I related to both EIE descriptions, but much moreso EIE-Ni (which was under EIE-Fe -- they were backwards). I also related a fair bit to the IEI-Fe description.
I related to both EIE descriptions, but much moreso EIE-Ni (which was under EIE-Fe -- they were backwards). I also related a fair bit to the IEI-Fe description.
What do these signs mean—,
, etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason,
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function(extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
It simply isn't the case that an individual's "dual pair" is always the easiest for them to identify.Originally Posted by Aleksei
I suppose there may be some merit in using subtype descriptions as a means to help you decide which type best fits you in such a way, but I don't believe it is particularly helpful for it to be your first port of call.
Actually this is true for me as well.
Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx
Moved From Full type and subtype descriptions by V. Meged & A. Ovcharov
The descriptions are longer than this, they should be modified to include the full versions.
http://socionic.ru/index.php/2010-10...10-14-21-07-24
(i)NTFS
An ILI at rest tends to remain at rest
and an ILI in motion is probably not an ILI
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Meged/Ovcharov subtype descriptions only seem plausible if you squint
'Often lacks determination and confidence in himself.' Determination may be lacking, but a lack of self-confidence is somewhat inconsistent with 4D-L, particularly in gamma where there's an optimum way of doing things.
'In his soul he is--' speculation about others' souls is patently invalid. Even if such statements were made by a person of the same type, they could not be reliably extrapolated.
'Subject to frequent doubts and fluctuations. Through his strong intuition he is able to predict the outcome of any undertaking...' --These two lines are contradictory for ILI. To begin with, it's not 'frequent doubts and fluctuations', which sounds a bit frantic. Doubts can be pervasive. One chooses the best possible course knowing sometimes when the moment has come to decide, the outcome remains uncertain. As for predictions, horoscopes and things are most appreciated by those with weak Ni. Competence in the function regularly proves the byzantine complexity of multiple changing variables. The approach of Ne is therefore to select several of many possibilities and try them, with no attachment to outcomes if results are bad --'throw everything at the wall and see what sticks' (btw, if you want to test whether someone is XSI, behave this way and see if they hate it). Ni mentally eliminates unlikely/flawed possibilities, which can sometimes leave a best result or a single eventuality. At other times the road remains forked however; Ni typically feels no great need to correct this because before long things will have shifted, and waiting for aspects of a situation to become clear is often the best way to decide which route is preferable. I agree that Ni implies a sort of frenetic mind, but without the resultant neuroticism in behaviour that would be seen if such changeability frightened the one observing it. The psychic palm-reader type is often XEI-Fe with SEI being paradoxically common -- by contrast, ILI do not waste time making a lot of predictions when outcomes remain uncertain. In fact, putting stacked and nested conditional statements into words is a tiresome activity. Assuming I'm ILI, I'd add the analysis of a situation happens automatically --half-subconscious, it's usually gelled a bit by the time someone asks 'So what now?'. This gives the illusion of preparedness, but sometimes I've not prepared at all; it's more like id-NeTi are working in the back rooms to perform damage control, and the good solution is just ready at my fingertips when required (whereas during group brainstorming exercises I usually won't participate, and when asked what style of music I prefer or what television programmes Ive watched recently, I draw a blank). As dynamic types, ILI recognise the moment (as time moves forwards) when the situation changes -- a critical point -- after which the path no longer forks. Diversion before this point is possible, after this point it's futile. For this reason, ILI can ruminate for quite some time on a seemingly-trivial detail preceding an event if it forms a sort of 'key'. Lastly, the two quoted sentences would not be paired in any predominantly logical mind. I agree that ILI are lazy but most people will take action when it serves them, and like any NT type, ILI have a need to know why certain things happen, which includes thorough understanding of all relevant processes. To wit, if ILI successfully predicted any and therefore all outcomes, then they would no longer be subject to doubts. Doubt would be needlessly emotional.
'Prone to remembering his failures and mishaps for a long time.' -- Here at last one finds a perfectly true statementUnfortunately, I do not think this can be unique to ILI.
'Person of habit' -- personally I'm not. I've a fair bit of trouble forming beneficial habits such as sleeping at the same hour or going to the gym on a Monday, or whatever it is. If I'm around others who are behaving properly it's easier. Then again if I'm really immersed in something, no amount of good influence can help; I'll only stop when my blood sugar has dropped and my stomach looks concave and I've got to crawl out of my dark area on trembling limbs lol
'Dislikes unpleasant suprises' -- lol here's a shocker
'Rarely takes the initiative in interaction himself; doesn't want to seem intrusive' --This seems so unlikely. Again perhaps I'm not the epitome of the type but I can't worry about 'seeming intrusive'; it's quite essential that I eschew sowing seeds of social anxiety because I do work best when left well alone. People have described first impressons of me as 'aloof' or 'very wealthy'; in one way or another, looking down from some sort of height. Such impressions are false; in fact I quite enjoy being proved wrong when I've ostentatiously assumed the worst in others; but if there's any sort of supercilious vibe it's not surprising people won't approach me; coming over more ~approachable wouldn't suit my aims either. Even if it seems troublesome, this behaviour pattern, far from mutually exclusive with ILI archetype, almost guarantees that I shall be the one to open communications in all cases, unless dealing with one of those testing Ep types, the sort to stick both hands into the fire to see how hot it gets. In dating, I've had enough people fancy me but wait for me to make the first move that it's come to seem propositioning is my natural role (Which isn't without comedic effect -- sometimes I have been so blind with terror when asking someone on a date that I've come over very stony-faced and been asked if I was taking the mickey lol. And the near-certainty that my feelings were mutual in a few cases did nothing to lessen the stage-fright). Viz., taking the initiative cannot possibly be uncommon for ILI, and meekly worrying about 'intrusion' instead of just reading the situation can't be too common either.
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