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Thread: Does Culture have an impact on Personality Type?

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    Default Does Culture have an impact on Personality Type?

    I'm wondering, do you think culture has an impact on personality type? We often judge type based on values and motivators, what if you have a different value system based on your culture?

    Also, do you think we might be mistyping some personalities because of culture? e.g. if you were raised in a culture that often came off to others either stubbhorn or arrogant to others, they might think you were one of the types who was more prone to that kind of behavior.

    Not that you were being stubborn or arrogant, within your own culture there is a completely different perception on the same behavior.
    Polly
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    I definitely agree.

    As a child-kid I grew up in a ghetto-like place - except home, that was okay.

    Most people that have grown up from that place seem to be ESTps or ESTjs or ISTps or ISTjs, or at least seem to exhibit the stereotypical traits of those types. Whether it was a necessary mask in order to stand the environment, or the environment plasmated the respective temperaments (EP EJ IP IJ) into the ST side in order to resist - I do not know.
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    I don't think culture has any influence on your real Socionics type; it may have an influence on your self-perception, if you try to type yourself by outward personality traits rather than by motivation. And it will likely influence your perceived MBTI type, if you go by tests and by the four dichotomies in terms of external behavior.

    For instance, I was raised in a place where the "normal" values are , , and EP temperament, or at least irrationality. So according to the kind of questions found in most short MBTI tests, I would easily get I, N, T and J, so INTJ.

    However, if I had been raised in Belgium, as a I would have no doubt about being E, N, T, J since the prevailig behavior here is ISXp.

    On the other hand, if I had been raised in Germany, where "J" behavior and especially IJ temperament is valued and seen as the norm, I might have thought I was E, N, T, and P.

    However, again, this is just about the perception of types, not about your real type. If being the only Gamma in an Alpha family, and a EJ in a bloody EP culture did not change my actual type, I very much doubt anything would have.

    Finally, I'm not saying that your actual Myer-Briggs type is influenced, either; but your own perception of your type, according to simplistic E/I, S/N, F/T and J/P criteria, may well be.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
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    I agree that your "real" socionics type won't be affected however I think it's next to impossible to not be imprinted in some way by the culture you grew up in or have lived in for any length of time. To the degree that it would mask out your true type though I don't know. I guess that would depend on your ability and need to take on local color in order to fit in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat
    I guess that would depend on your ability and need to take on local color in order to fit in.
    Yeah. I'm not a good example since I'm a true Enneagram 8 in the sense that the thought of having to "fit in" a culture whose values I despise makes me sick. Not that this trait has helped me in the corporate world.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    I'm honestly not sure. I don't know enough to say in socionics but I'm thinking in MBTI it does.

    On MBTI tests I score fairly high as a feeler and an introvert in comparison with my intuitive and perceiving.

    There could be lots of reasons for that but I was thinking, and this is just a possibility, I don't really know....

    I'm from a very feely based culture. To even say good bye to someone, its like this complex 'break it to them gently' type situation. Being blunt and to the point is considered very rude. Instead, we make people guess by dropping hints (some are better at taking them than others). In social situations, conversations don't usually get too deep so that others can always join in. If two people got into a deep philosophical debate they would be considered rude to those around them for excluding them from conversation...it may hurt their feelings. These are of course generalizations and there are exceptions.

    Despite scoring high as a feeler, I wasn't considered particularly feely as a child. I was criticized for being insensitive to this highly sensitive culture. To survive, I have had to act like an ENFP a lot.

    A female NT isn't very valued in my culture. Male NTs are more valued but not as much as those who have social charisma. Relationship building skills are prized over others.

    If you strongly lean one way or the other in your traits, I think your type would remain the same regardless of circumstance. But, I wonder if you are more borderline, would having your surrounding culture hone one trait and not another impact your results? If it did, would that be the true personality or would it be the one it was prior to being meddled with?
    Polly
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly
    I'm honestly not sure. I don't know enough to say in socionics but I'm thinking in MBTI it does.

    On MBTI tests I score fairly high as a feeler and an introvert in comparison with my intuitive and perceiving.

    There could be lots of reasons for that but I was thinking, and this is just a possibility, I don't really know....

