Has any IEE/ENFp tested as a logical type before?
Hello! I'm attempting to type a friend, and she seems like an ENFp, yet her MBTI results test as INTP/INTJ, whereas her sociotype results test as INTp, ENTj, ISTp, and INTj. Would it be possible for an ENFp to test as these types, and not as an ENFp?
Also, do ENFps not care about social norms and what others think?
Yes, ENFp has this thing that they have wrong perception of themselves which is combination of Ne and lack of logic, I know one ENFp who tests as LSE all the time while in the real life he's total opposite.
He says - "I am not intuitive! I am not ethical!". And still lives in this denial.
HelloOriginally Posted by falsehope
I see... May I know how he acts in real life? I'm still trying to figure out if someone I know is ENFp. She doesn't care about social norms or what others think. Is that true of other ENFps too?
And how this exactly look like? Is she anti-social or just not understanding social norms? Or maybe you are grumpy and dont accept her behaviour? I can imagine some Ni-PoLR and Ne-PoLR would have hard time accepting ENFp behaviour and say that they don't adhere to social norms. But what is normal for ENFp is not normal for ESFj and vice-versa.
it's not that i think she's anti-social... it's just that she wrote on her blog herself "fuck social norms and what other people think"... she wrote it herself so i was wondering if it was normal ENFp behavior? It's hard typing her so i'm just trying to pinpoint.
Well it's hard to guess what she meant by that. But yeah, for ENFp that could be life mantra. I think what she was thinking about was somewhat trivial and not serious. Like what she wears for example.
All the time. I'm orders of magnitude worse with other people's motivations, and avoiding stepping on toes or viscerally disgusting people, than I am with logical systems. And there's the fact that most of my "values" are admittedly self-serving and protectionist of my own good. Apparently there's a factor to Logicals that compels you to sacrifice yourself for the greater good, because reasons?...idk. But I'm definitely a lot more emotionally than rationally motivated. It's very frustrating to see ubiquitous descriptions of my most approximate type as being excellent at something I'm decidedly bad at.
Nope, there isn't.
I don't believe "sacrificing yourself to the greater good" is type related, but if it is, it might be related to wanting to convice others to do this (all the while not truly believing it oneself, or at least not acting accordingly). It's possible that certain unhealthy beta quadra types, and even some gamma ones, might adopt such rhetoric to get others to risk themselves for them. I'm thinking maybe Fidel Castro (EIE in my opinion) for example, since I once saw a movie on him, and the actor that played him kept repeating "we must sacrifice our individual hopes and dreams for the revolution" etc.
So while I don't think this is type directly related, I do think people wanting to seize power are more likely to employ this sort of rhetoric, simply because it is effective.
Anyways, sorry for derailing this thread.
Last edited by WVBRY; 08-25-2018 at 05:38 PM.
It sounds like something someone going through adolescence would write. Typewise it might be related to being ethical, since they externalize stronger reactions than logicals, but I don't think you can type someone without seeing the global picture of the person, this isn't very revealing tbh.
Yes, tests are not really reliable for self typing IMO. Descriptions are much better. It is easy to be perceived as an introvert or logical as an IEE because of our high intuition.
As for social norms, it depends on their instinctual stacking. I care less than other IEEs about social norms because I am so last, but an so first would care a lot more than me.
This is not true at all. I know several IEEs that are aware of MBTI and they self type as ENFP like me. We have similarities, but differences too just like any people with the same type. The IEE you know just happens to be an IEE with low self awareness.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
Did she take one of the free online MBTI tests? Those are notoriously bad at typing people accurately. I really don't think 'not caring about social norms' has anything to do with Sociotype. It might have something to do with Enneagram instinctual stacking, though.
Hello, i'm not sure about falsehope's IEE friend... But the acquaintance I know and am trying to type is a pretty self-aware person... She has written that she's a cruel and unforgiving person. She seems to be aware of her flaws... But she has still typed as everything except ENFP/IEE :/ Which i find strange...
I see :/ I'm not too sure which MBTI test she took :/ but she has gotten INTJ and INTP as her results before... she also took the test at sociotype, and got INTp as her most possible type, followed by ENTj, ISTp and INTj...
um she was in her twenties and in university when she wrote that :/
She has also written before about how her choice in deciding which university to attend was a messed up one, considering how she made it based on how she felt rather than how she thought... could this point to a more logical person?
btw would it be okay if i pm-ed you to discuss about this further?
