What ITR is this?

[Delilah]

I have a skewed version of how I related to this person. That is, i don't know how they view me and can only relate information on how i view them.

They seem to me too laid back, like they could do imo with getting a move on. I also see them as changing their interests/hobbies/professions too often - like more often than what i consider 'stable'.

I prefer to make plans in advance: so like meet with them 3 days from now, let's say. They always get in touch the last minute to check that we're still doing X together. It seems that is their way of confirming a plan, so they leave it for the last minute. To me this seems unreliable since in my head i've already finalized my plans several days ago.

To me they seem directionless, like in a way i could help them in this area. Yet, they are very resistant to feedback in this area.

I also get this impression like i'm babying them when we hang out. It is tiresome.

Any comments?

[FDG]

Benefit?

[lavos]

Could this person be IEE?

[Delilah]

Benefit?

Thanks for your feedback Do you mean i benefit them or the other way around?

[Delilah]

Could this person be IEE?

Could be, i've actually never tried to type them before. I can see what you mean tho, based on my skewed description here they come across as irrational and without a sense of stable direction which i've seen in some description associated with IEE

[lavos]

The thing about typing by ITR method is that it's necessary to have an idea of what the involved parties' types could be. ITR method is best to confirm the alleged types of two people. Trying to type by solely identify the ITR is very difficult, as some ITR effects are very subtle. Supervisor, benefactor, contrary, dual, conflictor; are usually the most apparent ones.

[User Name]

Seems Ne Ego, which is obviously not good for a Ne PoLR. What about Conflictor (ILE) or Supervisor (IEE)?

[Delilah]

The thing about typing by ITR method is that it's necessary to have an idea of what the involved parties' types could be. ITR method is best to confirm the alleged types of two people. Trying to type by solely identify the ITR is very difficult, as some ITR effects are very subtle. Supervisor, benefactor, contrary, dual, conflictor; are usually the most apparent ones.

I have often wondered how other members here use ITR. I know some, in the past, who would get the main clues from ITR than proceed from there to ascertain type. I feel like my psychological distance with this person is quite close and for some reason that makes it difficult to use other methods of typing.

[silke]

I have often wondered how other members here use ITR. I know some, in the past, who would get the main clues from ITR than proceed from there to ascertain type. I feel like my psychological distance with this person is quite close and for some reason that makes it difficult to use other methods of typing.

I tried using ITRs for typing being new to socionics. Would not recommend as a starting point. Learning more about the theory I had to re-type quite a few people typed by this method, and also discovered that there are other typologies out there that will leave their own relational imprint, which makes it hard to discern the parts of the relationship that are predicated by socionics. Both enneagram and instinct stackings encode their own degrees of potential compatibility, asymmetry, and conflict into relations, and there are even more of these typologies out there than these two.

The description sounds like they could be an intuitive irrational. I know an ILE who likes to not make any plans at all and keep it all in the air, then intensely plan and reconfirm in the last minute.

[Rebelondeck]

It seems that ITR, in this instance, is irrelevant; there are no neutral or positive comments on which to form a balanced assessment. The negative ways in which you describe interaction suggest that it would be best if ITR were stillborn to spare everyone any future grief. ......

a.k.a. I/O

[Exodus]

I have a skewed version of how I related to this person. That is, i don't know how they view me and can only relate information on how i view them.

They seem to me too laid back, like they could do imo with getting a move on. I also see them as changing their interests/hobbies/professions too often - like more often than what i consider 'stable'.

I prefer to make plans in advance: so like meet with them 3 days from now, let's say. They always get in touch the last minute to check that we're still doing X together. It seems that is their way of confirming a plan, so they leave it for the last minute. To me this seems unreliable since in my head i've already finalized my plans several days ago.

To me they seem directionless, like in a way i could help them in this area. Yet, they are very resistant to feedback in this area.

I also get this impression like i'm babying them when we hang out. It is tiresome.

Any comments?

It does seem like how an Ni valuer (non-suggestive) might perceive (/ conflict with) an Ne valuing type, maybe Ne leading.

[Exodus]

@Delilah I would never try to identify a relationship type abstractly without having an idea of the types involved.

The great thing here is that you identified a specific conflict of goals that can be categorized, and it's consistent with how I type you (and your self-typing). I use this kind of information all the time when I'm typing people, conflicts can be very telling.

[Delilah]

It seems that ITR, in this instance, is irrelevant; there are no neutral or positive comments on which to form a balanced assessment. The negative ways in which you describe interaction suggest that it would be best if ITR were stillborn to spare everyone any future grief. ......

a.k.a. I/O

Lol you are right, I only focused on the negative. Thanks for the reminder. Here we go if you got the patience to revisit this:

Positives: I find them very endearing. It is possible to discuss with them a very wide range of topics that interest me without me getting tired nor bored of it. I find they have very good taste in tv, movies, books and pop culture more generally and just entertainment overall. They are always up for unexpected / unplanned meet ups, i just need to ask - this can be quite nice if i don't have smth planned already.

They don't dwell on the negatives of a situation at all (this can be a double edged sword, since i sometimes take this to mean they don't go in-depth much, but it's good for just hanging out). They are quite social and have a wide circle of friends so it's good for mixing with others.

I think that's quite a few positives.

[Delilah]

@Delilah I would never try to identify a relationship type abstractly without having an idea of the types involved.

The great thing here is that you identified a specific conflict of goals that can be categorized, and it's consistent with how I type you (and your self-typing). I use this kind of information all the time when I'm typing people, conflicts can be very telling.

