Type My Uncle

[Ritella]

sorry this is long. i'm actually confused about his type and was hoping people could help me out. i'm going to see him a bit over the next few days so i figured it'd be fun to know. pictures below.

-frequently seems frustrated and yells, but not really at anyone. talks a lot to people, though it appears more like he's talking to himself. often makes a shrugging movement that seems to be saying "that's life" or "who knows?".

-Is made fun of for being the "cheap-o" of the family. Frequently says things like "$2 for coffee?! I can make coffee for 1/10 of that." Yells at me when he finds out how much money I spend on things, but then he goes "what do i care? it's your money" when I try to justify my purchases.

-runs and is in the best shape of anyone in the family. likes to eat and cook. seems to be very aware of certain styles of furniture and clothing.

-frequently the butt of everyone's jokes. seems to be a very easy target. does cheesy things like dresses as a set of die (with his wife) for halloween.

-is a bit of a "character." when i was around 8 years old, I remember that he would come to our house uninvited, possibly out of boredom. He did a great job "making himself at home," as he seemed oblivious to the idea that he was disrupting anything. Usually he would raid our refrigerator, cook himself dinner, and proceed to hijack my Nintendo, spending the entire time playing Duck Hunt while my sister and I sat on the couch observing him like he was some sort of alien life form.

-had sort of physical space control issues when I was younger, though he's gotten much better. For example, he didn't used to let people wear seat belts in his car because he complained that then he'd have to fix them when they got messed up. He also was obsessed with keeping the gravel in front of his house tidy. Everyone criticized him for this sort of behavior. When I was a kid I would tease him that he spent his mornings strategically positioning each gravel pebble. I would also make a point to mess up all the gravel every time I left his house. He totally knew that I was doing it and it became sort of like a running joke. Recently, though, he saved all of his old living room furniture for me to have, which essentially blocked off a room of his house for 3 months. Everyone thought that was surprisingly nice of him.

-thinks that my mom is way too strict. His views on parenting were expressed once as "what the fuck do i care what my daughter does after she goes to college?! It's her life." His wife seems to have done all the teaching and nurturing aspects of the parenting. he was very dependable in terms of things like driving his daughter to extracurriculars, friend's houses, etc.

-seems to have very little drama with his wife. i think they've fought 3 times in the 20 years they've been married. I know this because each time my aunt came over to our house crying that she had no idea what was going on and that someone needed to talk to him. This happened when I was younger so I don't remember it too well, but from what I recall my uncle just seemed like he had exploded from some sort of frustration. It never really seemed like his anger was directed at my aunt or their relationship, though.

-one of my aunts does not particularly like him because he's "uncouth" or something and has never invited her to his house for dinner. he's commented to me that he feels sorry that his daughter is always sort of snubbed by this aunt. i told him what i thought were my aunt's problems with him- he seemed completely surprised that she _had_ a problem- and suggested that he remedy it by inviting her for dinner. he wasn't entirely receptive to this, got defensive and went "i''m not going to do something just because she wants me to"

-i called him a few months ago because i had never painted an apartment before and wanted advice. He proceeded to give me super detailed instructions on what to do, stopping in between each direction to say something like "painting is a pain in the butt. you may just want to hire someone to do it." He also repeated the information about 4 times. To me, this was slightly funny because I felt like "you don't have to go into _that_ level of detail when I haven't even decided if I'm going to paint," but I got the feeling that he needed to talk to someone or something so I sort of "uh-d" him until he finished.

-seems to be a sort of victim of dramatic irony. He saved up for a really nice trip around Italy. On the first 2 days of the vacation he insisted that he wanted to touch the water in lake como, despite being warned not to; ended up falling in, and broke his arm. He spent the rest of the trip sort of bemoaning his bad luck. When I heard this, I honestly could not stop laughing because this is exactly the kind of thing that would happen (only) to him.

-of the cousin-uncle pairings we have probably the least developed relationship, though we do bond a bit every christmas eve because we both really like a "Christmas Story." my uncle will often quote the whole movie the entire time.

[Ritella]

left

[UDP]

does anyone else see eyes?

[Ritella]

pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeee people.

[Park]

V.I. - ENFj, but the description doesn't fit that well with ENFj, so I'll suggest INFp.

