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Thread: Differences Between LIE and ILI

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    FarDraft's Avatar
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    Deleted.
    Last edited by FarDraft; 12-16-2018 at 12:27 AM.
    ----- FarDraft, 2019 | 5w6 538 sp/sx

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    LIE: chad
    ILI: incel


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    the apogee of ILI-SEE dualization is SEE relieving ILI of their virginity

    /jk

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    A lot of ILIs are perfectly able to get laid, they just cannot convince themselves that it is worth it.

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    Indeed.
    If I stop responding or posting, I've probably taken a break from posting stuff. This really taxes me for whatever reason. Said break could last anywhere from a month to a year. I will likely be back, as socionics is one of my interests. If I'm not on here, you can contact me on steam.

    I got a new computer, so I'll not type on mobile as much any more.

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    Since i had this question too and came to the conclusion that i wasn't ILI but Strong Ni-Lie subtype, how i could differenciate:

    Temperament, Ej is restless and hyperactive while Ip can be like a massive black hole in the room that swallows every kind of energy.

    Result and Process: Entj (result) comes to conclusions top down, works with a big mental representation of whats happening and goes from the conclusion to the details that lead to them, also it's more stress resistant.

    Demonstrative in social interaction, while under people i am confortable with i use a lot of Ne in a playfull way while i simpy don't seem to care about ti.

    Interacting with Mirror types or other intertype relationships: With SEE i have activity with SLE benefit SLIs seem to despise me and i seem to supervise a IEI at least i could if i was mean. Also mutual correction and 2 sides of the same coin happen while interacting with ILI while interaction with LIE more started like a teacher student thing and went into concurrence with mutual disstatisfaction soon.

    Polr was also a great source do determine, Fe polr should be obvious, when you are being social as LIE you will propably use Fe as a ILI you will not, if you are restless and a bit hyperactive, can't enjoy the moment, and are absolutely unable to bring yourself to relax without drugs or other aids propabliy LIE.
    When you casually talk about food and health issues on an average personal distance bringing it up by yourself you are propably ILI.

    Hope this could make things clearer also for others who find this with the search function.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itsme View Post
    Since i had this question too and came to the conclusion that i wasn't ILI but Strong Ni-Lie subtype, how i could differenciate:

    Temperament, Ej is restless and hyperactive while Ip can be like a massive black hole in the room that swallows every kind of energy.

    Result and Process: Entj (result) comes to conclusions top down, works with a big mental representation of whats happening and goes from the conclusion to the details that lead to them, also it's more stress resistant.

    Demonstrative in social interaction, while under people i am confortable with i use a lot of Ne in a playfull way while i simpy don't seem to care about ti.

    Interacting with Mirror types or other intertype relationships: With SEE i have activity with SLE benefit SLIs seem to despise me and i seem to supervise a IEI at least i could if i was mean. Also mutual correction and 2 sides of the same coin happen while interacting with ILI while interaction with LIE more started like a teacher student thing and went into concurrence with mutual disstatisfaction soon.

    Polr was also a great source do determine, Fe polr should be obvious, when you are being social as LIE you will propably use Fe as a ILI you will not, if you are restless and a bit hyperactive, can't enjoy the moment, and are absolutely unable to bring yourself to relax without drugs or other aids propabliy LIE.
    When you casually talk about food and health issues on an average personal distance bringing it up by yourself you are propably ILI.

    Hope this could make things clearer also for others who find this with the search function.
    You convinced me with “I could if I were mean.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    You convinced me with “I could if I were mean.”
    , are Intps so much meaner though? Could make sense because to attract a Fi lead you should be hard wired to strive to be decend, for a Se lead it could be a hinderance, but in the descriptions ILIs are often said to be more into Fi matters than LIE due to their hidden agenda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itsme View Post
    , are Intps so much meaner though? Could make sense because to attract a Fi lead you should be hard wired to strive to be decend, for a Se lead it could be a hinderance, but in the descriptions ILIs are often said to be more into Fi matters than LIE due to their hidden agenda
    ILI’s have 2D Fi while LIE’s have 1D Fi. This surprised me when I first read it, because I was judging all the ILI’s I knew by how well they seemed to like people (which they do not seem to do because they are FePoLR), but I do believe that ILI’s are better at Fi, which is knowing who and what they like, than are LIE’s.

    ILI’s seem to be one step ahead of me in seeing the values in a relationship. I can clearly see this ability in them. SEE’s seem to have monstrous insight into people’s motivations, and ESI’s are just off the scale and out of my ability to comprehend. I don’t understand ESI’s, but I can ask them questions and get answers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    ILI’s have 2D Fi while LIE’s have 1D Fi. This surprised me when I first read it, because I was judging all the ILI’s I knew by how well they seemed to like people (which they do not seem to do because they are FePoLR), but I do believe that ILI’s are better at Fi, which is knowing who and what they like, than are LIE’s.

