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Thread: ENTp - ISFp duality description Meged and Ovcharov

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    Default ENTp - ISFp duality description [Meged and Ovcharov]

    The Seeker is the ENTp and The Mediator is the ISFp.

    © From: V.Meged, A.Ovcharov. Learn To Manage People Efficiently, 2000.

    The Seeker is somewhat 'not here and now', he longs for far-reaching projects. He is obsessed with many ideas, which he explains so vaguely that only few people can understand him. The Mediator, however, does not refuse them at once, but shows interest and if he finds in them something useful, he looks for support of people capable of practical implementation of these ideas. If these ideas, however, seem to him too naive, or if their implementation may be too problematic, The Mediator can 'earthen' The Seeker's redundant inventive energy, calm him down and distract from 'fighting windmills'. He appreciates The Seeker's originality of thought and often shares his passions. In general, he tolerantly attends to this 'eternal child', playing the role of a caring parent. He guides the practical side of their common life.

    The Seeker is critical towards everything created earlier. He looks for new ways and alternatives. Having analyzed the situation and finding its dubious aspects, he may provoke split in an organization and create his own group of adherents. But lack of tactfulness does not allow him to keep the adherents at his side. However, The Mediator is an expert at 'shuttle diplomacy'; he is quite capable of grouping people, softening the ethical mistakes of his dual and finding support of his superiors. He takes care of the comfort, rest and amusement of the party. He can arrange holiday parties. But in everyday chores he is mobile and strives for completion of his undertakings. That is if he is convinced in the perspective of the new undertakings, the suggested solution of complicated and intricate situations. The Mediator watches the flow of work and does not let The Seeker stop halfway by getting attracted to a new idea. The Seeker needs such a stabilizer both in affairs and in relations.

    The Seeker gets mobilized in critical moments: bravely repulses the enemy, protecting both his own interests and those of others. By doing this he sometimes loses the feeling of necessary limit. The Mediator who directs his initiatives watches him. When The Seeker loses vital tonus and begins neglect his duties, The Mediator 'arranges an emotional episode' for him and by this raises his spirits. But on the other hand, he can extinguish a quarrel by his diplomacy and jokes, before it results in rupture of relations. His feelings often return The Seeker ‘to solid ground’, distracting him from abstractions, making him think about practical tasks as well. The Seeker cannot regulate distance in communication; sometimes he is out of place, unceremonious, too credulous towards people, too kind to those who envy him. For this reason he may get into trouble. The Mediator saves him from this.

    The Mediator can take care of the health and comfort of others. The Seeker appreciates this trait of his dual very much. He responds to The Mediator with reciprocity. He strives to be faithful in their partnership and friendship, which is especially liked by The Mediator.

    Although The Mediator is ostentatiously optimistic, he is very much afraid of the future, as the source of uncertainty. His dual saves him from such doubts by making forecasts and especially by taking global strategic protective measures. The Mediator periodically falls into laziness but his dual does not rebuke him for it, in other words, does not require him to be always highly productive. The Mediator likes The Seeker's capability of deriving benefit from everything without much effort, of concluding profitable agreements, and he willingly assists his partner in such affairs.

    Ingenuousness, impulse of life and feelings represent the 'visiting card' of this dual pair.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

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    And -- do you have a point, where you'd just like us to comment?

    I think this is probably one of the better duality descriptions, overall it seems consistent with what I have seen of the marriage of my ENTp brother and his ISFp wife.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    I just wanted to put them all up so we can link people to these descriptions, because there isn't another way to do that right now, that I know of.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Where did you get that book? Somehow I always thought that Dmitri and his wife had written that text that was in his duality descriptions.

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    im an ISFP going out with an ENTP [:
    ISFp; SEI

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    I disagree with the "vaguely" bit a rather lot...the ILEs I know articulate their ideas better than most. That's the whole point of Ne: putting things in their most basic terms. They are probably more likely to discuss things that would normally seem vague and hard to understand, but their biggest strength is making these things accessible. Think about, as Rick points out on his website, ILEs like David Deutch, Einstein, Steven Levitt, Stephen Hawking: these are all people who take rediculously complex scientific or highly conceptual ideas and make them accessible and easy to understand for the "every-man."
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by jelly grass
    im an ISFP going out with an ENTP [:
    cool...tell us a-bout it :-) do the duality descriptions fit?

