View Poll Results: Slavoj Zizek's type?

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  • ILE (ENTp)

    1 25.00%
  • SEI (ISFp)

    0 0%
  • ESE (ESFj)

    0 0%
  • LII (INTj)

    1 25.00%
  • SLE (ESTp)

    0 0%
  • IEI (INFp)

    1 25.00%
  • EIE (ENFj)

    1 25.00%
  • LSI (ISTj)

    0 0%
  • SEE (ESFp)

    0 0%
  • ILI (INTp)

    0 0%
  • LIE (ENTj)

    0 0%
  • ESI (ISFj)

    0 0%
  • IEE (ENFp)

    1 25.00%
  • SLI (ISTp)

    0 0%
  • LSE (ESTj)

    0 0%
  • EII (INFj)

    0 0%
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Thread: Slavoj Zizek

  1. #1
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    Default Slavoj Zizek

    A famous Slovenian philosopher. Known for political stances on Socialism and attempts at running for office in Slovenia. His teachings on French psychoanalyst Jacques Lacan, materialism vs idealism, and numerous other subjects have made him a "celebrity" of sorts in the European intellectual community, and his influence is beginning to bleed into mainstream American academia as he tours college campuses (mine included ).

    I'm pretty sure of his type. Any thoughts?

     










    Slavoj quotes:

    "When I really love someone, I can only show it by making aggressive and bad-taste remarks." — Slavoj Zizek

    "You could say, in a vulgar Freudian way, that I am the unhappy child who escapes into books. Even as a child, I was most happy being alone. This has not changed." — Slavoj Zizek

    "Humanity is OK, but 99% of people are boring idiots." — Slavoj Zizek

    "In contrast to the situation in 1945, the world does not need the US; it is the US that needs the rest of the world." — Slavoj Zizek

    "Words are never 'only words'; they matter because they define the contours of what we can do." — Slavoj Zizek

    "We feel free because we lack the very language to articulate our unfreedom."

    "As soon as we renounce fiction and illusion, we lose reality itself; the moment we subtract fictions from reality, reality itself loses its discursive-logical consistency."

    "I am a good Hegelian. If you have a good theory, forget about the reality."

    "Do not blame people and their attitudes: the problem is not corruption or greed, the problem is the system that pushes you to be corrupt. The solution is not, "Main Street, not Wall Street," but to change the system where Main Street cannot function without Wall Street."

    "Because the horror of Communism, Stalinism, is not that bad people do bad things — they always do. It's that good people do horrible things thinking they are doing something great."

    "We're not dreamers. We're awaking from a dream turning into a nightmare. We're not destroying anything. We're watching the system destroy itself."

    "Our biological body itself is a form of hardware that needs re-programming through tantra like a new spiritual software which can release or unblock its potential."

    "I’m not a good father. There is something ridiculous in asserting my dignity which I resist automatically. My teenage son identifies with this undermining of my own authority. When he was 14, I was mad at him and used a vulgar expression in Slovenian: “Let the dog fuck your mother.” He replied: “That already happened 15 years ago. That’s how I was born."

    "I’m unable to have one-night stands. In my city, Ljubljana, you can tell exactly which women I’ve slept with, because I married them."

    "When we are shown scenes of starving children in Africa, with a call for us to do something to help them, the underlying ideological message is something like: "Don't think, don't politicize, forget about the true causes of their poverty, just act, contribute money, so that you will not have to think!"

    "The liberal idea of tolerance is more and more a kind of intolerance. What it means is 'Leave me alone; don't harass me; I'm intolerant towards your over-proximity."

    "The problem for us is not are our desires satisfied or not. The problem is how do we know what we desire."

    "If you have reasons to love someone, you don’t love them. ... Love feels like a great misfortune, a monstrous parasite, a permanent state of emergency that ruins all small pleasures."

