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Thread: Some possible famous/celebrity LIEs-ENTjs (reboot)

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    Default Some possible famous/celebrity LIEs-ENTjs (reboot)

    Themistocles, Athenian politician, 6th-5th century BC (a hunch)






    Gaius Julius Caesar the Dictator (but perhaps ESTp)





    Augustus, first Roman Emperor






    Julian "the Apostate", Roman Emperor 361-363 (perhaps ENFj but I doubt it)






    Grigori Potemkin, Russian statesman, Catherine the Great's "buddy"





    Prince Albert, Queen Victoria's husband

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    T. E. Lawrence "of Arabia" (that or INTp, I can't decide)





    Benjamin Disraeli, British prime minister and author (a hunch)

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Alexander Hamilton





    Sam Houston, President of the Republic of Texas (another hunch - perhaps ESTj)

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Margareth Thatcher, British prime minister (perhaps ESTj but I doubt it)







    Tony Blair, British prime minister







    Yulia Tymoshenko, Ukrainian oligarch and politician





    Junichiro Koizumi, former Japanese PM

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    T. E. Lawrence "of Arabia" (that or INTp, I can't decide)

    Seemed more ENFj to me, although ENTj seems plausible. Definitely not introverted.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    Lawrence re-wrote Seven Pillars of Wisdom three times; once "blind," after he lost the manuscript while changing trains. As to the truth of the book's narrative, with Lawrence it is always difficult to untangle reality from mythology; the man himself seemed to enjoy mingling fact and fiction. His complex relation with himself results in passages which alternately belittle his accomplishments and influence, and expand on his role in the revolt. Seven Pillars is a fascinating work as autobiography, as study of history, as psychology.

    The accusation that Lawrence repeatedly exaggerated his feats has been a persistent theme among commentators. The list of his alleged "embellishments" in Seven Pillars is long, though many such allegations have been disproved with time, most definitively in Jeremy Wilson's authorized biography, Lawrence of Arabia, based solely on contemporaneous documentation of Lawrence's life and deeds. However, some exaggerations by him are certain: for example, his supposed crossing of the Sinai in two days, which actually took him three days, and his alleged number of battle wounds, which in reality were few. Other exaggerations by him are therefore also possible.

    It is not disputed that Lawrence was present during the Arab Revolt. However, the claim that he was one of the leading lights, and indeed the inspiration, has been questioned — particularly as the main basis for this belief is his own book. The Germans commissioned a 12-volume report covering all aspects of the Arab Revolt. Lawrence is not mentioned at all. Still, the Arabs themselves evidently believe that he was influential.
    The tendency to exaggeration seems more characteristic of ENFjs, no?

    His Se HA is pretty obvious. He died while motorcycling, for instance.

    An amazing writer, by the way.

    Articles - Questionnaire - Typology Network - Blog

    يَا أَيُّهَا النَّاسُ إِنَّا خَلَقْنَاكُم مِّن ذَكَرٍ وَأُنثَىٰ وَجَعَلْنَاكُمْ شُعُوبًا وَقَبَائِلَ لِتَعَارَفُوا

    O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another.

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    David Stockman, Reagan's Budget Director, 1981-85





    Milton Friedman, economist

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    Seemed more ENFj to me, although ENTj seems plausible. Definitely not introverted.
    He went through periods in his life - long periods - where he adopted a kind of IP behavior, which is also consistent with EJs at some points. That is why I have difficulty choosing.


    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    The tendency to exaggeration seems more characteristic of ENFjs, no?
    I don't think Fe dominance is consistent with his life, Fe role or PoLR is.


    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush
    His Se HA is pretty obvious. He died while motorcycling, for instance.
    His valueing Se over Si is pretty obvious; not necessarily having Se as 6th function or HA. His love of fast vehicles as a means of transportation - not just as sport - is consistent with ENTj.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Thomas Sowell, US economist






    Robert Conquest, British historian (possibly ESTj or INTp -- all I'm sure is that all he writes overflows with Te)

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Jeremy Paxman, British Presenter of a topical news show called Newsnight.

