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Thread: Experiences with Conflicting Relations

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    Default Experiences with Conflicting Relations

    I was chatting with my INTp friend online yesterday and we came to the topic about her ESTp boyfriend. Both of us noticed that he seemed to be quite defensive and avoidant of me whenever a group of us went out together. He had been feeling this way since we first met and I haven't even talked to him before. It surprised me that a conflicting relation was evident even before any real conversation was involved.

    Anyway, I'm curious to know what an ESTp thinks of an INFj in general based on first impression and subsequent interactions, and how the conflicting relation is manifested overtime. I will talk about mine later.

    To everyone else, feel free to talk about your experience with your conflictor. Need not be restricted to negative experiences.

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    I knew one in highschool. She was always attracted to me, and still is.
    There is some mutual attraction, but I know we could never function in relationship, for reasons I described in my most recent thread in this section.

    She's just not my type (of person).
    That's the best way to put it.

    She's sexy and has good use of her eyes, and in terms of general things we can discuss matters well.
    Our conversations usually turn into some sort of flirting. She is pretty open to that kind of discussion in general, but of course more so with people she knows.

    In general she is a very considerate person and cares about relationships
    One of the few people from HS I keep in touch with.

    Very good at spell checking my papers.
    Very Se conscious, but, not actually terribly pushy about it. Is more interested in relationships than pure power, or that is how I see her at least.
    More sincere than some other people in terms of actual relationship ( ), but in her own irrational, Se dominant sort of way.


    I consider her a friend, and she considers me a friend.
    We are definitely from different worlds, but we can get along, it seems.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    I recently found out that one of my coworkers, whose type I was previously unsure of, is actually an ESFj. We can generally get along fine, since I've learned to be quite tolerant of Fe provided it's not directed at me in a negative way, although the way he often complains or overreacts to things can get on my nerves. Generally though we don't have any conflict, since I think we already vaguely knew how to avoid annoying eachother...if that makes any sense at all. Basically we make an effort not to pressure eachother's weak points, therefore we rarely hurt eachother.
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    I don't really have trouble interacting with the only INFj I know. Actually, I believe we're kind of attracted to each other.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    yes i think that conflictors can get along but it's been difficult for me to have more intimate relations with them. It has happened where I don't know someone and I just feel really neurotic around them. I think this happens when I encounter an ESxp. I work with an ISxj pretty sure Se sub and I forcefully keep her at an emotional distance, almost as an automatic reaction. I think it has more to do with polr subtype than the relation in my case. (im INTj)

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    I was friends with a very unhealthy ESFp for a long time (~4 years). I knew him through a mutual acquaintance, whose type I am quite confused about (although probably INTp). We had common interests, video games, but he was always the one initiating contact. We have since realized that we have a conflicting relationship, and have moved apart as much as possible (although daily contact is unavoidable). At times his sense of humor is still appealing, though.

    I live with an ESFp atm, and we once got into a really bad argument. Aside from that, on a regular basis he's just annoying. When I walk past him in the hall, we always find it awkward to let the other pass by--as if we're afraid of offending the other.

    I had an ESFp teacher for a while, and it wasn't that bad. He was certainly competent, and he made the class fun. Excellent taste in music.

    I cannot stress this enough: distance is the solution! Also, having a dual around to support you helps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    I was friends with a very unhealthy ESFp for a long time (~4 years). I knew him through a mutual acquaintance, whose type I am quite confused about (although probably INTp). We had common interests, video games, but he was always the one initiating contact. We have since realized that we have a conflicting relationship, and have moved apart as much as possible (although daily contact is unavoidable). At times his sense of humor is still appealing, though.

    I live with an ESFp atm, and we once got into a really bad argument. Aside from that, on a regular basis he's just annoying. When I walk past him in the hall, we always find it awkward to let the other pass by--as if we're afraid of offending the other.

    I had an ESFp teacher for a while, and it wasn't that bad. He was certainly competent, and he made the class fun. Excellent taste in music.

