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Thread: Si, caregiving, ramblings

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    Default Si, caregiving, ramblings

    When we were visiting my inlaws, we spent most of the time with my mother in law (ESFj), and father in law (ISFp). My husband is ISTp, and I think my daughter is ENFp but she's just a kid so who knows for sure. Anyway, I was surrounded by Si.

    The weird thing is that whenever I'm around all three of them, they're always taking care of me. Everyone takes care of me. It's like there's this focus on me. They take care of my daughter too now, but even before she was born when the four of us were together people were always focused on my comfort. Was I thirsty, was I sitting in a draft, would I like something, etc. When my husband does this, it feels more comfortable, but my in-laws are more demonstrative (Fe I suppose) and I feel like I have some obligation to reciprocate or something. So my instinct is to take care of their comfort too, but of course they're perfectly good at taking care of their own needs in that area, and I am awkward when I try to, so that never worked. Now that I've read about Socionics, I think to myself "what they need is Ne" but I honestly have no idea how one goes about giving people Ne. So I feel kind of guilty that everyone is taking care of me and I'm getting all the attention.

    So is this normal if you're an Ne surrounded by Si types? I don't know how to respond to having people take care of me all the time. And it sometimes feels like they're treating me like a child, like I can't take care of myself. Which I can't, but like I said it's different with my husband because it feels more like he's taking care of his own needs and either picks mine up here and there or just takes me along for the ride and my needs get taken care of without much effort on his part. But my inlaws really seem to work at it and I feel like I should be doing something for them too.

    And to the Si-dominant people out there, if you've gotten this far, what does Ne feel like to you?
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    Default Re: Si, caregiving, ramblings

    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom
    When we were visiting my inlaws, we spent most of the time with my mother in law (ESFj), and father in law (ISFp). My husband is ISTp, and I think my daughter is ENFp but she's just a kid so who knows for sure. Anyway, I was surrounded by Si.

    The weird thing is that whenever I'm around all three of them, they're always taking care of me. Everyone takes care of me. It's like there's this focus on me. They take care of my daughter too now, but even before she was born when the four of us were together people were always focused on my comfort. Was I thirsty, was I sitting in a draft, would I like something, etc. When my husband does this, it feels more comfortable, but my in-laws are more demonstrative (Fe I suppose) and I feel like I have some obligation to reciprocate or something. So my instinct is to take care of their comfort too, but of course they're perfectly good at taking care of their own needs in that area, and I am awkward when I try to, so that never worked. Now that I've read about Socionics, I think to myself "what they need is Ne" but I honestly have no idea how one goes about giving people Ne. So I feel kind of guilty that everyone is taking care of me and I'm getting all the attention.

    So is this normal if you're an Ne surrounded by Si types?

    ......
    i also experience that in the company of ISFps and ESFjs but not among ISTps and ESTjs. i think it has something to do with the mix of and , as in the how they go about doing the caretaking.

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    yeah, my ESFj grandmother is always doing this. it's probably the single factor that most drives me insane about her. she will incessantly barge in on whatever i happen to be doing (nothing ever very important) and ask if i want about 20 different things before i start yelling at her, for which i am then unfailingly reprimanded.

    knowing that i almost never accept her offers, sometimes she simply provides me with a plate of food without saying anything. predictably, this results in arguments ("what the hell are you giving me this for? i just ate an hour ago; i'm not hungry") and, often, wasted food.

    another thing; she's moderately rich and has no financial concerns for the rest of her life. in her mind, this is a mandate to spend as much money as possible. for example, i was recently forced to spend a night at her house due to circumstances completely beyond my control, and without exaggeration, she had purchased an extraordinary excess of foods that she thinks i like. she had bought 3 mangoes (at $1.50 apiece), 3 loaves of bread, several different kinds of cake so that i might choose from them, two large containers of yogurt, and all sorts of other crap that i couldn't possibly eat. i took home what i could, but much of what she bought simply went to waste. i just can't understand why she would do that.

    she tries without fail to anticipate what i want, and guesses wrong about 90% of the time.[/incessant conflictor-related rant]

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    sounds like an o.d. on Si and Fe to me what with an esfj AND an isfp!! way too much dose for you, hahaha

    i kinda feel like that around enfj's - too much Fe driven by Ni, whoa. it's like overload.

    how to give them some Ne. i think this is actually a great question. how is this done? i guess you'd try to get a lot of interesting conversation going, focusing on theories, concepts, etc that can be applied to many different things. Ne humor gets people going esp esfj's and isfp's. i like it when enfp's use Ne to talk about universal experiences that people have with other people. or when they explain how people feel and how relationships work.

    not that you would use this with your in laws, but at work once, and enfp led a rowdy and baudy conversation about sex that opened all of us up (we were all women). we were very well connected as a group after that.

    kinda limited, but HTH.

