Delta Duality questions - ISTp-ENFp and INFj-ESTj

[scio]

This really could be in the main ITR part but I'm just so cozy in the Delta section
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*Art by http://blairset.tumblr.com/


Okay so wondering if you ever TRULY understand your dual? I am confident that I've spent time w a dual. I feel warm and fuzzy with them and I am never bored by them bc SLIs are so mysterious mmmm.

I actually have a few questions:
-What are the differences between SLI females and males (might as well take advantage of posting in the delta group hehe)? Real examples preferably not from online sources
-Do you ever get passed the mysterious haze that blocks you from FULLY knowing your dual? It always feels like we are so intertwined yet they are still a mystery??? Perhaps SLIs are just mysterious to everyone??
-When you "dualize," if there is a such thing, is there a long period where you mesh together and use your suggestive A LOT? Like I feel like I'm living in Si-land. I loooooove it, but I can feel myself going back to my Ne ways. Just to give a quick example (bc it's easier to talk about clothes), I want so badly to be a minimalist with only quality things but then sooner or later I go back to buying cheap but large quantities of clothing (thrift store clothing bc #fightfastfashion). This happens regularly. I am so inconsistent it hurts. I want to be this natural earthy person but then I go and switch it off by wanting all of these crazy patterns and to experiment with how I look/do things. I've been living in this peaceful Si land with a beloved SLI but then I'm like ~~but what about who I am~~ and then skip off to explore and do things. I love being in both mindsets, but there is a stark difference. Obviously maintenance and caring of details is not natural, but when I do get into it I REALLY obsess over it. Anyone else experience this or is this not duality?
-Do both partners experience a feeling of past-lives? And what I mean specifically is that do you ever feel like you have already lived like your partner and how they are attempting to live now? We both experience a "been there, done that" sensation when one of us is working toward a project or have an idea. He is actively telling others to "think big" and create new ideas and I'm trying to live in an isolated peace bubble and am focusing all of a sudden on housekeeping... which I would NEVER have done before I met him.


Curious to hear from you guys

[Rebelondeck]

Like every type, female versus male is an overriding dimension that really has nothing to do with type. I find no differences in their thinking styles even though their life objectives can be very divergent. However as an outsider, I noted that the greatest impediments to IEE/SLI matches seems to be the IEEs and their continual search for greener pastures. They're the ones that have to stop and smell the roses.......

a.k.a. I/O

[Saoirse]

Okay so wondering if you ever TRULY understand your dual? I am confident that I've spent time w a dual. I feel warm and fuzzy with them and I am never bored by them bc SLIs are so mysterious mmmm.

What does it mean to "truly" understand someone?

-What are the differences between SLI females and males

Speaking from the U.S. perspective, an interesting difference I've found is that SLI females often put effort into appearing more feminine/fulfilling societal expectations of what women should look like (wearing certain kinds of clothes, putting on makeup in a certain way), but their efforts are ungainly, like a baby deer trying to walk. Maybe ones who care about it a lot (perhaps social-first in instincts) end up practicing it enough that they master it--because I do think there are some very fashionable SLI women out there (some people type Kim Kardashian and Emma Watson as SLI)--but on average, the SLI females I've known IRL have an awkward sense of style.

SLI males also usually don't have a sharp sense of fashion, but it is mitigated by two facts: (1) society doesn't put as much pressure on them to look a certain way, and (2) if/when they want to try, men have much more standardized fashion guidelines--if you wear a dress shirt, belt, pants, and dress shoes that all fit, you're way ahead of the curve--whereas women have to figure out what cuts/shapes of tops, dresses, skirts, etc. work for their body type, have to figure out jewelry, makeup, accessories.

-Do you ever get passed the mysterious haze that blocks you from FULLY knowing your dual? It always feels like we are so intertwined yet they are still a mystery??? Perhaps SLIs are just mysterious to everyone??

SLIs seem very straightforward to me, especially compared to Ni/Se egos. Beta NFs are the biggest mysteries to me.

