Is daydreaming or having a rich imagination characteristic of certain types or a combination of functions?
Daydreaming and imagination for INTjs and ESFjs
Is daydreaming or having a rich imagination characteristic of certain types or a combination of functions?
Last edited by Iwantpeace; 09-11-2020 at 04:52 PM.
Do not skimp on the daydreaming and imagination. If you are going to do it, do it well!
Yes, the stronger the intuition in the ego block, the more this manifests. ESE might daydream or imagine more since their base function is not about hands-on pragmatism as the LSE practices it, but romanticism. Do you relate?
From the IEE perspective, I experience both strong imaginative 'flashes' as I call them, as well as daydreaming moments where I zone out. It's hard to put into words but it's like a parallel world to what is going on/what I am doing. It's the second thought in some way, whatever stimulus I have doesn't get taken at face value. It's not totally unrelated, but not exactly pragmatic either. This is just an experience of high mental frequency where I get insights from my fantasy and image archive (almost always involving people as the topic), it's a state of detachment. Without a harmonious environment I can't get into this mode,in need of
.
Creativity can express itself through all elements, in Model A the creative function is showing us how. ESE's mobilizing requires some feedback in terms of how their fantasy truly captures the essence of something, so yeah as you said it can be confused with. EII as well since
in strength plus strong
.
There are different kinds of imagination.
The basic not type related imagination is daydreaming and it is a result of weak ego consciousness. Young persons typically have this.
When you get bored the ego consciousness steps back and imagination takes over.
Sometimes in the morning just when you have woke up the ego is still weak and you can get almost psychotic daydreams or compulsive images.
Primitive peoples tend to daydream more
Modern people in the west with a developed consciousness and in the middle of a career with lots of things going on and responsibility, they tend to daydream less.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
I can't actually believe it is, I daydream or make up detailed and sequential scenarios in my head all the time, my SEE best friend doe sit even more. While the most intuitive people I know (IEIs & IEEs) don't really indulge in that a lot. I think this is one of those "do you think about the future a lot?", "do you impartially analyze and categorize?" things. It was by answering yes to questions like this that I got many ILI and LSIs results.
Definitely.Originally Posted by Chae
Last edited by Iwantpeace; 11-27-2017 at 02:24 PM.
I've noticed that, but I do wonder how that plays out with other functions. Because I see so manyleads get "carried away",
dominants too
Its only natural. They live in a natural state with no office hours, no advance technology. Daydreaming is the natural state that modern ego consciousness has developed from.
This is sometimes discussed in Jungian psychology.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
In the "what heck is Ni" thread I briefly touch on this:
Kids daydream. Daydreaming often involves a lot of conscious thinking too and is not just spontaneous images or insights but insights can emerge from it. I know I was accused of it a lot as a child (it is written on reports) when something completely different was going on. My ESE sister wanted to be a princess and later a mother, with a set number of kids, (she wants to be neither now). She loved Disney stories even more than my other sister and me. Her daydreams usually lead to some kind of plan though."Because people like to theorize about things they don't understand, mind, spirit, nature, the universe, etc... Sometimes they have good or interesting insights which lead to deeper understanding, sometimes it just leads to more confusion. For example having a good imagination or fantasizing is often attributed to Ni but lots of people fantasize and have a good imagination. My EII-Ne sister fantasizes more than me. I think my ESE sister fantasizes a lot too, in a different way (she is always coming up with some "plan" and has big dreams to follow). I might look like I am just fantasizing when something completely different is happening inside my head. My teachers would write to my mom about me zoning out or daydreaming but in hindsight I don't believe that is what I was doing. I was taking in the information I was being taught differently than some of the other kids. I was an A student without really trying.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
Extraverted types tend to interact objectively with the rest of the world. Introverted types tend to be somewhat subjective.
I usually see elaborate daydreaming kind of constraining. Let's ditch this what I just got and head for the new.