    "In a traditional German toilet, the hole into which shit disappears after we flush is right at the front, so that shit is first laid out for us to sniff and inspect for traces of illness. In the typical French toilet, on the contrary, the hole is at the back, i.e. shit is supposed to disappear as quickly as possible. Finally, the American (Anglo-Saxon) toilet presents a synthesis, a mediation between these opposites: the toilet basin is full of water, so that the shit floats in it, visible, but not to be inspected. [...] It is clear that none of these versions can be accounted for in purely utilitarian terms: each involves a certain ideological perception of how the subject should relate to excrement. Hegel was among the first to see in the geographical triad of Germany, France and England an expression of three different existential attitudes: reflective thoroughness (German), revolutionary hastiness (French), utilitarian pragmatism (English). In political terms, this triad can be read as German conservatism, French revolutionary radicalism and English liberalism. [...] The point about toilets is that they enable us not only to discern this triad in the most intimate domain, but also to identify its underlying mechanism in the three different attitudes towards excremental excess: an ambiguous contemplative fascination; a wish to get rid of it as fast as possible; a pragmatic decision to treat it as ordinary and dispose of it in an appropriate way. It is easy for an academic at a round table to claim that we live in a post-ideological universe, but the moment he visits the lavatory after the heated discussion, he is again knee-deep in ideology."




    Last edited by silke; 03-28-2017 at 01:23 AM. Reason: updated links
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  2. #2
    Hot Message FDG's Avatar
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    Ne-ILE or NE-LII
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  3. #3
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Negatory
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  4. #4

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    still say alpha NT.

  5. #5
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    SLE logical sub. Listening to his basic explanations of some concepts is like picking grains of salt out of a pepper shaker. Not much Ne to speak of, but he's got more Ti than #22 on the periodic table.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan
    SLE logical sub. Listening to his basic explanations of some concepts is like picking grains of salt out of a pepper shaker. Not much Ne to speak of, but he's got more Ti than #22 on the periodic table.
    Ah, so that's why it's so easy for me to understand what he says?
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  7. #7
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    Probably, although I didn't know that to be the case with anyone He claims to simplify Lacan, but he really only succeeds in butchering and popularizing it, IMO
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan
    but he's got more Ti than #22 on the periodic table.
    That's one of the nerdiest jokes I've ever heard on this forum... which is quite an accomplisment.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  9. #9
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    I try.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  10. #10

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    I hate to say it, but it's somehow worse then niffweed. :/
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  11. #11
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    I'm over it.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    I hate to say it, but it's somehow worse then niffweed. :/
    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    take me back. i'll do anything.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    I hate to say it, but it's somehow worse then niffweed. :/
    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    take me back. i'll do anything.
    OK, what's the 84th decimal of pi; go, NOW.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    √7

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    I have a prof. who calls this guy "Slavvy Z." She studied with him at UChicago, and says that in person, that he's pretty much a thoughtless lecher...
    Some of his articles don't seem well-researched.

    ENTp (?)

    I know that there's a movie about him--haven't seen it though.

  16. #16
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    Yeah, I've seen it. The guy is a total riot, but he's smart as fuck. However, he tends to complicate just about everything that he explains, which is the antithesis of ILE-dom, plus he's Beta off the wall; thus, SLE logical.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  17. #17
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    Waait. Since when complicating things that one explains is a trait of SLEs??
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  18. #18
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    Weak Ne...less of an ability (or at least more effort required) to understand and explain concepts in their most basic, essential terms.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  19. #19
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    Default Slavoj Zizek

    This guy is awesome.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavoj_zizek









    My impression of his type was INTp.

  20. #20
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    It gets better...


  21. #21
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    Edit: I am debating this.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  22. #22
    ILE - ENTp 1981slater's Avatar
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    This man is clearly an ENTp , that's for sure!

    He is promoting changes, new ways of thinking, etc
    ILE "Searcher"
    Socionics: ENTp
    DCNH: Dominant --> perhaps Normalizing
    Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
    MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
    Astrological sign: Aquarius

    To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.