    I'm from a very feely based culture. To even say good bye to someone, its like this complex 'break it to them gently' type situation. Being blunt and to the point is considered very rude. Instead, we make people guess by dropping hints (some are better at taking them than others). In social situations, conversations don't usually get too deep so that others can always join in. If two people got into a deep philosophical debate they would be considered rude to those around them for excluding them from conversation...it may hurt their feelings. These are of course generalizations and there are exceptions.

    Despite scoring high as a feeler, I wasn't considered particularly feely as a child. I was criticized for being insensitive to this highly sensitive culture. To survive, I have had to act like an ENFP a lot.

    A female NT isn't very valued in my culture. Male NTs are more valued but not as much as those who have social charisma. Relationship building skills are prized over others.

    If you strongly lean one way or the other in your traits, I think your type would remain the same regardless of circumstance. But, I wonder if you are more borderline, would having your surrounding culture hone one trait and not another impact your results? If it did, would that be the true personality or would it be the one it was prior to being meddled with?
    female nt's aren't valued in any culture except perhaps india where the ideal woman is more thinking oriented and ideal men are more feeling oriented. at least i've heard that - advance apologies to any who are of indian descent who know otherwise.

    our anti-fi, fi polr whatever is just ya know anti female or something.

    you know though fuck it, i'm gonna be who i am try to go with my rules of thumb for Fi polr and stretch my strengths as far as i can....and pursue my dual.

    ILE

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    you know though fuck it, i'm gonna be who i am try to go with my rules of thumb for Fi polr and stretch my strengths as far as i can.
    I pretty much feel that way....now.

    I've read a few times they say as an ENTP gets older they get more comfortable in their own skin. I lub my ENTPness now. People either really love me or really hate me. It doesn't matter because I'm not noticing half the time anyway.

    I haven't found my dual that I'm aware of. I've dated in fairly long term relationships both my MBTI matches INTJ and INFJ. The connection did feel deeper but unfortunately it takes more than just personality type to make a relationship work.
    Polly
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    yes, you are right about relationships. i have actually found my dual, but it's pretty new and we will have to see. our values are very similar, our lifestyle is similar, our leisure interests are different though. i don't know how much of a difference this makes. segue into interests.....

    my lookalike ex and i had some common interests but once we weren't able to do them anymore (due to having kids) that's when things went way downhill. even when we were able to engage in our interests together, it fell flat. so i don't know how important interests are for a relationship, really. on the one hand it seems kind of superficial and external, on the other hand it seems like interests can be an important way to connect with people.

    thoughts, anybody?

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    I think ENTp women are cool because of their difference. I can't understand how any male could DISLIKE them for that. I can understand females disliking them, but if you have males on your side, other girls can die, I guess.
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    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    my lookalike ex and i had some common interests but once we weren't able to do them anymore (due to having kids) that's when things went way downhill. even when we were able to engage in our interests together, it fell flat. so i don't know how important interests are for a relationship, really. on the one hand it seems kind of superficial and external, on the other hand it seems like interests can be an important way to connect with people.

    thoughts, anybody?
    This is one of the things that go against "conventional wisdom", which is that a large part of "compatibility" is about common interests in terms of hobbies etc. That is probably true when you're just going out and having fun - since then the relationship is almost only about common hobbies - but what I have learned is that it's not really the most crucial factor.

    I had relationships with my super-ego - ESFj - and my dual - ISFj. I had far more interests in common with the ESFj than with the ISFj - far more - and yet the psychological level of comfort - as I saw it - was greater with the ISFj than with the ESFj.

    Perhaps self-defeatingly, however, we end up connecting more easily with people through shared interests, as in hobbies, etc, and that's where more opportunities for starting a relationship are found.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    my lookalike ex and i had some common interests but once we weren't able to do them anymore (due to having kids) that's when things went way downhill. even when we were able to engage in our interests together, it fell flat. so i don't know how important interests are for a relationship, really. on the one hand it seems kind of superficial and external, on the other hand it seems like interests can be an important way to connect with people.

    thoughts, anybody?
    This is one of the things that go against "conventional wisdom", which is that a large part of "compatibility" is about common interests in terms of hobbies etc. That is probably true when you're just going out and having fun - since then the relationship is almost only about common hobbies - but what I have learned is that it's not really the most crucial factor.

