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Thread: What does romantic mean? Are all IEIs/INFps romantics?

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    Default What does romantic mean? Are all IEIs/INFps romantics?

    I had a similar thread but it was deleted a while back in the hacker attack.

    So..again about romantics and romantic people. In all INFp descriptions it is said that INFps are one of the most romantic people. Is this true and how is "being romantic" defined here? I don't feel like being romantic at all but perhaps I don't understand the concept right.

    So what means being "romantic" and are all INFps into that?

    Another thing which bothers me is INFps and money. Pretty much all INFp descriptions make a big deal about how INFps use money. Generally they can't resist fulfilling their desires and thus are more or less big spenders. This is another thing I don't relate to at all. I have no problem resisting my desires and I'm not a spender in the least. I'm one of the most conservative spenders you will find except in special occasions.

    There are more but I'm just interested in these two details at the moment Why does every INFp description mention these if they are just insignificant details? Are they false and should they be removed from the descriptions or are they accurate descriptions of most INFps?

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    I don't know that many real life INFps, but those that I know are bigger spenders than INTps.

    In a sense both INTps and INFps can be called romantics due to their dominant , but INTps in general would clearly value reason and logic over the ideals that are commonly associated with the word "romantic" and the romantic movement in literature and philosophy. The same thing can not be said of the majority of INFps.

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    I thought there was a third post in this thread a while ago but no it is gone...am I imagining?? I didn't manage to read it. I just noticed it and now it is gone. Could it come back. I'd be interested in knowing what it said

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus
    I don't know that many real life INFps, but those that I know are bigger spenders than INTps.

    In a sense both INTps and INFps can be called romantics due to their dominant , but INTps in general would clearly value reason and logic over the ideals that are commonly associated with the word "romantic" and the romantic movement in literature and philosophy. The same thing can not be said of the majority of INFps.
    What are those ideals exactly? I don't feel romantic not even a little bit. I feel anti-romantic. Is this an argument against, not just INFp, but Ni as a whole?

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    Romanticism has more to do with Fe than Ni, IMO.

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    Most ESTp-Se and ESFp-Se I know are by a long shot bigger spenders than the INFps.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    The "INFps are big spenders" thing is an intepretation of their PoLR. I don't think it's necessarily reflected in that way.

    To give an example of how I see it working - my ISFp father also had PoLR. He was very careful with money, never over-spent, never got into debt for silly reasons. Yet he was, at the same time, remarkably -- yes, unskilled as to how he spent money. He had difficulty thinking of the future in terms of a pension plan (the major source of exasperation for my ESFj mother), he made investment decisions that were very obviously wrong - and yet he had both an accounting and economics degree, and he worked as an accountant.

    Yet, again, he never spent more than he had in his bank account, or even used his credit card recklessly. He never, ever, spent money in things like an expensive car, clothes, or the like.

    This is perhaps how I can see it working for INFps, too, rather than simply "overspending" and "lacking control" etc. Actually I can see both an INFp and ISFp being rather conservative and careful with money precisely because they don't trust their management of it.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    Romanticism has more to do with Fe than Ni, IMO.
    I agree with that -- at least if we talk about behaviours. But the word "romanticism" can have different meanings. Take the film Finding Neverland, for example. My guess is that the inventor of the story about Peter Pan was dominant, and as an INTp I can relate to it.

    And what can we say about Charlie Kaufman? Would you call him a "romantic" or not? Anyway, I strongly believe that he is an INTp. A film like Being John Malkovich is very typical, and it is hard to imagine it coming from any other mind that the mind of an INTp. The other day I also saw Adaptation again. And every theme is there -- every theme that is usually associated with being an INTp. It is also worth noticing that among Charlie Kaufman's favourite writers and influences are Franz Kafka, Samuel Beckett, and Stanislaw Lem -- and all three of those writers were probably INTps. I know that Rick disagrees about Beckett, but I still think that he has probably mistyped him.