  23. #23
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    OK. I could be swayed to that position.

    In case this is relevant, though, he is very much a Narrator rather than Taciturn.


    This is the most awkward thing I've seen in a long time:


    Would have called it ESFj-INTp conflict if I hadn't known better.
    Last edited by krieger; 01-12-2009 at 11:21 AM.

  24. #24
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    The interesting thing about hearing Zizek speak, and part of what makes him hard to follow, is the way he jumps around so much. He quite obviously works with a cohesive background of psychoanalytic assumptions, a set of beliefs about how the world works, and instead of making broad judgments or points about the things he analyzes, he merely skips from one point to the next, analyzing each in its individual significance, using his analytic "tools" on each, and moving on to the next thought. For example, in his discussion of Children of Men, he doesn't try to tie his analyses of the various constituent parts of the movie together into a cohesive opinion about the significance or direction of the movie; he simply talks about different things he likes about the movie, what they stand for, and the point he thinks they are trying to make.

    I think this is more characteristic of an Ne type than an Ni type. ILE is my opinion.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat View Post

    This is the most awkward thing I've seen in a long time:
    My first impression and guess is an ENTJ-Te.

    He's quite certain an EJ or EP temperament since his gestures nearly created a local tornado.

    I have a hard time seeing an INTP in him. But still it's possible.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    That seems less characteristic of someone with Ne in their ego though. An Ne ego would be willing to unite different constituents parts of the movie under the banner of a single theoretical conception. But he does seem to do a bit of that in the "The Sound of Music is racist" video.

    Furthermore, the use of different analytic "tools" strongly implies a Te type rather than a Ti type (or in some cases a beta ST).
    I disagree with all of this.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  27. #27
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    Furthermore, the use of different analytic "tools" strongly implies a Te type rather than a Ti type (or in some cases a beta ST).
    Then again, he is a psychoanalyst... That indicates Ti if anything does. I'm not sure what you are refering to when you say he uses Te-like tools as mostly he seems to be using pretty unscientific ones.

    How should that host be typed if Zizek is ENTp? IMO there is some pretty obvious intertype conflict going on there.

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    ILE - ENTp 1981slater's Avatar
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    ENTjs are dry, matter-of-fact, no-nonsense, serious, distrustful, exact and distant. Take as an example the character "Dick Jones" in Robocop.

    ENTjs are energetic, engaging, jokers, mobile and aggressive. Take as an example the character "Bob Morton" in Robocop, or John Hammond (Jurassic Park).

    Examples of ENTps: , Doc Brown (Back to the future), Dr Malcolm (Jurassic Park)
    Last edited by 1981slater; 01-12-2009 at 11:50 AM.
    ILE "Searcher"
    Socionics: ENTp
    DCNH: Dominant --> perhaps Normalizing
    Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
    MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
    Astrological sign: Aquarius

    To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.

  29. #29
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    Doc Brown's mind was always scattered all over the place. I think better examples of Ti ENTps would be that captain of Enterprise, and the leader of the team of Stargate SG1 (names be damned).

    In support of Doc Brown being Ti sub, he put quite a bit of energy into putting his ideas to practice.

    Not that I put stock in sub-typings, though.

  30. #30
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    IP temperament does not seem like a good fit for him at all, imo
    INFj

    9w1 sp/sx

  31. #31
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    Is Alpha NT a good fit...? I think there is quite a bit distinguishing him from a guy like slater, for example. He seems almost Beta in his fanaticism.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
    I think better examples of Ti ENTps would be that captain of Enterprise
    I really hope you don't mean Picard, because he is a textbook Se-IJ.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
    Is Alpha NT a good fit...? I think there is quite a bit distinguishing him from a guy like slater, for example. He seems almost Beta in his fanaticism.
    You know, he's really hard to pin down in a Quadra sense. He does seem to have a bit of Beta "revolutionary" in him; I can't remember the last time a self-proclaimed philosopher ran for high political office anywhere, especially with the notion of implementing his philosophical ideals in leading a country. His ideas are very radical not simply in a "this is strange and unusual" kind of sense, but also in that they aggressively question the way people see the world at large. Also, his dismissive, sometimes aggressive, or even downright demeaning attitudes towards other philosophies (see the clip on vegetarians) is not very Alpha-esque.