    I cannot stress this enough: distance is the solution! Also, having a dual around to support you helps.
    ? So what was the conflict exactly. I mean, what didn't you like about him, something like that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mea
    ? So what was the conflict exactly. I mean, what didn't you like about him, something like that.
    My friend? Uh, he's obsessed with his image. That's mostly it. His whole mission the past few years has been to become popular. (He's not very competent at it though. He has some...problems.) Our basic philosophies are opposing. He makes fun of Fe-type stuff that I enjoy. His hidden agenda is unbearable; he believes he can objectively justify his taste in music to me (?!), which is ridiculous.

    Why so curious? Gathering Fi data, I suppose?

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    my conflict relations have worked the same time over and over.

    in the beginning there is some mutual attraction and interest.

    But later on, then the conflict begins. sometimes you really hate eachother but keep it to yourself.

    The best defense that i use today, is to keep a certain distance. Only talk with respect to eachother instead of getting to know eachother well.

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    Default Conflict relations experiences

    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.

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    oh! i noticed that i have reduced my silent eye roll count when talking to ESFp. !

    /end daily conflictor progress blog

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    Default a harmless example of conflict

    this i think is an interesting, though completely inconsequential tidbit about intertype relations in socionics:


    my school today handed out forms for yearbook quotes to all seniors, by which we can fill out these forms and a quote will magically appear in the yearbook at the end of the year (ftr, i didnt get my picture taken because i forgot about it and i was lazy and i couldnt care less. lol.)

    anyway, the following text appeared on my form:
    "God is a potato"

    --Scott Adams, God's Debris
    look familiar?



    either somebody saw me writing that quote or i showed it to them, and, being something new, mysterious, and unusual, it was inevitably rapidly exchanged throughout the people that happened to be sitting in the general vicinity. when this guy who i think is ESE saw it (though i don't know him well at all), he didn't appear to like it. he initially thought that i wasn't serious about submitting that quote to the yearbook. when i affirmed otherwise, he expressed his disapproval, saying that he felt the quote excessively flaky and nonserious.

    i grilled him about why he disapproved of the comment. it was interesting; i didn't pressure him very hard, but you could certainly see that he had a very difficult time reconciling why anyone would associate themselves with such random and unusual methods of expression. he clearly had a much more orderly and organizational way of looking at things.


    i guess this is kind of mundane. it was more interesting in person.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder
    You remind me very much of my ILI friend from high school, I also remember him getting into that sort of situation with classmates many times. His refuge was Indonesian class, where the teacher thought his antics were completely hilarious and tended to encourage them in some unspoken way (or at the very least just overlook them).
    indonesian class in high school?

    wow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder
    You guys don't learn foreign languages in high school?
    we do, but nothing quite as exotic as indonesian. i don't really understand why the curriculum is so eurocentric, but thats the way it is.

    i think we have a choice of spanish, french, italian, latin, german, chinese, japanese (these are because my school is 60% asian though), and hebrew. there are also electives in greek, korean, and arabic. i think. (i took spanish because i had already taken spanish in middle school, where we had a choice of spanish or spanish).

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    now that i think about it, you're in australia. duhhh.

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    haha classic example of ESFj-INTp interaction. I remember going over my INTp friend's house and his ESFj mom giving him shit for not offering me food or drink and he was like if she wants it she'll ask. The whole thing just escalated from their with the ESFj going on about manners and the INTp being like who cares???

    yeah thats awesome with the languages.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder
    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    haha classic example of ESFj-INTp interaction. I remember going over my INTp friend's house and his ESFj mom giving him shit for not offering me food or drink and he was like if she wants it she'll ask. The whole thing just escalated from their with the ESFj going on about manners and the INTp being like who cares???
    My ISFp mum does this to me all the time as well.
    haha sooooo annoying! my INTj dad does it to me too... like who cares?? if you understood what I was trying to say why does it matter than all my t's are crossed and i's dotted and commas and parentheses put in to my sentence... geesh
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder
    Gamma must be a recessive trait or something. What is it with the Alpha parents?
    haha i no rite! maybe God is alpha and does it to mock our existences
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    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    haha classic example of ESFj-INTp interaction. I remember going over my INTp friend's house and his ESFj mom giving him shit for not offering me food or drink and he was like if she wants it she'll ask. The whole thing just escalated from their with the ESFj going on about manners and the INTp being like who cares???

    yeah thats awesome with the languages.
    Typical behavior of my ESFj mom.