    EII-Ne
    9w1 or 5w4 Sp/So

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    Yeah, good one. I think you're probably right.


    Helen Mirren - an EJ in my opinion, and makes both a Gamma and logical impression.

    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Ah, whatever. I'll just include him --


    [s:8c73975cb4]Richard Nixon, US President[/s:8c73975cb4]




    This is my major dispute with the socionics "establishment" -- I think Nixon was ENTj, and "they" say he was ISFj. Well I'm not so sure myself, but I still think he was ENTj -- EJ rather than IJ, Si rather than Ne PoLR, emotion-creating rather than construct-creating, Fe role rather than as 7th function. However, he did use a lot of Fi when he spoke, and his Se seemed stronger than for most ENTjs, I concede that.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Nixon as ENTj makes very little sense to me, for most of the reasons commonly used to describe him as ISFj.

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    Nixon as ENTj makes very little sense to me, for most of the reasons commonly used to describe him as ISFj.
    Yes, and these "common reasons" only look at his presidency and ignore the whole of his life before and after it.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    I disagree about Caesar and Augustus.
    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
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    Fine Dio, which types do you think they were then? At least we agree on ISTp for Tiberius.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Virginia Postrel, author of The Future and its Enemies (possibly ESTj but I don't think so)


    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Nixon seems ISFJ to me. He seems to be very forward (Se) in interactions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Ah, whatever. I'll just include him --


    Richard Nixon, US President




    This is my major dispute with the socionics "establishment" -- I think Nixon was ENTj, and "they" say he was ISFj. Well I'm not so sure myself, but I still think he was ENTj -- EJ rather than IJ, Si rather than Ne PoLR, emotion-creating rather than construct-creating, Fe role rather than as 7th function. However, he did use a lot of Fi when he spoke, and his Se seemed stronger than for most ENTjs, I concede that.
    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
    http://www.speedinternet.org,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Fine Dio, which types do you think they were then? At least we agree on ISTp for Tiberius.
    Ceasar was ISTJ In my opinion.
    Augustus was INTP IMO.

    As always, these are only my opinions of course.
    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
    http://www.speedinternet.org,

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    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
    http://www.speedinternet.org,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Ceasar was ISTJ In my opinion.
    Caesar was all about constant risk-taking and testing the limits; that's not very ISTj.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dioklecian
    Augustus was INTP IMO.
    That makes more sense, but I think he was EJ rather than IP, and Fe role rather than Fe PoLR.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Jodie Foster





    Gamma, rational, and EJ rather than IJ. Not so obvious Fe role but still Fe role.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    i just read up a deal about jodie foster and ENTj does seem like a good choice for her.
    6w5 sx
    model Φ: -+0
    sloan - rcuei

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    I first got the idea of ENTj for her as I listened to her running commentary in the Contact DVD - that is an ENTj speaking, IMO.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Ann Coulter

    ENFj and ESTp have been suggested. I keep coming back to ENTj from VI in interviews, writings, life and actions. She does have a flavor of Ti-Fe but in the end I think Te-Fi is her real "home". ENTj Ni subtype.


    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Creepy-Diana

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    .

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    Roger Ebert




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    Quote Originally Posted by Diana
    Someone suggested ENFj or ESTp for Ann Coulter?? That's weird. I never would have considered either one of those. ENTj works for me (in my expert opinion )
    Well, some time ago there was a thread on her, and there was a sort of ENFj-ENTj split among the views -- ESTp was suggested due to her sometimes going into "bullying" mode when debating.



    Roger Ebert: I know who he is but I don't really know about his type.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Donald Kagan, historian



    Te blah-blah. On the Origins of War and the Preservation of Peace is one big long paragraph that spends very many pages describing what happened in several wars and very few pages on why they happened.

