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Thread: The earth is round

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJackal View Post
    Yes it does.. It wasn't the magical evil tooth fairy ...

    Sorry, providing examples isn't "Cherry Picking"..., it is providing examples..., and I could go on right into what they did with the Incas in Peru.. Not only did Catholicism do this sort of stuff in doctrine, the church did as well.
    Dude, you have serious issues with time.

    I wanted to be a garbage truck driver when I was 4, so I could get all kinds of cool junk; therefore, I want to be a garbage truck driver. <- This is your logic.

    Catholicism and Christianity, historically, are not equivalent to Catholicism and Christianity today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Dude, you have serious issues with time.

    I wanted to be a garbage truck driver when I was 4, so I could get all kinds of cool junk; therefore, I want to be a garbage truck driver. <- This is your logic.

    Catholicism and Christianity, historically, are not equivalent to Catholicism and Christianity today.
    Doctrine is still as bad..., and though I wouldn't argue that Catholicism and Christianity are as bad today(in practice), but they are still "bad" in the here and now..

    I want to be a garbage truck driver.
    If you aspire to the doctrine, it is the same thing as saying you want to be a truck driver.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJackal View Post
    Doctrine is still as bad..., and though I wouldn't argue that Catholicism and Christianity are as bad today(in practice), but they are still "bad" in the here and now..

    If you aspire to the doctrine, it is the same thing as saying you want to be a truck driver.
    Except that your information is wrong lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Except that your information is wrong lol
    Incorrect

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJackal View Post
    Incorrect
    Well, if you don't want to be picked on by Christians, try not being such a weird little nutcase.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Well, if you don't want to be picked on by Christians, try not being such a weird little nutcase.
    You're not even making sense at this point.. O.o Let me know when you have arguments of substance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJackal View Post
    You're not even making sense at this point.. O.o Let me know when you have arguments of substance.
    That's kinda the point. You're nuts. That's why you don't grasp how arguments and logic work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    That's kinda the point. You're nuts. That's why you don't grasp how arguments and logic work.
    You are still engaging in ad hominems. Even if this is merely your belief, you did not need to voice it. You could have alternatively have produced proof for your arguments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    You need a reality lesson. "Does" doesn't equal "did."

    You can't just go around cherry-picking information to build a weak house of cards and call a belief of yours fact. Catholicism doesn't pass judgement on people, which is a fact. No amount of "logic" is going to change that, because it's a fact. You're just going to wind up a nutcase if you spend your whole life desperately trying to argue against reality.
    When the Pope says that someone is not a Christian, is that not Catholicism (as an institution) passing judgement on a person?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    You are still engaging in ad hominems. Even if this is merely your belief, you did not need to voice it. You could have alternatively have produced proof for your arguments.
    It's not an argument, if it is reality. I'm not going look for references for y'all, because y'all are too lazy to educate yourselves properly, especially when you both lie about being educated on something you clearly are not. Google is not a replacement for actual education, especially when it is used as a tool to promote one's own bigotry.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    When the Pope says that someone is not a Christian, is that not Catholicism (as an institution) passing judgement on a person?
    Wrong type of judgement, bro.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    You're being pretty goofy. You're still attempting to argue validity of beliefs, which I already previously stated I would not do so anymore. What I am arguing is that you're off on what the beliefs are that you're attempting to argue the validity of lol.

