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Thread: Se development and being smacked in the face

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    Default Se development and being smacked in the face

    I think that with Se development come the ability to withstand facial and sensory disturbances and disorientation without feeling loss of control. I think Bono had a music video with that same message in it, and hes an ENFp with Se as role function.
    -Slava


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    Default Re: Se development and being smacked in the face

    Quote Originally Posted by Slava2
    I think that with Se development come the ability to withstand facial and sensory disturbances and disorientation without feeling loss of control. I think Bono had a music video with that same message in it, and hes an ENFp with Se as role function.
    Imho Bono seems more like ENFj. With Se hidden agenda. Anyways to be able to better withstand being smacked in the face you must let people smack you in the face. I'm not sure if that develops your Se but it develops your ability to absorb smacks.

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    you do not become when i slap you in the face while we're having sex slava

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    Quote Originally Posted by science as magic
    you do not become when i slap you in the face while we're having sex slava
    What I'm saying is, doesn't the ability to tolerate slapping and facial/sensory obstructions indicate a certain level of Se. As for sex, I would imagine an N person taking S gratification from an S person by dominating them in their field of expertise via slaps and what not.
    -Slava


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    Quote Originally Posted by Slava2
    Quote Originally Posted by science as magic
    you do not become when i slap you in the face while we're having sex slava
    What I'm saying is, doesn't the ability to tolerate slapping and facial/sensory obstructions indicate a certain level of Se. As for sex, I would imagine an N person taking S gratification from an S person by dominating them in their field of expertise via slaps and what not.
    It might be more about the ability to put Si offline. Se-types are good in this but there might be other types who can do it too e.g ENTjs? I'm not sure about how Si PoLR works here.

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    I personally feel that one should never hit another on the face. I just think it's extremely disrespectful. It seems more like an attack on them as a person (as opposed to a disciplinary measure or, in a fight, a way of incapacitating an opponent).
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slava2
    Quote Originally Posted by science as magic
    you do not become when i slap you in the face while we're having sex slava
    What I'm saying is, doesn't the ability to tolerate slapping and facial/sensory obstructions indicate a certain level of Se. As for sex, I would imagine an N person taking S gratification from an S person by dominating them in their field of expertise via slaps and what not.
    When I'm focused it doesn't matter what is coming towards me.*


    Try this -- threaten an INTj (or bring a severe threat into his personal territory), and see if slapping him in the face 'inhibits him' in anyway. He will fight to the death. And if he doesn't he isn't LII. *


    Anyway, Se development may have something to do with getting used to 'harsh physical conditions', but not very much. Consider that to be also an Si issue.
    How to really develop Se is by sticking to a routine, and believing one and living it. Look at ISTjs. That is difficult for an LII because possibile ideas can spring up from anywhere, and determining what is more important can be difficult... (so consider scheduling free time to think, so it won't get in the way of other things, for example).

    Se polr in LIIs, however, can be a general disinterest in certain things, like martial arts. Sometimes, if sparing, say, it might seem very unimportant to an LII... but if he 'thinks about it in the right way', especially more philosophically, that might help.


    * - when I play sports, especially younger, I was notoriously competitive, especially as I often played on the weaker team. You know how young kids and bullies are. I particularly didn't care what people did, and I never backed down from anything. I never got into a fight, but I diffused two, without being a pussy either. as a reality destroying weapon... ah, the early days.....

    The point is, I am extremely competitive. That is why I do not enjoy playing games, competitively, especially among people in my family. As I mentioned in another thread -- I cannot relax that way, as some beta people can.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP III
    consider that to be also an Si issue.
    aka ENTp dual seeking
    aka ENTps most sensitive function in regard to the influence of others.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    I don't really think Se has anything to slaps, punches, martial arts, getting beaten up, beating people up, sticking to a routine, over-scheduling so that you can't have creative ideas, or any of that. It's just all misconceptions. It's completely unrelated. Put everything in this thread into the misconceptions column.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    I don't really think Se has anything to slaps, punches, martial arts, getting beaten up, beating people up, sticking to a routine, over-scheduling so that you can't have creative ideas, or any of that. It's just all misconceptions. It's completely unrelated. Put everything in this thread into the misconceptions column.
    Well, what is Se then? I honestly can't think of any other way it's been characterized.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush

    Well, what is Se then? I honestly can't think of any other way it's been characterized.
    Expansiveness. Action. Authority. Management. Domination. There is a physical element to it. Most Se types are larger than the rest of the population. But those that don't use physical authority are oftentimes the best at using mental force to get their way.

    here are a couple descriptions that i think really aid understanding:
    Courtesy Rick from socionics.us
    Se:
    "perceives physical traits directly, without an implied reference to the individual (size, shape, color, strength, rigidity), "
    "describes the handling of objects as an external physical act (throw, grab, stick, push, remove, fit, hit)"
    "describes desires as the need to consume an external object ("I really need," "I want," "come on," "I want you to"), "


    socionika.net:

    "Extraverted sensing is also called Volitional Sensing, or Space-capturing Sensing.

    This sensing function directs to occupation of space. People with this strong function are usually demanding people, which like when other people fulfill their wishes and demands. Sometimes they become managers, and sometimes – good sellers that can sell even unnecessary things. They often (but not always) have athletic, somewhat roundish figure, quick and demanding eyes. They are very persistent in the life: "If I want, then it should be achieved”, and they often gladly help other people – those who accept their leadership. Their outbursts of anger may fear some people, but in fact they are short-term – in several minutes they become calm again and restore their good mood. "


    I like this last description. Haven't you met people like this before, or at least seem them in movies? Think of them and their behaviour and you will understand Se.
    asd

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    Look around for this kind of people:


    First check that it is not UDP. Then check that their eyes are focused (to rule out an angry ENTp). If it is not UDP or some ENTp then it must be

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    I don't really think Se has anything to slaps, punches, martial arts, getting beaten up, beating people up, sticking to a routine, over-scheduling so that you can't have creative ideas, or any of that. It's just all misconceptions. It's completely unrelated. Put everything in this thread into the misconceptions column.
    It's definitely not completely unrelated to physical fights. It is unrelated to routine and over-scheduling.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    I personally feel that one should never hit another on the face. I just think it's extremely disrespectful. It seems more like an attack on them as a person (as opposed to a disciplinary measure or, in a fight, a way of incapacitating an opponent).
    in the 40's a good slap in the face was a woman's only method of rebuke....a la katherine hepburn and spencer tracy. too bad it's gone by the wayside, a lot of men could use a slap in the face these days.....

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    I don't really think Se has anything to slaps, punches, martial arts, getting beaten up, beating people up, sticking to a routine, over-scheduling so that you can't have creative ideas, or any of that. It's just all misconceptions. It's completely unrelated. Put everything in this thread into the misconceptions column.
    It's definitely not completely unrelated to physical fights. It is unrelated to routine and over-scheduling.
    Well, Rick has typed Sylvester Stallone and in particular his "Rocky" character, as well as Britney Spears, as SEE. I think he's right in both cases.

    In the case, of Rocky, obviously physical fights are involved. But in the Spears type of SEE, Se is expressed more as tendency to want to constantly be on stage and to get people's attention.

    As with any function, Se can be expressed in different ways. Non-Se types may be physically aggressive; Se types aren't necessarily. Also, some Se descriptions sound like the "Type A personality" which LSEs and other Ej types may have.

    Furthermore, Cre-Se in ESI types is hardly ever related to either physical aggression or Type A personality; ESI types, especially Fi subtypes, are often very gentle, are great with children, and are about as far from the Type A, aggressive boxer personality as you could get.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    Furthermore, Cre-Se in ESI types is hardly ever related to either physical aggression or Type A personality; ESI types, especially Fi subtypes, are often very gentle, are great with children, and are about as far from the Type A, aggressive boxer personality as you could get.
    until you piss them off...

    One good characterization of people with strong Se is that they are _demanding_. They have no problems demanding things from other people and they won't easily back down on these demands. It doesn't have to have anything to do with being aggressive but they perhaps can more easily resort to physical aggression than some other types (if their demands are not listened to and respected). I agree that e.g. ISFjs can in a normal mode give even somewhat submissive vibe and ESFps seem to have a tendency to want to please people they like and thus you might not think they are aggressors on many occasions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    Furthermore, Cre-Se in ESI types is hardly ever related to either physical aggression or Type A personality; ESI types, especially Fi subtypes, are often very gentle, are great with children, and are about as far from the Type A, aggressive boxer personality as you could get.
    until you piss them off...