    ILI’s seem to be one step ahead of me in seeing the values in a relationship. I can clearly see this ability in them. SEE’s seem to have monstrous insight into people’s motivations, and ESI’s are just off the scale and out of my ability to comprehend. I don’t understand ESI’s, but I can ask them questions and get answers.
    Interesting, yes, one can only imagine how it is not to run around semi blind in relationships, but maybe there is an ESI-guide dog aviable out there.
    Shocking how much there is never to comprehend in a lifetime just because you have been born with a different function order.
    I will have to take a look at how the strong Fi- Types i know work, maybe i can ask them how they are that good at this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itsme View Post
    A lot of ILIs are perfectly able to get laid, they just cannot convince themselves that it is worth it.
    Never had this issue, one could probably say it's the reason I do a lot of things.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Is it worth it? I don't see it.
    Sol mb F type due to his inability to think alternatives.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    ILIís have 2D Fi while LIEís have 1D Fi. This surprised me when I first read it, because I was judging all the ILIís I knew by how well they seemed to like people (which they do not seem to do because they are FePoLR)
    Weak nonvalued Fe means people are not accented on objective value of people as persons. This does not mean they dislike them, they more try do not input emotions (Fe ones mostly) in thoughts about them, to stay emotionally indifferent.
    It's similar with role Fe and is more noticable when L*E are tired - they switch to poker faces. Fe types may perceive this as disrespect and inabbility to influence on base Te, which influence Fe types have lesser than it seems as base Te types often play Fe as surface and formal rituals.
    There is not significant difference in strenght between weak and strong functions.

    Te types value Fi. They prefer personal relation - like you to me, so me to you. Te types real emotionality is switched by this, - when you do something personal good or bad to them. You'll not get loud emotions, but in eyes you'll see what happens inside, also you may expect a justiful return relation.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    ILI ain't a cunt

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    ILI are highly negative and can not stand LIE who are positive
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    ILI are highly negative and can not stand LIE who are positive
    Bullshieeet.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    Quote Originally Posted by Remiel View Post
    Bullshieeet.
    It is true, what Maritsa said, if you are mistyped you won't understand - BTW, LIE are introverts and tend to mistype themselves if coming from MBTI or crappy tests.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soupman View Post
    It is true, what Maritsa said, if you are mistyped you won't understand - BTW, LIE are introverts and tend to mistype themselves if coming from MBTI or crappy tests.
    Itís not lol. ILIís duals are SEE who are also positivists.

    If an ILI dislikes LIE itís for other reasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    It’s not lol. ILI’s duals are SEE who are also positivists.

    If an ILI dislikes LIE it’s for other reasons.
    Actually there's another fact to learn - duals cannot work with each other side by side for the same positivist/negativists reason. Things work bests when duals don't interfere with each other - and normally they sort of don't given their divergent sphere's of interest.

    I have personally asked Viktor Gulenko about this - you can ask him yourself, he's got a facebook page etc.

    I actually know this from first hand experience both SEE & ESE even don't instinctively understand the mindset of a person that starts dwelling on problems when deriving an answer. They just see it as somebody trying to spoil the enthusiasm - passionate vitriol is amply supplied when they see this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soupman View Post
    Actually there's another fact to learn - duals cannot work with each other side by side for the same positivist/negativists reason. Things work bests when duals don't interfere with each other - and normally they sort of don't given their divergent sphere's of interest.

    I have personally asked Viktor Gulenko about this - you can ask him yourself, he's got a facebook page etc.
    Something for you to learn is how to STFU. Directly quote what he said then if you’re good buddies, because as far as I know, the point of this positivism/negativism dichotomy is that they balance each other out in a good way. Of course there’s the general clash of opposites that comes with duality but Reinins in isolation are purely complementary.

    A piece of evidence towards this is that all ITR only have half of the Reinins in complement, except for duality, which has them all in complementary pairs. So if Gulenko speaks against this he’s wrong af. Gulenko isn’t God. Reinins were made to highlight compatibility.
    Last edited by sbbds; 02-19-2019 at 11:40 PM.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Itís not lol. ILIís duals are SEE who are also positivists.

    If an ILI dislikes LIE itís for other reasons.
    Ē
    ďEmotionally the ILI has a suppressing effect on the LIE. "He as if kills everything that is living," complains about his ILI friend a merry, restless jokesmith LIE, "Around him all the joy of life disappears - all of its vitalizing nutrients evaporate." It is difficult for the LIE to interact with the ILI for a long period of time. ILI's emotional dullness and insipidness takes a heavy toll on him. LIE's ethical aspects are at least held to some norms, while the ILI can be an obnoxious partner for him in this respect - he either depresses LIE's spirits by boredom, disheartenment, and melancholy, or irritates him by sudden outbursts of anger, unethical statements and behavior, and unbridled humor and jokes. And ILI's jokes can be even more shocking than LIE's, even more ill-suited, crude, and indecent (lets recall ILI's famous "black humor"!). Ē
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post