    You're not educated on what Catholicism is, so you're having to derp around resources to try and argue (Ti) due to your lack knowledge (Te). I'm point blank telling you that one of your arguments about the validity of Catholicism's beliefs is off, because it's not Catholicism's beliefs lol. If you want to discuss Catholicism, go learn it first. If you want to discuss Christianity, understand that Christianity includes Catholicism, and that your arguments will be derp if they are contradictory to Catholicism.
    You said that Catholic belief was summed up in "doctrine and the catechism". The Catechism of the Catholic Church is clear that the Revelation of Christ as revealed in the Canon (the approved books that make up Scripture) cannot be surpassed or corrected. Thus, any doctrines voiced by Christ in those works are the entirety of what there is to know about Christ's doctrines and character. Both @TheJackal and myself are familiar with the content of these books, and seemingly know more about what constitutes Catholic ideology than you do (nevermind Christian ideology as a whole).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    It's not an argument, if it is reality. I'm not going look for references for y'all, because y'all are too lazy to educate yourselves properly, especially when you both lie about being educated on something you clearly are not. Google is not a replacement for actual education, especially when it is used as a tool to promote one's own bigotry.
    First you were saying "there is only belief", now you are saying you are objective reality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Wrong type of judgement, bro.
    No, it is exactly the relevant type of judgment. Not only is it of exactly the same judgement that god, according to Christian doctrine, makes on Judgement Day, it is taken to be a judgement of faithfulness (in Christ, and in god), as well as one of moral judgement (at least according to Christian standards).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Nice try, but you just proved my point about premise-affirming searches. Try again.
    You asked me to read all of "Catholic Doctrine and Catechism".

    Upon investigating, I found that Catholic doctrine and the Catechism say that Scripture alone is enough to get the message of Christ's doctrines. That is hardly premise-affirming: it is merely what Catholics believe, and what most Christian sects throughout history have believed. The earliest records of Christ's teachings have formed the core of Christian texts for the last two millenia, and you asserted that all Christian sects were valid in any case.

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    Not really sure how your logic keeps breaking in the same spot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Not really sure how your logic keeps breaking in the same spot.
    This isn't a matter of my logic, but of you being wrong and wishing to claim some victory in the realm of "my truth is as valid as any other truth lol".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    This isn't a matter of my logic, but of you being wrong and wishing to claim some victory in the realm of "my truth is as valid as any other truth lol".
    Well, I'm not wrong, for one, because I actually know my religion.

    I was referring to a personal level, though. You appear to be stuck in Business. Based upon such and what you wrote in your thread about your enneagram blog thing, I think it's due to your lack of super-id. Te-Si. You realize you have to do that, right? Without such, you won't have the necessary background for your Business to complete.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Well, I'm not wrong, for one, because I actually know my religion.
    And which religion is that? Please be as precise as possible, for once in this thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    I was referring to a personal level, though. You appear to be stuck in Business. Based upon such and what you wrote in your thread about your enneagram blog thing, I think it's due to your lack of super-id. Te-Si. You realize you have to do that, right? Without such, you won't have the necessary background for your Business to complete.
    I feel for you if you think that portraying yourself in this way is good for your Sense of Self and your Legacy. There are far more creative ways of being a troll.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    And which religion is that? Please be as precise as possible, for once in this thread.

    I feel for you if you think that portraying yourself in this way is good for your Sense of Self and your Legacy. There are far more creative ways of being a troll.
    Roman Catholic. You're still missing information. Either you simply haven't come across it yet, or you misinterpreted it.

    You have to do more physical, hands-on work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Roman Catholic. You're still missing information. Either you simply haven't come across it yet, or you misinterpreted it.

    You have to do more physical, hands-on work.
    Do you consider the Gospels central works of (your) Catholic faith, and representative of Jesus's views?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    Do you consider the Gospels central works of (your) Catholic faith, and representative of Jesus's views?
    I have directly told you multiple times now that Catholicism does not pass judgement on anyone. It is not my job to educate you out of your own laziness.

    Once you know what you're talking about, you can discuss the reasoning for such with me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    I have directly told you multiple times now that Catholicism does not pass judgement on anyone. It is not my job to educate you out of your own laziness.