[implied]

V.I. - ENFj, but the description doesn't fit that well with ENFj, so I'll suggest INFp.

funny but i was thinking something similar. i think a lot of things she wrote suggest some sort of odd NT type but i keep going back to "this is kind of like an anal-retentive ENFj" in my head.

[Mea]

? he looks and sounds nothing like an ethical type to me.

[Mariano Rajoy]

He loves turtle necks.

Maybe EIE.

Possibly unrelated.

[Mariano Rajoy]

? he looks and sounds nothing like an ethical type to me.

Te is to loose logic as Fe is to loose ethics, which is a bit scary cause he is someones uncle.

[Ritella]

I'd be surprised if he were an ethical type, esp. EIE.
There is an EIE in the family already. He thinks she's a bit crazy and she thinks he is honest and dependable and often enlists his help in various little favors.

[unefille]

-thinks that my mom is way too strict. His views on parenting were expressed once as "what the fuck do i care what my daughter does after she goes to college?! It's her life." His wife seems to have done all the teaching and nurturing aspects of the parenting. he was very dependable in terms of things like driving his daughter to extracurriculars, friend's houses, etc.

I lot of things struck me as un-EIE (assuming I'm EIE) such as being 'cheap-o' [if anything, my spending habits are well within my means, but nevertheless extravagant], and the coming into your house and 'making himself at home'. Even if someone explicitly invites me into their house, I tend to take up minimal space so as to minimise the inconvenience I'm causing. I can't imagine ever acting the way you describe.

Now, even moving beyond what I personally identify with, or don't: I just don't see how an EIE can have that attitude toward parenting in that quote. I can't imagine any EJ have such a hands off attitude, though I may be wrong, but the natural role of the EIE surely involves some nurturing and teaching (and inspiring) of their children. I think an EIE would be more likely to be in danger of projecting too much onto their children than to be hands-off with respect to the direction and moral character of their children.

[Wittmont]

LSE

Strong Te and sensing. Outspoken about other people's 'efficiency', focused on order in his surroundings etc

Ni PoLR - breaking arm story eg trouble predicting outcomes

[Joy]

I thought LSI perhaps from VI, but the description sounds more ILI.

[implied]

LSE

Strong Te and sensing. Outspoken about other people's 'efficiency', focused on order in his surroundings etc

Ni PoLR - breaking arm story eg trouble predicting outcomes

why? that story about the seatbelts was absolutely stupid and i can't imagine an ESTj saying, "don't use the seatbelts in my car because i'll have to fix them later." i don't understand how that's Te.

Te is to loose logic as Fe is to loose ethics, which is a bit scary cause he is someones uncle.

i kind of like this, although perhaps it's rather generalized. i don't find that ENFjs have no ethics but sometimes i think they can come off as such to me. i think sometimes i have a hard time identifying ENFj men precisely because they can often seem like absolutely NOT ethical types.

[Joy]

Nah, the thing about needing to control his space is just OCD. It's not type related, unless you believe the theory that machintruc talks about, in which case he would have (or would have had, in the very least) low serotonin, high dopamine, and high norepinephrine.

[implied]

Nah, the thing about needing to control his space is just OCD. It's not type related, unless you believe the theory that machintruc talks about, in which case he would have (or would have had, in the very least) low serotonin, high dopamine, and high norepinephrine.

i don't think there's anything far fetched about believing that many ENFjs could be OCD. Si polr + Te role + Ti ds. god he sounds annoying though. no offense, ritella. i'm not anti ITj but wow hah. and what INTp would really spend that much time strategically placing every piece of gravel?

[Joy]

i don't think there's anything far fetched about believing that many ENFjs could be OCD. Si polr + Te role + Ti ds. god he sounds annoying though. no offense, ritella. i'm not anti ITj but wow hah. and what INTp would really spend that much time strategically placing every piece of gravel?

One with OCD.

[implied]

One with OCD.

therapist

[Joy]

[Wittmont]

why? that story about the seatbelts was absolutely stupid and i can't imagine an ESTj saying, "don't use the seatbelts in my car because i'll have to fix them later." i don't understand how that's Te.



i kind of like this, although perhaps it's rather generalized. i don't find that ENFjs have no ethics but sometimes i think they can come off as such to me. i think sometimes i have a hard time identifying ENFj men precisely because they can often seem like absolutely NOT ethical types.

