How to find/spot LSIs-ISTjs: observations, stories, experiences

[anndelise]

We had one disagreement. I had to tuck my daughter into bed before we could work on resolving that disagreement. During that 5 minutes time, he made some kind of decision and left without a word, and I never heard from him again.

Holy shit!

yeah, that did a number on me
at least until I realized that if that was how he handled arguments, then his leaving was in both of our interests

[snegledmaca]

I doubt a disagreement would make a person just walk out like that. My guess is that he just couldn't take it anymore, what ever it was, realized that there is nothing he can do about it other then to free himself from whatever it was.

[anndelise]

I doubt a disagreement would make a person just walk out like that. My guess is that he just couldn't take it anymore, what ever it was, realized that there is nothing he can do about it other then to free himself from whatever it was.

the disagreement involved one of the rules I had for my daughter.
we lived in an area where things got stolen very easily...one blink and whoop there it went...okok, one blink with the back turned. So one of my rules was that before my daughter could play in the playground area, we had to first put her tricycle away (we lived right next to the park...and I mean right next to it). Once in a while she'd fight the rule, wanting what she wanted then and there instead of waiting a couple of minutes to put the tricycle away, but all in all, she was accepting the rule.

One day, the ISTj and I had been walking around the park following my daughter as she rode her tricycle. Then she decided she wanted to play in the playground area. So we started walking towards the apt so she could put the tricycle away. We had to walk somewhat past the playground to get to the apt. My daughter didn't start fussing until the ISTj asked weren't we going to the playground. I told him that we had to put her tricycle away. He said he'd take her to the playground and I could put it away. I said no, that I was trying to teach her to put her own toys away. Then he complained that she was too young to learn that (she was about 3yo). I told him that she'd been doing good about it so far. By this time, manta had either caught on to the possibility that she could get out of putting her trike away...or had somehow caught some thought that we wouldn't be going to the playground, and she threw one of her major hissy fits (aka screaming fits). So, now I'm stuck trying to calm her down, get the tricycle home, AND listen to him throwing things out of proportion (as if I was demanding she carry the trike upstairs herself!). ... Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground. I was livid at that. But, I took the bike home and then went to the playground to play with my daughter. After she was done, we went to the apt, I told him I'd be right back, that I had to tuck her in, he stayed about halfway through my tucking her into bed, and then left just before I came back to the livingroom.


He didn't like my driving, so we had him drive my car.
He didn't care so much for my spontaneity, so I tried to tone it down and do a little more planning.
If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.

[Mariano Rajoy]

An LII friend of 10+ years did something simliar to a girl he was living with. She went to the supermarket and he knew that she would be about twenty minutes, so he took his most imprtant possesions and chucked em in the car and left in about fifteen minutes.

He never spoke to her again.

I have thought about about doing something similar with past relationships, but have always chosen to tell her face to face that it's not what I want. I can't decide which way is easier though.

[snegledmaca]

If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.

Sounds to me he was defying you and you him. A pretty big clue that something is very wrong.

[anndelise]

If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.

Sounds to me he was defying you and you him. A pretty big clue that something is very wrong.

how does my letting him drive my car and my trying to tone down my spontaneity suggest defiance?

how does not being aware that there is something wrong = a big clue that there is something wrong?

[Mariano Rajoy]

I don't think anyone was defying anyone else. It is just Ti hard at work, which tends to shut off those Fe messages.

It doesn't surprise me in the least that Ann didn't have a tiny clue about him. Not that she should either. It is just the nature of the personality interaction...

[snegledmaca]

If there were other issues, he never brought them up to me, nor gave so much as a tiny clue.

Sounds to me he was defying you and you him. A pretty big clue that something is very wrong.

how does my letting him drive my car and my trying to tone down my spontaneity suggest defiance?

It's not from there that I got that impression, it's from this segment

Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground.

where it seems to me like he's carrying out his will regardless of and despite your wishes. Seems to me he was just brushing you aside, in essence defying you.

