Overly dramatic, "woe is me" communication style a Beta thing?

[mjgonz92]

If there's anything more repelling to me, it's this. When I tried a type me thread a while back, it was between EIE and IEE for me. But I'm starting to think there's no way that I could possibly be a Beta, due to real life scenarios and how I react to people with a very dramatic communication style. The "woe is me", poetic, melodramatics? I realized that is the only thing that seriously repels me and I never want to be around those kind of people again. If it's family, I will "love them from a distance", like my own mother and an aunt of mine. Does this maybe have something to do with "opposing quadras?"

what quadra would be completely against this or do anything to keep these kinds of people at a far distance?

[Tigerfadder]

I think somewhere that one who strongly feel repelling about social things are Fi lead. Maybe you are EII then?

[Pookie]

Hah my EII mom can't stand melodramatic people.

Now we don't talk about our feelings anymore, and it's better for the most part.

[Number 9 large]

Maybe you're gamma then, probably the most harsh quadra. No fe in there (pretty much epitome of melodrama), and also no si which is in delta and alpha ,which I could imagine wouldn't be that opposing to melodrama as you seem to be, because si involves being caregiving. Just lots of ni, te, se and fi. Gamma is all about toughness (se) and efficiency (te), and the ethical side is introverted (fi), so i wouldnt imagine any melodramatic acts going on there. Could make a case for Ni being melodramatic at times, though, because of victim behaviour, although I would rather classify Ni as skeptical, timerelated, hipsterlike than melodramatic, especially in gamma Nis, which are NTs, not the beta NFs which have Fe in their ego. Gamma Nis might feel melodramatic but probably wouldnt act out this way as much, unless they were IEI or EIE, but that is beta.

Edit: Might also just be Fi vs Fe valuing though. In that case it wouldn't rule out Delta. But yeah, you asked which quadra would hate that the most, so I thought of Gamma, because they don't have Si OR Fe

[mjgonz92]

EII seems to fit, but the thing about Gamma being about toughness and efficiency? Seems really familiar. Hmm...

[mjgonz92]

Besides the whole typing of myself, I'm also just trying to get an understanding and feel for how each quadras works. Not just what they share in common (within that quadra), but how they contrast with the other quadra.

It seems easier for me though if I can relate it to personal experience

[Aylen]

Any type, in any quadra, can be overly dramatic with their "woe is me" attitude but it seems to be related to health levels > cognitive. I guess it depends on what you find dramatic though. I don't think it is an attractive trait in anyone and it would be wear me down over time, regardless of the person's type, if I had to listen to it all the time. If the person is truly distressed I do not hold it against them but if they continue to complain without making an effort to change then it just seems that there is not much you can do to help them and they need some professional help. I guess going by theory it would be Fe valuers who might be moved to shift out of that mindset by others showing them positive emotion but it really would depend. Sometimes I want to feel miserable but I am probably not going to be too talkative when I feel self pitying. I find it just as unattractive in myself as I do in others. I can feel miserable or sad without feeling self pity and not letting on to anyone. Mostly because I lock myself away so I don't make others miserable.

[Shytan]

If you were stuck between IEE and EIE then you're probably IEE because you're definitely Fi ego.

[squark]

If you're talking about being whiny and feeling sorry for themselves that's mental health and not type related. But I'm not entirely sure that's what you mean.

[scio]

I also was stuck between EIE and IEE not too long ago. I know I'm an IEE now and I have the similar annoyances to what you're talking about.
I'm REALLY timid with my emotions and dislike in general when people are overly dramatic and draw attention to me when I'm always trying to downplay my emotions.
I've had a friend (I type her as ESE) recently tell me she felt "abandoned" by someone when they neglected to comfort her when her dog died and she was "traumatized" by it. I tried really hard not to vomit. Just for the sake of contrast, when my dog died when I was much younger than she is now, I didn't even tell anyone my dog died because I didn't want to bother anyone or get pity from anyone. I mourn quietly because it's a private thing I don't feel the need to share. I always find that sooner or later when I make friends that are dramatic, it's too much and they make everything about them. My parents are Beta NFs and literally like to start fights with workers that are telling them what to do because they feel personally attacked. I wouldn't act this way because I know that the people are trying to do their jobs almost all of the time and it's not their fault they have to tell someone to do something. I literally have to actively tell them that the situation isn't about them. Hope this helps

[Aylen]

If you're talking about being whiny and feeling sorry for themselves that's mental health and not type related. But I'm not entirely sure that's what you mean.

Yeah, I was unsure too. To me silent sulkers can look as dramatic as someone actively complaining, if their moping is out of place, since they are still affecting the emotional atmosphere and bringing others down but their way is heavier and often less tolerable than the open complainers. You can't tell a silent sulker to just shut up. I don't like whining in adults or children. I don't like to whine but I tend to when I get really sick or in pain. I ask to be left alone then too because I know how it can affect some people's state of mind and I don't want them to get sick of me. lol

I wonder if caregivers are better at listening to this kind of stuff than other types. My ESE sister can listen to people complain(self pity) and seems like it doesn't bring her down. She just might be better at dealing with it than I am. I can relate to not wanting pity from others like Vertu said. I imagine it is pride and learned behavior for me Even as a child I would hide when I cried but that is because I had a gamma aunt who would say she would give us something to really complain or cry about if we didn't be quiet. She was an open complainer and didn't care who heard it though but it was tinged with bitterness. ESI, with questionable mental health. :/

I was reminded of Gulenko's communication styles.