I don't know if I would say LSEs, my dual, seem like a mystery to me. I don't understand how they do some of the things they do, but that's just different IE dimensionality, as domr said. I do think I would understand them a lot less if I didn't have socionics as a baseline guide though.

[Hope]

-What are the differences between SLI females and males (might as well take advantage of posting in the delta group hehe)? Real examples preferably not from online sources

Ime female SLIs tend to be more witty in communication, more artistic and more compassionate than males (on emotional terms I mean).

As dorm said, female SLIs tend to appear more masculine or neutral than average girls, while male IEEs tend to be more feminine or neutral than other types. It was posted once the scale of masculinity/femininity in sociotypes, which I found very interesting since I really fit the measure (was 0 on femininity, lol).

 

To summarize, in Filatova's perception:

Most to least masculine types:
+3: SLE, LSI, LIE, LSE, SLI
+2: ESI, LII, SEE
+1: ILE, ESE
=0: ILI
-1: SEI
-2: EIE, EII, IEE
-3: IEI

Most to least feminine types:
+3: SEI, ESE, IEI, EIE, SEE, EII, IEE
+2: ESI
+1:
=0: LSI, ILI, LSE, SLI
-1: ILE, LII, SLE, LIE
-2:
-3:

Looks like Filatova didn't want to disparage any of the women reading her article and distributed positive scores to most of the types. The scores that I would disagree with are IEIs being more masculine than SEIs and EIIs, ESIs being most masculine of all IxFx types, and IEEs being more masculine than SEEs. In this sense I agree more with Gulenko's assignments (link).

Most masculine types: SLE, SLI, LII, LIE
Intermediary types, masculine predominates: IEI, IEE, ESE, ESI
Intermediary types, feminine predominates: LSE, LSI, ILI, ILE
Most feminine types: EII, EIE, SEE, SEI

Some of my way of thinking, body movements and way of talk can be specially unfeminine. I noticed this after watching full body pictures and videos and being told by friends. Surprisingly, that doesnt make me look less attractive for males, apparently.

SLI males that I've seen look completely normal as the average masculine guy.

About enneagram mentioned above, is true. I'm similar to fellows SLI 9s. My communication style and train of thought seems also similar to others with my same tritype (952), doesn't matter the sociotype or the order of tritype.

-Do you ever get passed the mysterious haze that blocks you from FULLY knowing your dual? It always feels like we are so intertwined yet they are still a mystery??? Perhaps SLIs are just mysterious to everyone??

IDK, others have had this kind of impression or feeling about me in the past, mostly females NFs (IEI, EII, ime). It seems like I'm always a mystery for them no matter how many years we've know to each other. They seem like not fully understand me (and sometimes make wrong assumptions or do stuff that offends me), but not because I'm hard to understand, guess is our psychological configurations what makes it harder for them. Apparently, males NFs in general (there are exceptions too) seem to get me better than females. Maybe its just that females SLIs are indeed more masculine than the average girl.

However, I don't think that I'm physically less feminine than random girls (I mean not in outfit or general features), but apparently, psychologically and in attitude I am. Not surprise that I've better relationships with males in general with more deep understanding in psychological level than with most female feelers. However I must say that is also hard for me to understand some females and some feminine guys, and supporting this with enneagram, I'd say I can have better understanding with 6 and 9 (probably 9w8) females (even if they are feelers) than with other e types probably.

-When you "dualize," if there is a such thing, is there a long period where you mesh together and use your suggestive A LOT?

Yes. When I'm with dual I seem to switch to Ne somehow, while he seems to get on a more serious way. Anyway I think is precisely the using of suggestive function that is excited by the other, since its not a real display of Ne or Si, but like a Si Nees and a SiNees…lol, don't have better words to explain that.

Its how you said, you start acting in certain way but at the end you still being Ne.
For me, I immediately turns into good mood and playful side. I start to be very creative in my playfulness, while my IEE starts being kind of serious and less emotional, like a more mature person (!), while I feel like a little kid. lol
Then, he even gets in a parental mood (pseudo caregiver/aggressor), which is actually funny.

-Do both partners experience a feeling of past-lives?