    I've learnt to simply ignore her and shoo her away.
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    it drives me nuts when my ESE grandmother (remember her?) tries to offer me stuff like that.

    about half the time:

    "do you want X?"
    "no"
    "do you want Y then?"
    "no"
    "do you want Z?"
    "would you shut the fuck up and leave me alone?"
    "(some comment about how rude and abrasive i'm being)"

    the other half the time she simply gives me something without my asking:

    "what the fuck is this? why are you giving me this? i'm not hungry. take it away."
    "(see comment about rude and abrasive)"

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    it drives me nuts when my ESE grandmother (remember her?) tries to offer me stuff like that.

    about half the time:

    "do you want X?"
    "no"
    "do you want Y then?"
    "no"
    "do you want Z?"
    "would you shut the fuck up and leave me alone?"
    "(some comment about how rude and abrasive i'm being)"

    the other half the time she simply gives me something without my asking:

    "what the fuck is this? why are you giving me this? i'm not hungry. take it away."
    "(see comment about rude and abrasive)"
    hahaha ohhh how i love my dual and how they curse off their grandmas
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    it drives me nuts when my ESE grandmother (remember her?) tries to offer me stuff like that.

    about half the time:

    "do you want X?"
    "no"
    "do you want Y then?"
    "no"
    "do you want Z?"
    "would you shut the fuck up and leave me alone?"
    "(some comment about how rude and abrasive i'm being)"

    the other half the time she simply gives me something without my asking:

    "what the fuck is this? why are you giving me this? i'm not hungry. take it away."
    "(see comment about rude and abrasive)"

    i really, really cannot stand this conversation. i don't understand why "no" isn't a good answer the first time. if you're that hungry you'll surely say so, right? this has boggled my mind for ages. i used to just yell, "NO!!!!! STOP IT!!!!!!!!!"



    anyhow, liveandletlive -- i don't know why, but it seems like for nearly every gamma i know they have at least one alpha relative whether it be mother/brother/whatever.

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    Though it's not limited to ESEs. I know a person whose type is EII who does all of the above.

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    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Though it's not limited to ESEs. I know a person whose type is EII who does all of the above.
    yeahhhh but there's a certain way that ESEs go about it that makes it that much more irritating.
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    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Though it's not limited to ESEs. I know a person whose type is EII who does all of the above.
    yeah, i have met EIIs like this, too. it's not limited to ESEs, you are correct. it's too much, regardless of type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    it's too much, regardless of type.
    Definitely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Though it's not limited to ESEs. I know a person whose type is EII who does all of the above.
    yeahhhh but there's a certain way that ESEs go about it that makes it that much more irritating.
    Yeah: intertype relations. ESEs are very bad at intertype relations.

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    for the record, i hate this too. Buuuuuuut i love it too haaa <-- exaggeration

    One time I remember I almost cried because it was just going on for too many years and I'm like. Look. Don't you value or hear anything I say? Are the words indicative of my autonomy worth nothing? But then it's like, well I can't expect them (Si + Fe) to care for me just whenever I feel like it. It's just like they are like that all the time so if you want it sometime you're gonna have to deal with it all the time.

    Also.. I'm not saying that only Si + Fe does makes me feel like they aren't listening to what I say either. I feel like Te people do that too.