[anndelise]

It's not from there that I got that impression, it's from this segment

Just as I finally get her to start pedaling home, he bodily lifts her out of the tricycle and carries her over to the playground.

where it seems to me like he's carrying out his will regardless of and despite your wishes. Seems to me he was just brushing you aside, in essence defying you.

Oh that, yeah, i can see his defiance there.
But where do you see me defying him? Because I wanted to keep the toy return training in effect? I guess one could look at it as me defying his desire in how to raise my child. But my focus wasn't on defying him....but on keeping to the rules she and I had. (which, considering how my daughter is when it comes to rules, was very important)

But yeah, that incident was a sign that something was wrong, but I felt that clearly communicating with each other could have solved that. He's one of the few guys from my past that I felt could have been a good father figure for my daughter.

(and no, i was not looking for a father figure for my daughter, but it was something I always had to keep in mind when dating)

[Slacker]

He was an ass, and if he disagreed with how you were raising your daughter, he should have talked to you about it out of her earshot.

And you said you dated him briefly so it doesn't sound to me like he was there long enough to get a full vote on that topic anyway.

<3

[anndelise]

He was an ass, and if he disagreed with how you were raising your daughter, he should have talked to you about it out of her earshot.

And you said you dated him briefly so it doesn't sound to me like he was there long enough to get a full vote on that topic anyway.

<3

I agree with you on the everything but the ass part.
While he responded like an ass this one time, that very well could have been why he left like he did (cuz he felt like he'd acted like an ass). Also, considering how loud my daughter's screaming fits are, it's not like one can think nor keep one's cool around that.

[zillah]

I know one male ISTJ that thinks he has the right to hand out judgements and advice on parenting to people he hardly knows. It's really offensive and hurtful. Advice is one thing but "you need to get that little bastard under control" = instant zero respect.

On the way that guy walked out of the situation... I don't know what it was about for him, but I have done that a couple of times. I was in a position of dependence on others to get my needs met and they weren't interested, so rather than feel helpless I just left. Kindof a tactic of last resort but better than humiliation. I wonder what was the trigger for him.

[anndelise]

On the way that guy walked out of the situation... I don't know what it was about for him, but I have done that a couple of times. I was in a position of dependence on others to get my needs met and they weren't interested, so rather than feel helpless I just left. Kindof a tactic of last resort but better than humiliation. I wonder what was the trigger for him.

How do you make your needs known prior to walking out?
some people put them into words
some people ask questions
some people drop hints/clues
some people expect the other person to psychically know them
some people expect the need meeting to be an automatic personality trait of the other person

(i used to be a hint/clue person, over the years I've learned to put my most important needs to be met into words and actually talk about them, now I'm a combo of talking it out and seeking the personality trait that automatically covers the important needs)

[zillah]

How do you make your needs known prior to walking out?

Depends. 2x I can think of I told my family outright what I needed. "I need sleep" (on holiday, sick and sleeping in the lounge, my brother & his friend were watching dawn cartoons next to my head) "I need food" (I was shaken and tired after travelling, sick again, to a difficult singing audition but my mum was only interested in shopping.) The responses were "Everything's fine" and "Stop being selfish" respectively so I employed my feet. Another time I was with someone I didn't know so well, who dragged me along to hang with her best friends, who I hadn't met. I didn't want to, but she was set on it and I don't voice my opinions so strongly to someone unless I know them well. They closed up their clique and ignored me totally, and she did nothing about it, only talking to them, so I left without a word. It was rude cause her family had put me up for the night, but she put me in an intolerable situation where I had no power but to leave. With more extreme provocations I would occasionally explode in rage and attack the relevant person. Or just the nearest one. Ain't teenagers fun.

