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Thread: Socionics, the MBTI and the Pretense of Intellectualism....

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    Board philosopher or bored philosopher? jason_m's Avatar
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    Default Socionics, the MBTI and the Pretense of Intellectualism....

    Have you noticed that in the MBTI and even socionics, this is NT/Rational/Scientific type:



    Is there really anything of substance that makes him smart? I find instead the mere pretense of intelligence, based on speech/clothes/behaviour. It bothers me, because I am the exact oppositie of Stewie: when people talk to me in real life, they get more of the feeling that I am an 'everyday guy,' and would have no sense that I have any sort of intellectual side at all... It also bothers me, because I wonder if, in the end, I am not 'Rational NT', but instead some more 'ordinary' type, when I have worked my whole life to be smart! It makes me angry: why would someone like that be considered 'high IQ' and me 'average intellect' for such superficial reasons, when I know damn well I'm smart? Is it necessary that I brag about it every chance I get? What is going on here?! Anyway, I'd like to hear what you think...
    LII

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    Keyword there is "pretense." There's a certain pretense that comes with NT in pop culture that they are intelligent. People type as NT most often, it seems, due to this pretense, not because it accurately reflects them. In groups of people who type as NT in my personal experiences, there's a pretty solid sub-division of people who actually display NT traits for what they really are, and those who simply pick it based upon the pretense associated with it while clearly displaying no NT traits. Within both groups there are varying ranges of intelligence.

    What do you actually type as on 16personalities.com from the perspective of "this is how I factually am?"

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    Board philosopher or bored philosopher? jason_m's Avatar
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    Results:

    MEDIATOR (INFP-T)

    MIND
    This trait determines how we interact with our environment.
    9%
    INTROVERTED
    91%
    EXTRAVERTED

    ENERGY
    This trait shows where we direct our mental energy.
    83%
    INTUITIVE
    17%
    OBSERVANT

    NATURE
    This trait determines how we make decisions and cope with emotions.
    34%
    THINKING
    66%
    FEELING

    TACTICS
    This trait reflects our approach to work, planning and decision-making.
    30%
    JUDGING
    70%
    PROSPECTING

    IDENTITY
    This trait underpins all others, showing how confident we are in our abilities and decisions.
    23%
    ASSERTIVE
    77%
    TURBULENT
    LII

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    Quote Originally Posted by jason_m View Post
    Results:

    MEDIATOR (INFP-T)

    MIND
    This trait determines how we interact with our environment.
    9%
    INTROVERTED
    91%
    EXTRAVERTED

    ENERGY
    This trait shows where we direct our mental energy.
    83%
    INTUITIVE
    17%
    OBSERVANT

    NATURE
    This trait determines how we make decisions and cope with emotions.
    34%
    THINKING
    66%
    FEELING

    TACTICS
    This trait reflects our approach to work, planning and decision-making.
    30%
    JUDGING
    70%
    PROSPECTING

    IDENTITY
    This trait underpins all others, showing how confident we are in our abilities and decisions.
    23%
    ASSERTIVE
    77%
    TURBULENT
    Sorry, but having a difficult time deciphering the percentages. What % do the bars show for I, N, F, P, and Turbulent?

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    Board philosopher or bored philosopher? jason_m's Avatar
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    MIND
    This trait determines how we interact with our environment.
    9%
    INTROVERTED
    91%
    EXTRAVERTED
    means:

    9% Introverted and 91% Extraverted.
    so:

    9% INTROVERTED
    vs. 91% EXTRAVERTED


    83% INTUITIVE
    vs. 17% OBSERVANT


    34% THINKING
    vs. 66% FEELING


    30% JUDGING
    vs. 70% PROSPECTING


    23% ASSERTIVE
    vs. 77% TURBULENT
    LII

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    Quote Originally Posted by jason_m View Post
    means:



    so:

    9% INTROVERTED
    vs. 91% EXTRAVERTED


    83% INTUITIVE
    vs. 17% OBSERVANT


    34% THINKING
    vs. 66% FEELING


    30% JUDGING
    vs. 70% PROSPECTING


    23% ASSERTIVE
    vs. 77% TURBULENT
    So you're barely Introverted, correct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    So you're barely Introverted, correct?
    Sorry, those are backwards...

    91% Introverted
    9% Extraverted
    LII

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    Quote Originally Posted by jason_m View Post
    Sorry, those are backwards...

    91% Introverted
    9% Extraverted
    Ah, okay. Well, my personal understanding of the situation is that you are Vital (P) IEI (Highest preference N, second F) that is focused on your Weak functions (Turbulent).

    One misnomer in your Original Post is equating smart/intelligent to knowledgeable. The former refers to speed at creatively achieving something, and ability to increase such is fairly difficult, but simply involves brain exercises; e.g. Luminosity.com, breadth of varying experiences, stuff like that. The latter is what you're referencing, and is independent of anything to do with typology.

    Most "NT"s online are really probably other types, who subconsciously lie about how they actually are to mask their insecurities. This is why many of them come across as so abrasive with their "logic," because they are very overly eager to find some acknowledgment of intelligence, which leads to extreme focus and studying and spending years on a relatively arbitrary system which they state is proof of their intelligence (mistakenly calling T such) and using their knowledge and experience of the system for self-validation via argumentation.

    Try not to worry about it. You try hard, do what you can do in life, and find other's who appreciate and value such, and that's all it's really about for anyone anyways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Ah, okay. Well, my personal understanding of the situation is that you are Vital (P) IEI (Highest preference N, second F) that is focused on your Weak functions (Turbulent).
    Would that essentially mean Se-PoLR? Because I identify myself as LII-IEI, because I'm basically Se-PoLR with very weak and unvalued Te...

    Jason
    LII

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    Quote Originally Posted by jason_m View Post
    Would that essentially mean Se-PoLR? Because I identify myself as LII-IEI, because I'm basically Se-PoLR with very weak and unvalued Te...

    Jason
    No, that would be IEI with Te PoLR and Se Dual-Seeking. There's good and bad ways to do both. Keep in mind, in Socionics, "attacking" someone is essentially hitting their weak functions. Te PoLR means its unvalued, weak, and you're consciously aware of pain caused by people focusing on it. Se Dual-Seeking is having someone who knows to stand-up for your Te issues without you having to worry about it.

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    You're just in a not-so-great place by having to stay in your weak functions to watch out for them, due to lack of proper individuals to watch out for them for you, and vice-versa for they.

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    We could talk about differences of temperament/outside behavior here and information cognition as is supposed to be given by Socionics. You have a point. There are a lot of 'normal' looking people out there that are NTs...and you really can't tell until you start to work with them or talk with them in some kind of intellectual capacity. Others have their temperament matching the stereotype. They tend to be very different in outward appearance...almost being different types by the personality system defined by your eyes.
    salmon

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