Hello
I've known many IEEs who've worked in technical laboratory environments, and because they do, many seem to assume that they're T-types. Also, some IEEs retake tests many times because they themselves don't seem to want to believe the answer - but I've seen many other Eps play with the answers on an assortment of issues.
a.k.a. I/O
Last edited by Rebelondeck; 08-26-2018 at 12:20 PM.
Well, IEEs are always open to other possibilities. So they will entertain ideas and possibilities that have a slim chance of being true. So that includes matching with a type that does not fit them at all. However, I have seen other types do this, this forum is a good example of that, lol. It is also possible that she may not be IEE, it is easy to mistype people if you don't know them well enough.
Last edited by Raver; 08-26-2018 at 02:18 PM.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
It sounds like she's taking quite a few tests, then, so she's probably used free ones that are easy to access. Even if she's taken a written questionare, that's not likely to be accurate without a MBTI typist carefully interpreting the questions for her (even then...well let's just say I've seen a SLE typed as ENTJ by those people before, when he's obviously got amazingly strong Se and Fi PoLR. So I dunno how much to trust in the professional typists. But, that's just my take...).
When I was into MBTI and I had finally figured out I was probably ISFP, I still got INTP and INTJ a lot when I took those online tests. And before I was familiar enough with the system to type myself accurately, I got all kinds of things from ENTJ to INFJ to ISTP (but INTJ/P was my most common result out of all of them). There's actually a lot of discussion on MBTI forums about how biased those tests are (in favor of logic and intuition). I remember they had a lot of yes or no questions that said things like:
"I often use critical thinking when examining new data"
"I enjoy new theories and possibilities even if they have no direct connection to reality"
"I value logic over feeling".
It's so easy for someone who is not NT-anybody-to answer 'yes' to all those questions. Who would say 'No, I don't use critical thinking'? Using critical thinking is just part of being a responsible person, or part of being curious about how things work, it's not something only logical types do. And even if somebody really doesn't use it hardly at all, how likely would they realize that? It's even possible for a logical type to be inconsistent at applying critical thinking, so I'm not sure that's a good measurement of type. If their unconscious emotional insecurities get in the way, they sometimes avoid thinking carefully about things that disturb them (ask any feeling type who's been close to logical types before--their thinking often shuts down when the beliefs they have trusted their personal security in are being threatened).
Sensors often do enjoy new theories and possibilities even if they have no direct connection to reality. In socionics, that's part of dual-seeking.
An ethical type can just as easily value logic over feeling as a thinking type can. Especially in American society (where I come from) where emotional reasoning is usually regarded as inferior and less intelligent, it's common for everybody to value logic over feeling.
So yeah, it's completely possible for an ENFp to get INTJ/P on myers briggs tests. And if she's pretty sure in her self concept that "I am INTx" and she generally understands the character traits associated with that, she's likely to self report INTx on those Socionics tests, too. Well, if she learns about the system enough, eventually over time she'll figure out her real type (whatever it is). And if you know the system pretty well, and you know her pretty well, you probably have a pretty decent understanding of her type.
@Xaiviay
I find your take about logic being valued socialy very interesting.
I lived the opposite, logic being devalued, Te mostly, which lead me to get NF typings. I really wanted to be that, but I'm not.
For the question "I value logic over feeling", one can have logical reasons to value feelings or feel that logic is the best way to go, and that drives me insane.
When I start to think about the questions to give the most representative answer, I can end up with a mental breakdown from overthinking them.
I know someone who has developed her whole understanding of mbti around being INFJ, the first test result she got... I think she's not but there's nothing I can do about it, she's closed to discussion on the matter. (Everyone she dislikes is ESTP lol.)