[FDG]

I would enjoy being raged all over by you, zillah

[zillah]

[Search]

I am experiencing something similar myself with an ISTJ.
I dont think he had any issues (or major ones, at least not that he expressed to me) with me, as a matter of fact he said he found something in me he had never experienced with another woman or even another person in his life. Sanctity.
We made plans that fell though because of his military orders which sent him overseas, as the date got closer and closer he unexplainedly got 'further' from me, dropping out of site and touch for periods of time....and now he left over a month ago telling me he would be in contact as soon as he got settled and NOTHING. Not a Happy Holidays, nothing...however a forum we both post at he has been on and off for over a week!

I am shocked and perplexed............

[Ms. Kensington]

Sorry, but didn't you say you were ESFp?

[Search]

um, no.......is that a joke I am missing?

???

[UDP]

One recent experience with an ISTj

The worst kind of religious follower.
Her home, a momument to christ.
Christianity, and being saved, was her duty and honor.
But it only served her Se purposes, it provided the Ti base for her mind, but it was all about Se.
Her mind eventually became warped, and she would rationlize things for Se purposes.


A negative example, yes, but it really surprised me. I didn't realize how much that person was not really sincere. In the end she just demonstrated herself as shalllow and self serving, kind of the ultimate sort of hypocrite. But it is so deadly dangerous because in hermind, she can do nothing wrong. She has a long list of failed relationships to prove it, too... but she cannot accept that she was at fault.

That is what scares me about Ti.
Ti Se isn't necessarily any more rational or realistic, or 'real/true' than Ti Ne, as I once assumed it to be.

[Rocky]

One recent experience with an ISTj

The worst kind of religious follower.
Her home, a momument to christ.
Christianity, and being saved, was her duty and honor.
But it only served her Se purposes, it provided the Ti base for her mind, but it was all about Se.
Her mind eventually became warped, and she would rationlize things for Se purposes.


A negative example, yes, but it really surprised me. I didn't realize how much that person was not really sincere. In the end she just demonstrated herself as shalllow and self serving, kind of the ultimate sort of hypocrite. But it is so deadly dangerous because in hermind, she can do nothing wrong. She has a long list of failed relationships to prove it, too... but she cannot accept that she was at fault.

That is what scares me about Ti.
Ti Se isn't necessarily any more rational or realistic, or 'real/true' than Ti Ne, as I once assumed it to be.

I don't think you can blame this on type... lots of types believe in religion... I'm more agnostic but still...

[xiuxiu]

i think they're funny. the females can be quite alluring in more visually pleasing physical vessels. dave attell is istj i think.

[vague]

people seem to be bringing up that ISTjs believe they are the authority on what one can and can not do. i often feel as though they are my supervisor. they tend to irritate others by pointing out flaws the same way a child only does the low kick with vega to defeat opponents. they would shout and say that you can not do that but the ability was still there when the next fight began. i played street fighter 2 after school with an ISTj in the making who took joy in annoying others. i am reminded of these afternoons every time i work with an ISTj. training on the job with one was the worst. i deviated from the fixed method and though my end result was the same, it was for naught in the ISTj's eyes because it was not carried out in a particular way.

my father and a friend are ISTjs. a commonality i notice is they both have standards and ideals they hold others to but fail to meet themselves. my ISTj friend says he could never respect or be in a relationship with a girl who parties and drinks but this is practically all he does in his recreational time. my father has threatened to disown me if I ever do some of the things he did in younger years. both also come off as very serious in unfamilar social situations but are really goofy and fun around people they are close to.

overall, my relations with ISTjs have been positive, just not in the workplace. i will type of positive experiences later when my thoughts are more coherent. i failed to use capitalization and i will not fix it. this flaw would have bothered me in the past. i am proud.

[Exodus]

One recent experience with an ISTj

The worst kind of religious follower.
Her home, a momument to christ.
Christianity, and being saved, was her duty and honor.
But it only served her Se purposes, it provided the Ti base for her mind, but it was all about Se.
Her mind eventually became warped, and she would rationlize things for Se purposes.


