I'm working on a Test

[TheGrayInk]

Hiya folks, hopefully this is the right forum.

I'm on a quest to see if I can make a nearly fool proof Socionics test. This will likely be my last test using Hello Quizzy before trying something new and I want to see how it fares.
I posted this at PersonalityCafe not too long ago and hopefully I can get something a little more constructive here.

Hello Quizzy - Socionics Dichotomy Test

Feel free to critique. Did it work, what questions were problems, something you'd add, etc.. pretty much anything other than what equates to "you should've did it this way".

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

arent we supposed to just say what we got

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
LSE (ESTj) The Director
7 Judicious, 5 Asking, -1 Positivist and 5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results

ISFj More active state
ENTp More positive
ENFP Prefers to monologue
INTj More fixed goals

[Anglas]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
LIE (ENTj) The Entrepreneur
-1 Judicious, -9 Asking, 3 Positivist and -7 Tactical!

Neighboring Results

INFj More relaxed state
ESTp More negative
ESFp Prefers to dialogue
ISTj Less fixed goals

[Moonbeaux Rainfox]

1st time: SLE (ESTp) The Conqueror
-7 Judicious, -3 Asking, -1 Positivist and -9 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ISFp More relaxed state
ENTj More positive
ENFj Prefers to monologue
INTp Less fixed goals

I got INFj the second time and ENTj the third time.

[TheGrayInk]

Ah yes results are appreciated especially if you feel they're wrong or weird.

Nymeria's ESTp INFj result might be a good example,then again the two other results do neighbor with ENTj.
If it's at least close I think I'm on the right rack.

[The Exception]

SEI (ISFp) The Mediator
9 Judicious, -7 Asking, -3 Positivist and -5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ESTp More active state
INFj More positive
INTj Prefers to monologue
ENFp less fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using introverted sensing as her base function and extroverted intuition as her creative, the SEI excels at creatively applying her introverted sensing to improve the mood of those around her. As with the ESE, the SEI is in tune with people's emotional states and seeks to mitigate conflict and encourage a harmonious atmosphere. The SEI's creativity is practically unlimited, and this skill is used in a number of pursuits including graphic design, music, and culinary arts, to name a few. Generally speaking, this creativity is channeled towards uses that will have a positive impact on at least one person's emotional state; as such, the SEI would prefer not to channel her creativity towards more impersonal endeavors. At her best, the SEI applies sensory stimuli (in the form of art, good food, etc.) to make herself and those around her comfortable and content; at her worst, the SEI can become highly emotional, and these emotions can become very volatile--changing quickly from happiness to sadness to anger within minutes. Furthermore, these volatile and strong emotional states will be shared freely with those around her--to either their pleasure or detriment.

[Chakram]

ILE (ENTp) The Inventor

9% Judicious, 3% Asking, 7% Positivist and 9% Tactical!

Neighboring results
INFp More active state
ESTj More negative
ESFj Prefers to monologue
ISTp More fixed goals

I sometimes have a hard time deciding between questions. But yea this seems pretty accurate, if we assume Reinin dichotomies are, which they seem to be most of the time. Maybe reword question 4, about working conditions. I assumed that question was money vs something you find fun/interesting as greater priority. Any test can be wrong though, depends on the state of the person while taking it. Pretty good nonetheless.

[anndelise]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
IEE (ENFp) The Psychologist
13 Judicious, -5 Asking, -1 Positivist and 5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
INTp More active state
ESFj More positive
ESTj Prefers to dialogue
ISFp More fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using extroverted intuition as his base function and introverted feeling as his creative, the IEE is adept at generating new possibilities, particularly those that relate to human interaction. Like the ILE, the IEE absorbs and comprehends new concepts with amazing speed. However it should be noted that the IEE relies on his personal observations as a foundation for his conceptual understanding; he bases all his theoretical frameworks on what he has observed in the real world. If the IEE cannot relate a hypothesis to something he has personally observed, it is more difficult for him to conceptualize or believe in it. The IEE uses his creative function to understand the intricacies of relationships and human interaction. At his best, the IEE has deep and profound insight into the nature of human behavior and their relationships; at his worst, the IEE's propensity for generating possibilities can leave him adrift in an idealized world with little motivation to actually accomplish goals or complete projects. Furthermore, although the IEE understands abstract concepts quite readily, he sometimes glosses over the logical framework of a hypothesis or theory.


YOUR ANALYSIS (Vertical line = Average)
You scored 13% on Judicious, higher than 95% of your peers.
You scored -5% on Asking, higher than 18% of your peers.
You scored -1% on Positivist, higher than 31% of your peers.
You scored 5% on Tactical, higher than 88% of your peers.