    Also note that his primary influences, Freud and Lacan, are both likely Betas, whose work consist primarily of Ni-esque ideas of personal psychological development and are very much geared towards the idea of there being predominant memes or themes that govern people's attitudes or relations to the outside world.

    Maybe we should consider IEI? That might help explain the unstructured appearance of his analyses, as well as the fact that he is as much a celebrity as a philosopher.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  34. #34
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    Ok, here is a quote for the ages that, to me, points towards Lacan being Beta NF:

    "The less you understand, the better you listen."

    Classic.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  35. #35
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    I really hope you don't mean Picard, because he is a textbook Se-IJ.
    I meant the series Enterprise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_Enterprise

    I agree with the Picard typing... I personally favor ISFj over ISTj. If Picard was ISTj, the enterprise would be ran and flown like a klingon warbird.

    His ideas are very radical not simply in a "this is strange and unusual" kind of sense, but also in that they aggressively question the way people see the world at large. Also, his dismissive, sometimes aggressive, or even downright demeaning attitudes towards other philosophies (see the clip on vegetarians) is not very Alpha-esque.
    Exactly. Very well said... Now I don't really think I could see him as Feeling, because it is particularly the firmness of his standpoints that stands out in him. There's nothing social or agreeable about the man either. Just look at that bit in the talkshow...

  36. #36
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    I have a feeling that Smilingeyes would be very quick to designate this guy the neutral Creating Ti type: ExTp. The focus is completely on the firm interpretatory message that is presented in the form of a narrative. There's the world of ideas on one hand (Ne) and societial action on the other (Se), but both are kept at a distance so that the link between the two is as clearly as possible in view...

    Also: under the smilexian interpretation, an introvert function (such as Ti) signifies the maximally steep increase of Narrator. The point at which the need and oppurtunity to start declaring is a strongly as possible felt.
    Last edited by krieger; 01-12-2009 at 06:49 PM.

  37. #37
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    Funny, my initial typing of him was SLE. Perhaps this is worthy of consideration?

    But, please, don't bring Smilexian Socionics into this...
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  38. #38
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
    Exactly. Very well said... Now I don't really think I could see him as Feeling, because it is particularly the firmness of his standpoints that stands out in him. There's nothing social or agreeable about the man either. Just look at that bit in the talkshow...
    You would agree that Hitler was rather firm in his standpoints, no? And I think we are all in accord that he is EIE. I think it's unreasonable to discount the possibility of an ethical type simply because of his "firmness;" if anything, I would relate it to Se values.

    As for the talk show, I see an intelligent intellectual with an accent trying to make a point in as little time as possible while a relatively unintelligent and uninterested reporter makes attempts to seem intruiged and in agreement with what is being said. Yeah, it's awkward, but I don't know if there's anything that makes me necessarily think, "Wow, what a logical type!"

    However I am willing to consider SLE, as I have in the past. As far as VI goes, I think it makes more sense.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    from his appearance and mannerisms i would have approximated the same for zizek, but my impression of how he communicates is that it is atypical of ENTps. he doesn't have the same slant towards being systematic & self-consistent with his arguments, tying all the loose ends into a neat little knot (which is a recurring theme IME w/ ENTps). he's a lot more comfortable with being completely scattered, touching only superficially on topics and then moving on very quickly to the next -- i'm not sure how to describe it, but in my mind it appears as a constant stream of images contorting in and out of focus because i can't predict whatsoever where the topic is leading up to, and in the end i'm left more confused than i started out with. i tend to correlate this w/ Beta Ni in my mind.

  40. #40

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