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    XoX your views on Romanticism and money are again similar to those of ENFjs I know. Really there hasn't been given any reasonable evidence of you being INFp. I think all the functional bullshit that has been fed you has only served to confuse you further. I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you. In my opinion the whole "deductive reasoning" argument for figuring out types is inferior to the comparison argument. It's being propogandized noticably by "logical" T type forum members because it's easier for them to see socionics as a "logical" concept-type system instead of seeing the patterns in relations approach (which would be I suppose the F, or ethical, way of seeing things).

    Romanticism in INFps can be considered to mean something more so along the lines of imaginative idealism. Dreaming of being "swept off your feet" by another person instead of taking the initiative and sweeping someone off their feet yourself - think along the lines of "hopeless romantic" because romanticism, like 99% of the time, is an ideal that never arrives in reality, but INFps still dream that maybe, just maybe, it could happen, and they/we take solace in those dreams (imagining what *could* be represents the Ni). Also the affection shown towards a signficant other/someone the INFp truly loves, making that person feel loved (Fe).

    In terms of money when I go to a store and see, for example, a shirt, or pair of pants that I must have, I immediately know. Like I don't even need to try it on, I must have it. Even if it's not on sale I'm willing to pay more to have something I love rather then fish around in the bargain bin for something less adequate. Do you see how this could be bad? That being said I don't go shopping often as I'm aware of my potential to abuse my finances, instead I only go when I know that finances are healthy enough that I can abuse them, enough to put a smile on my face, and live not to regret it later. I suck at bargain shopping, I don't know when sales are or where to go to take advantage of them. When something catches my eye it's like nothing else matters - I compensate for this weakness by avoiding places where things lie that threaten to catch my eye... lol

    I think these examples, from an INFp, should help clarify things for you, feel free to ask me to elaborate on anything if there's any confusion.
    INFp-Ni

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    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    XoX your views on Romanticism and money are again similar to those of ENFjs I know. Really there hasn't been given any reasonable evidence of you being INFp. I think all the functional bullshit that has been fed you has only served to confuse you further. I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you. In my opinion the whole "deductive reasoning" argument for figuring out types is inferior to the comparison argument.
    But if you type people by comparing them to "the XXXxs I know", how do you avoid getting into a circular-thinking trap?

    For instance, you may end up not typing someone as ENFj because of some differences with regard to the "ENFjs you know" which may not even be essential to the type; and this will be worse particularly if some of the "ENFjs you know" are not really ENFjs.

    As for "not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you" -- why "faith"? I am giving my opinion and arguments. I try to explain why I can't see XoX as an INTp and I find ENTp and INFp more likely than either ENFj or INTp. However, it's of course his decision as to which conclusion he wants to reach. If he decides to say "I am an ENFj and that is my type, that is my decision" I will say "fine, but in my opinion you don't seem to be one from what I can see" and that's it.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you.
    this is funny. Does this apply to you as well :wink

    In my opinion the whole "deductive reasoning" argument for figuring out types is inferior to the comparison argument. It's being propogandized noticably by "logical" T type forum members because it's easier for them to see socionics as a "logical" concept-type system instead of seeing the patterns in relations approach (which would be I suppose the F, or ethical, way of seeing things).
    Yeah, I agree completely, and that is how I type, based on impressions.

    I only go when I know that finances are healthy enough that I can abuse them, enough to put a smile on my face, and live not to regret it later.
    Precisely, you couldn't have expressed my thoughts more clearly, that is exactly how I spend money, first make the money "safe" to spend (Or should I say first "kill" and "cook" it before I "ingest" it).

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    I don't feel romantic not even a little bit. I feel anti-romantic. Is this an argument against, not just INFp, but Ni as a whole?
    It is an argument against INFp, and combined with everything else we know about you, it is an argument for INTp. We are similar in that respect. It is in no way an argument against .

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    XoX your views on Romanticism and money are again similar to those of ENFjs I know.
    They are also very similar to those of one INTp I know very well -- me.