Meh. It's not like I can "fix" her perception. That would presomptuous to think I can fix people anyway. -w-b
Jung talks about that and says that is the product of roughly equivalent development of logic/ethics, but he says its also because neither is developed fully, and concludes one is mostly like an irrational type to see things that way. I do see the point though, which is to say you can value one through the prism of the other, which makes any statement about one superseding the other superfluous, since you can come to either by way of the other, thus they're lateral shifts not heirarchical. but that is Jung's point, when they are laterally arranged like that, they fit in the middle somewhere, sandwiched between perceptions. I thought about that for a long time and came to the conclusion that logic really does sit below ethics, and that all logic is essentially a mode of affect management, whether it be through resource acquisition or making sense of the world in terms of metaphysics or whatever. its all a method to deal with the world as an ethical arena, even though how you slice such a thing abstractly can vary and paradoxes abound. this says more about my perspective I suppose than the world itself, or more particularly it speaks of my world. I think in this sense you could say such a person is likely to be an ethical base type
@NorthernRose Oh that's interesting that it's been so different for you, regarding logic vs feeling. Yeah there must be some sections of society that value feeling over logic, even if it's not as common (I might be wrong on it being less common? Stuff like this gives me that idea).
I'm sorry if you've felt your Te was no good because others kept devaluing it. There's nothing wrong with being an NT (if that's the type you're leaning towards, now?) For what it's worth, I think you should feel just as good about being a thinking type as you would have felt about being an ethical type. Neither logic or feeling is better or worse, and both bring a lot of value to the world.
Yes, you have a good point here with:That's so true. It's driven me crazy in the past, too.one can have logical reasons to value feelings, or feel that logic is the best way to go
Ohh wow, haha. I can see that happening, yes. That kind of thing is mildly irksome to me, but it's like you said, you can't 'fix' their perception and they can believe whatever they want...I know someone who has developed her whole understanding of mbti around being INFJ, the first test result she got... I think she's not but there's nothing I can do about it, she's closed to discussion on the matter. (Everyone she dislikes is ESTP lol.)
Meh. It's not like I can "fix" her perception.
Last edited by Xaiviay; 08-27-2018 at 01:04 AM.
yes I think that anchoring effect is itself a form of affect mangement and kind of goes to squarks davesuperpowers thing. lots of people will build their entire understanding of socionics around a premise derived from a long prior MBTI result they liked. its sort of like the biblical parable of having your reward now or later. the people who do that have their reward, but they lose out on any real insight socionics might be able to offer, because they've distorted the system to suit themselves rather than learn anything of substance that might require shifting course. they see this unwillingness to shift course as testament to the accuracy of the initial premise, when its just doubling down on an error and daring anyone to move you, when of course the person who really suffers from such indolence is mainly them
@Xaiviay
One of the problem with this stat thing is : how exactly are logic and feeling defined? Many people think deciding with feelings mean being like Trump or being some hystericaly unreasonable person.
All I know is that a lot of people feel the need to repress themselves to "fit", but fit what exactly? A sort of ideal in their mind. Many factors, including culture can influence this ideal greatly.
I think both feelings and logic are used to reach a decision, some may prefer one, but that doesn't mean the other is completely ignored... I mostly make decisions based on those two elements through time, past feelings and logic, present feelings and logic, possible logical outcomes and possible emotional repercussions...
I'm not so sure how to respond to "I'm sorry" and "you feel" kind of sentences. I know they come from the heart, and that's probably what confuses me. It sounds like you're trying to highlight my experience and maybe comfort me?
I'm going with an F PoLR typing at least... xD
Logical and ethical having had a similar experience, that's to highlights how we aren't complete alien to one other. It's a wonderful thing to witness.That's so true. It's driven me crazy in the past, too.
@Bertrand
Ethical base type... I can see that.
I usually know I have a feeling because I feel nauseated, dizzy, stiff, heavy or something... it's not precise enough to base any decision on... mostly that I can "don't notice" all of it magnificently...
@NorthernRose Well yeah, it depends on how you define the two. I guess I'd have to see some kind of poll or study done where both logic and feeling were described accurately and people were asked to rate their opinions on them, to see if there really is some kind of societal bias...
I do try to come up with decisions that make some sense from both feeling and thinking perspectives. I agree with this:
I think both feelings and logic are used to reach a decision, some may prefer one, but that doesn't mean the other is completely ignored... I mostly make decisions based on those two elements through time, past feelings and logic, present feelings and logic, possible logical outcomes and possible emotional repercussions...Ohhh lol, well you understood what kind of effect I hoped to give you xD F-PoLR for you does sound likely. Also, I'm guessing you are not Fe-seeking.I'm not so sure how to respond to "I'm sorry" and "you feel" kind of sentences. I know they come from the heart, and that's probably what confuses me. It sounds like you're trying to highlight my experience and maybe comfort me?