    One good characterization of people with strong Se is that they are _demanding_. They have no problems demanding things from other people and they won't easily back down on these demands. It doesn't have to have anything to do with being aggressive but they perhaps can more easily resort to physical aggression than some other types (if their demands are not listened to and respected). I agree that e.g. ISFjs can in a normal mode give even somewhat submissive vibe and ESFps seem to have a tendency to want to please people they like and thus you might not think they are aggressors on many occasions.
    Good points. Now we're getting closer to reality, finally. I agree, ESI types are demanding in the sense that they want you to do what they want you to do. You can convince them with that you should be doing something different, and they'll accept that. But if you were take the attitude of "I'm just not going to do what you say because it's not important to me, and besides which I have better things to do...and don't tell me what to do" (or if you were to just blow them off without comment), then you'd tick them off big time! In fact, that sort of behavior, in addition to not thinking about how one's actions affect other people, would be the precise definition of how to stimulate the ire of an ESI. However, in my experience, they may not be so likely to confront authority figures.

    Now, here's another expression of Se values that people may not think of: hiking, especially extreme hiking.

    Most people probably think of hiking as an Si activity. However, it's interesting that some LIE descriptions mention that LIEs often enjoy hiking. I know someone who I think is an LIE, and his idea of fun is to pick the most difficult trail available, and then run up it as fast as possible. I also know an IEI who likes to do this, and I like to do it to an extent, somewhat more in moderation (I take pictures along the way, and avoid anything that's too crazy) but with the same basic motivation to tackle the "real" challenges instead of just going up an "easy" trail.

    I wonder if other people here like to do that...

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    [quote][quote="Jonathan"]
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    Furthermore, Cre-Se in ESI types is hardly ever related to either physical aggression or Type A personality; ESI types, especially Fi subtypes, are often very gentle, are great with children, and are about as far from the Type A, aggressive boxer personality as you could get.
    until you piss them off...

    One good characterization of people with strong Se is that they are _demanding_. They have no problems demanding things from other people and they won't easily back down on these demands. It doesn't have to have anything to do with being aggressive but they perhaps can more easily resort to physical aggression than some other types (if their demands are not listened to and respected). I agree that e.g. ISFjs can in a normal mode give even somewhat submissive vibe and ESFps seem to have a tendency to want to please people they like and thus you might not think they are aggressors on many occasions.
    Good points. Now we're getting closer to reality, finally. I agree, ESI types are demanding in the sense that they want you to do what they want you to do. You can convince them with that you should be doing something different, and they'll accept that. But if you were take the attitude of "I'm just not going to do what you say because it's not important to me, and besides which I have better things to do...and don't tell me what to do" (or if you were to just blow them off without comment), then you'd tick them off big time! In fact, that sort of behavior, in addition to not thinking about how one's actions affect other people, would be the precise definition of how to stimulate the ire of an ESI. However, in my experience, they may not be so likely to confront authority figures.
    That's exactly my behaviour big time. Not only that - I purposefully add "I am not going to do it because you told me so - if you didn't tell me so, I would have done it!". Although I tend to think how my behaviour affects people, that balances the relation a bit.

    Now, here's another expression of Se values that people may not think of: hiking, especially extreme hiking.

    Most people probably think of hiking as an Si activity. However, it's interesting that some LIE descriptions mention that LIEs often enjoy hiking. I know someone who I think is an LIE, and his idea of fun is to pick the most difficult trail available, and then run up it as fast as possible. I also know an IEI who likes to do this, and I like to do it to an extent, somewhat more in moderation (I take pictures along the way, and avoid anything that's too crazy) but with the same basic motivation to tackle the "real" challenges instead of just going up an "easy" trail.

    I wonder if other people here like to do that...
    Yeah, when I cycle, I like to pick the most difficult climb at the first time I go out during the late winter-early spring
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by diamond8
    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    I personally feel that one should never hit another on the face. I just think it's extremely disrespectful. It seems more like an attack on them as a person (as opposed to a disciplinary measure or, in a fight, a way of incapacitating an opponent).
    in the 40's a good slap in the face was a woman's only method of rebuke....a la katherine hepburn and spencer tracy. too bad it's gone by the wayside, a lot of men could use a slap in the face these days.....
    Since I am fairly pain-tolerant, I once made the mistake of letting a girl slap me in the face. Not such a big deal. But then at the last second she back-handed me!

    Never doing that again...

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