A negative example, yes, but it really surprised me. I didn't realize how much that person was not really sincere. In the end she just demonstrated herself as shalllow and self serving, kind of the ultimate sort of hypocrite. But it is so deadly dangerous because in hermind, she can do nothing wrong. She has a long list of failed relationships to prove it, too... but she cannot accept that she was at fault.

That is what scares me about Ti.
Ti Se isn't necessarily any more rational or realistic, or 'real/true' than Ti Ne, as I once assumed it to be.

I think most of this is due to Ni HA.

my father and a friend are ISTjs. a commonality i notice is they both have standards and ideals they hold others to but fail to meet themselves.

Yeah, I often feel this way about my ISTj mother. Weak Fi + weak Ne = inability to put yourself in someone else's shoes.

overall, my relations with ISTjs have been positive, just not in the workplace.

That's typical of activity relations.

[WVBRY]

I personally like the female ones. They are one of the sexier types I think, lol.

Seriously though, havent had much experience with them, except more in aqcuintance than in long term relationships, so its hard to say. I like the sensory subtypes better, they are more sociable, the logcal ones are bit different, a bit less communicative perhaps. There was one that went to my acting school, she majored in law but wanted to take acting to discover "her passionate half", but she left after the first semester as it was too hard for her to juggle both the acting classes and the extensive college cirriculum she had. I got along with her well, I think she liked me partly because in the first excercise of the year, I chose her to play in my scene. She got along well with everyone though, she knew how and wasnt a shy or withdrawn person at all. She gave the impression of being rich and coming from a big house in the suburbs, she wore classy clothes and just had a certain aura to her.

[pezzonovante]

My friend used to be roommates with this ISTJ who was incredibly anal about his stuff. He kept it meticulously clean and organized, with everything always in the same spot. So of course I couldn't help but move things around slightly whenever he was gone .

[Dorian]

His line of thinking seemed to be, "you are useless, but why should I tell you that or even show that I think that? It won't change anything since you can't change, since you're useless. I will just destroy you as soon as I can, which is just fair since you're useless."

This fits exactly

[felafel]

I am experiencing something similar myself with an ISTJ.
I dont think he had any issues (or major ones, at least not that he expressed to me) with me, as a matter of fact he said he found something in me he had never experienced with another woman or even another person in his life. Sanctity.
We made plans that fell though because of his military orders which sent him overseas, as the date got closer and closer he unexplainedly got 'further' from me, dropping out of site and touch for periods of time....and now he left over a month ago telling me he would be in contact as soon as he got settled and NOTHING. Not a Happy Holidays, nothing...however a forum we both post at he has been on and off for over a week!

I am shocked and perplexed............

bump

islandgirl, i've had an almost identical experience with an istj i was dating a couple of years back(save the military part). honestly (and this is biased) i think it is extremly difficult to maintain a relationship with an istj (enfj's and esfj's are much better at that).

As for him disapearing, beware that while away he might have just revised his entire "system" of feelings towards you and decided to go a different way (not tryign to freak you out). On the other hand, i might be perfectly wrong.

Any esfj's or enfj's around here 'd be able to help you out much better than me in this situation (if it is some advise you'r elookign for... )

cheers

[felafel]

An LII friend of 10+ years did something simliar to a girl he was living with. She went to the supermarket and he knew that she would be about twenty minutes, so he took his most imprtant possesions and chucked em in the car and left in about fifteen minutes.

He never spoke to her again.

I have thought about about doing something similar with past relationships, but have always chosen to tell her face to face that it's not what I want. I can't decide which way is easier though.

this is hilarious! i've had sth like that happen to me in the past (well, now i can laugh about it). ISTJs are (in my biased opinion) crazy crazy when it comes to break-ups (sth like what you're explaining...or alolng those lines)

[Expat]

The chief accountant where I work is a female ISTj I think (I mean I think she's ISTj, I'm rather sure she's female).