[anndelise]

Maybe reword question 4, about working conditions. I assumed that question was money vs something you find fun/interesting as greater priority.

I had no problem answering number 4.
Rewards wouldn't just be about money, it could include respect, recognition, fame, travel, sexual opportunities, the work resulting in a better quality of life for someone else, the purpose and intent of the final product of the work, and such.
Better working conditions could include things like liking/respecting your boss, getting along with your workmates, appreciating the physical environment of the workplace (ie an outdoorsy person enjoying working while outdoors, an indoorsy person prefering protection from the elements, an active person preferring a job that requires more energy than a sit down job, etc), and other such things that can ease the actual working aspect of one's job.

Which has a higher priority to you (the test taker), desirable/acceptable working conditions or achieving the final intent of your efforts?

[Chakram]

I had no problem answering number 4.
Rewards wouldn't just be about money, it could include respect, recognition, fame, travel, sexual opportunities, the work resulting in a better quality of life for someone else, the purpose and intent of the final product of the work, and such.
Better working conditions could include things like liking/respecting your boss, getting along with your workmates, appreciating the physical environment of the workplace (ie an outdoorsy person enjoying working while outdoors, an indoorsy person prefering protection from the elements, an active person preferring a job that requires more energy than a sit down job, etc), and other such things that can ease the actual working aspect of one's job.

Which has a higher priority to you (the test taker), desirable/acceptable working conditions or achieving the final intent of your efforts?

Although those things could be put under each of those, I guess money could go under either as well.Even having fun at the job could be a reward rather than a working condition. I guess just leave it as is and allow the person to interpret it in their own way. Although then they could misinterpret it. Also if you can add more dichotomies, that might be helpful to making it more fool proof.

[Roro]

LSE (ESTj) The Director
1 Judicious, 3 Asking, -3 Positivist and 7 Tactical!

Neighboring Results

ISFj More active state
ENTp More positive
ENFP Prefers to monologue
INTj More fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using extroverted thinking as his base function and introverted sensing as his creative, the LSE excels at identifying methods and tools that can improve one's efficiency and productivity. This understanding, coupled with the LSE's high energy levels and generally strong work ethic, makes him a very productive individual. As such, he generally performs very well in lower and mid level management where attention to productivity, organization, and detail take precedence. At home, the LSE likes to surround himself with aesthetically pleasing items that also have a functional use. Socializing, the LSE enjoys entertaining small groups of people with thoughtful discussions or light-hearted games. At his best, the LSE's drive for perfection at home and at work make him a good employee and reliable family member. At his worst, the LSE can become overly concerned and worried when trying to plan for the future, and he tries to mitigate this concern by minimizing risk below the level that many other types would be perfectly comfortable with.

Judicious Distribution
You scored 1% on Judicious, higher than 41% of your peers.
Asking Distribution
You scored 3% on Asking, higher than 90% of your peers.
Positivist Distribution
You scored -3% on Positivist, higher than 16% of your peers.
Tactical Distribution
You scored 7% on Tactical, higher than 93% of your peers.

[Sol]

I'm on a quest to see if I can make a nearly fool proof Socionics test.

To make "fool proof Socionics test" in primitive preferences format is not possible. By this way went MBTI and came to not very good result.
While to check correctness of the test you need people without opinion about their type or they may choose what fits to that opinion.

[ashlesha]

LSE (ESTj) The Director
3 Judicious, 1 Asking, -3 Positivist and 9 Tactical!

Neighboring Results

ISFj More active state
ENTp More positive
ENFP Prefers to monologue
INTj More fixed goals

[silke]

ESE (ESFj) The Enthusiast
1 Judicious, -5 Asking, 9 Positivist and 7 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ISTj More active state
ENFp More negative
ENTp Prefers to dialogue
INFj More fixed goals

Feel free to critique. Did it work, what questions were problems, something you'd add, etc.. pretty much anything other than what equates to "you should've did it this way".

A few comments:
- You might want to steer clear of using the Asker/Declarer dichotomy. Over the years typing I've got an impression that it's difficult to assess and not very reliable (too many misses when tried in application).
- Question #5 needs to be changed/improved - "focus on everyone present" doesn't quite work for distinguishing aristocratic types.
- Might want to add more questions relating to the Subjectivist/Objectivist dichotomy.
- "Relaxed to active state" questions that check for Decisive/Judicious trait have much more nuancing to them regarding temperament and subtypes. For example, lower temperament intellectual type of Ti-LSI or Fi-ESI as well as Ni-IxIs may spend a lot of time in a relaxed contemplative state and have some difficulty mobilizing, yet they are Decisive types.