    I had relationships with my super-ego - ESFj - and my dual - ISFj. I had far more interests in common with the ESFj than with the ISFj - far more - and yet the psychological level of comfort - as I saw it - was greater with the ISFj than with the ESFj.

    Perhaps self-defeatingly, however, we end up connecting more easily with people through shared interests, as in hobbies, etc, and that's where more opportunities for starting a relationship are found.
    Thanks for these wise comments, Expat. I think I needed to hear somebody say this and you said it well. It's almost like with a non-dual you need the distraction of common interests/hobbies, simply too much tension without it or something. And often IRL people do connect via their activities, or on the basis of their previous relationships such as with family of origin, their neighborhoods and a host of other external factors, not via their psychological compatibility.

    With the internet, a lot of those external factors get filtered out and when people are honest on the internet, one is left with one's personality and psychological functioning. And this creates a strong and clear impression. I'm thinking of internet dating, forums, weblogs, chat rooms, and the like. Over time, peoples' personalities shine through like a headlight, and in a way that's different from IRL. I've been thinking about whether the internet will fundamentally change the way people match up. My boyfriend and I never would have crossed paths IRL. Yet we may be duals. Could the internet change "mating practices" for lack of a better phrase on a large scale? Interesting possibilities are implied here for sure.

    But as far as interests go, you hit the nail on the head when you say it's not the most crucial factor; could it be a less crucial factor, though?Otherwise, how would time together be spent in a scenario where you don't live together? You can always do the usual types of entertainment such as movies, dinners, parties, concerts, etc. Or perhaps common interests can be developed over time.

    And at other times you can have great psychological compatibility with someone you've met on the internet but when you meet face to face, neither person is feelin it the way they felt it on the phone or online or whatever. So the physical attraction piece is important, too.

    hmmmm, so psychological compatibility first, then physical attraction, then external commonalities?

    ILE

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    Depends on how hardheaded you are. :>

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    Yes definitely insofar as it changes the physical structure

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    With the internet, a lot of those external factors get filtered out and when people are honest on the internet, one is left with one's personality and psychological functioning. And this creates a strong and clear impression. I'm thinking of internet dating, forums, weblogs, chat rooms, and the like. Over time, peoples' personalities shine through like a headlight, and in a way that's different from IRL. I've been thinking about whether the internet will fundamentally change the way people match up. My boyfriend and I never would have crossed paths IRL. Yet we may be duals. Could the internet change "mating practices" for lack of a better phrase on a large scale? Interesting possibilities are implied here for sure.
    That's a very interesting idea. I definitely see that as the internet spreads and becomes more prevalent in our daily lives, boundaries between people who would have otherwise never met are knocked down and this opens up a lot of possibilities.

    However I think that a lot of people are not very honest on the internet. Since the internet gives a person a lot of power to filter their words and impressions, many will do so in order to project what they think is an "ideal" image. This goes completely against what would allow duality to manifest itself. Just look through a couple profiles on myspace - they all just reek of fakeness.

    How did you and your boyfriend meet? Also, how do you see the internet changing mating practices in the future? This is a cool topic.
    ENTj




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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    Thanks for these wise comments, Expat. I think I needed to hear somebody say this and you said it well.



    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    It's almost like with a non-dual you need the distraction of common interests/hobbies, simply too much tension without it or something. And often IRL people do connect via their activities, or on the basis of their previous relationships such as with family of origin, their neighborhoods and a host of other external factors, not via their psychological compatibility.
    That is precisely how I see it, although I think it does not apply equally to all non-dual types (I know this is pretty obvious, I just wanted to make the point).


    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    Could the internet change "mating practices" for lack of a better phrase on a large scale? Interesting possibilities are implied here for sure.
    For most people, it won't imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    But as far as interests go, you hit the nail on the head when you say it's not the most crucial factor; could it be a less crucial factor, though?Otherwise, how would time together be spent in a scenario where you don't live together? You can always do the usual types of entertainment such as movies, dinners, parties, concerts, etc. Or perhaps common interests can be developed over time.
    What I have observed, and experienced, is that with your psychologically-compatible type you end up discussing, ah, "real" issues, that is, things that really concern you, your worries, fears, hopes, ambitions, priorities generally, and that's where you "meet" psychologically. If you don't share those, you'll find out that discussing the same interests won't help, either. And I think that's precisely the stage of many break-ups. You see that what you had in common did not go beyond the common interests.