Hmm -- that's it. It's fitting though.

[Dorian]

Ive wrote a thread called "Understanding ISTJ"

view here:
http://similarminds.com/forums/viewt...t=1268&start=0


And here is some ISTJ humor:

http://www.snabbstart.com/flash/fd2e372c44

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdHpYMR4ljY
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSwYMHkZgLg&watch_response

[Dioklecian]

Ive wrote a thread called "Understanding ISTJ"

view here:
http://similarminds.com/forums/viewt...t=1268&start=0


And here is some ISTJ humor:

http://www.snabbstart.com/flash/fd2e372c44

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdHpYMR4ljY
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSwYMHkZgLg&watch_response

Would you say that Germany is ISTJ by the way? And where does your nick come from?

[Dorian]

Ive wrote a thread called "Understanding ISTJ"

view here:
http://similarminds.com/forums/viewt...t=1268&start=0


And here is some ISTJ humor:

http://www.snabbstart.com/flash/fd2e372c44

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdHpYMR4ljY
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSwYMHkZgLg&watch_response

Would you say that Germany is ISTJ by the way? And where does your nick come from?

I would say germany is INTj. But i dislike categorizing countries into types, i think it works as long a you aint living there.

What makes a country a type? The government? Whats written in the newspapers? How many people of one kind living there? I dont know wehre to start categorizing.

My nick comes from "The Picture of Dorian Gray", a book written by oscar wilde.

[Dioklecian]

Ive wrote a thread called "Understanding ISTJ"

view here:
http://similarminds.com/forums/viewt...t=1268&start=0


And here is some ISTJ humor:

http://www.snabbstart.com/flash/fd2e372c44

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdHpYMR4ljY
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSwYMHkZgLg&watch_response

Would you say that Germany is ISTJ by the way? And where does your nick come from?

I would say germany is INTj. But i dislike categorizing countries into types, i think it works as long a you aint living there.

What makes a country a type? The government? Whats written in the newspapers? How many people of one kind living there? I dont know wehre to start categorizing.

My nick comes from "The Picture of Dorian Gray", a book written by oscar wilde.

-I have long thought that Grmany could well be INTJ

-A country's type is more about culture and values in my opinion.

[Dorian]

A country's type is more about culture and values in my opinion.

Yes but if you'd live here you didnt see the culture cause youre involved in.
If im in another Country, like france, i see whats different in their culture cause i can compare.

Also there are many different traditional german cultures and some new-age-no- culture big city culture.

If i'd have to say something about germany i would say i feel like its a intj country.

[Dioklecian]

A country's type is more about culture and values in my opinion.

Yes but if you'd live here you didnt see the culture cause youre involved in.
If im in another Country, like france, i see whats different in their culture cause i can compare.

Also there are many different traditional german cultures and some new-age-no- culture big city culture.

If i'd have to say something about germany i would say i feel like its a intj country.

What about all the prussian military history? Armies, genocide, gestapo, that sort of thing?

[snegledmaca]

I think it's Austria that is LSI. Germany seems LII to me as well.

[Dioklecian]

I think it's Austria that is LSI. Germany seems LII to me as well.

Austria is ISFJ I think.

[Dorian]

What about all the prussian military history? Armies, genocide, gestapo, that sort of thing?

Ive you were german you'd know that its soooo funny hearing this stuff over and over again.

Its just not that present anymore. Its not my gerneration. I have no relationship to it.

There are some dump guys calling themselves nazis cause they are fuckt up about germany has become that liberal that everyone foreigner is able to move in without any problems. Often you feel that there are over 50% foreigners in our cuntry, i have no problem with that.

But its a wound point in our history so everyone is getting crasy if they hear "nazi", because of that our society chokes every nazi flame coming up. There is a 0 tolerance for it.

[Dioklecian]

I don't want to promote stereotypes, however Prussia (not necessarily modern Germany) has a very significant military tradition, that is what I had in mind.