That said as I aim for objective truth I tend to think that imaging processes is important step when you want to problem solve. It is like I'm throwing myself inside a system as external observer and later come back with an answer. It can get pretty silly if I want it.
Example of
Last edited by The Reality Denialist; 08-08-2017 at 06:14 AM.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
I associate daydreaming more with Ep- and Ij-types who rationalize in a sort of mental isolation. It doesn't seem to be any more Ne associated than Se although Se-types seem less inclined toward the past and the out-there stuff. However, I associate imagination with inspiration, which all types undergo. Ej- and Ip-types have very subjective references but require participation in their rationalization processes, which is not conducive to zoning out.
a.k.a. I/O
I like to imagine that I'm daydreaming, or daydream that I am imagining.
I find nowadays I tend to usually imagine in a practical manner. It is where I develop my best ideas and then flesh them out internally to near perfection before anyone has heard them yet.
Some of these ideas get put aside for the future though for a variety of reasons. When I was young, it was mostly just daydreaming without purpose. Still happens today of course, but nowhere near as much.
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
I was a maladaptive daydreamer as an adolescent - like, talking to myself in public level - but I have lost some imagination and find daydreaming less and less interesting as I get older. I think the easy gratification of getting on my phone to pass the time has a lot to do with it. I have always had more or less "realistic" fantasies (like if I'm rich I need to have an explanation in mind for how it happened, even though it's not real anyway) and I wonder if there's any type correlation w people having more outlandish daydreams which allow for breaking more temporal rules.
you mean fantasizing about things disconnected from their possibility of ever coming true? one of my favorite jokes is "all this money can't buy me a time machine" which I love to pull out when people go down counter factual lines of reasoning (if they're doing the whole coulda woulda shoulda thing, because of the temporal contradictions it entails). I do think one way to circumvent the absurdity is "step into the shoes" of an entirely different reality, which all that matters is that it could happen in that reality. This is like works of fiction in general. True there's no way I can insert my concrete self into certain fantasies because all avenues are cut off to me for varying reasons, but what if you live entirely vicariously through another person? its enough that it could happen to them. I like thinking in those terms sometimes, because I think there's something universal about "the human experience" that allows you to meaningfully share in those kinds of fictitious happenings... I think some of the biggest daydreamers of that kind are IEI, for whom its like good enough that they imagined something, regardless of its concrete instantiation... I think its a Fe + strong intuition thing. I think Te valuing is more prone to think about "productive" or "live" possibilities, even if they value Ne it will usually be directed toward that end, for example IEE might create lots of zany ideas but they're mainly directed at concrete individuals with a "live" purpose--to inspire or distract or whatever. Whereas I feel IEI really "lives" the possibilities from the first person perspective--because the "purpose" was Fe and it fulfills that purpose without having to come into some kind of Te fruition
i also think there's something going on where when you're young you use base + mobilizing more than creative, which you come into in your teens and 20s, like I used to be way more of a physical comedian until around 13 or 14 when I became way way more philosophical and my humor became highly ironic and inaccessible. I could see ESI being a huge daydreamer until they get more into creative Se and it becomes more about live and concrete possibilities, I wonder if IEI when young somehow managed to merge Fe + Ti? maybe like making complex diagrams of some Fe related material or some such. lol maybe giving dad a 1 through 20 list of reasons why hes the best or something
Ha. Daydreaming is nice. I don't really do it, but I tend to have a sleep schedule which leads to interesting dreams in the morning if I follow it. I have some interesting short stories that I could tell from them, because they are mostly incredibly detailed, at least by my standards, anyways. Otherwise, I do tend to have very active thoughts at times, but they are not usually a "dream" type thing. I tend to get very introspective about my perceptions though, and that might count. I also tend to think up music at times, and this might count. Like, full blown symphonies and stuff. Too bad I always forget what I think of when I go to write it down. It doesn't help that I think of them by sound instead of as notes, which can get confusing as I often think of polyphonic music.