[Aylen]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...

IEI (INFp) The Romantic

-5 Judicious, 7 Asking, 5 Positivist and 5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ENTp More relaxed state
ISFj More negative
ISTj Prefers to monologue
ESFp More fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using introverted intuition as her base function and extroverted feeling as his creative, the IEI lives in a world of vivid imagery and imagination. Like the SEI, the IEI is a very creative type and is often seen channeling this creativity towards artistic pursuits such as music. However the two types' creativities diverge with the SEI's creativities channeled towards more tangible creations and the IEI's channeled towards more intangible creations--e.g., the creation of imaginary worlds or stories. The IEI is acutely attuned to the effect these creations can have on people's emotional state, and it is not uncommon for these creations to have a strong emotional impact on people. At her best, the IEI provides deep and meaningful insight into events and trends--particularly those involving human interaction. At her worst, the IEI can become lost in her imagination and lackadaisical. Overall, the IEI's depth of imagination and emotion often goes unidentified by those around her, and this is perpetuated by the IEI's disinterest in broadcasting these traits.

[Aylen]

To make "fool proof Socionics test" in primitive preferences format is not possible. By this way went MBTI and came to not very good result.
While to check correctness of the test you need people without opinion about their type or they may choose what fits to that opinion.

Um, no. People who do not know themselves well enough, to not have an opinion on their type, probably would not know themselves well enough to take this quiz and get an kind of accurate result. I had my friend do it before me and they got SEE. Not their type. They did not even understand the wording of the questions. You need some basic knowledge of this stuff, and yourself, to answer in any meaningful way. Go back to making home movies.

OP:
The test probably could use some rewording and examples. The language is not user friendly. It is really short too. I would not rely on it to type myself or anyone I know. Sorry...

Edit: It did get my self typing right though so I am not saying this because it got me wrong. Pay no attention to the TIM, since it is dynamic and subject to change.

[Persephone]

The first time ever I got... SLI lol I am not a sensor.

[Attis]

SEI (ISFp) The Mediator

1 Judicious, -3 Asking, -3 Positivist and -1 Tactical!
Neighboring Results
ESTp More active state
INFj More positive
INTj Prefers to monologue
ENFp less fixed goals

[poops magoops]

I got SLI lol.

[ashlesha]

I feel like a higher judicious score on this test would correlate with depression, at least for me.

[FoxOnStilts]

I got SLI.

I am ILE.

[Narc]

LIE (ENTj) The Entrepreneur
-5 Judicious, -5 Asking, 3 Positivist and -1 Tactical!


Neighboring Results
INFj More relaxed state
ESTp More negative
ESFp Prefers to dialogue
ISTj Less fixed goals

[Narc]

I would consider using these dichotomies:

Rational/Irrational
Result/Process
Positivist/Negativist
Yielding/Obstinate

Using all of them will be enough to narrow down to a single result.

Like Silke said, Asking/Declaring leads to a lot of tail-chasing.

[Satan]

i found a lot of these questions difficult. i don't really know if i focus on goals or routes and paths i kind of focus on both at once... like i have a goal and i work out the routes and paths to get there? although the goal can shift too.. and is obtainable...

also i don't really relate to things like relaxing.

also things like finding silver lining in bad experiences.. i'm kind of both at once... i'm not negative negative in bad experiences... but i can be negative negative positive... and i can be double positive of triple positive if i see a way to make light or better of a certain aspect and not focus on the other parts... but i basically generally don't want to dwell in the negative with most people - i'm more likely to be "empty" than to to be "seething"

ILI (INTp) The Critic
-1 Judicious, -3 Asking, -1 Positivist and 1 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ENFp More relaxed state
ISFj Prefers to dialogue
ESTp More fixed goals
ISTj More positive

[jaein]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
SLI (ISTp) The Craftsman
11 Judicious, 3 Asking, 3 Positivist and -5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ESFp More active state
INTj More negative
INFj Prefers to monologue
ENTp Less fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using introverted sensing as his base function and extroverted thinking as his creative, the SLI is immersed in his senses and has a strong understanding of both the design and functional aspects of objects. Much like the SEI, the SLI is highly in tune with the effect his surrounding environment can have on his and others' senses. This, coupled with his ability to assess factual information, makes him an ideal candidate for matters of design and function--particularly when the two are intertwined. The SLI is drawn to people and things that increase his pleasurable sensations. The SLI enjoys peaceful interaction and often prefers to either be alone or limit his interaction to the few select individuals that he cares most about. Often he is drawn towards nature and the outdoors. At his best, the SLI is born with a fundamental understanding of the way things operate which allows him to excel in fields from engineering, to architecture, to medicine; at his worst, the SLI has difficulty opening up emotionally and may misinterpret others' intentions as more negative than they truly are.
YOUR ANALYSIS (Vertical line = Average)


You scored 11% on Judicious, higher than 89% of your peers.

