Rumi (Sufi mystic and poet)

[para]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumi

What type do you think Rumi was?

I'm pretty sure he's beta NF.

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

nice thread. Months ago I watched a Spanish film called Don't Look Down and right before the end titles it showed a Rumi quote. I don't remember which one it was but I remember being mesmerized by it.

[Chae]

IEI

[Pallas]

I would've liked that post if Olimpia didn't. I can't agree with Olimpia typing any famous people IEI.

[silke]

I've seen him typed as IEI before and INFJ in MBTI (INFJ is their Ni-Fe type) so I went on to read some of his poems and quotations and discovered that they did not really make much impact. They didn't strike me as anything, there was this strange absence of any 'hooks', some kind of vacuum there which made me think that Rumi was actually Ne valuing.

Revisiting some of his writing now it sounds a lot like Delta complex of clipped wings mixed with soc-9 dissolution of ego boundaries and search for holy love, irrational type freedom seeking, don-juanism, and specks of e1 search for brilliance. There is some very ungrounded floating feeling to his writing overall. Thus for his type I would guess IEE-Ne so/sx 9w1.


"People want you to be happy.
Don't keep serving them your pain!
If you could untie your wings
and free your soul of jealousy,
you and everyone around you
would fly up like doves."
― Rumi

“This is love: to fly toward a secret sky, to cause a hundred veils to fall each moment. First to let go of life. Finally, to take a step without feet.” ― Rumi

“Words are a pretext. It is the inner bond that draws one person to another, not words.” ― Rumi

“Stop acting so small. You are the universe in ecstatic motion.” ― Rumi

“You were born with wings, why prefer to crawl through life?” ― Rumi

“Sell your cleverness and buy bewilderment.” ― Rumi


“I want to see you.

Know your voice.

Recognize you when you
first come 'round the corner.

Sense your scent when I come
into a room you've just left.

Know the lift of your heel,
the glide of your foot.

Become familiar with the way
you purse your lips
then let them part,
just the slightest bit,
when I lean in to your space
and kiss you.

I want to know the joy
of how you whisper
"more”
― Rumi

“I closed my mouth and spoke to you in a hundred silent ways.” ― Rumi

Really reminds me of this paragraph about Delta quadrant: "Mysterious look, gazing into infinity, polysemous enigmatic smile, detachment, and insularity in their own world far away from the worldly life, made them resemble this ancient figure. Getting together, each of them either "mysteriously" kept silent or talked about something of his own, getting more and more pulled into the transcendent world of his dreams and distant from realization creative plans and interests - a world from which no one will displace them or prune their wings in high flight."

[Pallas]

I've seen him typed as IEI before and INFJ in MBTI (INFJ is their Ni-Fe type) so I went on to read some of his poems and quotations and discovered that they did not really make much impact. They didn't strike me as anything, there was this strange absence of any 'hooks', some kind of vacuum there which made me think that Rumi was actually Ne valuing.

Revisiting some of his writing now it sounds a lot like Delta complex of clipped wings mixed with soc-9 dissolution of ego boundaries and search for holy love, irrational type freedom seeking, don-juanism, and specks of e1 search for brilliance. There is some very ungrounded floating feeling to his writing overall. Thus for his type I would guess IEE-Ne so/sx 9w1.


"People want you to be happy.
Don't keep serving them your pain!
If you could untie your wings
and free your soul of jealousy,
you and everyone around you
would fly up like doves."
― Rumi

“This is love: to fly toward a secret sky, to cause a hundred veils to fall each moment. First to let go of life. Finally, to take a step without feet.” ― Rumi

“Words are a pretext. It is the inner bond that draws one person to another, not words.” ― Rumi

“Stop acting so small. You are the universe in ecstatic motion.” ― Rumi

“You were born with wings, why prefer to crawl through life?” ― Rumi

“Sell your cleverness and buy bewilderment.” ― Rumi


“I want to see you.

Know your voice.

Recognize you when you
first come 'round the corner.

Sense your scent when I come
into a room you've just left.

Know the lift of your heel,
the glide of your foot.

Become familiar with the way
you purse your lips
then let them part,
just the slightest bit,
when I lean in to your space
and kiss you.

I want to know the joy
of how you whisper
"more”
― Rumi

“I closed my mouth and spoke to you in a hundred silent ways.” ― Rumi

Really reminds me of this paragraph about Delta quadrant: "Mysterious look, gazing into infinity, polysemous enigmatic smile, detachment, and insularity in their own world far away from the worldly life, made them resemble this ancient figure. Getting together, each of them either "mysteriously" kept silent or talked about something of his own, getting more and more pulled into the transcendent world of his dreams and distant from realization creative plans and interests - a world from which no one will displace them or prune their wings in high flight."

Rumi is about the least "clipped wings" person ever.

“Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing there is a field. I'll meet you there.” — Rumi

So moralistic. Anyways, he's a Sufi, and Sufis are provocative. I'm not saying he can't be what you typed him but your reasons are wrong. People tend to remove all the Muslim imagery from Sufi poetry and you get this weird hazy stuff instead of what they actually say. The key to poetry is its specificity. If you're offended by someone writing about 72 virgins, homoeroticism, and getting drunk and just want to replace it with "love is good," find someone else to translate. Don't mess up Rumi.

http://www.dar-al-masnavi.org/corrections_popular.html

[silke]

Rumi is about the least "clipped wings" person ever.

“Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing there is a field. I'll meet you there.” — Rumi

So moralistic. Anyways, he's a Sufi, and Sufis are provocative. I'm not saying he can't be what you typed him but your reasons are wrong. People tend to remove all the Muslim imagery from Sufi poetry and you get this weird hazy stuff instead of what they actually say. The key to poetry is its specificity. If you're offended by someone writing about 72 virgins, homoeroticism, and getting drunk and just want to replace it with "love is good," find someone else to translate. Don't mess up Rumi.

http://www.dar-al-masnavi.org/corrections_popular.html

Even that quote is addressing the Delta complex, for flying high means the possibility of crashing which is buttressed by envisioning yourself to be beyond this world, beyond its rights and wrongs, in some Elysian field that lies out of reach of everyday mundane concerns and petty rules and those who might want to clip your wings. It's a Ne safeguard:

"For those who fly too high, the downfall is painful. The fear of this downfall is a widespread manifestation of complex of "clipped wings". Attempts of developing protection against this fear by "falling in love" with one’s fall ("To lie in the sweat of vice and admiration for one’s own downfall ..."), to morally degrade yet still be above judgment and scornful valuations, subjectively insisting on one's own moral superiority - is one of the most common defenses from the quadral complex in Delta Quadra - even open sexual relations are not considered something reprehensible - for what could be wrong with love? (-Ne↑; +Fi↑)."

Translations are usually done to be as accurate to the original as possible. I do not see why any translators have an intention to "strip the imagery from poetry" they are translating. They would destroying the poetic work if this was the case, which implies some inexplicable unprofessionalism or ill intent on their part and that's too implausible of an assumption to follow. IEIs, however, are not known for excessively detailed imagery so even in case that they stripped it this would still point to another type.

[ooo]

Listen, O drop, give yourself up without regret,
and in exchange gain the Ocean.
Listen, O drop, bestow upon yourself this honour,
and in the arms of the Sea be secure.
Who indeed should be so fortunate?
An ocean wooing a drop!

In God's name, in God's name, sell and buy at once!
Give a drop, and take this Sea full of pearls!

Rumi

[Pallas]

Even that quote is addressing the Delta complex, for flying high means the possibility of crashing which is buttressed by envisioning yourself to be beyond this world, beyond its rights and wrongs, in some Elysian field that lies out of reach of everyday mundane concerns and petty rules and those who might want to clip your wings. It's a Ne safeguard:

"For those who fly too high, the downfall is painful. The fear of this downfall is a widespread manifestation of complex of "clipped wings". Attempts of developing protection against this fear by "falling in love" with one’s fall ("To lie in the sweat of vice and admiration for one’s own downfall ..."), to morally degrade yet still be above judgment and scornful valuations, subjectively insisting on one's own moral superiority - is one of the most common defenses from the quadral complex in Delta Quadra - even open sexual relations are not considered something reprehensible - for what could be wrong with love? (-Ne↑; +Fi↑)."

Translations are usually done to be as accurate to the original as possible. I do not see why any translators have an intention to "strip the imagery from poetry" they are translating. They would destroying the poetic work if this was the case, which implies some inexplicable unprofessionalism or ill intent on their part and that's too implausible of an assumption to follow. IEIs, however, are not known for excessively detailed imagery so even in case that they stripped it this would still point to another type.

Read the page I linked. Rumi isn't a wishy-washy poet and these people are interpreting a translation without knowing Farsi because they're inspired by someone else doing the same.

[silke]

Read the page I linked. Rumi isn't a wishy-washy poet and these people are interpreting a translation without knowing Farsi because they're inspired by someone else doing the same.

The page you linked is effectively criticizing and putting down the work of previous translators, ascribing linguistic differences as to being their faults and saying that they didn't even know the language that they took on to translate. Then it goes on to promote the sales of the book of its authors. This is the cheapest marketing trick out there, and lets just say this doesn't constitute any sort of typing argument. You might want to check your sources before posting them.



Notice how Ibrahim & friends call their own translation as "uncorrupt" vs. those other "corrupt" translations. So buy them for $29.95, £19.50 as they surely have more upcoming.

[niffer]

Rumi also SLI confirm

[Pallas]

Rumi also SLI confirm

lol

[Pallas]

The page you linked is effectively criticizing and putting down the work of previous translators, ascribing linguistic differences as to being their faults and saying that they didn't even know the language that they took on to translate. Then it goes on to promote the sales of the book of its authors. This is the cheapest marketing trick out there, and lets just say this doesn't constitute any sort of typing argument. You might want to check your sources before posting them.



Notice how Ibrahim & friends call their own translation as "uncorrupt" vs. those other "corrupt" translations. So buy them for $29.95, £19.50 as they surely have more upcoming.

OK, I’ll find a different site saying the same thing. But that doesn’t change the fact that there are just a lot of bad translations out there. For example, did you know Persian poetry rhymes? Arabic poets invented that and Persian poets copied them so of course it does. It shouldn’t be translated as free verse poetry or have all the specific cultural references removed. All the Victorian translations of Sufi poets are classics so you don’t have to buy the page’s translations. Rumi can be IEE or SLI or whatever and I frankly don’t care what people are typed as but he’s not a wishy washy poet.