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    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    yeah, my ESFj grandmother is always doing this. it's probably the single factor that most drives me insane about her. she will incessantly barge in on whatever i happen to be doing (nothing ever very important) and ask if i want about 20 different things before i start yelling at her, for which i am then unfailingly reprimanded.

    knowing that i almost never accept her offers, sometimes she simply provides me with a plate of food without saying anything. predictably, this results in arguments ("what the hell are you giving me this for? i just ate an hour ago; i'm not hungry") and, often, wasted food.
    Hmm, you really have no clue about ESEs, do you.
    I'm sure you will absolutely love it when you find the right ESFp.
    Happy hunting.


    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP III
    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    My thoughts exactly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    Quote Originally Posted by diamond8
    like it when enfp's use Ne to talk about universal experiences that people have with other people. or when they explain how people feel and how relationships work.

    I think both of these are excellent suggestions for both ESFj and ISFp.

    The ESFjs I know, love talking about people, experiences, and psychology/personality. One thing to remember is that they don't do this that often, so they may be a bit....limited...on how deep they're willing to go. They seem to know a number of "code" words/phrases, but not necessarily go deeper than that. Which is what you'd be good at SlackerMom. You have the know how to naturally take the conversation deeper (or broader) than they'd normally go, and thus expand their experience in these kinds of thinkings.

    The ISFps I know, love the odd sense of humour and making unexpected connections. They'll create and/or join in the creation of a making a story or scenario that involves some really outrageous connections. Though, I suppose the extent of the outrageousness might depend upon the person.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise
    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    Quote Originally Posted by diamond8
    like it when enfp's use Ne to talk about universal experiences that people have with other people. or when they explain how people feel and how relationships work.

    I think both of these are excellent suggestions for both ESFj and ISFp.

    The ESFjs I know, love talking about people, experiences, and psychology/personality. One thing to remember is that they don't do this that often, so they may be a bit....limited...on how deep they're willing to go. They seem to know a number of "code" words/phrases, but not necessarily go deeper than that. Which is what you'd be good at SlackerMom. You have the know how to naturally take the conversation deeper (or broader) than they'd normally go, and thus expand their experience in these kinds of thinkings.

    The ISFps I know, love the odd sense of humour and making unexpected connections. They'll create and/or join in the creation of a making a story or scenario that involves some really outrageous connections. Though, I suppose the extent of the outrageousness might depend upon the person.
    I don't know much about ESFjs but there is one at work that does seem to be delighted when I make "funny" "weird" comments, or sort of make an unexpected comment. I always thought she took well to me just because I seemed to respond so well to her.. smiling and laughing and generally looking like i wanted to be there.

    As to how to give Ne, i know an ISFp who always says im so funny and she has told me several times, "if i didn't have you I wouldn't be at [place where she can relax, or experience new things]". She has said from time to time, that sometimes she needs to learn about new things and experiences and I think an Ne person points out such opportunities to the Si person. I think Rick said something similar on his site.

    In general i thought it was telling that ann said that esfjs might not be willing to go deeper with certain things even if they like them, and in general I have also had thoughts similar to what Niffweed was expressing. So I thought it was interesting that Slacker Mom, an ENFp, would be know better how to soothe an ESFj into going deeper. Because it's true that INTjs would want to "cut the crap" or just be oblivious as to how to do this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    At least with ESFjs, what they seem to welcome most is indeed humor based on the unexpected and odd (but still funny).
    My satirical and strange humour is a bane to my ESE mother. I like to joke in a constant basis and she finds it rather ridiculous, even though she does appear to like vulgar humour. There are people in the other hand, that find every joke I say funny, while most find a few of them funny. This has to do with humour being highly arbitrary, but I think type does have an impact, but I'm not sure how much of an effect it has or if there are other factors involved. There are some people in the other hand that appear to universally hilarious.
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    i also experience that in the company of ISFps and ESFjs but not among ISTps and ESTjs. i think it has something to do with the mix of Introverted Sensing and Extraverted Feeling, as in the how they go about doing the caretaking.
    I disagree somewhat. I have an ESTJ friend who acts very accomodating toward his friends and seems to relish inviting people over for dinner and always offers financial and material support to friends in need. He's probably the most giving person I know. He's not very tactful at dealing with emotional problems, but when it comes to physical and economic comfort he's almost always willing to help you unless he senses that you're trying to take advantage of him (he's very brutal to people who stab him in the back.) And he definately has very developed extroverted thinking. He's always learning new programming languages for the fun of it and then getting on the internet and teaching other people how to do programming. It bores me to tears how he always talks about the people he helps on the internet, but helping people is definately something he is about.