    Articles - Questionnaire - Typology Network - Blog

    يَا أَيُّهَا النَّاسُ إِنَّا خَلَقْنَاكُم مِّن ذَكَرٍ وَأُنثَىٰ وَجَعَلْنَاكُمْ شُعُوبًا وَقَبَائِلَ لِتَعَارَفُوا

    O mankind, indeed We have created you from male and female and made you peoples and tribes that you may know one another.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Jodie Foster





    Gamma, rational, and EJ rather than IJ. Not so obvious Fe role but still Fe role.
    I think that she might be ISFJ, again, just my opinion of course.
    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
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    I agree with you Dio, I was torn between ISFj and ENTj for her, but on reading about her life and listening to her running commentary in the Contact DVD I thought ENFj was more likely.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Yulia looks more LSE if you ask me.

    Caesar is more likely SLE, I think.

    Nixon has always struck me as Te dominant, but I would say LSE is more likely; DS functions appearing strong is not usually a problem for typing, IMO, and I think his Te comes across in more cases than his Fi (at least from what I've seen).

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    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    Yulia looks more LSE if you ask me.
    In that picture? That Si-loaded look is a front she's adopted in recent years. And if you watch her in an interview, it becomes clearer.

    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    Caesar is more likely SLE, I think.
    It's possible, and of course it's impossible to settle it, but a lot of small things that have been described about him personally - as by Suetonius - suggest LIE to me.

    Also, Russian Socionists type him as SEE. I no longer find that as impossible as I used to, but I think that they may have been on to something as seeing him as a Gamma.

    I think that the true SLE of the time was Pompey the Great.


    Quote Originally Posted by GillySaysGoodbye
    Nixon has always struck me as Te dominant, but I would say LSE is more likely; DS functions appearing strong is not usually a problem for typing, IMO, and I think his Te comes across in more cases than his Fi (at least from what I've seen).
    Again, I prefer LIE when I look at his life as a whole.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Bill Gates




    I had almost forgotten him.

    He's a good example of what many ENTjs look like -- a bit "nerdy" and awkward.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Bill Gates




    I had almost forgotten him.

    He's a good example of what many ENTjs look like -- a bit "nerdy" and awkward.
    I agree with this of course
    Well I am back. How s everyone? Don't have as much time now, but glad to see some of the old gang are still here.
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    Actually I don't have a strong argument against ESFj -- she can come across as one in TV interviews. But from reading about her life, and more in-depth written interviews, and from seeing her live, I think she's a logical type, although perhaps ESTj is also possible.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Zbigniew Brzezinski, Jimmy Carter's National Security Advisor





    I had first typed him as INTp, but Rick suggested that ENTj is more likely, and I tend to agree.

    Interestingly, he was very close to Carter, whom I have typed as ISFj.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Conan O'Brien

    EDIT: Which is odd, because I find his jokes somewhat annoying. Heh.


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    Lol. Bill Gates at the US Supreme Court is one of the greatest comedy acts of our time.

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    Conan O'Brien and Brzezinski even VI similarly in those pictures
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Lee Kuan Yew politician

    *"Even from my sick bed, even if you are going to lower me into the grave and I feel something is going wrong, I will get up."

    *"In a different world we need to find a niche for ourselves, little corners where in spite of our small size we can perform a role which will be useful to the world. To do that, you will need people at the top, decision-makers who have got foresight, good minds, who are open to ideas, who can seize opportunities like we did... My job really was to find my successors. I found them, they are there; their job is to find their successors. So there must be this continuous renewal of talented, dedicated, honest, able people who will do things not for themselves but for their people and for their country. If they can do that, they will carry on for another one generation and so it goes on. The moment that breaks, it's gone."

    * once quoted as saying he preferred to be feared than loved. Adamant that the ends justify the means, Lee often prescribed repressive measures to safeguard national security and interests.

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