Not at all. (Plus I don't believe in past lives).

Hope that helps

[Sol]

When you "dualize," if there is a such thing, is there a long period where you mesh together and use your suggestive A LOT?

After and during communication with dualization types I find my weak functions as more active in consciousness. Suggestive is not exception, if the other type was dual/semidual. Such is more expressed with people I'm sincere with, to which I trust.

[scio]

Ime female SLIs tend to be more witty in communication, more artistic and more compassionate than males.

As dorm said, female SLIs tend to appear more masculine or neutral than average girls, while male IEEs tend to be more feminine or neutral than other types. It was posted once the scale of masculinity/femininity in sociotypes, which I found very interesting since I really fit the measure (was 0 on femininity, lol).

 

Some of my way of thinking, body movements and way of talk can be specially unfeminine. I noticed this after watching full body pictures and videos and being told by friends. Surprisingly, that doesnt make me look less attractive for males, apparently.

SLI males that I've seen look completely normal as the average masculine guy.

About enneagram mentioned above, is true. I'm similar to fellows SLI 9s. My communication style and train of thought seems also similar to others with my same tritype (952), doesn't matter the sociotype or the order of tritype.





IDK, others have had this kind of impression or feeling about me in the past, mostly females NFs (IEI, EII, ime). It seems like I'm always a mystery for them no matter how many years we've know to each other. They seem like not fully understand me (and sometimes make wrong assumptions or do stuff that offends me), but not because I'm hard to understand, guess is our psychological configurations what makes it harder for them. Apparently, males NFs in general (there are exceptions too) seem to get me better than females. Maybe its just that females SLIs are indeed more masculine than the average girl.

However, I don't think that I'm physically less feminine than random girls (I mean not in outfit or general features), but apparently, psychologically and in attitude I am. Not surprise that I've better relationships with males in general with more deep understanding in psychological level than with most female feelers. However I must say that is also hard for me to understand some females and some feminine guys, and supporting this with enneagram, I'd say I can have better understanding with 6 and 9 (probably 9w8) females (even if they are feelers) than with other e types probably.





Yes. When I'm with dual I seem to switch to Ne somehow, while he seems to get on a more serious way. Anyway I think is precisely the using of suggestive function that is excited by the other, since its not a real display of Ne or Si, but like a Si Nees and a SiNees…lol, don't have better words for explain that.

Its how you said, you start acting in certain way but at the end you still being Ne.
For me, I immediately turns into good mood and playful side. I start to be very creative in my playfulness, while my IEE starts being kind of serious and less emotional, like a more mature person (!), while I feel like a little kid. lol
Then, he even gets in a parental mood (pseudo caregiver/aggressor), which is actually funny.




Not at all. (Plus I don't believe in past lives).

Hope that helps

Sorry for the late reply my love! But THIS. ALL OF IT. Yes.
I become uncharacteristically motherly and serious hahahhahahaa
OH yes, I love duality

The last part is probably me just trying to make things more romantic in my head bc I'm still a 5 year old schoolgirl

[scio]

Like every type, female versus male is an overriding dimension that really has nothing to do with type. I find no differences in their thinking styles even though their life objectives can be very divergent. However as an outsider, I noted that the greatest impediments to IEE/SLI matches seems to be the IEEs and their continual search for greener pastures. They're the ones that have to stop and smell the roses.......

a.k.a. I/O

Extremely true. Probably won't ever change lol. My ADD search for something else makes it hard to do anything fully

[scio]

After and during communication with dualization types I find my weak functions as more active in consciousness. Suggestive is not exception, if the other type was dual/semidual. Such is more expressed with people I'm sincere with, to which I trust.

Mhmm. Exactly. I become REALLY inspired to do all of the things I would normally avoid

[Olimpia]

Here's the old duality thread btw.

[scio]

What does it mean to "truly" understand someone?