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    Default Interactions with conflicting types

    Hello, everyone. I was wondering if anybody has had any experience with dealing with their conflicting types? I think one of my roommates of a little over a year and I are conflicting relations (he exudes ESTP like it was going out of style). We've certainly never been close by any means, but we've seemed to have come to some sort of terms. It wasn't always like that of course. At first, it was something I really found intolerable. The two of us just came at things from such different angles that we constantly misunderstood each other. He never gives an inch on anything and always has to have the upper hand. It's always everyone else around him that has to adjust to his way of doing things. I don't think I've ever quite met someone as self-confident as he is, but he also seems trapped in a perspective that there is one right way and one reality (which he is an authority on).

    Now, this isn't a rant on all the things that are 'wrong' with ESTp's in general or my roommate in particular. He has a good deal of fine qualities to go along with the rest. For example, he is a highly intelligent guy who focuses on the task at hand. He could be a professional sports analyst, referee, or even a professional poker player if he continues to improve. It's just that the only way we seem to be able to co-exist is if I tacitly adopt or play to his interests (watching every single sporting event known to man) while the things I adhere to (discussing philosophy, the meaning of life, psychology, other peoples and cultures, what people think or feel) are simply pointless and, although he's never explicitly said so, I get the feeling he considers them signs of being weak. In fact, the relationship seems to get on better the less we delve into each other (although I still try to understand him privately). That isn't saying that I feel like I couldn't learn anything from him. In many ways, I think he has much to offer. On rare occasions, it seems like the same might strike him. Still, in the beginning things were very rough and I have to say that he's the only person I've ever actually thought I might get into a physical confrontation with. So, we've kind of settled into a polite distance, able to hang out and crack a few jokes with each other, provided that our socialization is limited to a few words a day and maybe a few hours once or twice a week (when the three of us get together to grill out and watch *sports*, of course). I wouldn't say the relationship is positive. I don't think either of us really gets much from the other, but I would say that we've ironed out most of the truly negative aspects that there used to be, but only because I was willing to meet him about 80% of the way (after I did that for a while, he slowly began to come the other 20%). Though maybe I'm being unfair. I know I'm a hard person to get to know, much less understand.

    What about the rest of you? Do you have any similar or dissimilar stories?
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    I wrote about a brief relationship I had with a conflictor (ISTj) here (pages 1 and 2): http://the16types.info/forums/viewto...=165945#165945

    here's a copy of the parts dealing with my experience:
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    i, very briefly, dated an istj.

    all in all, he was actually a pretty good guy, just not the guy for me.
    he didn't appreciate too much my spontaneous nature and actions, and he hated my driving Other than that though, he seemed to be willing to be patient until I "grew up".

    He would have been willing to be a caring father to my daughter. Unfortunately, that seemed to include overriding my rules when it came to her. His actions would have completely spoiled her and made her demanding and ungrateful. However, those same actions with a different child may have worked wonders.

    We had one disagreement. I had to tuck my daughter into bed before we could work on resolving that disagreement. During that 5 minutes time, he made some kind of decision and left without a word, and I never heard from him again.
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    We had one disagreement. I had to tuck my daughter into bed before we could work on resolving that disagreement. During that 5 minutes time, he made some kind of decision and left without a word, and I never heard from him again.
    Holy shit!
    yeah, that did a number on me
    at least until I realized that if that was how he handled arguments, then his leaving was in both of our interests
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    I doubt a disagreement would make a person just walk out like that. My guess is that he just couldn't take it anymore, what ever it was, realized that there is nothing he can do about it other then to free himself from whatever it was.
    the disagreement involved one of the rules I had for my daughter.
    we lived in an area where things got stolen very easily...one blink and whoop there it went...okok, one blink with the back turned. So one of my rules was that before my daughter could play in the playground area, we had to first put her tricycle away (we lived right next to the park...and I mean right next to it). Once in a while she'd fight the rule, wanting what she wanted then and there instead of waiting a couple of minutes to put the tricycle away, but all in all, she was accepting the rule.