As for daydreaming being caused by boredom, I don't know. I do agree that it comes from a great shift in consciousness though, and that would be something you get with boredom, but I'm sure that is just a symptom of boredom, and that there are other cases where one might have that shift in consciousness, for example, extreme tiredness. I also do the music thing in times of great joy, which sometimes probably borders on mania. When my mood is comparatively low, I don't usually do it. If I do, there is a greater chance that the music will be something I heard, and also be more likely to be something I don't like. Whether I am listening to something or not doesn't really matter. So yeah, there is an example of my take on the daydreaming.
I also have a decent imagination, although nailing down specifics is hard for me. It is a common theme where I'll set up a system of doing things, and then hit some roadblock with the specifics, such as the names or set numbers. As such, I'll often use real or already defined fictional data to fill in the gaps. This can be an arduous task of research, though, and I don't enjoy it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrenology
An optimist - does not get discouraged under any circumstances. Life upheavals and stressful events only toughen him and make more confident. He likes to laugh and entertain people. Enters contact with someone by involving him with a humorous remark. His humor is often sly and contain hints and double meanings. Easily enters into arguments and bets, especially if he is challenged. When arguing his points is often ironic, ridicules the views of his opponent. His irritability and hot temper may be unpleasant to others. However, he himself is not perceptive of this and believes that he is simply exchanging opinions.
http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php?title=LIE_Profile_by_Gulenko
I experience the same thing.
They were vivid and enticing when I was younger, I remember I'd feel jaded and disillusioned whenever I checked back into reality. Like whiplash. And now the crux of my memories from that time period are tainted by unrealized fantasies. Hardcore escapism, but nowadays I just ruminate on the shoulda, woulda, coulda but didn'ts of the past, romanticize present circumstances, and muse over future happenings that'll never happen. Sometimes I think of how interesting it'd be to fabricate a backstory since at times I feel more connected to those unrealized fantasies than I do my real life experiences.
I daydream a fair bit. Usually to illustrate every day life. I like thinking about stories based off of my favourite shows/books, inserting myself in the story line and imagining how I'd react in the situations.
Or if im in a negative anxious state of being ill be imagining worst case scenarios and panicking for my loved ones and my own safety :0
I can not speak for other people, but for me this is true.
Replace the word "nowhere" with "from your own subconscious"
Intuition is perception your subconscious generates.
I can tell that ESE and LSE can also use Ne in a skillful way. I type my aunt as ESE.
Ehm. What?
Nah, I sold my imagination for highest bidder. Deal was good and we are good friends. We used to play poker together everyone evening from 20.10 to 20.11.
I won my imagination back one evening but I lost my ability to eat porridge. Oh well, this is just life.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
I explained this in post #10 in this thread. Strong ego development in western culture.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
I beg to differ between situational flashes of insight and daydreaming.
Daydreaming is more removed from reality. Flashes of insight are more situational helpful,
but a guess there is a difference between intuitional perception filtered by logic or ethical judgement.
I agree. But I was talking about daydreaming all the time.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
I can see at least two different ways of daydreaming: Recalling images of own past expirences and creative daydreaming. Creative daydreaming is about situations that didn't happen in reality.
I guess lot a storywriters use daydreaming in a productive way, writing down their own fantasies, with maybe mixing in own expierences in altered forms.
From a NT type point of view daydreaming might be a form of a biological virtual reality simulation that living creatures with having consciousness of themselves posess.
I hope my argument is understandable for readers, because english is not my native language.
Question of interest: Do different types daydream in a different way and more or less frequent?
But that was basicly the question of the whole topic.
I daydream. I Maladaptively Daydream actually.
Given my type, my dreams are probably not as great, vivid, or imaginative as yours...but I do this too.
I daydream almost constantly but its pretty much limited to the things like tender romance or blowing stuff up.
I do this a lot too - i like imagining what i would imagine in a given state or situation.