    Once you know what you're talking about, you can discuss the reasoning for such with me.
    Do you consider the Gospels central works of (your) Catholic faith, and representative of Jesus's views?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    Do you consider the Gospels central works of (your) Catholic faith, and representative of Jesus's views?
    You lost this argument before it ever started. When you know, I'll discuss it with you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    You lost this argument before it ever started. When you know, I'll discuss it with you.
    You saying that "Catholicism does not pass judgement on anyone" has no bearing on whether Jesus was/is ethical. It doesn't even have any bearing on whether Jesus, God, or any other agents other than "Catholicism" passes judgement on anyone.

    If you mean to imply that people "choose" to send themselves to Hell in your ideology, or in your understanding of Christian ideology, or in your understanding of Catholic ideology, that is not what Scripture says. Jesus is clear that it is god's judgement and his subsequent throwing of people into the eternal fire and brimstone of Hell that places people there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    You saying that "Catholicism does not pass judgement on anyone" has no bearing on whether Jesus was/is ethical. It doesn't even have any bearing on whether Jesus, God, or any other agents other than "Catholicism" passes judgement on anyone.

    If you mean to imply that people "choose" to send themselves to Hell in your ideology, or in your understanding of Christian ideology, or in your understanding of Catholic ideology, that is not what Scripture says. Jesus is clear that it is god's judgement and his subsequent throwing of people into the eternal fire and brimstone of Hell that places people there.
    Do you think it was not of my own free will that I chose to speak to you? I gave you your proof very directly. I told you that I have other things to tend to. This was not enough for you. I have now told you multiple times, in multiple ways, the answer. You do not need to know what I do. You do not need to understand what I do. You do not need to know why I do and continue to do the things which I do. Wood is heavy for a reason. If it was not, people would never grow stronger from carrying it. Strength is there for a reason. You need to physically work. Now, I have other things to tend to. Please be respectful and mindful of others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Do you think it was not of my own free will that I chose to speak to you? I gave you your proof very directly. I told you that I have other things to tend to. This was not enough for you. I have now told you multiple times, in multiple ways, the answer. You do not need to know what I do. You do not need to understand what I do. You do not need to know why I do and continue to do the things which I do. Wood is heavy for a reason. If it was not, people would never grow stronger from carrying it. Strength is there for a reason. You need to physically work. Now, I have other things to tend to. Please be respectful and mindful of others.
    Whether or not we have free will is another topic altogether: we can discuss it if it helps you.

    I thought before you said there was no such thing as proof. Have you since changed your mind, and are thus more amenable to considering me correct?

    Is wood really that heavy? Does it really have a rationale for being heavy as you contend? I know of no Christian doctrine which says that a person need physically work...I wasn't aware that Jesus is recorded as having practiced such a belief himself.

    You are entitled to your beliefs, as long as they do not involving hurling insults at others and otherwise causing harm to society.

    Considering that you have not clarified why you consider Jesus (according to Christian doctrine) not to have advocated Hell as a place to send people, and considering you claimed to find Jesus' teachings ethical, and considering your repeated ad hominems in this thread, I find it very rich for you to ask me to be respectful and mindful of others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    Whether or not we have free will is another topic altogether: we can discuss it if it helps you.

    I thought before you said there was no such thing as proof. Have you since changed your mind, and are thus more amenable to considering me correct?

    Is wood really that heavy? Does it really have a rationale for being heavy as you contend? I know of no Christian doctrine which says that a person need physically work...I wasn't aware that Jesus is recorded as having practiced such a belief himself.

    You are entitled to your beliefs, as long as they do not involving hurling insults at others and otherwise causing harm to society.

    Considering that you have not clarified why you consider Jesus (according to Christian doctrine) not to have advocated Hell as a place to send people, and considering you claimed to find Jesus' teachings ethical, and considering your repeated ad hominems in this thread, I find it very rich for you to ask me to be respectful and mindful of others.
    I recommend you consider the nails you you're holding and read the bible to see who was condemned to hell. How many times will you see those eyes? How many nails? How many tears? How many cries? How much blood? How much before only one man is left alone in his bloody tears of defeat? Hubris? Sounds like hell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    I recommend you consider the nails you you're holding and read the bible to see who was condemned to hell. How many times will you see those eyes? How many nails? How many tears? How many cries? How much blood? How much before only one man is left alone in his bloody tears of defeat? Hubris? Sounds like hell.
    So you do accept that Jesus believed in Damnation (according to Scripture), and you do consider his views ethical.

