ago, he visited me with his fiancé. She was an extremely tolerant logical introvert. He and I got to talking about our days together and just laughed and laughed. I told him I had stopped drinking because I got into too much trouble. He said he still went out (which is amazing, because he is a PhD math professor). His fiancé said, “I don’t care if you go out, as long as you come home to me.”
He roared with laughter and shouted “Adam, do you know how many women I had to have before I found her?”

I did know. But if he had had a better idea of what he really needed, he might have found her sooner.


P.S. My friend might not have been SEE, but it fits our ITR better than any other type. I do know that I’v never met anyone else remotely like him. The closest I’ve come is a lawyer/musician SEE who is married to an IEI therapist. (He is a crusader for justice by day, a song writer/musician by night.) When I first met this guy, I had immediate “Let’s Party” vibes. Very dangerous.

[Adam Strange]

I just finished the second book in “The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo” series, and I was struck once again by how much the girl resembles a female ILI whom I know, and how much Mikhail Blomkvist resembles the male SEE’s I know.
@idontgiveaf, you might want to give the book a read and see what you think. It is very well written.

[idontgiveaf]

Her responses are very similar to @Without Warning. Congrats. She has just turned up recklessness in action and in thinking bit higher. I have no idea why that makes someone .

Always putting to use to get out of something like learning a system.

Nahhh.. I'm not reckless.. I'm just impulsive

[idontgiveaf]

It would be a lot of fun, I’m sure.
BUT, the last time I was in Tokyo was over ten years ago, so don’t wait around for me. It might be another ten years before I’m back.

I had a buddy in college who might have been SEE. He and I did some pretty crazy things together. We would get his guitar and some alcohol and some weed and would go over to the girl’s dorm and knock on doors randomly, asking women if they wanted to go out in the woods and party. We had amazing success with this method. I mean, amazing.

He went through many more girls than I did, and they all viewed him favorably after they broke up.

Not too long ago, he visited me with his fiancé. She was an extremely tolerant logical introvert. He and I got to talking about our days together and just laughed and laughed. I told him I had stopped drinking because I got into too much trouble. He said he still went out (which is amazing, because he is a PhD math professor). His fiancé said, “I don’t care if you go out, as long as you come home to me.”
He roared with laughter and shouted “Adam, do you know how many women I had to have before I found her?”

I did know. But if he had had a better idea of what he really needed, he might have found her sooner.


P.S. My friend might not have been SEE, but it fits our ITR better than any other type. I do know that I’v never met anyone else remotely like him. The closest I’ve come is a lawyer/musician SEE who is married to an IEI therapist. (He is a crusader for justice by day, a song writer/musician by night.) When I first met this guy, I had immediate “Let’s Party” vibes. Very dangerous.

Noice. 😊

[idontgiveaf]

I just finished the second book in “The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo” series, and I was struck once again by how much the girl resembles a female ILI whom I know, and how much Mikhail Blomkvist resembles the male SEE’s I know.
@idontgiveaf, you might want to give the book a read and see what you think. It is very well written.

Oh I watched the movie 😂


It's actually pretty good. I like the girl

[Singu]

Insufficient grounding therefore people use their own rules. It has never been done. Therefore it is not ready for use or even to be validated. So it should be noted that the thing is just infancy waiting for something better.

Even the simple statement of "You're doing this because of your PoLR" deserves great explanations. The explanation for PoLR hypothesis requires an explanation of how PoLR works, and how PoLR works requires the explanation of how Model A works, and how Model A works requires the explanation of how functions work, and how functions work require the explanation of how typing works.

None of those things are explained, and they merely become the convoluted elaboration of the current available explanation, such as that it has to do with the structure of your brain, or whatever. It says, "Yes, that is true, and yet, on top of that, it actually has to do with one's PoLR, which requires extra explanations".

[FDG]

Ti Polr isn't about being bad at science or math, I also know a SEE woman who is a very successful scientist. Incidentally, her ILI ex-boyfriend (I met her through him) left science after his 1st year of PhD because he found it too unprofitable. Whereas the SEE just said - I have chosen this career and i'll stick to it. Very different approaches.

[The Reality Denialist]

Even the simple statement of "You're doing this because of your PoLR" deserves great explanations. The explanation for PoLR hypothesis requires an explanation of how PoLR works, and how PoLR works requires the explanation of how Model A works, and how Model A works requires the explanation of how functions work, and how functions work require the explanation of how typing works.

None of those things are explained, and they merely become the convoluted elaboration of the current available explanation, such as that it has to do with the structure of your brain, or whatever. It says, "Yes, that is true, and yet, on top of that, it actually has to do with one's PoLR, which requires extra explanations".

This is not right place for this topic. Can you explain me every crazy thing there is about quantum mechanics? If you can't by that logic it means that everything you have worked for is baseless.


Basically you need to setup an interpretation layer in order to keep yourself somewhat sane.

You may say that I dodged your argument. Be my guest.