Daydreaming and the "world of imagination" tends to have a lot more to do with Ni than Ne. Ne is more about coming up with ideas for things that could actually exist, or combining existing things in new ways.
Who are ya calling primitive?!
If anything daydreaming and imagining is the opposite of primitiveness, since it allows people to experience scenarios and explore ideas that aren't readily present. There's a lot of things you can learn through experiences created in your own mind: If you wonder whether or not something will work or happen, you can try to imagine the process and the outcome (via daydreaming) and see if it's likely to work or not. Therefore daydreamers will get better "results" than non-daydreamers; such a shame that people with a "developed consciousness" daydream less.
I do agree with your last sentence, though. Daydreaming is for people who have time on their hands, and for those who haven't had all their creativity and imagination sucked out of their brains by the system*. Society's becoming more and more rational and less imaginative, I blame technology being the new drug for kids who should be playing in their yards or something instead of playing Minecraft and using Snapchat or whatever. People these days (big and small) are used to everything being spoon-fed to them and their problems being magically solved by some random app rather than THEM having to use their imagination to come up with a solution. So indeed, modern people daydream and imagine less than ever, but is that a good thing? Can you call that progress? Because if you can't, you can't call the people of today modern* if there's a regression in their way of thinking.
*whatever that means to you
As for how my own imagination works... I don't do it when I really shouldn't, say, being in the middle of a class and daydreaming about something completely unrelated (unless perhaps if the class is really boring) but I'll regularly do it as a means to "rest" my own mind. I can strain my mind for quite a few hours before I get tired, but the longer I go, the more I feel like "disconnecting" and just imagining something more fun. I always daydream before going to sleep, sometimes I even spend 1-2 hours before I finally fall asleep. When I go out for walks I semi-think/semi-daydream too, when I walk I get to see different images which kind of fuel my imagination. My daydreams are either about cool (realistic) possibilities in the near or far future (think, months to several years), sci-fi stuff set several centuries in the future (xNTx cliche, I know), and romance. Romance daydreams are my most common ones, guess it's just easier to make relationships in your head than in real life. I used to daydream a whole lot more when I was younger, though, maybe even 1/3 to 2/3 of my entire time awake, I'd just tune out the real world and think about nice things in my head. I never really thought it was a problem and over time I started doing it less.
I mean from an antropological and psychological point of view.
Daydreaming is closer to the original state of mind. On this state human ego consciousness is built. If we become tired or bored ego consciousness steps back and daydreaming rises to the surface. Its the primitive mind thats still active in all of us.
In children and young people daydreaming is common because ego consciousness is still weak. And this is also true for primitive, or indigenous peoples. Ego development is so much more advanced in modern societies.
Ego consciousness is the exception. The new invention and fragile thing. Unconsciousness and autonomous psychic phenomena is the common thing in nature.
Yes we need both, but one shouldnt take ego consciousness for granted. Our personal sanity and whole civilization depends on it.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
I daydream heavily and have since in elementary. Daydreams are heavy, constant and often. I daydream anywhere, no matter how noisy the environment, few or many people, no matter the topic of conversation or type of music playing.
I don't understand how the ILE-3Ne plays into all of this. Don't know if I'm alpha or not. I have learned that the 3 on that Ne means I'm heavy Ne but I don't know what all that means.
The ones with weak se or te and strong intuition, cough infp cough lol
It makes em look like lazy day dreaming motherfrs
I'm a dreamer and a doer, but not a planner
I imagine something for years, then spontaneously act it out later without much actual thought, just with the intention of having fun
I relate to this completely. I m not alpha. I think my ne is pretty strong though how to tell level I don't know. I dayfream alway s even when doing very active mental things ie writing a story I am thinking simultaneously. I can't stop it. Sometimes to write a story and get out of it I go to a cafe and try to focus on what is happening and who is there then I write with the other hand what I am barely aware of and it comes out good sometimes.
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