Angry ENTps

[Jimbean]

I absolutly hate it when people are not being honest with me! Dishonesty usually makes me want to call them out on it or become aggressive in some other way.

In bad sitututions, I become shifty in my resources! Sometimes I am able to ignore the value loss and have some fun with the competition/opposition.

Okay, I know that there is a similar thread on this, but I just want to expand on the anger aspect of it for ENTp's.

I just learned today that I got messed with by somebody and now there is nothing I can do about it. I am finding it difficult for me to stop being angry/pissy, how do other ENTp's deal with this, or do they all have the same problem? I remember Slava saying that he gets over these kinds of things by imagining something bad happening to that person. From my expeirance, I have always had this problem, I think other ENTp's might also, but that is what I want to talk about.

[science as magic]

you always sound more exxj to me. exxps have good bullshit detectors and tend to propogate a lot of that crap as well. exxjs seem incapable of dealing anything that upsets the equilibrium of their perfect lives heh

[Jimbean]

Are you PTL by any chance? Almost everybody but me has changed their name once or twice so I don't know whos who.

I don't think it was a bullshit detector problem, I just got tripped up/could of happened to anybody type of thing.

[science as magic]

yeah i am

[oakey]

I absolutly hate it when people are not being honest with me! Dishonesty usually makes me want to call them out on it or become aggressive in some other way.

In bad sitututions, I become shifty in my resources! Sometimes I am able to ignore the value loss and have some fun with the competition/opposition.

Okay, I know that there is a similar thread on this, but I just want to expand on the anger aspect of it for ENTp's.

I just learned today that I got messed with by somebody and now there is nothing I can do about it. I am finding it difficult for me to stop being angry/pissy, how do other ENTp's deal with this, or do they all have the same problem? I remember Slava saying that he gets over these kinds of things by imagining something bad happening to that person. From my expeirance, I have always had this problem, I think other ENTp's might also, but that is what I want to talk about.

I don't know, that doesn't happen to me... but I tend to not externalize my emotions. I'm not really someone you want to push over the edge (: Because i will spontaneously stop feeling that emotion and will turn it into action.

Thats not to say I am not passionate, i just don't stew in anger or depression or similar, or in the least others won't see it. When confronted with an emotional crisis I tend to become emotionally detached and become very Machiavellian. Alternatively I seem to get most messed up when I can't rationalize other peoples emotions in regard to myself or their actions/feelings.

For instance.. Jealousy is an emotion I just plain do not understand. People will do things expecting you to get jealous or show some degree of it... and I don't know.. sorry babe.. I like you, but if you want to flirt with that guy maybe we shouldn't be dating... ummn catch you later.

[reyn_til_runa]

I absolutly hate it when people are not being honest with me! Dishonesty usually makes me want to call them out on it or become aggressive in some other way.

In bad sitututions, I become shifty in my resources! Sometimes I am able to ignore the value loss and have some fun with the competition/opposition.

Okay, I know that there is a similar thread on this, but I just want to expand on the anger aspect of it for ENTp's.

I just learned today that I got messed with by somebody and now there is nothing I can do about it. I am finding it difficult for me to stop being angry/pissy, how do other ENTp's deal with this, or do they all have the same problem? I remember Slava saying that he gets over these kinds of things by imagining something bad happening to that person. From my expeirance, I have always had this problem, I think other ENTp's might also, but that is what I want to talk about.

I have the opposite problem. I couldn't muster up the energy needed to exact revenge if I had to. I do get angry, but I'm usually the first to forget, want to make up, or if that's impossible, move on. I tend to have a negative reaction to people who are always talking about getting even with people because, in my opinion, there's no way to act proportionately to the action of the person who wronged you. If you're not able to make feelings in the relationship symmetrical, then what is the purpose?

[Blaze]

if i'm really angry and it can't go away, then i listen to angry music.

then i think about strategy with the person, balanced by relationships (you know cuz you can't go around blasting all your relationships or you're fucked).

then i implement the strategy and let it go. what is the strategy? depends on the person and what happened. but generally you can let Ti loose on things, along with some pumped up Se if ya can muster it.

[misutii]

lol this thread reminds me of a story my ENTp friend told me. He was late for class one day and the parking lot was full so he had to use a lot that he didn't have a pass for. An hour later he was returning to his car when he noticed that one those "university parking lot security" people, (if you take that job you have to be an asshole cuz you spend your days fining students that have no money) anyways she was just beginning to write him a ticket for like $50(having been given parking fines on multiple occassions he'd come to harbour a natural resentment to such situations). he immediately ran towards his car and jumped in, acknowledging the "university parking lot security" women's escalating authoritative demands to "WAIT!" as nothing more than music to his ears, he put the car in reverse, almost hit the pitiful creature badgering him, and then non-nonchalantly waved goodbye in that ironically adorable manner that only a self-justified ENTp is capable of, lol, i wish i could do that!

[oakey]

I absolutly hate it when people are not being honest with me! Dishonesty usually makes me want to call them out on it or become aggressive in some other way.

In bad sitututions, I become shifty in my resources! Sometimes I am able to ignore the value loss and have some fun with the competition/opposition.

Okay, I know that there is a similar thread on this, but I just want to expand on the anger aspect of it for ENTp's.

I just learned today that I got messed with by somebody and now there is nothing I can do about it. I am finding it difficult for me to stop being angry/pissy, how do other ENTp's deal with this, or do they all have the same problem? I remember Slava saying that he gets over these kinds of things by imagining something bad happening to that person. From my expeirance, I have always had this problem, I think other ENTp's might also, but that is what I want to talk about.