I'm going with an F PoLR typing at least... xD
I like this point you made very much and I agreeLogical and ethical having had a similar experience, that's to highlights how we aren't complete alien to one other. It's a wonderful thing to witness.
Way back when I was learning MBTI, I thought I was INFP. When I read about E/I in Gifts Differing, i realized I was ENFP. With Socionics, ther aer so many ways to check itl. Beta/Delta differences should be obvious, for example. It's strange though that she is always self-typing T instead of F.
I sort of don't care about social norms and sort of do. I want to do what I think is right, and I won't put that aside for social norms if it's important to me. However I want people to be comfortable so i try to follow social norms all the way til it conflicts with a strong belief.
"A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........
"Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
attitude acceptable to today's standards." - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"
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@Xaiviay
Even with the proper definition, I see feelings as logical informations about a person. I have researched those in the past and that's how I managed to "understand" and take into consideration feelings... : 3
I'm very sure you see it differently.
I'm curious as to how you would describe how it happens in your head, I can't imagine it at all.
I can find biais everywhere... easy after being the "odd one" so often. -w-b
Making decisions is sure a lot of brain power... lord.
That, in a way, is hilarious. I'm glad you don't seem mad at my reply. xDOhhh lol, well you understood what kind of effect I hoped to give you xD F-PoLR for you does sound likely. Also, I'm guessing you are not Fe-seeking.
I think you have shown valuable intention, and putting emphasis on my experiences is something I appreciate from others. Comforting me is a little useless though, and I think you've seen somewhere a feeling that does not exist. I'm not trying to blame you or make you feel bad about any of this, I just like analyzing situations...
It's a thing I often see in Fe's, since mine is poor, there are some missunderstandings like this that I wonder where they came from... and I analyse it thorougly for days... : 3
I guess I can "intellectualise" Fe decently now, but "feel" it? It's awkward to me.
I'm probably even Fe PoLR. Sometimes I find it a bit scary to talk to Fe egos, so it is relieving to see we can agree on stuff, that we share experiences, and can have a conversation where I don't feel the need to bring out "Fe replies".
Just like we are both humans trying our best.
a dichotomy test may mistake in any of the dichotomies and any of their quantity
you may get any type by any typing method and with any typing skills. this is the question of probability. there are no perfect methods and skills
any method, including tests, are used because give significantly better than accidental results. any today test or other method mb correct at ~50% of cases or lesser. it's good to combine different methods to check the results. the more often you get the same result with this approach - the more you may trust to it
the best in Socionics for checking of your type is IR theory. it's hard to fool yourself enough to get good match to the theory with its using. in case you get bs - do not think IR theory as bad, think about how correct are your types and the degree other factors besides types may affect what you see. for example, people with good IR may have conflicts too, while with bad IR may look ok on the surface. some people may work relatively good in weak regions. etc. but it's doubtful you may get the same personal sympathy and ease of relations from superego like from your duals on regular - the closer and more you interact, the more IR effects will be noticed in your impressions about the human and interactions with him.
Jung's types are important for relations and how people behave. this is expressed as classical theory describes in general. if you see the other - you need to type better
Weird - the most wildly mistyped person I've ever met was a IEE (I think) typing as a MBTI INTJ. She was definitely EP > IJ anyway. I tried to get her to check it again but she, in the sunniest and bubbliest manner, told me she was cold and logical and looked at life in a strategic, detached way. If she wants to take tests, I think ones that look at cognitive functions / IMs are a bit more accurate but still not the best.
Generally IME it doesn't matter what people are typing themselves since if they are only taking free tests it's just a fun game anyway. If they started trying to pick a career or hunt for their dual on a mistype - then maybe you could worry! A lot of people I know casually take the test and then forget their result a week later. I also think it's really interesting to see what people type as on tests because it gives you a good indicator of how they see themselves (and pretty much nothing else haha). It's a total trip when they think of themselves completely different to how they present (like ENFp / INTp). Also weird was an INFP boy typing as an ESTPOh and when I first took an MBTI test I got ENTJ hahahaha.