    With a partner who's your dual or close, but with whom you don't share common interests -- well, surely, there must be some common ground; but I agree with what you said at the end of the paragraph quoted above.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by pezzonovante
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze8
    With the internet, a lot of those external factors get filtered out and when people are honest on the internet, one is left with one's personality and psychological functioning. And this creates a strong and clear impression. I'm thinking of internet dating, forums, weblogs, chat rooms, and the like. Over time, peoples' personalities shine through like a headlight, and in a way that's different from IRL. I've been thinking about whether the internet will fundamentally change the way people match up. My boyfriend and I never would have crossed paths IRL. Yet we may be duals. Could the internet change "mating practices" for lack of a better phrase on a large scale? Interesting possibilities are implied here for sure.
    That's a very interesting idea. I definitely see that as the internet spreads and becomes more prevalent in our daily lives, boundaries between people who would have otherwise never met are knocked down and this opens up a lot of possibilities.
    At this point, I know so many people who met on line that it causes me to wonder if the gene pool is going to be mixed in a vastly different way. People used to meet through friends, family members, activities, and community stuff. And connecting on the basis of their backgrounds and activities, perhaps to a greater extent, which resulted in a lot of non-dual marriages. This, coupled with a loosening of religious influence on marriage, perhaps results in a higher incidence of divorce - the currnent rate of 50% for first marriages. OK, so if it is easier to identify psychological compatibility through on line avenues, then theoretically the rate of dual marriages increases. Would this show, then an effect on the divorce rate? Are dual marriages more or less likely to result in divorce? OK, so second, people would be meeting and marrying and having children with people they would not have crossed paths with in previous generations. Is this evolutionary? Purposeful in some way? These are my thoughts about this.

    However I think that a lot of people are not very honest on the internet. Since the internet gives a person a lot of power to filter their words and impressions, many will do so in order to project what they think is an "ideal" image. This goes completely against what would allow duality to manifest itself. Just look through a couple profiles on myspace - they all just reek of fakeness.
    You are absolutely correct in this regard, which is why dating websites build in different kinds of cheater detection methods. And also why it is so important to meet people face to face as soon as feasible. Oftentimes, there is psychological compatibility but no physical chemistry; another interesting phenom. So, the ideal mate would be psychologically compatible and there would be physical attraction and chemistry. I think, too, that once you meet someone in person, you can detect dishonesty or BS far more easily.

    How did you and your boyfriend meet? Also, how do you see the internet changing mating practices in the future? This is a cool topic.
    We met thru an on line dating service....so far so good but hey you never know it's only been about 2 months. I dated about 6 people prior to meeting him, so I've had a chance to make some observations about it. It's a drastically different world than dating when I was in my 20's, for sure. As far as the internet changing "mate selection" practices, it could very well be that people could be in a better position to find their duals over the internet. I don't know, though, what do you think?

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    Culture certainly affects personality, but I am not sure if it significantly affects personality type except through the expression of the functions.
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    However I think that a lot of people are not very honest on the internet. Since the internet gives a person a lot of power to filter their words and impressions, many will do so in order to project what they think is an "ideal" image. This goes completely against what would allow duality to manifest itself. Just look through a couple profiles on myspace - they all just reek of fakeness.
    This is SO true. Some you can pick out right away, while others are better at deceiving you. I'm on an internet dating site as well and out of the 5 guys I dated, only 2 weren't being misleading.

    The guys out number the women I find on these sites quite a bit. You have to sort through an awful lot of not rights to find the rights. It really doesn't help when they are being misleading trying to win you over. Some posting 20 year old pics only to find out they are now some overweight hillbilly missing half their front teeth and 10 years older than they said.

    ...I so hate dating.

    Lately though I've had some higher calibre ones hitting on me so maybe my luck is about to turn.
    Polly
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