I have the opposite problem. I couldn't muster up the energy needed to exact revenge if I had to. I do get angry, but I'm usually the first to forget, want to make up, or if that's impossible, move on. I tend to have a negative reaction to people who are always talking about getting even with people because, in my opinion, there's no way to act proportionately to the action of the person who wronged you. If you're not able to make feelings in the relationship symmetrical, then what is the purpose?

Who said anything about symmetrical???

If something is worth doing its worth doing on a grand scale no?

Also i tend not to think of stuff as "revenge" but maybe "ultimate justice", obviously I can't fix what was wronged against me, but maybe for others...


As a short aside, I have always been a pretty big and strong guy, and very confident, but not really cocky. For some reason or another all the punks when i was growing up figured if they wanted to prove how cool they were they'd have to fight me... so I destroyed them, though I would never initiate battle without reason.

So most of the time I find it beneficial if not plain expedient to avoid violent confrontation, but on the other hand I realize there is a time and place. With that said I have always had the mindset that I never would fight to be fair, or really even "win" in a traditional sense, I tend to view things as survival or not survival. So long as I survive, I win. If I have to do battle you can bet if I have control it will be on the battlefield of my choosing and it will be overwhelming.

[reyn_til_runa]

Who said anything about symmetrical???

If something is worth doing its worth doing on a grand scale no?

Also i tend not to think of stuff as "revenge" but maybe "ultimate justice", obviously I can't fix what was wronged against me, but maybe for others...


As a short aside, I have always been a pretty big and strong guy, and very confident, but not really cocky. For some reason or another all the punks when i was growing up figured if they wanted to prove how cool they were they'd have to fight me... so I destroyed them, though I would never initiate battle without reason.

So most of the time I find it beneficial if not plain expedient to avoid violent confrontation, but on the other hand I realize there is a time and place. With that said I have always had the mindset that I never would fight to be fair, or really even "win" in a traditional sense, I tend to view things as survival or not survival. So long as I survive, I win. If I have to do battle you can bet if I have control it will be on the battlefield of my choosing and it will be overwhelming.

Fine. But how can you discriminate between fighting back for survival and fighting back for "ultimate justice"? The two seem contradictory, if you ask me. Oh, and I said something about symmetry because without it, I would find it difficult to decide that a purposeful angry reaction is "worth it."

[oakey]

Who said anything about symmetrical???

If something is worth doing its worth doing on a grand scale no?

Also i tend not to think of stuff as "revenge" but maybe "ultimate justice", obviously I can't fix what was wronged against me, but maybe for others...


As a short aside, I have always been a pretty big and strong guy, and very confident, but not really cocky. For some reason or another all the punks when i was growing up figured if they wanted to prove how cool they were they'd have to fight me... so I destroyed them, though I would never initiate battle without reason.

So most of the time I find it beneficial if not plain expedient to avoid violent confrontation, but on the other hand I realize there is a time and place. With that said I have always had the mindset that I never would fight to be fair, or really even "win" in a traditional sense, I tend to view things as survival or not survival. So long as I survive, I win. If I have to do battle you can bet if I have control it will be on the battlefield of my choosing and it will be overwhelming.

Fine. But how can you discriminate between fighting back for survival and fighting back for "ultimate justice"? The two seem contradictory, if you ask me. Oh, and I said something about symmetry because without it, I would find it difficult to decide that a purposeful angry reaction is "worth it."

my concept about "survival" and "ultimate justice" are two separate concepts and I did not intend for the twine to meet...

I think the short answer is that you have to assume responsibility for your actions and if a situation warrant only as much force as you are willing to accept responsibility for. If it is a question of my survival or that of a loved one then, deadly force... sure without hesitation. Compared to being killed jail time would be welcome.

Thats too easy though...

Lets make this more complicated...

A boss of mine was engaging in dubious ethical behavior resulting in him pilfering money from my account I was managing, which resulted in my wages being adversely effected to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars, at the same time while creating an extremely hostile work environment not to mention slandering his employees to our clients. I quit.
My intention was to bring documents to the better business bureau, and to our clients, possibly resulting in litigation for me to recoup my earnings.
Unfortunately due to outside circumstances my apartment was burglarized (by a different party) and my evidence was removed (along with my laptop and other electronics). Knowing that my counter would be ineffective without said evidence I moved on. I take some solace knowing that after I quit the entire operational staff quit within 2 several weeks.

What is "ultimate justice"? Me getting my wages, making sure my integrity is intact and making sure that my boss is unable to conduct business in his unethical manner.

Ultimately I was unable (or unwilling) to go forward with attaining that level of execution.

...

I discount entirely arguments of symmetry... but I guess that depends on having a firm basis on what reality is in the given scenario.

If for some reason I found myself in a basketball or football game I will abide by the rules because I can (generally) expect the same from a competitor. But imagine a situation where somebody mugs you... would you think.... ohh I better not fight back... after all he only wants my wallet?
He may well want your wallet, and surely my life is NOT worth the price of my wallet... but I don't know for sure he only wants my money, nor do I know that he is willing to harm or kill me to get my wallet, or that he may kill me regardless. So, will my reaction be assymetric sure...
If I throw him the wallet... he wins... I lose (ultimately I survive). If he tries to take it from me though I would have no qualms in using unthrottled force to save my potential loss of life.

I discount symmetry in most things of this nature... eye for an eye.. tooth for a tooth is just not good enough (though it is a start). Threefold, tenfold, or a thousandfold is more int eh right direction.