    “Emotionally the ILI has a suppressing effect on the LIE. "He as if kills everything that is living," complains about his ILI friend a merry, restless jokesmith LIE, "Around him all the joy of life disappears - all of its vitalizing nutrients evaporate." It is difficult for the LIE to interact with the ILI for a long period of time. ILI's emotional dullness and insipidness takes a heavy toll on him. LIE's ethical aspects are at least held to some norms, while the ILI can be an obnoxious partner for him in this respect - he either depresses LIE's spirits by boredom, disheartenment, and melancholy, or irritates him by sudden outbursts of anger, unethical statements and behavior, and unbridled humor and jokes. And ILI's jokes can be even more shocking than LIE's, even more ill-suited, crude, and indecent (lets recall ILI's famous "black humor"!). ”
    First of all this is from LIE’s perspective towards ILI, not the other way around which is what we were talking about.

    Next, this structurally can’t be the effect of positivism and negativism on their own clashing. ILI is also like that because of Fe polr, and they naturally seek positivism and Fe demonstrative and energy from their duals. LIE has Fe role instead, which takes on a different flavour and can grate against ILI.

    ESIs are technically negativists as well and are seen to be killjoys too in some ways by LIE as well, but the point of negativism is to reduce cognitively. It’s not about pessimism although it can appear like that because of the direction of mental focus negativists get into.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    First of all this is from LIEís perspective towards ILI, not the other way around which is what we were talking about.

    Next, this structurally canít be the effect of positivism and negativism on their own clashing. ILI is also like that because of Fe polr, and they naturally seek positivism and Fe demonstrative and energy from their duals. LIE has Fe role instead, which takes on a different flavour and can grate against ILI.

    ESIs are technically negativists as well and are seen to be killjoys too in some ways by LIE as well, but the point of negativism is to reduce cognitively. Itís not about pessimism although it can appear like that because of the direction of mental focus negativists get into.
    You are quite disagreeable for someone of your type
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    You are quite disagreeable for someone of your type
    You two are conflictors, so...

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrsTortilla View Post
    You two are conflictors, so...
    Possibly but even conflict relationships pose as something sweet and nice at the beginning which is what attracts them rather than repels them. In conflicts which are easy to start SLE comes off as affirming positive inspiring inspirational and positive
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Possibly but even conflict relationships pose as something sweet and nice at the beginning which is what attracts them rather than repels them. In conflicts which are easy to start SLE comes off as affirming positive inspiring inspirational and positive
    Possibly, but it is my belief that experience with your conflictor in the past can really remove the beginning part of the relations in future interactions with new conflictor people. In other words, the more you spend time with any conflictor, the more “allergic” you get to your conflictor in general. I could be wrong but that’s been my experience.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrsTortilla View Post
    Possibly, but it is my belief that experience with your conflictor in the past can really remove the beginning part of the relations in future interactions with new conflictor people. In other words, the more you spend time with any conflictor, the more ďallergicĒ you get to your conflictor in general. I could be wrong but thatís been my experience.
    You are correct in many ways but in the ways that I am allergic to SLE is when they speak about energy strength power etc not when they disagree with me on my posts and try to correct and reconstruct me.
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 2w1sw(1w9) helps others to live up to their own standards of what a good person is and is very behind the scenes in the process.
    Tritype 1-2-6 stacking sp/sx


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soupman View Post
    It is true, what Maritsa said, if you are mistyped you won't understand - BTW, LIE are introverts and tend to mistype themselves if coming from MBTI or crappy tests.
    If you can't bend over and nibble at the tip of your penis you're mistyped.

    Btw you're ridiculous.
    "The society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools." ―Thucydides



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    The qualities that conflictor might handle well but also makes fun of is quite serious business for a dual. LIE's are quite adept when trained to bombard people with ridiculous ideas. There is no real moment for wonder.
    Whereas tecnically busting something do make SEI's quite amused and ESI's perhaps quite paranoid.

    I also see the above description happening in LIE and ILI dynamic.
    Sol mb F type due to his inability to think alternatives.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    You are quite disagreeable for someone of your type
    What are you talking about lmao

    Somewhere in the literature it says it’s impossible to argue with SLE

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrsTortilla View Post
    Possibly, but it is my belief that experience with your conflictor in the past can really remove the beginning part of the relations in future interactions with new conflictor people. In other words, the more you spend time with any conflictor, the more “allergic” you get to your conflictor in general. I could be wrong but that’s been my experience.
    No lmao. I’m like this with all people on this forum. It has nothing to do with Maritsa actually although yes we’re conflictors technically. Debating is just fun. It’s why I’m here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Possibly but even conflict relationships pose as something sweet and nice at the beginning which is what attracts them rather than repels them. In conflicts which are easy to start SLE comes off as affirming positive inspiring inspirational and positive
    I still love you Maritsa.

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