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    Default Re: Si, caregiving, ramblings

    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom
    Now that I've read about Socionics, I think to myself "what they need is Ne" but I honestly have no idea how one goes about giving people Ne. So I feel kind of guilty that everyone is taking care of me and I'm getting all the attention.
    Hey Slacker Mom, just remember that extroverted SJs derive pleasure and a sense of usefulness from helping others, that they often don't really expect a lot of reciprocation from you except for kind comments and your friendship. They know that you're probably a bit out there in outer space and might like to revel is some Earthy pleasures for awhile and so they're more than happy to help. As far as your Ne, just talk about what you know with them. SJs in particular seem to like listening to deep people, you'll be surprised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typeless Wonder
    i also experience that in the company of ISFps and ESFjs but not among ISTps and ESTjs. i think it has something to do with the mix of Introverted Sensing and Extraverted Feeling, as in the how they go about doing the caretaking.
    I disagree somewhat. I have an ESTJ friend who acts very accomodating toward his friends and seems to relish inviting people over for dinner and always offers financial and material support to friends in need. He's probably the most giving person I know. He's not very tactful at dealing with emotional problems, but when it comes to physical and economic comfort he's almost always willing to help you unless he senses that you're trying to take advantage of him (he's very brutal to people who stab him in the back.) And he definately has very developed extroverted thinking. He's always learning new programming languages for the fun of it and then getting on the internet and teaching other people how to do programming. It bores me to tears how he always talks about the people he helps on the internet, but helping people is definately something he is about.
    What was it that you disagreed with in my post?

    I was referring to experiencing a sense of obligation and this feeling of awkwardness from receiving caretaking from ISFps and ESFjs, similar to what Slacker Mom experienced. And I was letting her know that I don't get that feeling among ISTps and ESTjs.

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    I understood Stefana It's just like that - I get caretaking from ESTjs and ISTps, and I don't feel this sense of guilt or need to reciprocate. But when I get the caretaking from ISFps and ESFjs I feel like I need to do something. They all provide that caretaking, but I react to it a little bit differently.
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    yeah, my ESFj grandmother is always doing this. it's probably the single factor that most drives me insane about her. she will incessantly barge in on whatever i happen to be doing (nothing ever very important) and ask if i want about 20 different things before i start yelling at her, for which i am then unfailingly reprimanded.

    knowing that i almost never accept her offers, sometimes she simply provides me with a plate of food without saying anything. predictably, this results in arguments ("what the hell are you giving me this for? i just ate an hour ago; i'm not hungry") and, often, wasted food.

    another thing; she's moderately rich and has no financial concerns for the rest of her life. in her mind, this is a mandate to spend as much money as possible. for example, i was recently forced to spend a night at her house due to circumstances completely beyond my control, and without exaggeration, she had purchased an extraordinary excess of foods that she thinks i like. she had bought 3 mangoes (at $1.50 apiece), 3 loaves of bread, several different kinds of cake so that i might choose from them, two large containers of yogurt, and all sorts of other crap that i couldn't possibly eat. i took home what i could, but much of what she bought simply went to waste. i just can't understand why she would do that.

    she tries without fail to anticipate what i want, and guesses wrong about 90% of the time.[/incessant conflictor-related rant]

    I can relate to the annoyed feeling....but I hardly get mad at them...I'm focused on intentions all the time....but wasted food annoys me, barging in annoys me, etc...but I know they are just trying to care for me so I forgive them, and tell them in the nicest way possible what I like, and how much they should buy if they INSIST on buying things for me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slacker Mom
    I understood Stefana It's just like that - I get caretaking from ESTjs and ISTps, and I don't feel this sense of guilt or need to reciprocate. But when I get the caretaking from ISFps and ESFjs I feel like I need to do something. They all provide that caretaking, but I react to it a little bit differently.
    i'm telling you it's simply too high a dose of caretaking! with all the Fe it simply feels like overload.

    i dont' have experiences with istp's but i do with estj's....their Si is OK....but not a therapeutic dose. i need MORE! hahaha

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    Both ISFp and ESFj want attention. They want people to like them, and they try to please the way the know best.

    The problem is that ISTp and ESTj do not need/expect people to smile at them for what they do or anything, while ISFp and ESFj do. That's the difference.

    ENFp get a lot of attention from such types because their duals are a bit dry and cold. I've seen my INTj father to be blunt to his ESFj friend many times. I, on the contrary, can be as "interesting" as him, but also quite polite.
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