Let’s talk about quadrant drama

[Beautiful sky]

What themes or topics have you observed surroundings quadrant drama.
For Delta it’s usually LSE trying to get everyone under his or her control as far as actions and behaviors.

[Lord Panda]

Yeesh ok, where to start with the Beta quadra lol

EIEs have the Socionics title of official drama queens, but they don't create drama for no reason. Everything EIE does, they do with style. ExFx is the heart and soul of their respective quadra and they sort of 'embody' the quadra values. There's a lot of puffing up going on, but it is with the intent of making a statement, making the person's effect known to the world, something like that. I can understand why it may come off as shallow to the other quadras, but it's not really a question of "is it fake or real?" The question is more, "Am I able to make an impact? Can everyone hear me?" Like that.

I found a song that describes the EIE attitude perfectly:



So my Japanese is pretty basic, so the translation may not be accurate:

"The life of a flower is ephemeral
Today it withers and fades away
It colors everything in it's life
Then fades away, as is it's fate

There's no chance to try again
The players are shackled
Next it is my turn, what should I do?
The more I struggle, the farther away the future gets

And just when I am about to give up
It looks brighter than ever

This is the twisted mechanism of life, right?

I'm not just a pretty thing, this isn't a game
Beyond defeat there is only ruin
Someday I'll be able to wipe away my tears
As I stand on the sacrifices that I made

So, I stand on this stage and play
And dance perfectly as they pull my strings
I decided that one day I'll escape this dilemma
And I have hidden my trump card.

I probably bear a lot of weights on my shoulders
I'll pretend that I don't hear my puppet-like(?) heart
So even if my body lets out a scream and I can't move,
I won't ever stop.

This isn't a game, I'm not playing around
I'll capture the future in these hands
In this game where I have to bet my own life
I'm determined to win

They're polite, and they keep a pleasant face
But these guests are not able to satisfy me
The time for pretenses is up
I'll show you exactly how careless you have been

Even if every day of my life is so meaningless
I still want to keep living

This is the twisted mechanism of life, right?

I'm not just a pretty thing, this isn't a game
Beyond defeat there is only ruin
Someday I'll be able to wipe away my tears
As I stand on the sacrifices that I made

So, I stand on this stage and play
And dance perfectly as they pull my strings
I decided that one day I'll escape this dilemma
And I have hidden my trump card. "

There is an emphasis on Se here, but this isn't Beta ST or gamma SF... It's clear the character is struggling with being powerless. There's also the idea of 'waiting and watching' which is what Ni ego is like, looking for the right amount to strike. EIE has DA thinking, she tries to paint herself as both - a fading flower, a puppet being manipulated by others and also as some kind of ruthless, cold warrior type. As in, I'm a dainty princess, but I can also kick ass if I need to. The character in the show, Sumireko Hanabusa, is a character who has gone through a lot of struggles in life. But there is an element of drama to her. It's not fake... it's just embellished, put on a show. "Express myself as overtly as I need to, until I'm sure my message is heard!" If ESE is the matriarch of the alpha family, then EIE is the queen of the beta kingdom.



This character is also an EIE, the theatrical nature, the "fuck the system attitude" (I'm no longer your subservient puppet!) All telltale signs of Beta. But you can also see, there's an essence of concealing, hiding who they are. The thing is, if Ni egos "reveal" their Ni, the game is up, they've lost their advantage. So I think this is why you won't hear about Gamma NT's plans (not sure about this) same goes for whatever social game the EIE is playing. IEI is much much more subtle when it comes to this.

EIE's dual is LSI, and LSI can be pretty dramatic as well. For LSI, I think their main focus is this sense of duty, wherever LSI go, they make rules. They have visions as well. Ti base with Ni HA, they have an idea of what things should be like. Ti base types tend to try to conform the external world to fit to their system, as opposed to Te base types that do the reverse. They have dual seeking Fe, they want social influence, someone who can spread their word. So the EIE is naturally the dual match for them. EIE wants the kind of power that an Se ego type has in exchange.

LSI drama is more subdued, it's more like this sense of struggle that they feel... it's hard to explain. I think this song, the Opening to death note, is pretty LSI.



I've linked Jonathan Young's English cover.

So from here, the singular, kind of visionary nature of LSI is pretty apparent. There's a dramatic nature to this one too ("please tell me why? Am I a savior meant to save us all?). Along with an idea what the world should be like (Ti) and a sense of struggle. It's not a powerful "I am!" statement like with the previous song, the struggle is more internal, since LSI is an introvert. There's also this Ni visions (replace these clouds with shining sky) and a sense of duty (I made a promise for a change, a revolution in the night). The "fuck the system" attitude is there as well.

I'll have to think a bit more for the IEI/SLE dyad... but I hope this is what you wanted ^^' If I got anything wrong, feel free to correct me.

[para]

I find that SLE usually likes to create some sort of Aristotelian dramatic narrative in most interactions.

[Lord Panda]

I find that SLE usually likes to create some sort of Aristotelian dramatic narrative in most interactions.

What do you mean by that?

[para]

What do you mean by that?

Things have beginning and end, build-up, conflict and resolution is placed in the same spots. SLE either prevails or fails when looking at him/herself. The SLE i know perceives herself as a tragic hero of sorts when in an argument with others. Direct struggle for the good seems to be central to the type.

Of course, i'm just joking around a bit. But they do seem to relate to conflict in that way, as does my EIE acquaintance.