@Xaiviay some of those tests are totally wild! And definitely geared towards NT. Other than "I use critical thinking" for T/F, there's also the S/N divide of "I'm open to new ideas", "I don't like discussing new theories." And MBTI SJ descriptions in particular are along the lines of being a duty-bound drone who has never had a thought for themselves. I really don't know who gets those results on tests.
"I take back like half of the exclamation points.....they make me look....eager to please. Which I AM....but I don't want anyone to KNOW that"
- Carrie Fisher
I'm not saying we should exclude irrationals or anything, but I think at some point one has to accept that irrationals aren't interested in typology for the same reasons usually as rationals and that means them not being typed correctly is often intentional and part of their game and they like it that way, hence its not worth getting too worked up trying to get them on track, because they don't necessarily want that, nor are they going to try and intentionally hurt anyone who is on track. for them its just a sideshow to whatever else they've got going on. IP types take it more seriously, but the brighter EPs its like, good luck
Thank you everyone for your responses! Actually I remembered something... The acquaintance I'm trying to type... She does seem cool. And she seemed to use Introverted intuition too. We were talking halfway, and then she suddenly told me that she saw how things pieced together - like she connected the dots.
She's very straightforward too, and she would just tell me that she didn't care about me. She also told me how she didn't like a particular lecture over another, cos it took too long to be delivered, when it could have been summed up and delivered in 5 minutes. Would ENFP/IEEs be like that?
Yeah if IEE is not interested in the subject he has issues with following it trough.
Yes, IEEs seem to be one of the quicker types to get bored, and also seem to relish expressing the reasons for their boredom. They also like to stir up controversy and argument so long as they feel that they won't get caught in the crossfire. They can be very, very opinionated and argumentative when they're in what they feel is a safe environment. Sometimes they miscalculate and realize much later that they went too far and will try to make amends in indirect ways but often their words won't come across as sincere but rather milder forms of their original theses.....
a.k.a. I/O
Hi NorthernRose,
'feelings as logical informations about a person'- I also think this way
Hmm, how to describe feelings...you said this in a previous comment:
It's actually quite similar for me. Emotions cause physical sensations like sickness, heaviness, lightness, etc. And there's also just the emotional 'sensation' itself (happiness, sadness, joy, anger, fear).I have a feeling because I feel nauseated, dizzy, stiff, heavy or something...
Maybe a good way to describe what feelings are like for me, is how I feel in response to other people face-to-face. Some of the emotions will be what the other person looks like they are feeling, and others will be what that person causes me to feel by interacting with me. There's a girl who I think is ILI that I talk with at the book store, and she often makes me feel cautious, kind, eccentric, and contemplative...this is the way she looks like she feels, and it tells me about how she maybe spends a lot of her time. She also tends to make me feel excited, anxious, and intrigued. Those are my personal feelings in reaction to her.
I hope this helps answer your questions
Yes, being the "odd one" would make you attuned to other's biases...I think ILIs are naturally good at finding the biases in other people's reasoning, too?I can find biais everywhere... easy after being the "odd one" so often. -w-b
Making decisions is sure a lot of brain power... lord.
Lol I think it's funny, too xD Thank you for appreciating my intention. Yes, I think I projected an emotion that you weren't having, when you probably were just wanting to compare experiences? You don't need to apologize for intellectualizing. It's interesting to see the way a thinking type reasons things out.That, in a way, is hilarious. I'm glad you don't seem mad at my reply. xD
I think you have shown valuable intention, and putting emphasis on my experiences is something I appreciate from others. Comforting me is a little useless though, and I think you've seen somewhere a feeling that does not exist. I'm not trying to blame you or make you feel bad about any of this, I just like analyzing situations...
That's kind of cool how you can intellectualize Fe! It's useful to understand ethical things in an objective way, when possible. I even like it when I can have a logical perspective on my emotions because it feels more clarifying.
I can definitely understand this. ILIs (if that's your type) are sometimes intimidating to me, so it feels relieving to see where we have common ground and similar experiences, too.I'm probably even Fe PoLR. Sometimes I find it a bit scary to talk to Fe egos, so it is relieving to see we can agree on stuff, that we share experiences, and can have a conversation where I don't feel the need to bring out "Fe replies".
Exactly!Just like we are both humans trying our best.