Yeah, that's pretty bizarre heh. It could be a weird kind of Te in that he feels it isn't worth the effort to use them as he would have to work to get them sorted afterwards - efficiency of actions = Te and Si, he didn't like his surroundings messed up.

For strong Te I was thinking more along the lines that he was good at describing how to paint the appartment - the pro's and con's of the procedure itself.

Also the obsession with the pathway points to strong Si if he is that fastidious with his surroundings.

[implied]

Also the obsession with the pathway points to strong Si if he is that fastidious with his surroundings.

right, well, it's one thing that made me think, "probably not INTp." i can't personally imagine an INTp putting that much effort into rearranging the rocks on the driveway. on the other hand, i could easily see my mother, who is ENFj, doing this. as well as getting mad about the seatbelts. but in her case the argument would be like, "don't sit on that couchcover, i just cleaned it." or "don't walk on the living room floor because i just cleaned it and i'll have to clean it again if you go and walk on it."

[Joy]

I think his social awkwardness, poor emotional control, critical nature, and "cheap-o" tendencies are far more relevant to his type than his OCD symptoms are.

[Ritella]

hey people, thanks.
okay, here is some more info that may be helpful.
i think it's usually very easy for me to spot ILIs, so I would be surprised if he were that. I would also be a bit surprised if he were any kind of N or F type because to me he seems neither theoretical nor emotionally aware. I've always thought he was an ESTx, and I was leaning toward ESTj until recently when I realized how crap I am at identifying them.
Fwiw, I've realized the description may seem negative, but I honestly didn't mean it that way. I find most of the stuff that I wrote to be pretty funny. The seatbelt thing was the only thing I ever thought was objectively bad, because it was a safety hazard. The rest of his little neuroses seem entirely self contained so they've never really scared me or anything. At most, I just don't want to deal with it, because it seems a bit unneccessarily stressful. As I already mentioned, whenever someone complains about this uncle being annoying, the EIE will say "leave him alone. he doesn't hurt anyone," which is a pretty accurate assessment imo. (Also, he has lightened up a great deal since I was 8 and no longer has the seatbelt or gravel obsession.)
The only other things I can think of about him (and may sound like I'm making a case for LSE, though I don't mean to) are:
-He was never really academic. I think he didn't see the point. I was, however, shocked once when he started talking about all this history that he learned from the history channel, which is apparently one of his favorite channels.
-He used to have a really high paying job on Wall Street but quit it because he didn't like the life style. Now he works as a mail carrier, which he likes (i think) because it's fairly autonomous, low stress, and he gets to be outside a bit.
-He is actually probably the _chillest_ (no joke) member of my extended family. As I already mentioned, he thinks that my mom's parenting style was absurdly strict. He's seen me sort of have panic/anxiety attacks in response to some things that my mother has said to me. He's not really emotionally sympathetic; like he wouldn't be the first person I'd call to talk about my feelings. However, when he would see me really bad he would always be like "your mother is crazy. if i were you i would go to college and never come back again. you don't need this." He also seems genuinely confused about how I could let her put me down. He will say stuff like "you've done x. you've done y. can't she leave you alone? how do you take her criticisms at all seriously?"
-I've actually sort of always liked his "hands off" attitude toward parenting my cousin. The thing is, my dad was very good at being an intellectual teacher, as he has a bit of "absent minded professor" personality, but my dad has always complained whenever he had to drive me anywhere or had to do anything else related to being in the moment or logistically capable. My uncle, on the other hand, always drove his daughter to extracurriculars and organized his schedule around hers without even a second thought. I think he just sees it as obvious and doesn't view it as "self-sacrifice," that he should fulfill these parental obligations.
-Everyone else in my family is always pumping me with "what career are you going to go into" type loaded questions. My (i think) ISTJ uncle frequently makes comments like "when are you going to go to law or medical school so that you can get a real job?," as if those are the only 2 possible career paths. An ILI relative is like "this is life: you go to work, you do the best you can, you don't have to love it, and then you come home. forget your lofty dreams and deal with it." I always go off on a rant about how I'm trying to find a field in which I have a compartive advantage, that it's important for me to love my job, and call the ILI "miserable" for settling into a career that doesn't entirely suit him. This uncle concurred with my assessment that the ILI's attitude was wrong and a result of his own failures to self-actualize. The only comment this uncle made when I was unemployed were things like "how much money do you have saved? well that's 4 months until you need to find employment" and "teachers have a decent lifestyle. you won't get rich, but it's summers off and you might like it" when I told him I might want to teach.
-The only thing that sort of hurt my feelings with the whole career discussion with him was that I once said something like "several of my friends think I should be a psychologist. do you think I could be good at that?." He laughed and was like "i can't see you getting into people's heads" as if he thought it was super hokey or something, but then he shrugged and was like "i dunno. i have no idea what people like doing." This sort of bothered me because I would hope that people who know me well have some sort of perception of what I'm good at, but oh well...
-During huge family gatherings I often play the part of social clown/little kid. I just feel like the atmosphere is _way_ too tense, so the only way for me to deal with it is to go into this weird cartoon character mode. So, I often do things like claim I can eat more cake than anyone there and proceed to eat almost everything while making these sort of like baby noises, as if to say "yum." eh, this is really hard to explain over the internet. The EIE thinks this is funny but sometimes find it offensive, which to me is stupid because I'm not hurting anyone. The SEE hates when I behave like this and will often yell at me for being "rude" or "ruining her image" or something. (IMO she takes herself _way_ too seriously.) As for as I can tell, the uncle is completely indifferent to this sort of behavior and, if anything, thinks it's slightly amusing. He'll often laugh and be like "what the heck is she doing now?."
-He really cannot pay anyone a compliment. If he says things _about_ a person it's almost always positive, but I don't think I've ever heard him say it _to_ the person. Sometimes when he talks to me he'll make a comment and my aunt will go "your uncle doesn't know how to compliment people. he really means ____" before I can even react to what he's said.
-From what I've seen, I actually don't think my uncle has loose ethics or whatever. The EIE often tells white lies or tries to manipulate people a tad. On the other hand, my uncle appears pretty "as is." If you ask him to do you a favor he will seem annoyed, but he will almost always fulfill your request. He seems to like to do things on his schedule, though. Also, the EIE does stuff like steals sugar when she goes to Starbucks. The uncle, who always gets the rap for being cheap, was like "jesus. just _buy_ sugar" when he saw her doing this.
-The ISTJ(?) hates when this uncle talks and talks and talks to people. He's always like "can't he shut up?! noone is listening to him. what is he talking about?"
-i think that might be it