[Lord Panda]

Continued from previous post

SLE

SLE is probably the type that embodies most of the Beta bravado. They are also very dramatic. Just listen to any LostProphets song lol. Everything about the band is very Beta from the title to every song they made. This is the most Beta-ish of all their Beta songs:



They also appear to be some kind of a wolf pack, the Beta 'clan' if you will lol. You can see their will power, it's strong, it's potent, they sound like they're coming after you. This is the puffed up peacock-ing effect, also resemble dude bros messing around. The example is exaggerated, but SLE's vision can be seen through the song. They're not able to accurately tell what it is that they're envisioning, but they can tell you what isn't right in this world (Ti, I think) There's a focus on power and they're also dramatic. SLE is very in your face, but it's more of a "you're weak" than EIE's "I'm strong." The drama is more about looking bigger and tougher than they are, putting on a show as they put others down. They kind of have to be loud if they want to dominate socially, command respect and test people's strengths. Also, the song is literally a "fuck you" lol.

I want to run this by @sbbds since I don't know how accurate this is >.>

IEI

IEI is like layers upon layers of depth. When interacting with IEIs, you only kind of see a hint of what's going on inside. They're very subtle and very attuned to their emotions. Like with LSI, the struggle is internal.



LeeAndLie is a beta NF, more leaning towards IEI. The most focus is on the Ni visions over anything else. There's a lot of mental Ni imagery using metaphors and the like. A lot of her songs involve the use of metaphors. She also has the ability to transmute Fi into Fe. A lot of the times, she's able to change lyrics from the original songs to an Fe kind of expression. For example, she did a cover of Cruel angel's thesis, where she changed the entire feel of the song from Gamma SF to Beta NF. (example: one of the original lines in the song is "I'll never become a goddess but I'll still continue to live" and she changed it to "Though I'll take a stance, I'm still only human; the goddess you need can't be me")

I think this transmuting ability really benefits their dual SLE...? I don't really know much about this dyad lol. There's also this idea of rebelling against something big and nebulous... Maybe they are fighting the universe? I don't really know. They strive to understand the mystical elements of the world, so maybe it's connected to that.

*phew*

[Lord Panda]

Things have beginning and end, build-up, conflict and resolution is placed in the same spots. SLE either prevails or fails when looking at him/herself. The SLE i know perceives herself as a tragic hero of sorts when in an argument with others. Direct struggle for the good seems to be central to the type.

Of course, i'm just joking around a bit. But they do seem to relate to conflict in that way, as does my EIE acquaintance.

This is actually very good! Thank you for sharing!

[The Reality Denialist]

SEI's breast pump is broken and short rage ensues.
ILE has let himself to his own devices and comes out mumbling something totally incoherent with huge variety of gesticulations while acquired depression goes away.
ESE has been too bubbly and starts to become very moody and withdraws only being mildly socially connected.
LII has been thinking about thinking and is about to start to think about thinking of thinking.

[Beautiful sky]

SEI's breast pump is broken and short rage ensues.
ILE has let himself to his own devices and comes out mumbling something totally incoherent with huge variety of gesticulations while acquired depression goes away.
ESE has been too bubbly and starts to become very moody and withdraws only being mildly socially connected.
LII has been thinking about thinking and is about to start to think about thinking of thinking.

[Sisyphean]

Oh you mean which types make each quadra interesting?

EIE and SEE

Still waiting to be convinced the other two quadras are lol

[para]

LII has been thinking about thinking and is about to start to think about thinking of thinking.

Assuming i am LII, you should probably change the ILE description to ''has begun to read mirror types thoughts''. Or should i say thoughts about thoughts.

Also, the ESE i know seems to get slightly ''overheated'', and needs to pull away like you describe.

[para]

This is actually very good! Thank you for sharing!

Hey, no problem! This forum is nothing if not exchange of ideas.

[Lord Panda]

Assuming i am LII, you should probably change the ILE description to ''has begun to read mirror types thoughts''. Or should i say thoughts about thoughts.

Also, the ESE i know seems to get slightly ''overheated'', and needs to pull away like you describe.

ESE seem to get legitimately frustrated if people aren't having a good time. They seem to be under a lot of social pressure, in a way that EIE isn't...

[para]

ESE seem to get legitimately frustrated if people aren't having a good time. They seem to be under a lot of social pressure, in a way that EIE isn't...

I think that's true. Fe for EIE isn't bound to pleasure, fun, being at ease. Fe has, in some way, a broader scope for Beta types, seeing it as a facet of everything rather than a specific desired state. At least, that's how i find Beta Fe to be described.

[The Reality Denialist]

Well, there are ESE's who are very emotional outwards and then there are those who are subdued. Those super emotional ones are certainly prone of having lots of mood swings. If we contrast it to EIE most of people can agree that their moods fluctuate but they really really dwell in them. It is not a snap movement to stop it. If I have understood it correctly it might be years maybe some manage to make it to carry over several generations.

[Lord Panda]

Well, there are ESE's who are very emotional outwards and then there are those who are subdued. Those super emotional ones are certainly prone of having lots of mood swings. If we contrast it to EIE most of people can agree that their moods fluctuate but they really really dwell in them. It is not a snap movement to stop it. If I have understood it correctly it might be years maybe some manage to make it to carry over several generations.

I think ExE are perfectly capable of controlling their moods... They just don't want to. I know that both types will push hard, but if it feels like things are going to break, they will back off... It shouldn't be possible if they couldn't control their moods, if that makes sense.