Lol! Not gonna lie this was pretty funny xD
True, it's not that big of a deal for most people.Generally IME it doesn't matter what people are typing themselves since if they are only taking free tests it's just a fun game anyway. If they started trying to pick a career or hunt for their dual on a mistype - then maybe you could worry!
I guess he accurately reported his values, at least? lol. For a short period of time, I thought I was an ENTP (silly meAlso weird was an INFP boy typing as an ESTP) And my first ever test result was INTJ, rofl.
Oh goodness, I know right? Those SJ descriptions are so unappealing. And the bias against SJs in MBTI forums was pretty bad, last I checked. I like how Socionics does a pretty good job of fairly evaluating the strengths of all the types.@Xaiviay some of those tests are totally wild! And definitely geared towards NT. Other than "I use critical thinking" for T/F, there's also the S/N divide of "I'm open to new ideas", "I don't like discussing new theories." And MBTI SJ descriptions in particular are along the lines of being a duty-bound drone who has never had a thought for themselves. I really don't know who gets those results on tests.
@Xaiviay
Hid in my hole for a few days. -w-b
That's interesting, ethical people I know seem to feel and not think much of it, as if the feeling is enough for them. Seem. Maybe I just don't know what happens in their head... hmm...
To know how I feel about someone or what they could have felt, I have to be alone and reflecting on it. That you can do it face-to-face sounds like sorcery to me. xD
It does help, I do enjoy collecting points of view also. The more I have, the more comfortable I am about "people-ing".
ILIs tend to be critics, but is it their biais or our? That's something to keep in mind. As I pass a lot of time with people from other quadras, I know that what I think is unconsistant or impractical can be appreciated by others and therefore let them have it how they like, the "best way" might suck for them... but I always notice when someone forgets to zip their pants... xD
Hm, that's just a small thing, but the word "compare" bothers me. I understand what you mean, as in sharing to see divergences and convergences, though compare is often used to talk about "X has this I don't have", or what is better or worse, and that's why it annoys me. It has a "bad" connotation I want to avoid....you probably were just wanting to compare experiences?
It's how an ILI gets called "critic"... it's annoying, even for me to be like this. (My biais.)
What I were trying to do was just as you said though... lol.
I do think the most likely type for me is ILI... even though I doubt it every other day, like everything else that it's possible to doubt. I know I'm not a "typical" ILI, it's still the only type that makes sense to me.
> intimidating
It's a word often used about ILIs, I find it sad in a way. I don't know if you think I am, and I hope not, it's not how I want people to view me at all. I know my incredibly high standards can scare people, as does my attention to do things as good as I can... and slight obsession over it... haha.
It's just how my brain works... no effort made, so it's a little rough on me, enough that I try to hide it. (I'm a little sad about this.)
I'm glad to know communication can help overcome this, as I like people in general, and mostly the differences and similitudes, so being intimidating can really play against me.
Well, thank you. I worked hard to understand so I appreciate it even more.That's kind of cool how you can intellectualize Fe! It's useful to understand ethical things in an objective way, when possible. I even like it when I can have a logical perspective on my emotions because it feels more clarifying.
It's great that you mention liking having a step back about your feelings, we seem to do the same thing with opposing starting points. : P
Test results are soo fake. Don't believe on it.. They have this psychological term, i forgot what it is..
Lemme explain, people when answering tests tends to answer high on the things they're really low at, because it's like they wanna prove themselves on a specific aspect of their personality which is low. Like for example an ese who are low at Ne and TI will tend to answer high on Ne and Ti related stuffs because currently it's the one he's currently mastering
I have one friend he gets intp on mbti results. Like wut the actual fuck. He's not intp.. But esfj.. 🤣
Well the explanation of choosing the options of what you lack creates a bias of being something you're not in mbti tests.
I also had encountered esfp and estp which have intj results in their mbti tests.. But well actually and obviously they're estp/esfp..
Like, well it's flawed. Tests are flawed.
Yeah, soon after i was awarded the fields medal I...
Fuck no.
ENFp (Unsure of Subtype)
"And the day came when the risk it took to remain closed in a bud became more painful than the risk it took to blossom." - Anaïs Nin
Hi @NorthernRose,
I don't mind you hiding in your introverted hole for a while, I often have to do the same thing or I get too stressed -_- I hope you don't mind, I've had to take a bit of a break lately, too.