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...ication-styles

Passionate style: ExFx (SEE, IEE, ESE, EIE)

Passionate communication style group is comprised of ethical extroverted types: IEE, SEE, EIE, ESE. This group is most confident in their attitudes towards other people and not afraid to show their likes and dislikes and ethical evaluations. These sociotypes are the most sociable in informal contact.

In conversation, their position is an active search for feelings. They bring emotions to people around them. In their life scenarios, it is typical of them to marry earlier on the average than individuals other sociotypes. However, they also divorce more frequently than other sociotypes. These types understand dialogue as an exchange of emotions, as a kind of "sailing" through active currents of life.

This group is designated as ER: their Ego blocks hold either ethics of emotions E (Fe) as the first function, or ethics of relations R (Fi) as the second function.

I thought of Trisha (who is often typed SEE here) and how I can't take her videos for long. This kind of thing just comes off dramatic and fake but I have seen people act like this irl. People I would type "passionate" communication types. I think any type with 4D Fe could potentially be overly dramatic with their self pity but like I said it depends on what dramatic is being defined as. To me this is the kind of dramatic that can get irritating. "Sincere/soulful" types are introverts and probably won't be as dramatic as the above types but it could happen.



* I have seen drunk people of different types act like this too. I suppose it is on the same level as "mean" drunk to me. I don't like being around either for long, especially if I can't talk them down. I dealt with this recently at a get together at my house. They were fine once they slept it off but, omg.

[Skepsis]

There is nothing inherently wrong with overly dramatic people, but they do help me suddenly remember that I things to do and places to be.

[Muddy]

EIEs and their association with being dramatic has pretty much become a meme in socionics. Whether they are actually the most dramatic type or not IDK, but that's what most people here seem to think.

[Spermatozoa]

EIEs and their association with being dramatic has pretty much become a meme in socionics. Whether they are actually the most dramatic type or not IDK, but that's what most people here seem to think.

I don't think this is an accurate stereotype.

EIEs certainly become histrionic under stress, but we're hardly inclined towards spontaneous emotional outbursts. Drama of the kind you're describing isn't a trait I would associate with any one type.

[darya]

If you're talking about chronic pathetic complainers and "victims", then it's not connected to a type, most people hate those fuckers, but if you're repelled by interersonal drama, strong (also negative) emotional expressions and turbulent emotionality then it's unlikely you're Beta NF. Such strong aversion is also odd for IEE's, more for Fi leads and Fe PolR.

[Olimpia]

The "woe is me", poetic, melodramatics?

Unhealthy Type 4.

You are gonna find that kind of person in every Quadra except Alpha.

[Aylen]

Unhealthy Type 4.

You are gonna find that kind of person in every Quadra except Alpha.

When it is expressed poetically though through art, music, writing or even some acting it is beautiful. I have seen self typed alphas do the "woe is me" thing too, on this forum, so I imagine they do it irl just fine.

[Spermatozoa]

When it is expressed poetically though through art, music, writing or even some acting it is beautiful.

Possibly, though I need to be in a certain mood to appreciate it. Oftentimes I will find such music meanders in self-pity, and doesn't explore a complex range of emotions - only sadness.

As it happens, @Medusa's is a complaint people often have about 4s, especially Se-ignoring 4s. When unhealthy, they glorify their own suffering and won't take action.

[mjgonz92]

Yes, the "victim" act, to be quite frank.

As soon as the dramatics are aimed towards me, I don't care who it is, I'm running the opposite way. And it happens a bit too much. I can tell when someone is being genuine and trying not to come off dramatic or annoying. I have no problem helping them out and will do the best I can to be there and be supportive.

I just dont get how there are people that actually listen to or entertain it, period.

[Spermatozoa]

As soon as the dramatics are aimed towards me, I don't care who it is, I'm running the opposite way. And it happens a bit too much. I can tell when someone is being genuine and trying not to come off dramatic or annoying. I have no problem helping them out and will do the best I can to be there and be supportive.

Playful exaggeration and hyperbole are essential to Beta Quadra types in courtship. We have a shock value sense of humour, and will often possess exhibitionist tendencies. The key thing to remember here is that this is for fun, to stimulate someone else (or a group of people) into action. Beta theatricality has nothing to do with the melodrama you're referring to.

I just dont get how there are people that actually listen to or entertain it, period.

To be quite frank, this attitude is responsible for a lot of depressed people committing suicide.

[mjgonz92]

Just because someone doesn't want to entertain someone's hysterics, doesn't mean anyone else is to blame for whoever makes that decision to begin with. It is your choice to make. It's also someone's choice to seek professional help.