[UDP]

You say he's not Fe valuing, or did recently. You seem to be saying a lot of different things, but right now it seems like some sort of Fe-devaluing Sensory type.

[Joy]

What about SLI? I just can't picture an LSE being so laid back in parenting. I'd be interested in hearing slacker mom's opinions about this guy.

[UDP]

I just suggested that to her, actually. But she seems to be set on something else right now. I think it would be a much better idea to try type the person AFTER you see him again, rather than relying in old memories and interpretations from long ago.

But I suppose that's what the fun is all about.

[Ritella]

What about SLI? I just can't picture an LSE being so laid back in parenting. I'd be interested in hearing slacker mom's opinions about this guy.

What exactly is so laid back about his parenting? To me it seems "normal." I like his attitude in terms of not forcing his own beliefs or career desires onto his daughter. I mean, on the other hand, I guess I would say that he doesn't do any of the emotional nurturing, intellectual teaching part of parenting, which seems bad. But, I think part of this might be because he doesn't have to. My aunt is uber-obsessed with this aspect of parenting and does it to the point of overkill imo, so he might just be indifferent about it because he knows that he sucks at it and she doesn't?

[implied]

What about SLI? I just can't picture an LSE being so laid back in parenting. I'd be interested in hearing slacker mom's opinions about this guy.

so would i, really.

[Slacker]

Well he does share my husband's parenting style (VERY hands off) and I can see my husband quitting a high pressure job to deliver mail. That would be so him. He's talked about quitting his job to work as a welder or something.

[Ritella]

Well he does share my husband's parenting style (VERY hands off) and I can see my husband quitting a high pressure job to deliver mail. That would be so him. He's talked about quitting his job to work as a welder or something.

do you think an LSE would be that hands off as well? Also, any idea on the type based on the descriptions?

[Slacker]

do you think an LSE would be that hands off as well? Also, any idea on the type based on the descriptions?