    Why do you consider it ethical to send anybody to hell, nevermind people who are Good who happen to not believe in the existence of god (and/or his moral soundness) (e.g. Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, and George Soros) as well as those who did not accept Jesus as their Saviour and/or follow his teachings (e.g. Anne Frank, Winston Churchill, and Albert Einstein)?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    So you do accept that Jesus believed in Damnation (according to Scripture), and you do consider his views ethical.

    Why do you consider it ethical to send anybody to hell, nevermind people who are Good who happen to not believe in the existence of god (and/or his moral soundness) (e.g. Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, and George Soros) as well as those who did not accept Jesus as their Saviour and/or follow his teachings (e.g. Anne Frank, Winston Churchill, and Albert Einstein)?
    Never heard of forgiveness before? It goes hand in hand with love. You could beat up people left and right and I'd forgive you. You could do all sorts of self-destructive things that make me so angry that I yell at you at the top of my lungs, and I'd forgive you. You could insult and criticize me left and right, and I'd still forgive you. Hell, you could even try and sacrifice your own kid, and I'd forgive you. Not only that, but love doesn't exactly have some sort of magic timeframe on it expiring, because it exists outside of time or anything else. Pretty sure if I, a gimpy person, can forgive, then God can too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Never heard of forgiveness before? It goes hand in hand with love. You could beat up people left and right and I'd forgive you. You could do all sorts of self-destructive things that make me so angry that I yell at you at the top of my lungs, and I'd forgive you. You could insult and criticize me left and right, and I'd still forgive you. Hell, you could even try and sacrifice your own kid, and I'd forgive you. Not only that, but love doesn't exactly have some sort of magic timeframe on it expiring, because it exists outside of time or anything else. Pretty sure if I, a gimpy person, can forgive, then God can too.
    The thing is, the bible is clear that people's sin has already been redeemed, via Jesus's "sacrifice", and that god's "love" is unconditional...even if he sends people to hell. Additionally, Jesus says that only those who repent are forgiven: especially considering the number of people he is sending to hell, this does not seem at all magnanimous.

    People are sent to hell after failing to meet the standards of god's "grace".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    The thing is, the bible is clear that people's sin has already been redeemed, via Jesus's "sacrifice", and that god's "love" is unconditional...even if he sends people to hell. Additionally, Jesus says that only those who repent are forgiven: especially considering the number of people he is sending to hell, this does not seem at all magnanimous.

    People are sent to hell after failing to meet the standard's of god's "grace".
    Well, then it's a good thing God has plenty of time to wait. Probably takes a lot of nails.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy8419 View Post
    Well, then it's a good thing God has plenty of time to wait. Probably takes a lot of nails.
    I think you'll find that Damnation is an one way process where mortals are made to suffer for eternity for "choices" made in their mortal lifetimes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    I think you'll find that Damnation is an one way process where mortals are made to suffer for eternity for "choices" made in their mortal lifetimes.
    Mortal? Sounds like hell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    "The beginning of wisdom is the definition of terms."
    /spins top

    Shiny.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unimpressed Kimu View Post
    the flat earth society has members all around the globe.


    This can't be true. They don't believe in a globe. They are only allowed to live on a flat earth as per their birth agreement in article 42, something something something or other... They are in violation by living around the globe.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    This thread is like a book that I will never get around to reading. You guys got stamina. You should put it to better use.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    This thread is like a book that I will never get around to reading. You guys got stamina. You should put it to better use.
    I usually post when at work, occupado, or in traffic.

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