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    Really there hasn't been given any reasonable evidence of you being INFp.
    Not any very strong evidence, anyway. But many things suggest dominance.

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    In my opinion the whole "deductive reasoning" argument for figuring out types is inferior to the comparison argument. It's being propogandized noticably by "logical" T type forum members because it's easier for them to see socionics as a "logical" concept-type system instead of seeing the patterns in relations approach (which would be I suppose the F, or ethical, way of seeing things).
    I agree with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    In terms of money when I go to a store and see, for example, a shirt, or pair of pants that I must have, I immediately know. Like I don't even need to try it on, I must have it. Even if it's not on sale I'm willing to pay more to have something I love rather then fish around in the bargain bin for something less adequate.
    This might be an important difference between INTps and INFps. My INFp friend is exactly like you describe yourself, misutii. He seems to be more confident in using his intuition when he is making a decision -- and he is aware of that. I, on the other hand, tend to spend a lot of time comparing every aspect of different pants (or shoes, or ...), because I am afraid of making the "wrong" decision. In that respect I am more of a perfectionist, and I am using thinking more than intuition in that process. I know that my method is too time-consuming, and that I probably would benefit from using my intuition more, by in order to do that I have to try to resist my natural inclination. What we discuss here can compared with this:

    http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...10148&start=45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    XoX your views on Romanticism and money are again similar to those of ENFjs I know. Really there hasn't been given any reasonable evidence of you being INFp. I think all the functional bullshit that has been fed you has only served to confuse you further. I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you. In my opinion the whole "deductive reasoning" argument for figuring out types is inferior to the comparison argument.
    But if you type people by comparing them to "the XXXxs I know", how do you avoid getting into a circular-thinking trap?

    For instance, you may end up not typing someone as ENFj because of some differences with regard to the "ENFjs you know" which may not even be essential to the type; and this will be worse particularly if some of the "ENFjs you know" are not really ENFjs.

    As for "not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you" -- why "faith"? I am giving my opinion and arguments. I try to explain why I can't see XoX as an INTp and I find ENTp and INFp more likely than either ENFj or INTp. However, it's of course his decision as to which conclusion he wants to reach. If he decides to say "I am an ENFj and that is my type, that is my decision" I will say "fine, but in my opinion you don't seem to be one from what I can see" and that's it.
    I know my argument is totally biased, I made mention that the comparative approach is more reasonable to ethical types, the deductive approach more reasonable to logical types... what I was hinting at was that the deductive approach may only help him if he's actually a logical type. From my experience the deductive approach has only served to confuse me. Expat I'm not doubting your competency with the material, indeed I'd say your more competent with it then me. However, the problem is that your competency can't be immediately transferred to other people. Basically what I'm saying is that you're propogandizing the whole functional approach to a bunch of forum members that simply don't understand the functions and their practical application well enough yet to make use of what your telling them. In other words you're being too smart for your own good. I'm mentioning this because I've been at the whole socionics thing for a while, over a year. I've consorted regularly with my INTp and ENTj friend (in RL) who I've infected with the socionics disease and we 3 still are forced to use description and comparison approaches because we're still relatively incompetent at applying the deductive approach and getting anywhere. I didn't mean to insult you, in fact you should probably take it as a compliment, I did mean to insult all the impudent forum members that have been trying to be you though, lol

    and the ENFj thing goes back to a previous thread where I discussed XoX's type with him and compared him to my ENFj roomate. I know my roomate is ENFj because we've lived together for 2 years and i've compared him to myself. He uses Fe alot, he's good at manipulating and understanding emotion. In the aforementioned thread where I was discussing type with XoX I wrote alot of observations about my roomate's behaviour compared to mine and lo' and behold an ENFj on the forum actually identified with it too. By behaviour I'm talking about recognizable patterns, not simple observations like "he's nice" but in terms of the way he goes about selecting clothes, responding to emotional drama etc.
    INFp-Ni