You scored 3% on Asking, higher than 88% of your peers.

You scored 3% on Positivist, higher than 72% of your peers.

You scored -5% on Tactical, higher than 9% of your peers.


This is strange. Ill take it again later

[Pink]

EII (INFj) The Empath

4 Judicious, -3 Asking, 3 Positivist and -9 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ENTj More active state
ISFp More negative
ISTp Prefers to dialogue
ESFj Less fixed goals

Sociotype.com Description
Using introverted feeling as her base function and extroverted intuition as her creative, the EII is adept at understanding people's internal drive and motivation. She often acts reserved, respectful, and polite around others she does not know well but will eventually open up more. She implicitly trusts her intuition when judging someone, and this intuition serves her well at grasping more abstract concepts. EIIs need to constantly set new goals for themselves and they care deeply about meeting these goals. However it should be noted that these goals are very personal, and she places less weight on the conventional achievements that society values, so often any correlation is largely coincidental. At her best, the EII is known for respecting other people's beliefs and values while also being an overachiever at school and work; at her worst, the EII's compassion and empathy can cause her undue harm when the people she cares about are suffering. Overall, the EII cares about diligence, meeting one's individuals goals, and respecting others; she distastes behavior that is overtly loud, abrasive, or aggressive.

[Satan]

i tried shifting it around. i still don't get it.

SEE (ESFp) - The Politician
-7 Judicious, 1 Asking, 1 Positivist and -5 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ISTp More relaxed state
ENFj More negative
ENTj Prefers to monologue
INFp Less fixed goals

[Satan]

so let's go through some example:

A I focus more time and effort into executing a task.

B I focus more time and effort into preparing for a task.

What happens if you focus more on preparing or doing tasks rather than monitoring how you do them?

Doing something like writing this post it takes about the same amount of time to think about what I'm going to say and to type it out So I'm 50/50.

[Myst]

Doing something like writing this post it takes about the same amount of time to think about what I'm going to say and to type it out So I'm 50/50.

really? I definitely start with just typing it out


Test itself -

SLE (ESTp) The Conqueror

-11 Judicious, -7 Asking, -1 Positivist and -1 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ISFp More relaxed state
ENTj More positive
ENFj Prefers to monologue
INTp Less fixed goals

Well those -1s are close to flipping over and then it would match my self type

[ouronis]

IEE (ENFp) The Psychologist
5 Judicious, -3 Asking, -3 Positivist and 1 Tactical!

[TheGrayInk]

Ah this has been more helpful already.

I probably should have prefaced this with earlier, I only used 4 dichotomies out of laziness. I just picked 4 that I could relate to and that could make any result, It would've taken forever otherwise. I think I know a way to forgo Hello Quizzy and make a more robust test but I wanted to see how things go with just these 4. I agree asking/declaring needs to be nixed.

Doesn't look too bad so far, Reinin seems usable at the very least.

A I focus more time and effort into executing a task.

B I focus more time and effort into preparing for a task.

Yeah that does look like it could cause some trouble.

I likely won't fix any of the questions, but I will take the problems into account for later on.

[Myst]

Ah this has been more helpful already.

I probably should have prefaced this with earlier, I only used 4 dichotomies out of laziness. I just picked 4 that I could relate to and that could make any result, It would've taken forever otherwise. I think I know a way to forgo Hello Quizzy and make a more robust test but I wanted to see how things go with just these 4. I agree asking/declaring needs to be nixed.

Doesn't look too bad so far, Reinin seems usable at the very least.

Sorry but, it looks bad to me. 21 people taking it, 13 getting the wrong type, often very much wrong, 6 getting the right type, 2 I don't know.

Not that this is your fault More like Reinin's fault

[Satan]

really? I definitely start with just typing it out

Ok that's curious, so like writing this response, did you start the post, do the test, then put the test results into the post?

I kind of have a mental note of what I'm going to do in the future, then sequence things.

[nondescript]

Firstly a suggestion:

Using super multifaceted Reinins to determine a type is a wrong approach. No matter how you turn it or twist it, you start from the simple things and build up from there. Opposite is just madness. Ok, I can understand pruning the diversity until just necessary remains, but trying to understand something when being asked questions which references stuff that is multifaceted, hence directly referencing each of those facets AT ONCE...not good.