    One day, the ISTj and I had been walking around the park following my daughter as she rode her tricycle. Then she decided she wanted to play in the playground area. So we started walking towards the apt so she could put the tricycle away. We had to walk somewhat past the playground to get to the apt. My daughter didn't start fussing until the ISTj asked weren't we going to the playground. I told him that we had to put her tricycle away. He said he'd take her to the playground and I could put it away. I said no, that I was trying to teach her to put her own toys away. Then he complained that she was too young to learn that (she was about 3yo). I told him that she'd been doing good about it so far. By this time, manta had either caught on to the possibility that she could get out of putting her trike away...or had somehow caught some thought that we wouldn't be going to the playground, and she threw one of her major hissy fits (aka screaming fits). So, now I'm stuck trying to calm her down, get the tricycle home, AND listen to him throwing things out of proportion (as if I was demanding she carry the trike upstairs herself!). ... Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground. I was livid at that. But, I took the bike home and then went to the playground to play with my daughter. After she was done, we went to the apt, I told him I'd be right back, that I had to tuck her in, he stayed about halfway through my tucking her into bed, and then left just before I came back to the livingroom.


    He didn't like my driving, so we had him drive my car.
    He didn't care so much for my spontaneity, so I tried to tone it down and do a little more planning.
    If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.
    Sounds to me he was defying you and you him. A pretty big clue that something is very wrong.
    how does my letting him drive my car and my trying to tone down my spontaneity suggest defiance?

    how does not being aware that there is something wrong = a big clue that there is something wrong?
    I don't think anyone was defying anyone else. It is just Ti hard at work, which tends to shut off those Fe messages.

    It doesn't surprise me in the least that Ann didn't have a tiny clue about him. Not that she should either. It is just the nature of the personality interaction...
    Quote Originally Posted by snegledmaca
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    Quote Originally Posted by snegledmaca
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.
    Sounds to me he was defying you and you him. A pretty big clue that something is very wrong.
    how does my letting him drive my car and my trying to tone down my spontaneity suggest defiance?
    It's not from there that I got that impression, it's from this segment

    Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground.

    where it seems to me like he's carrying out his will regardless of and despite your wishes. Seems to me he was just brushing you aside, in essence defying you.
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    It's not from there that I got that impression, it's from this segment

    Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground.

    where it seems to me like he's carrying out his will regardless of and despite your wishes. Seems to me he was just brushing you aside, in essence defying you.
    Oh that, yeah, i can see his defiance there.
    But where do you see me defying him? Because I wanted to keep the toy return training in effect? I guess one could look at it as me defying his desire in how to raise my child. But my focus wasn't on defying him....but on keeping to the rules she and I had. (which, considering how my daughter is when it comes to rules, was very important)

    But yeah, that incident was a sign that something was wrong, but I felt that clearly communicating with each other could have solved that. He's one of the few guys from my past that I felt could have been a good father figure for my daughter.

    (and no, i was not looking for a father figure for my daughter, but it was something I always had to keep in mind when dating)
    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    He was an ass, and if he disagreed with how you were raising your daughter, he should have talked to you about it out of her earshot.

    And you said you dated him briefly so it doesn't sound to me like he was there long enough to get a full vote on that topic anyway.

    <3
    I agree with you on the everything but the ass part.
    While he responded like an ass this one time, that very well could have been why he left like he did (cuz he felt like he'd acted like an ass). Also, considering how loud my daughter's screaming fits are, it's not like one can think nor keep one's cool around that.
    Quote Originally Posted by istj female
    I know one male ISTJ that thinks he has the right to hand out judgements and advice on parenting to people he hardly knows. It's really offensive and hurtful. Advice is one thing but "you need to get that little bastard under control" = instant zero respect.