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    I guess the forums name should be turned to "Misutii and XoX talk it out." since all other forum members opinions are not worth paying attention to.
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    [21:29] hitta: idealism is just the gap between the thought of death
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    Quote Originally Posted by snegledmaca
    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you.
    this is funny. Does this apply to you as well :wink
    especially to me! lol. I just consider it important that we be cautious with information, be willing to accept that we're many times wrong, and be willing to provide useful information that can at least teach us something even if it doesn't get us anywhere so then we can at least use what we've learned to avoid making the same mistakes in the future. I know it's a pipe dream but I try
    INFp-Ni

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clover
    I guess the forums name should be turned to "Misutii and XoX talk it out." since all other forum members opinions are not worth paying attention to.
    I resent that! *bitch slap INFp on INFp style*
    INFp-Ni

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    SEE Unknown Subtype
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    [21:29] hitta: idealism is just the gap between the thought of death
    [21:29] hitta: and not dying
    .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clover
    I guess the forums name should be turned to "Misutii and XoX talk it out." since all other forum members opinions are not worth paying attention to.
    I'm not sure how you perceive that E.g. there are like seven writers in this thread and I think they get pretty equal attention (except Expat always gets a little bit extra being the local Aristotle).

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Quote Originally Posted by Clover
    I guess the forums name should be turned to "Misutii and XoX talk it out." since all other forum members opinions are not worth paying attention to.
    I'm not sure how you perceive that E.g. there are like seven writers in this thread and I think they get pretty equal attention (except Expat always gets a little bit extra being the local Aristotle).


    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    I'd recommend not putting much faith in what other forum members tell you.

    ^
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    [21:29] hitta: idealism is just the gap between the thought of death
    [21:29] hitta: and not dying
    .

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    Some INFps are probably adverse to the term romantic because of the connotations that go along with it--illogical, impractical, not grounded in reality. These terms can cause insecurity because of the Ti Hidden Agenda and the Te poLR thus inspiring us to go off on bouts of trying to prove we are none of those things by being misguidedly stubborn when we use logic.

    You seem really opposed to being labeled INFp [and I think there is a strong case for you being one]. I get the impression that you are allowing the perception of the types to have too much influence on your self-perception. It doesn't matter what you're labeled, it doesn't change your personality. [which is why I'm always bewildered when people say "But I don't want to be this type!"]
    IEI subtype

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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Some INFps are probably adverse to the term romantic because of the connotations that go along with it--illogical, impractical, not grounded in reality. These terms can cause insecurity because of the Ti Hidden Agenda and the Te poLR thus inspiring us to go off on bouts of trying to prove we are none of those things by being misguidedly stubborn when we use logic.

    You seem really opposed to being labeled INFp [and I think there is a strong case for you being one]. I get the impression that you are allowing the perception of the types to have too much influence on your self-perception. It doesn't matter what you're labeled, it doesn't change your personality. [which is why I'm always bewildered when people say "But I don't want to be this type!"]
    I'm opposed to being labeled as INFp mostly because so far I relate to INFp descriptions badly. Secondly I really think I am not very romantic. Perhaps this is learned behavior and I have a hidden romantic somewhere inside. The problem is that even if I had some theoretical curiosity towards "romanticism" in practice I get bored to "that kind of stuff" pretty quickly. Thirdly I don't understand Te PoLR. The only thing that so far would perhaps point to that is that I have some fluctuations in my intellectual performance meaning it is hard for me to keep it consistent (e.g. at work) over a long period of time. Instead I tend to have "good days" and "bad days". But this kind of fluctuation is typical for all p-types I think. I'm not sure if it is more Ep or Ip though. Some days concentration on the boring task at hand is just a little bit harder than on some other days.

    Anyways I'm not against being any type. I'm mostly just trying to nail down my type to better understand myself and to know what to answer if a company puts me in a personality test I feel that I need to know my type e.g. to better understand whether I should keep pursuing a purely technological career or should I make a leap to more inter-personal jobs. So far I have lacked the courage to test my wings in "people jobs" so I don't know how well I would do there. Then again I'm curious about trying but I wouldn't want to make that leap without being quite sure that it is a good turn of events.