You need to do it either like MBTI does it(ask about N, J etc) or do it by asking questions about Reinins which consist of two dichotomies:

-> Carefree / Farsighted ( EN + IS / ES + IN )
-> Yielding / Obstinate ( EF + IT / ET + IF )
-> Static / Dynamic (EP + IJ / EJ + IP )
-> Aristocratic / Democratic ( NF + ST / SF + NT )
-> Strategic / Tactical ( NJ + SP / SJ + NP )
-> Constructivist / Emotivist ( FJ + TP / FP + TJ )

Those six should do the trick.

[Myst]

Ok that's curious, so like writing this response, did you start the post, do the test, then put the test results into the post?

I kind of have a mental note of what I'm going to do in the future, then sequence things.

No, I did the test then I saw your post and clicked reply and posted. But it could have been that way too

Yeah I also have that mental note of points of what to do but that takes like just a second to see them.

[Not A Communist Shill]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
SEI (ISFp) The Mediator
9 Judicious, -5 Asking, -3 Positivist and -1 Tactical!

Neighboring Results
ESTp More active state
INFj More positive
INTj Prefers to monologue
ENFp less fixed goals

[rien]

I got..
ESE (ESFj) The Enthusiast
9 Judicious, -7 Asking, 5 Positivist and 3 Tactical!


Neighboring Results
ISTj More active state
ENFp More negative
ENTp Prefers to dialogue
INFj More fixed goals

Huh! That was somewhat unexpected. I read through some ESE type descriptions, but still feel like I relate much more to delta NF. I'm awful at the dichotomies though, so I can't give any constructive comments unfortunately

[TheGrayInk]

Looks bad, you say? On the contrary..

Assuming everyone is sure of their type...
3 People got their type correct (as far as I can see)
6 People got neighboring results
2 People got borderline neighboring results
3 People got their type wrong
7 People I can't tell (I'll take Myst's word that 3 of the 7 are right but ignore these since I can't compare)

In addition to posting
2+ more neighboring results

Considering I took 4 completely arbitrary things that seem to have very little to do with functions and did this well is very promising.

You might say neighboring results is a cop out but there's still a 69% (11/16) chance that you won't get one and only 19% (3/16) were significantly off.

The beautiful thing is if you get a really strange result, the nearby results seem a lot more convincing.

I got into a debate on methodology on the last thread and I'm not going to repeat that here. I'm only looking for problems not solutions.

[Myst]

Looks bad, you say? On the contrary..

Eh, we have a very different way of seeing this.

Assuming everyone is sure of their type...
3 People got their type correct (as far as I can see)
6 People got neighboring results
2 People got borderline neighboring results
3 People got their type wrong
7 People I can't tell (I'll take Myst's word that 3 of the 7 are right but ignore these since I can't compare)

In addition to posting
2+ more neighboring results

No, that's a minority of people getting their type correct and the rest getting it wrong.

When you are some random user who doesn't know their type yet and gets a result on your test, how will they be able to backtrack to the correct option? It's one of these options 1) spot-on with the type (with a pretty low chance) 2) neighbouring result 3) borderline neighbouring result (wtf) 4) utterly completely wrong - but how does the person tell which one it is, lol.

The beautiful thing is if you get a really strange result, the nearby results seem a lot more convincing.

And how do you tell which type of those is the correct one if it even happens to be listed there...

There is nothing beautiful here, the results in the thread so far are distributed in a way that shows reinin dichotomies only have a little validity giving results slightly better than if picking at random even if you take into account all those neighbouring and "borderline" neighbouring results.

I can't be bothered to calculate exact probabilities for you now that take all that into account but I'm sure of the above; you can simplify it down by simply looking at how many people got the actual correct type. It is better too than going by random chance but not by that much.

So. There *is* something because it's clearly past the level of random noise but not a whole lot. Was that really your objective with the test?

I got into a debate on methodology on the last thread and I'm not going to repeat that here. I'm only looking for problems not solutions.

Well I've given you enough problems here then, hope you are happy

I really do not understand why you are sticking to reinin when it clearly does not work.


(Note, yes, I'm just trying to provide helpful criticism. I do have a strong opinion though because I really don't see how this is going to amount to anything good.)

[uncivilized]

Your result for The Socionics Dichotomy Test ...
LIE (ENTj) The Entrepreneur
-1 Judicious, -1 Asking, 5 Positivist and -5 Tactical!

I'm most likely INTp if you need that info.