[Singu]

This is not right place for this topic. Can you explain me every crazy thing there is about quantum mechanics? If you can't by that logic it means that everything you have worked for is baseless.

Basically you need to setup an interpretation layer in order to keep yourself somewhat sane.

You may say that I dodged your argument. Be my guest.

Yes, because Quantum mechanics isn't exactly "crazy" (other than they defy our current common sense view of the world), and there are explanations for them.

And if things ARE lacking in explanations, then we can't say that the reason is due to X.

[The Reality Denialist]

You're going to loose predictability of one aspect when you focus on another one too much.

People still transfer different exact methods into new context where predictability given by them is far less uncertain.


People should just learn to deal with it uncertainty. It is not ready. Lots of things are not ready.

[The Reality Denialist]

Ti Polr isn't about being bad at science or math, I also know a SEE woman who is a very successful scientist. Incidentally, her ILI ex-boyfriend (I met her through him) left science after his 1st year of PhD because he found it too unprofitable. Whereas the SEE just said - I have chosen this career and i'll stick to it. Very different approaches.

My SEE nephew figured himself how to do division calculations in his head (with integers) when situation was described using objects (first step) and very soon figured out it in more general way before he started school.

[Singu]

You're going to loose predictability of one aspect when you focus on another one too much.

People still transfer different exact methods into new context where predictability given by them is far less uncertain.

People should just learn to deal with it uncertainty. It is not ready. Lots of things are not ready.

Then why did you say that the answer is "This is because of your PoLR"? That answer is not simply uncertain, it is nonsensical.

[The Reality Denialist]

As I define it: IE in oneself that one can acknowledge but tend to resists it more than anything else where realization of it depends largely on one's goals. Which is not tightly zoomed definition but it can be seen as separate (resisting structural approach) from others at least in this case where approach assumes uncertainty of the accuracy. If you can't live it then you can't. One can construct artifical reality that approaches reality by using different building blocks. It can go wrong. Just live with it.


I don't think in most exact way one can say that person has two apples. Still we accept an apple as a unit. You decide when it goes wrong or when there is room for improvement.

[idontgiveaf]

You're going to loose predictability of one aspect when you focus on another one too much.

People still transfer different exact methods into new context where predictability given by them is far less uncertain.


People should just learn to deal with it uncertainty. It is not ready. Lots of things are not ready.

Saying that, people should just accept uncertainty is stupid.

That's how people become sheeps

You don't trust anything specially if it's uncertain

[Ave]

Saying that, people should just accept uncertainty is stupid.

That's how people become sheeps

You don't trust anything specially if it's uncertain

Isn't certainty that causes people to become sheep?

If you are certain of something you will follow it.

If you are certain evertything someone says is true, you will become a follower.

[The Reality Denialist]

Saying that, people should just accept uncertainty is stupid.

That's how people become sheeps

You don't trust anything specially if it's uncertain

I think everything is questionable. I trust in it. I don't really commit to uncertainty. It is just the way it is. You can't precisely simulate this universe or it takes too much energy to do it and you can't stop the time in order to do it (at least in these days).

[Myst]

This thread is full of Fi Creative stuff. It is all about her "heart", inner emotional experience, coupled with Fe Demonstrative emotionality (tons of emojis and exclamations).

All with the background of tangible experiences, valuing being strong and "hardcore", and wanting to know/yearning for a holistic, unified view on how the experiences matter and will turn out in the long run (Ni Seeking).

I find the thread is a good example of an SEE-Fi's inner monologue.

Please quote the Fi creative stuff.

I looked a bit in the linked thread, first few lines I skim:

"I only can produce sweet fluids. Is that enough?"

"My mindset is very guy like. I think like a man all the fucking time.."

"Because I'm still fucking learning how to live in this fucked up world. Trying to listen to people who seemingly knows stuffs. But ofcourse i should not. Because i have my own logic and my own brain."

And it goes on like this...

Where's the Fi?

I recently started considering SLE-Se for @idontgiveaf actually. SLE-Se can get pretty emotional actually, so...

[Bertrand]

Saying that, people should just accept uncertainty is stupid.

That's how people become sheeps

You don't trust anything specially if it's uncertain

trusting that uncertainty is always a factor is just wise

trusting what any given person tells you because "well! we can't be sure" is being a sheep

the fact that uncertainty means whatever x is saying could be false is the beginning of not being a sheep

in the end you can be a sheep to avoid uncertainty (blindly accept as true whatever is given) or use uncertainty to not be a sheep (decide for yourself whether x is true). uncertainty can cut both ways, its what you do with it that makes you a sheep or not. also sometimes there's good reasons to be a sheep, so there's that too

[maniac]

what about isfp? i feel like your energy isnt big enough for an esfp. i think youre either enfp or isfp.

[The Reality Denialist]

Another option besides SEE could be weird SEI. I'm actually at least half serious.

[idontgiveaf]

Isn't certainty that causes people to become sheep?

If you are certain of something you will follow it.

If you are certain evertything someone says is true, you will become a follower.

Yes. Like socionics followers.