    Edit: of course the fact that I see myself as negativist is a case against INFp (as well as ENTp). But as explained elsewhere this is not a good way to use Reinin dichotomies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    he made investment decisions that were very obviously wrong - and yet he had both an accounting and economics degree, and he worked as an accountant.
    that's interesting; i wonder how there can be such a divide between knowledge and action. I assume there is at least some overlap when one has your father's background.

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    hm also i have heard of ENTjs being the romantic types. In this sense I see Ni being the common factor of being romantic. I see Ni being romantic in having an ideal, more of the literary meaning of sweeping movement, and Fe being more of a sugary romance. Im not quite sure but I do think ENFjs are the most romantic type, one that seems to become totally entranced in his or her visions. May edit this later.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus
    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    Romanticism has more to do with Fe than Ni, IMO.
    I agree with that -- at least if we talk about behaviours. But the word "romanticism" can have different meanings. Take the film Finding Neverland, for example. My guess is that the inventor of the story about Peter Pan was dominant, and as an INTp I can relate to it.

    And what can we say about Charlie Kaufman? Would you call him a "romantic" or not? Anyway, I strongly believe that he is an INTp. A film like Being John Malkovich is very typical, and it is hard to imagine it coming from any other mind that the mind of an INTp. The other day I also saw Adaptation again. And every theme is there -- every theme that is usually associated with being an INTp. It is also worth noticing that among Charlie Kaufman's favourite writers and influences are Franz Kafka, Samuel Beckett, and Stanislaw Lem -- and all three of those writers were probably INTps. I know that Rick disagrees about Beckett, but I still think that he has probably mistyped him.
    Kaufman's type? Not sure. Certainly his films seem INTx. I was thinking more of the stereotypical 19th-century romantic writers, whose style his films do not exactly exemplify.

    @Msk: I'm not sure. My experience with ENTjs is fairly limited. Maybe they are more idealistic than romantic. (I wonder what our local ENTjs think about this.) I have not met any "romantic" INTps, tho.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    I was thinking more of the stereotypical 19th-century romantic writers, whose style his films do not exactly exemplify.
    Yes, I thought you did. And INTps are not romantics in any normal sense of the word. I have some trouble finding examples that would illustrate what I have in mind in a way that you would understand. I could explain it with reference to famous chess players, for example, but most people are not familiar with them.

    1. Bobby Fischer is a typical example of an analytic approach. His playing style is systematic, analytic, and not at all romantic.

    2. Aron Nimzowitsch is an example of a synthetic approach. He formulated universal laws of chess in his "System" (which was not really a system), but he was not a good example of an analytic. Compared with Fischer, Nimzowitsch was in a sense a romantic.

    Kaufman can be said to be a romantic in a sense if we compare him with more realistic writers, becuase a film like Being John Malkovich is so disconnected from any realistic frame of reference. It is more l'art pour l'art, whereas LII writers often have a political message in their works. (This is not very clear, I know. Maybe I can come up with better examples later.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus
    Kaufman can be said to be a romantic in a sense if we compare him with more realistic writers, becuase a film like Being John Malkovich is so disconnected from any realistic frame of reference.
    /

    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus
    It is more l'art pour l'art, whereas LII writers often have a political message in their works.
    Maybe. I identify strongly with Aestheticism, and I think my poetry reflects this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    he made investment decisions that were very obviously wrong - and yet he had both an accounting and economics degree, and he worked as an accountant.
    that's interesting; i wonder how there can be such a divide between knowledge and action. I assume there is at least some overlap when one has your father's background.
    He was very good in the detailed work of finance and accounting: looking into the small clauses of loan conditions of several banks, and balancing out the arrangements with each of them according to the best overall result; and keeping accurate track of the whole mess.