Yes, I think this is true. Basically, the emotions communicate enough to me about what is going on, and I don't have to consciously analyze them much further. Of course, there are downsides to that approach, and you definitely need logic a lot of the time (for instance, you can't 'feel' your way through a math course, lol).That's interesting, ethical people I know seem to feel and not think much of it, as if the feeling is enough for them. Seem. Maybe I just don't know what happens in their head... hmm...
Ahhh man lol, yes I do understand what you mean by this. I have to pour 100% of my focus to really analyze something logically, it's not something I can really do while talking to other people (or otherwise multi-tasking).To know how I feel about someone or what they could have felt, I have to be alone and reflecting on it. That you can do it face-to-face sounds like sorcery to me. xD
Yeah it's true, viewing ILIs as 'critical' could just as easily be our bias. But if ILIs are more critical, I think it's a good thing. We need critics in society. I'm glad you can take that approach with other quadras, I've been trying the same thing. Sort of being open-minded about what works for them, while keeping your own judgement.ILIs tend to be critics, but is it their biais or our? That's something to keep in mind. As I pass a lot of time with people from other quadras, I know that what I think is unconsistant or impractical can be appreciated by others and therefore let them have it how they like, the "best way" might suck for them... but I always notice when someone forgets to zip their pants... xD
Lol okay I see what you mean. 'Comparing' can have sort of a negative connotation of 'poor me, I have it worse than you/poor you'. We're evaluating/analyzing experiences, then, not comparingHm, that's just a small thing, but the word "compare" bothers me. I understand what you mean, as in sharing to see divergences and convergences, though compare is often used to talk about "X has this I don't have", or what is better or worse, and that's why it annoys me. It has a "bad" connotation I want to avoid.
It's how an ILI gets called "critic"... it's annoying, even for me to be like this. (My biais.)
What I were trying to do was just as you said though... lol.
Avebury mentioned to me that Dialectical-Algorithmic types doubt things constantly, so even this could point to you being ILI. It's good that you're keeping an open mind and considering all possible sides.I do think the most likely type for me is ILI... even though I doubt it every other day, like everything else that it's possible to doubt. I know I'm not a "typical" ILI, it's still the only type that makes sense to me.
Ohh I see...well I don't think it's bad to be intimidating, and if you show a sincere interest in others like you've done for me, I don't think you need to worry about scaring them off...I can't help but be intimidated by ILIs, but I'm also flattered that you expressed an interest in my perspective and have created a conversation with me! It feels like a compliment from you. Also, for what it's worth to you, it's compliment from me when I see people as intimidating, haha.> intimidating
It's a word often used about ILIs, I find it sad in a way. I don't know if you think I am, and I hope not, it's not how I want people to view me at all. I know my incredibly high standards can scare people, as does my attention to do things as good as I can... and slight obsession over it... haha.
It's just how my brain works... no effort made, so it's a little rough on me, enough that I try to hide it. (I'm a little sad about this.)
I think it makes you ideal for SEEs, that you tend to hold people to high standards. I've been in a relationship with a SEE man before, so I would know...They don't give up on living up to their partner's standards, as long as their partner sets them.
I'm happy to know that you like people in generalI'm glad to know communication can help overcome this, as I like people in general, and mostly the differences and similitudes, so being intimidating can really play against me.So do I.
You're welcome, I appreciate that you've been trying to understand my perspective as well!Well, thank you. I worked hard to understand so I appreciate it even more.
It's great that you mention liking having a step back about your feelings, we seem to do the same thing with opposing starting points. : P
It's kind of interesting how we reason similarly, even though we use differing starting points, as you've said.
Well, you seem to use and valueI guess he accurately reported his values, at least? lol. For a short period of time, I thought I was an ENTP (silly memore than a SEI type on average would do.
(Contact subtype of SEI,+
At least the quadra is correct as result.
...and I think IEE with a strong focus on-HA can test as a logical type.
Well thanks! Yes, I think I am the contact subtype...and yup, got the quadra values right, anyhow!Well, you seem to use and value
(Contact subtype of SEI,
At least the quadra is correct as result.
...and I think IEE with a strong focus on
Yes that could be the case with the IEE, here.
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