[Tearsofaclown]

Playful exaggeration and hyperbole are essential to Beta Quadra types in courtship. We have a shock value sense of humour, and will often possess exhibitionist tendencies. The key thing to remember here is that this is for fun, to stimulate someone else (or a group of people) into action. Beta theatricality has nothing to do with the melodrama you're referring to.



To be quite frank, this attitude is responsible for a lot of depressed people committing suicide.

Exactly. And serious types whine about it. I hate whiners. Beta would be the least "woe is me" quadra. I see woe is me posts on facebook everyday. Shut up. You aren't getting my sympathy. lol. It is embarrassing to do that shit. And even if we are pussies we try to put up the biggest facade to pretend otherwise. Appear strong when you are weak.

This UFC forum I am on. Almost all Beta. This fighter cried after he got knocked the fuck out and lost. We have been mocking him endlessly since. We are outraged. That you would give that man even a larger victory. Your enemy you been talking shit about fuckin flattens you. Ain't that enough? You're gonna fuckin cry too? Jesus. Hasn't he taken enough from you? Now you are gonna blubber on national TV? lol.

I will kick a motherfucker when he is down. That is usually the best time to kick them.

[Hermit Soul]

That sounds more like an enneagram 4 thing actually. Enneagram 4s are prone to feeling misunderstood and self-pitying/victimization tendencies.

[Aylen]

Exactly. And serious types whine about it. I hate whiners. Beta would be the least "woe is me" quadra. I see woe is me posts on facebook everyday. Shut up. You aren't getting my sympathy. lol. It is embarrassing to do that shit. And even if we are pussies we try to put up the biggest facade to pretend otherwise. Appear strong when you are weak.

This UFC forum I am on. Almost all Beta. This fighter cried after he got knocked the fuck out and lost. We have been mocking him endlessly since. We are outraged. That you would give that man even a larger victory. Your enemy you been talking shit about fuckin flattens you. Ain't that enough? You're gonna fuckin cry too? Jesus. Hasn't he taken enough from you? Now you are gonna blubber on national TV? lol.

I will kick a motherfucker when he is down. That is usually the best time to kick them.

It was pointed out to me recently that I can be overly focused on weaknesses in others sometimes. Like Trump whining for example. To me that is a subconscious thing sort of ingrained in me. It is a weakness to whine in public. It is a weakness to whine at all. Weakness is punished or ridiculed. I think it is because I was raised in a place where weakness was not acceptable in any form and you had to develop a thicker skin to be there.

I don't want to kick people when they are down though.

[Tearsofaclown]

It was pointed out to me recently that I can be overly focused on weaknesses in others sometimes. Like Trump whining for example. To me that is a subconscious thing sort of ingrained in me. It is a weakness to whine in public. It is a weakness to whine at all. Weakness is punished or ridiculed. I think it is because I was raised in a place where weakness was not acceptable in any form and you had to develop a thicker skin to be there.

" I don't want to kick people when they are down though.

The thing about Trump is his language is so soft. He never really gets rough with people. Like he will say something like, "you are not nice! you are a bad person!". It sounds juvenile and feminine. Compare him to somebody like Christopher Hitchens. Hitchens gets mean. Or even Richard Dawkins. These guys actually say harsh things. Trump doesn't.

And I dont think he is thin skinned. He makes a fool of himself everyday and is proven wrong everyday but he just keeps on trucking. I would hide under a rock. He doesn't care. He can take it. He has no shame.

Same thing has been pointed out to me. How I hate weakness and am "hyper masculine". Nietzsche despised weakness and pity too.

“Pity preserves things that are ripe for decline, it defends things that have been disowned and condemned by life, and it gives a depressive and questionable character to life itself by keeping alive an abundance of failures of every type. People have dared to call pity a virtue… people have gone even further, making it into the virtue, the foundation and source of all virtues, - but of course you always have to keep in mind that this was the perspective of a nihilistic philosophy that inscribed the negation of life on its shield. Schopenhauer was right here: pity negates life, it makes life worthy of negation, - pity is the practice of nihilism. Once more: this depressive and contagious instinct runs counter to the instincts that preserve and enhance the value of life: by multiplying misery just as much as by conserving everything miserable, pity is one of the main tools used to increase decadence - pity wins people over to nothingness! … You do not say ‘nothingness’ : instead you say ‘the beyond’; or ‘God’; or ‘the true life’; or nirvana, salvation, blessedness … This innocent rhetoric from the realm of religious-moral idiosyncrasy suddenly appears much less innocent when you see precisely which tendencies are wrapped up inside these sublime words: tendencies hostile to life.”


― Friedrich Nietzsche, The Anti-Christ



Beta, cuz of Fe and Se, may take that approach. Get your ass up. You never nurture pity. Stand up and try again.


I think it is unbelievable how you have given into the hands of fate.

[mjgonz92]

Aylen, I resonate with everything you are saying. I've been exhausted for the past month, so it's hard to have others type me accurately when I'm being very short in my responses lol.