    In economics, he learned the basic theory - as in Keynes graphs etc - but he did not really focus on making the connection to how that worked, or not, in real life. His attempt at using Ni to make investment decisions essentially, simplistically, amounted to assuming that most present trends would just continue as they were.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    hm also i have heard of ENTjs being the romantic types. In this sense I see Ni being the common factor of being romantic. I see Ni being romantic in having an ideal, more of the literary meaning of sweeping movement, and Fe being more of a sugary romance. Im not quite sure but I do think ENFjs are the most romantic type, one that seems to become totally entranced in his or her visions. May edit this later.
    If ENTjs are "romantic", it's mainly in the sense of devotion in a relationship.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    You seem really opposed to being labeled INFp [and I think there is a strong case for you being one]. I get the impression that you are allowing the perception of the types to have too much influence on your self-perception. It doesn't matter what you're labeled, it doesn't change your personality. [which is why I'm always bewildered when people say "But I don't want to be this type!"]
    Indeed.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    His attempt at using Ni to make investment decisions essentially, simplistically, amounted to assuming that most present trends would just continue as they were.
    OMG, it's the same with my ESE mother! Her Ni essentially boils down to that line of thinking. When I was deciding to go to college she gave advice based on impressions of trends 30 years ago, when she was going to college, and what other people told her. She was completely unable to determine for herself the likelihood of development of a given carrier path and I know this because I constantly brought this aspect to her attention. Her main arguments and points of reference was a line of thinking that relied upon current trends not changing tomorrow. When asked for a justification for me potentially taking her suggestion she would basically say it has always been like this, even when I was young and I constantly said that that means nothing and that she has to use foresight to predict future trends. She's like one of those people who think that if a coin fell 17 times as heads up there is more chance of it falling heads down the next time. She relies on retrospect and not foresight. And funnily enough she's an accountant as well. In fact the three SEI-s I know are all in economics (Not because they want to but because here when you're to lazy and don't know what to do with yourself you go into economics. It's like a safety net for the unmotivated and disinterested. I think this may also explain why our economy is in the state it is, that is, a very, very bad state)

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    XoX's Avatar
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    So what could be considered as "romantic activity"? What kind of concrete things romantic people like to do?

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    So what could be considered as "romantic activity"? What kind of concrete things romantic people like to do?
    Think of Lord Byron and King Ludwig II of Bavaria.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    So what could be considered as "romantic activity"? What kind of concrete things romantic people like to do?
    Think of Lord Byron and King Ludwig II of Bavaria.
    It that some famous gay couple from the middle ages? I've never heard of them. For some reason I connect Bavaria to secret societies and illuminati. Other than that...I need more examples

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    That conveys a romantic image:

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    So what could be considered as "romantic activity"? What kind of concrete things romantic people like to do?
    dream about doing something romantic, lol, also make an occasion seem to be more than it really is in reality, by decorating, candles etc. romanticism is really just an exaggeration of reality. think along the lines of symbolism, i.e. corny example but easiest to make the point: a flower isn't just a flower, when given to someone else it symbolizes love/affection etc. so like consider the next two sentences.

    a) the man picked a plant out of the neighbour's yard and gave it to a woman (realistic interpretation)

    b) the man offered his beloved the most beautiful red rose he could find, he offered it to his beloved as a means of portraying his passionate affection towards her (romantic interpretation)

    do you see how the sentences can mean the same thing? but how the second sentence exaggerates the event into something meaning more?

    anyways that would be a modern interpretation, if you go back in time to its historical roots in the enlightenment you would find that authors like Goethe and Rousseau represent the "romantic" movement where as authors like Locke and Hume represent the comparably sober "reason" movement.....