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    I disagree with the "vaguely" bit a rather lot...the ILEs I know articulate their ideas better than most. That's the whole point of Ne: putting things in their most basic terms. They are probably more likely to discuss things that would normally seem vague and hard to understand, but their biggest strength is making these things accessible. Think about, as Rick points out on his website, ILEs like David Deutch, Einstein, Steven Levitt, Stephen Hawking: these are all people who take rediculously complex scientific or highly conceptual ideas and make them accessible and easy to understand for the "every-man."
    Then perhaps "vaguely" could be translated then as "with not enough details and facts for the satisifaction of a dominant." I have heard some complain that some people who use gloss over details, which may have the appearance for them at least as being vague.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    I disagree with the "vaguely" bit a rather lot...the ILEs I know articulate their ideas better than most. That's the whole point of Ne: putting things in their most basic terms. They are probably more likely to discuss things that would normally seem vague and hard to understand, but their biggest strength is making these things accessible. Think about, as Rick points out on his website, ILEs like David Deutch, Einstein, Steven Levitt, Stephen Hawking: these are all people who take rediculously complex scientific or highly conceptual ideas and make them accessible and easy to understand for the "every-man."
    I'm ENTp if the above is true.
    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

    You know what? You're an individual, and that makes people nervous. And it's gonna keep making people nervous for the rest of your life.
    - Ole Golly from Harriet, the spy.

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    Well, it's true of me and many highly suspected ILEs, but that doesn't make you one. IEEs have Ne as well, you know.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Default Re: ENTp/ISFp duality description

    Famous ENTp-ISFp couple: Kermit the Frog & Miss Piggy

    ... even down to the v.i.

    Incredible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    Well, it's true of me and many highly suspected ILEs, but that doesn't make you one. IEEs have Ne as well, you know.
    That's why I said it. When people speaks about such features, they seem to forget that many types share them. Would you deny that INFj and INTj are also good at making things seem clear to others?

    And you can go on with "Fe types are emotional". Aren't we all? Etc.
    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

    You know what? You're an individual, and that makes people nervous. And it's gonna keep making people nervous for the rest of your life.
    - Ole Golly from Harriet, the spy.

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    You need to back to Socionics school. Or maybe just English class

    If I say that x is a feature of a particular type, that doesn't mean that I'm saying that trait is unique to that type. I was just saying that the part of the description that implied "vagueness" as a characteristic of ILEs is either imprecise or altogether false; they tend to be interested and describe things that are obscure or hard to understand, but they are almost always adept at describing things well. Nothing that I said implies that ONLY ILEs are like this.

    Christ.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Default Re: ENTp/ISFp duality description

    Quote Originally Posted by astralsilky
    Famous ENTp-ISFp couple: Kermit the Frog & Miss Piggy

    ... even down to the v.i.

    Incredible.
    This is sad. It's as if ISFps are prone to be rounded (at least at some juncture in their lives).

    Examples

    Enough said.

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    Default Re: ENTp/ISFp duality description

    Quote Originally Posted by astralsilky
    Famous ENTp-ISFp couple: Kermit the Frog & Miss Piggy

    ... even down to the v.i.

    Incredible.

    i really do think you're brilliant sometimes. my first thought would be to call miss piggy ESFj, though, in spite of the rounded figure. i think her temperament is more EJ/proactive/aggressive.
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    Default Re: ENTp/ISFp duality description

    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    i really do think you're brilliant sometimes. my first thought would be to call miss piggy ESFj, though, in spite of the rounded figure. i think her temperament is more EJ/proactive/aggressive.
    Agreed.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by diamond8
    Quote Originally Posted by jelly grass
    im an ISFP going out with an ENTP [:
    cool...tell us a-bout it :-) do the duality descriptions fit?
    well, from the duality relations thing on the socionics site.. this is what i find to be true about my relationship:

    They usually understand each others intentions without any need to say a word.
    Dual will naturally protect your weak points and appreciate the strong ones without asking for anything in return.
    Interaction with your Dual allows you to be yourself without the need to adjust to your partner like in other relations.
    Your Dual partner will love you just for what you are
    ISFp; SEI

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