    On the way that guy walked out of the situation... I don't know what it was about for him, but I have done that a couple of times. I was in a position of dependence on others to get my needs met and they weren't interested, so rather than feel helpless I just left. Kindof a tactic of last resort but better than humiliation. I wonder what was the trigger for him.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    my father and my ex husband were in the exact same infj-estp conflict relation. they could not communicate to save their lives and totally disliked one another. i'm sure my father thought he was meeting my ex halfway...and i'm sure my ex thought likewise. it's more like they tried to meet but passed each other being on completely different paths. the best they could do was stand sort of side by side on different paths. they co-existed kinda like the 2 sides of the cold war existed lol.

    i once witnessed a conversation between about religion, charlton heston, and gun control which was pretty funny to watch. estp doesn't get the nuances or undercurrent infj doesn't get the practical application in the least. well whatever, for my self i am friendly with a conflict but we never get together unless other people are there. this helps a lot.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Quote Originally Posted by betterthandead
    ..[].. I've had ENFJ women become attracted to me only to find that their "getting to know you" date questions came to me like an interview and I guess my evasive answers like "Yeah I am a gigolo or I have a 15 inch penis" statements weren't that great for them. I'm sure if it was an ENFP she would laugh it off and then start talking about butterflies.
    I'd more likely play along with your answers, quizzing you about your job as a gigolo or women's reactions to the length of your penis, etc..as if your answers were real answers....up until i couldn't stop blushing or was laughing too hard to keep playing....which probably wouldn't take long .
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    My conflictor (ESTj) and I cannot follow each other's inductive reasoning process or find merit in the other's conclusions. Those conclusions seem stupid, short-sighted, or devoid of reasonable input. We can't see things from a similar vantage point no matter how meticulously our positions are explained. It is a full-blown conflict of values in every conceivable arena.

    I agree that 'keeping the peace' requires suppression of natural inclinations, including honest expression of one's opinions and observations. It creates resentment and rising tension since both persons are constantly required to 'bend' or 'tolerate' to a snapping point.

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    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    ESFp-Fi sub
    6w7 sx/so/sp

  35. #35
    Creepy-bg

    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    u mean there's deeper intent to what SEEs say?

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    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    fine...but what do YOU do? that, my friend, is the question on the table.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat
    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    u mean there's deeper intent to what SEEs say?
    everyone has an intent when they say something. you may be referring to meaning?
    ESFp-Fi sub
    6w7 sx/so/sp

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    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sunshine Lively
    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    fine...but what do YOU do? that, my friend, is the question on the table.
    that is for my conflictor to decide and communicate to me.
    ESFp-Fi sub
    6w7 sx/so/sp

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    with isfj's and me, assuming i'm an entp at the moment, i notice that things tend to get extremely tense externally and internally. in the face of my Ne, the isfj just stops talking and shuts down. if they do start talking, they start asking passive-aggressive questions designed to poke holes in my great ideas. lol. it's weird though, it's like they are totally repulsed by Ne....and i so totally do not mean to repulse them.

    on my side of it in the face of their Fi i kind of crinkle my nose inside. basically i shut down, too. or i might make anti-Fi jokes if i feel secure enough in the situation. i actually don't have a problem understanding them, it's more like i just don't focus on the same things they do. it always seems to me that they look at these small details that are beside the point. however, over time i have noticed that these small details they notice have a lot of tactical and strategic value, so i have started to listen to them more in the last 10 years or so.

    interesting side note is that i don't think my Ti bothers them and their Se doesn't really bother me.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Default Re: polr slapping with conflictor-- inevitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Sunshine Lively
    Quote Originally Posted by liveandletlive
    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington
    not slapping your conflictor's polr means you suppress your natural inclinations.

    With ESFp, I sometimes blurt out when they have blatantly contradicted a previous statement. It's automatic. :/

    Btw I have noticed that whenever ESFp and I talk we quite often begin speaking at the same time. No flow at all.

    What experiences do you have with your conflictor that show lack of flow, and can we specify which functions are responsible? Or is it just something that can be generalized across all conflictors? My example about talking at the same time I could see related to Se/Ni.
    i completely agree- you guys can get really annoying with that- just think of the logical errors to yourself and direct your intuition towards seeing the deeper intent of what the see is saying.
    fine...but what do YOU do? that, my friend, is the question on the table.
    that is for my conflictor to decide and communicate to me.
    i beg to differ....i think it's about the relationship and the interaction, not just commenting on how they affect you.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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