My initial thought was LSE because he sounded maybe more like an Ej temperment, but the quitting a higher-paid higher stress job for a more laid back job sounds much more SLI than LSE. (I'm trying to use the 3-letter names but I'm not quite used to them yet.) But I can definitely see him as an ST Delta anyway.

[UDP]

My initial thought was LSE because he sounded maybe more like an Ej temperment, but the quitting a higher-paid higher stress job for a more laid back job sounds much more SLI than LSE. (I'm trying to use the 3-letter names but I'm not quite used to them yet.) But I can definitely see him as an ST Delta anyway.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with that.

I think LSE would be more inclined to have hands on parenting.

I know an SLI mailcarrier, too (I think he left another job for it, similarly. Or just took it because it was more autonomous). He's actually a really big asshole who is basically always looking out for himself and getting his. He uses people fairly readily.

I could see him going over to your house and playing your videogames, while you watch him.

[Wittmont]

Ritella said something about her uncle talking loads - I don't think I've ever seen a motormouth SLI. (Not saying he can't be SLI at all).

[Ritella]

My initial thought was LSE because he sounded maybe more like an Ej temperment, but the quitting a higher-paid higher stress job for a more laid back job sounds much more SLI than LSE. (I'm trying to use the 3-letter names but I'm not quite used to them yet.) But I can definitely see him as an ST Delta anyway.

yea, that's the thing. i initially thought he was LSE, which could kind of make sense because he's the relative i honestly have always paid the least attention to, though i also don't think of him as particularly "ideal." i remember that my one word summary for him when i was younger (i sort of had one for everyone) was "simple." I'm questioning his type now because aspects of him remind me of other people who are def not LSE.
If you think he is Delta ST, then i would say LSE over SLI because he has way too much extroverted energy and almost none of that internal calm that SLIs have. (As I said, he's pretty easy to poke fun of.)
But, eh, I could also fathom some sort of Beta. If it means anything, he really used to like the show "Cops" when I was younger, which to me seems pretty abusive. He also finds that Osbourne reality show amusing. I think he thinks it's funny that Ozzy is so messed up and a dad.

[UDP]

I know an SLI who loves cops. He also loves gangster movies, drama, crime. He sort of enjoys watching how screwed up other people are, sort of like the delta version of aristocracy.

[implied]

the quitting wallstreet to work a less high pressure job does not exceptionally strike me as a type really. idk, i'll have to think about it heh.

[Joy]

What exactly is so laid back about his parenting? To me it seems "normal." I like his attitude in terms of not forcing his own beliefs or career desires onto his daughter. I mean, on the other hand, I guess I would say that he doesn't do any of the emotional nurturing, intellectual teaching part of parenting, which seems bad. But, I think part of this might be because he doesn't have to. My aunt is uber-obsessed with this aspect of parenting and does it to the point of overkill imo, so he might just be indifferent about it because he knows that he sucks at it and she doesn't?

Maybe I'm not being objective about this due to the LSE's I've known... but EJ temperament + aristocracy + Ni PoLR = a tendency to take a strict approach (in my observations).

[UDP]

I don't think I'll be a strict parent, but definitely hands on - I'd feel responsible to help my kids grow and develop and get good opportunities - if I just let them be I'd feel like I wasn't "doing" enough.

My SLI mom was very, very hands off.

[Ritella]

ok, but hands on how?
like "talk to me about your emotions," "come read War and Peace with me?"
He seems to do stuff like take his daughter to events, extracurriculars, watch tv with her, mildly entertain her friends. He seems to be sort of like friends with his daughter. Not like her "buddy," but also not like some sort of "respect me. i am your elder. my rule is gold" father.
i always associated this with delta. The betas in my family are much more "my vision must be your vision. there is no alternative."
As stupid as this may sound, the "taking his daughter places" is a HUGE part of parenting for me because I would completely suck at this. Just the thought of driving my kids to school, going to get them afterwards, bringing them to various activities (while I have my own job) gives me anxiety.

[Joy]

The betas in my family are much more "my vision must be your vision. there is no alternative."

I can relate.

I do think that's more a matter of how healthy a person is though, at the end of the day. I've already admitted by bias toward LSE's... largely as a result of the affect my son's LSE dad has on him.