    Like that pic posted by expat, or the famous Napoleon on the horse painting which makes napoleon seem "larger than life", seem like a grand general. The "unromantic" version would show napoleon for what he really was, very short, not overly good looking, probably looking awkward on the horse...... does it make sense now?
    INFp-Ni

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    To make it worse, Napoleon was actually riding a donkey on that occasion.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    To make it worse, Napoleon was actually riding a donkey on that occasion.
    Better that way than the other way around.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    That conveys a romantic image:

    There is something in that view. I wouldn't care about looking that view in a painting but if I actually was there in the mountains I might spend there some time. Eventually I do get bored about that kind of stuff though. E.g. I wouldn't care to live there or watch that view every day. It is more like a temporary thing that comes and goes. But ok, I'm not totally immune to that kind of stuff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    So what could be considered as "romantic activity"? What kind of concrete things romantic people like to do?
    dream about doing something romantic, lol,
    I have to admit that I don't dream much

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    also make an occasion seem to be more than it really is in reality, by decorating, candles etc. romanticism is really just an exaggeration of reality.
    I don't care about decorating or candles (but my wife is crazy about that stuss, apparently she is a romantic then). How about watching fantasy movies? Is that related to being romantic? Like Lord of the Rings? I like the imaginary world and all the weird creatures and I even liked to landscapes in the movie. Can romanticism manifest in the like of these kind of things?

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    think along the lines of symbolism, i.e. corny example but easiest to make the point: a flower isn't just a flower, when given to someone else it symbolizes love/affection etc. so like consider the next two sentences.

    a) the man picked a plant out of the neighbour's yard and gave it to a woman (realistic interpretation)

    b) the man offered his beloved the most beautiful red rose he could find, he offered it to his beloved as a means of portraying his passionate affection towards her (romantic interpretation)

    do you see how the sentences can mean the same thing? but how the second sentence exaggerates the event into something meaning more?
    I think this is a good one. I'm clearly more like option a) in real life but I have the capability to write something like b) if I want to. I won't act it out in real life though. If I would write poems and such I would be able to imagine that kind of things and write about them. So there is something related to romanticism in me. In real life behavior I'm very unromantic though.

    Quote Originally Posted by misutii
    does it make sense now?
    I think it does I'm not really romantic in every day life nor do I need it on consistent basis but I can find a hidden romantic inside me on rare occasions. Perhaps in right company I could become more romantic in behavior too but I doubt I can ever really be described as a "romantic".

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    le petit prince raisonpure's Avatar
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    The pictures below have a strong appeal to my sense of heroism. Do they make your blood boil, and do you feel destined to seek out similar scenarios in your life and triumph over them?


    “I think, therefore I'll think" - Ayn Rand (ESTp, UR GUARDIAN ANGEL)

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    Quote Originally Posted by raisonpure
    The pictures below have a strong appeal to my sense of heroism. Do they make your blood boil, and do you feel destined to seek out similar scenarios in your life and triumph over them?


    The "heroes" in those pics (especially in the above picture, not so much in the below picture) are very appealing to me. However I dislike how they are pictured trampling and humiliating the others. I think they could be portrayed a bit differently.

    How do you feel about e.g. this kind of lyrics. This is from Manowar and many people consider it a bit lame (which I guess it is, lol) but then it carries a "mood of heroism" which somehow affects me and makes me imagine me being there. Without knowing the "epic mood"of the song the lyrics might seem less impressive than they really are

    Manowar - The Crown And The Ring (Lament Of The Kings) Lyrics

    [Joey DeMaio]

    From a battle I've come
    To a battle I ride
    Blazing up to the sky
    Chains of fate
    Hold a fiery stride
    I'll see you again when I die

    High and mighty alone we are kings
    Whirlwinds of fire we ride
    Providence brought us the crown and the ring
    Covered with blood and our pride

    Heroes await me
    My enemies ride fast
    Knowing not this ride's their last
    Saddle my horse as I drink my last ale
    Bow string and steel will prevail

    High and mighty alone we are kings
    Whirlwinds of fire we ride
    Providence brought us the crown and the ring
    Covered with blood and our pride

    Odin I await thee
    Your true son am I
    I hail you now as I die
    I pledge you my sword and to no man I kneel
    Ours is the Kingdom Of Steel

    High and mighty alone we are kings
    Whirlwinds of fire we ride
    Providence brought us the crown and the ring
    Covered with blood and our pride

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