ITR is one of the many methods of typing. I kinda feel like it's not paid attention too much, and only used as secondary method. I'd say it's worth checking out how it stands on its own.

[Bertrand]

I have a friend at school who I really like but I think I scare her and I think shes ESI. I think she thinks I'm full of shit and she's not wrong, but I want her to know I know that and I want to get past that and I think we could be good friends if she gave it a chance. If you're an ESI does this sound familiar and do you have any advice. Also sorry for the derail but I think it might be related in the sense that this could potentially be how it feels from the other side. Which is like I know I'm a frivolous goofy bastard sometimes but its not as bad as it seems, and I can be serious and those things you want to see but its a process and we don't start there but we've got to get there somehow. Also I'm sort of afraid she just thinks I want to use her for sex and that's where its all leading up to, but that's not what I'm about at all, but I think maybe I give that impression so I don't blame her if she's worried about that. Sorry for the livejournal but its a similar "what ITR" is this question, specifically I want to know if delilah recognizes this dynamic or if its something totally different

[Exodus]

ITR is one of the many methods of typing. I kinda feel like it's not paid attention too much, and only used as secondary method. I'd say it's worth checking out how it stands on its own.

It can't stand on its own because there is too much variation in intertype relations - element interactions are much more reliable. If you hate someone because of their political views it doesn't necessarily say a lot about their type (for example).

[Delilah]

I have a friend at school who I really like but I think I scare her and I think shes ESI. I think she thinks I'm full of shit and she's not wrong, but I want her to know I know that and I want to get past that and I think we could be good friends if she gave it a chance. If you're an ESI does this sound familiar and do you have any advice. Also sorry for the derail but I think it might be related in the sense that this could potentially be how it feels from the other side. Which is like I know I'm a frivolous goofy bastard sometimes but its not as bad as it seems, and I can be serious and those things you want to see but its a process and we don't start there but we've got to get there somehow. Also I'm sort of afraid she just thinks I want to use her for sex and that's where its all leading up to, but that's not what I'm about at all, but I think maybe I give that impression so I don't blame her if she's worried about that. Sorry for the livejournal but its a similar "what ITR" is this question, specifically I want to know if delilah recognizes this dynamic or if its something totally different

It is rare that i view someone irredeemably full of shit. At most i'd consider them 50% full lol. To be full of it you have to have demonstrated over a long period of time. There are a few people irl that have met the criteria, and even the occasional person on here since now in my '30s i feel that i don't need that long to make an assessment.

I gather that you are younger. I was quite conservative when i was younger and erred on the side of caution so i'd say i'd escaped situations where someone might have wanted me for sex only. I don't know how nor why, though have some suspicions.

As for you personally, i think you're far from being full of it. Sure, you change your mind about things (socionics etc) a fair bit, but changing your mind is a right you ought to have.

This being said, i lean strongly delta (or am delta with strong gamma leanings - my only other self-typing here having been iee in the past). Hope that answers your question though i can't help but feel like i've missed smth.

[Bertrand]

oh yeah when i said full of shit I meant it more figuratively, like you said more like %50 full not totally full

[Delilah]

oh yeah when i said full of shit I meant it more figuratively, like you said more like %50 full not totally full

I don't think you're even near it, you needn't worry at all, but i don't know the dynamic with this girl so can't speak more to that.

[Bertrand]

excellent I will proceed with confidence and we'll see what happens

she actually tore me a new asshole once when i tried to lecture her friend on some law topic, it was really memorable

[Number 9 large]

Obvious EP temperament vs your J
Maybe its supervision cuz of the babying thing. Like you supervise their polr with ur lead. Thats why theyre resistant to it

[Sol]

It can't stand on its own because there is too much variation in intertype relations

IR is one of factors which can be used for typing. On common behavior level - it's harder to be used, as two people = twice more of non-types noise. Though for border cases, like best or worst IR - it's useful. For exampe, if you see close long friends - it's low possibly to have opposite quadras or revision/order there.

IR are more useful to feel their effects, to assume possible types when you know own type. The serious problem of such using IR effects - it's not easy to explain, it's important to have personal experience or communicating and watching people of different types. Besides own type mb other than a man thinks.
Though even without an experience a man may use IR effects for border cases. Like to assume types of some people in own life, if will remember which ones he perceived as "people inspiring the most of friendly sympathy" (good IR) and the most personally annoying and harmful for him ones (bad IR). There will be a lot people with good and bad IR which stayed as mediocre in the perception, though it's doubtfully the one with good IR was remembered as among the worst people and vice versa.

> If you hate someone because of their political views it doesn't necessarily say a lot about their type (for example)

IR is about specific feelings from specific things in others as persons. What someone thinks about politics is much external knowledge, gotten with a propaganda and education. My familiar EII has opposite to mine political views. We interact ok outside of political discussions, which prefer to do not touch seriously. A person may inspire negative emotions by some things, and positive by other things - in the same time, and a man may understand what trait or behavior inspires which negative emotion.

A woman may talk bs, but you also see cute and pretty woman - you like this in her, meanwhile bs inspires anger in you - do not like that in her. Relations and people are complex. Among IR itself there are ambiguous ones: for example, semi-duality IR contain a lot of ambiguous in relations and in personal attractions, - often of minor misunderstanding + major mutual positive, so people may prise and blame such relations with ~equal intensity, - they do not break but may whine easily about chronic issues.