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Thread: Johann Sebastian Bach

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    Default Johann Sebastian Bach









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    Oh come on, someone must have an idea about Bach's type. He had such a distinctive face; that must count for something.

    Here are some ideas that have been put forth before:

    INTj because his music's unfolding of ideas sounds like "inner logic."
    ESTj because he was a practical musician, and family man, and very prolific (in both areas)
    INTp because people who seem INTj are really INTp
    ...or...you fill in the blank.

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    I can give you my opinion on the Skid Row's singer. ESFp.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    For his industriousness that touches every area of his life, from work to home (lots of musical compositions and kids): EJ temperament

    That gives four choices: ESTj, ENFj, ENTj, ESFj

    Maybe ESTj.

    (You aren't gonna take this seriously)

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    Quote Originally Posted by stefana
    For his industriousness that touches every area of his life, from work to home (lots of musical compositions and kids): EJ temperament

    That gives four choices: ESTj, ENFj, ENTj, ESFj

    Maybe ESTj.

    (You aren't gonna take this seriously)
    Well, you're not the first person to say ESTj. But here's where I have trouble...

    First of all, the general argument: Talking about ESTj in particular, people say that someone is ESTj as soon as industriousness is brought up.

    For example, once on this forum, someone said that Orson Welles was ESTj. Why? For no other reason than that he did a lot of stuff.

    I mean, I'm not saying Orson Welles wasn't ESTj; it's just that the person had no other reason except that he did stuff.

    Don't other people do stuff? I mean, being industrious in a solitary activity like composition could also indicate I. Certainly, there are lots of types who accomplished a lot of things. I've noticed also that some ENTps often get an amazing amount of stuff done, almost effortlessly. In fact, I know people of all sorts of types who get lots of things done.

    So much for my rant about industriousness=ESTj or =Ej.

    But the other problem I have is that whenever I do something out of the ordinary, especially in composition...say if I write a choral piece, or a fugue or something....it always seems that it's an ESTj who criticizes the impracticality: "That's too hard for an amateur group." "Why did you write something so elaborate?" "That wasn't the assignment. In 18th century counterpoint, you don't start a fugue in D minor and modulate to G# minor."

    And yet Bach seemed to be the intellectual explorer, always coming up with these weird twisting motifs. And he also got into a lot of trouble himself, writing stuff that others thought was too difficult to sing, or hard for the congregation to follow.

    I'm not saying he couldn't be ESTj...just that he was the antithesis of most ESTjs I know....except Smilex who says he's ESTj....but most ESTjs seem to want everything to be practical and easy.

    I will agree though that in a certain sense he was in the ESj world. I wonder if he was so fully ESj and INj at the same time that it makes him hard to type.

    What type do you think he looks like?

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    Wo, Jonathan. I actually posted that as a joke (which is why I said you are not going to take it seriously).

    Using industriousness to decide someone as having an EJ temperament is a poor criteria so your rant is justified. Indeed, there are also non EJ types who are hardworking and productive out there.

    What type I think he looks like... Hmm I am not too fond of VI-ing portraits or statues but my guess is that he's a judging thinker.

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    Default Johann Sebastian Bach

    Type him!

    Picture for VI:



    Some music for AI (audio identification):







    Could he have been ESTj?

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    JS Bach was a prophet of God, like Moses, Jesus and Mohammed.
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Ok, I'll answer myself with some very random thoughts:

    I thought he could be something like ESTj. (I've even read it somewhere, I think). Te+Si could make sense, I think. His work is very formal, and he emphasizes formality. Developing the art of rule bound music, like the fuge. I think of Bach that his music is not about feelings, it's just pure music.

    Anyway, I don't think he's SEI.

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    Te-INTp

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    Maybe ISTp or ESFp. He is 100% NOT a J type. If he was then the only other option would be ESFj, but ESFj's are not that driven and I don't think they would have the drive to produce that much music as Bach did. I absolutely love his music.

    ISTp's are the kings/queens of music like John Lennon.
    Elivis was ESFp; so maybe Bach was ESFp?
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 04-24-2010 at 05:40 PM.

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    Removed at User Request

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    To go on about Bach, Bach music is construed entirely by technicalities....
    Not so. Bach is also emoyionally very rich, but it takes some life experience to realize that, for the emotionality of Bach is quite a different thing:



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    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    Not so. Bach is also emoyionally very rich, but it takes some life experience to realize that, for the emotionality of Bach is quite a different thing:
    Yes, All emotions in Bach's works come in the form of pure music, they are translated into the music, so many T types like Bach, it doesn't provoke them.

    He is extremly formal and technical, but the technicalities always serves the music, not the other way around.

    It's really hard to guess the type of a composer, I think. You listen to the music and it's difficult to decide what would be a sign of N or S etc.

    Ok, but his music is more important than his type

    I like the harpsichord, the sound is so tickling!


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    not a bumblebee octo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    To go on about Bach, Bach music is construed entirely by technicalities and is extremely intricate and complex in a way characteristic of Ti being expressed through music. It is the base of his music and to me that suggests a strong likelihood towards him having been Ti leading. I rather bend towards LSI, myself, considering the power in his music. Very technical but can be very heavy at times, too.

    FTR, socionics has nothing to do with musical prowess. Never has and never will except by those entirely ignorant of the music world and the people involved and the process.
    Word to all of this post. I would also add that the technicality and intricacy should be viewed as partially a result of his era rather than solely a reflection of his personality.
    Quote Originally Posted by Agee The Great View Post
    Nobody here...besides me, seems to know what SLE is except for maybe Maritsa.

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    Bump

    It's over 3 years since I made this thread. How time flies. Now I think he was probably ILI, just as someone suggested earlier in this thread. I think you can get an impression of and in Bachs music. Especially in the creative position makes sense to me.

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    This picture gives impression of ESTP.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    INTp ? (up)
    sound Se Ni, not sure of Fi Te
    "The final delusion is the belief that one has lost all delusion."

    -- Maurice Chapelain

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    Bach is boring. ESTj.

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    Quote Originally Posted by octo View Post
    Word to all of this post. I would also add that the technicality and intricacy should be viewed as partially a result of his era rather than solely a reflection of his personality.

    I was going to mention that too. This also goes for the relative "boringness" of the music. I also find his music relatively boring (at least compared to Beethoven, Tchaikovsky, Mendelssohn, etc). I dont think that necessarily lends clues as to his socionic typing.
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    Why don't we just use the unbiased photographs we have of him?
    Why don't we just read the interviews people made with him?

    But seriously, I reckon that music at the time was greatly influenced by the zeitgeist of the period, so to classify J. S. Bach as a certain type based on his music is to try to apply Socionics theory to categorise his music (not illegitimate, but you're not typing the person), which would be probably more useful for assigning a type to the style of music of the period.

    I don't know why, but it seems that Baroque Music, Classical Music, Romantic, 20th, pretty much made up all of the music of their respective periods, whereas now people can write in any style and often vary, so how people write in the past is probably more indicative of the era rather than themselves.

    Secondly, I know musicians who write different styles of music based off different eras - implicitly here I'm saying that I can't identify any Socionics IEs in their different positions - so I don't think what people write is necessarily related to how they are as a person.
    Warm Regards,



    Clowns & Entropy

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    Éminence grise mikemex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    ISTp's are the kings/queens of music like John Lennon.
    John Lennon SLI? Stop smoking that shit Maritsa, it's not good for you.

    I've always seen Bach as SEI.
    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    John Lennon SLI? Stop smoking that shit Maritsa, it's not good for you.

    I've always seen Bach as SEI.
    They make great musicians...what's wrong with that?

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    Fi/Te something

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