Speaking from the U.S. perspective, an interesting difference I've found is that SLI females often put effort into appearing more feminine/fulfilling societal expectations of what women should look like (wearing certain kinds of clothes, putting on makeup in a certain way), but their efforts are ungainly, like a baby deer trying to walk. Maybe ones who care about it a lot (perhaps social-first in instincts) end up practicing it enough that they master it--because I do think there are some very fashionable SLI women out there (some people type Kim Kardashian and Emma Watson as SLI)--but on average, the SLI females I've known IRL have an awkward sense of style.

SLI males also usually don't have a sharp sense of fashion, but it is mitigated by two facts: (1) society doesn't put as much pressure on them to look a certain way, and (2) if/when they want to try, men have much more standardized fashion guidelines--if you wear a dress shirt, belt, pants, and dress shoes that all fit, you're way ahead of the curve--whereas women have to figure out what cuts/shapes of tops, dresses, skirts, etc. work for their body type, have to figure out jewelry, makeup, accessories.



SLIs seem very straightforward to me, especially compared to Ni/Se egos. Beta NFs are the biggest mysteries to me.

I don't know if I would say LSEs, my dual, seem like a mystery to me. I don't understand how they do some of the things they do, but that's just different IE dimensionality, as domr said. I do think I would understand them a lot less if I didn't have socionics as a baseline guide though.

I do have this feeling like I want to FULLY understand my partner. I need to learn that a lot of this isn't possible. I'm young, I suppose. But yes, you don't really FULLY know anyone. And mhmmmm, Socionics has helped a lot

[Adam Strange]

This video seems to me to have an SLI-IEE vibe to it:

[The Reality Denialist]

[Sol]

@Troll Nr 007

delta has better aesthetic taste

[Bertrand]

https://charlierose.com/videos/27263?autoplay=true

[noaydi]

There isn't anything called "love" in delta duality.

Discuss.

Love is a meme. Fuck that life.

[Sol]

There isn't anything called "love" in delta duality.

Due to mistyping your IR may be other and your type is doubtful to be delta. Fe is more likely. Not EII with such "bad" language, for sure. IEI, EIE - possibly.

You may make a typing thread with video to look at your type.

[noaydi]

I'm just disintegrated and parodical.

And you are trying to avoid the truth.

Another world for this : a troll, the delta way.

[UDP]

i think 'true understanding' is difficult in certain evaluation senses about what has taken place, because of the complete opposite 4D / strong functions.
However, I think duality has a unique interpretation of how things progress, that is complementary in unique ways.

[NdFeB08]

Hmm...SLI females and males; no idea if it's type related but the females I know are very hardworking and utterly reliable homemakers. Stay at home moms with a university degree just in case, and both are sort of the backbone of the family, quietly supporting from behind the scenes, pretty much like a skeleton, without them the household would crumble. Neither of them openly question or challenge their husbands, instead they approach them like "the voice of reason", or if they disapprove of something they just give you this reproaching grim look... and you feel as an unworthy being...
The males I know fit the strong silent type, down to earth handymen, and seem to be serious at first (some actually look a bit intimidating) but are cozy homebodies once you know them better. They are practical and no-nonsense, and more openly critical of perceived flaws than the females.
Both very protective, self preservation oriented, and very much "people of their tribe" so to speak. Neither expresses affection verbally, but they work their asses off for those they love, and will have an easier time with physical demonstrations.

So far I've interacted with duals only twice; I wouldn't say I completely understood them, but I did have an easy time relating to them and understanding where they were coming from. Working together we were like ants.
Communication was also surprisingly candid (I shell up easily but I perceived these people as so unpretentious, unambiguous and bussiness minded that I saw no need for it).
As for the mysterious gaze/veil, I've no idea really; but I did feel as if I never totally knew them (do we ever totally know someone? Hell I don't even know myself lol).
Onto the suggestive function...not sure if it's because I'm actually using it myself or simply using their advice, but I do feel more focused and oriented towards efficiency/competence. I think what I *really* get is a feeling of confidence and clarity in the steps I'm taking, yeah, that's it. Otherwise, I just leave the Te to them and then go fail at parallel parking (*plays "I'm Every Woman" in the background*).

A feeling of past lives - sounds pretty cool, but nah; I didn't get that feeling.