2016 US Election

[Pookie]

Whats being argued here, that white people have it better? Of course we do. Or is the argument what to call it?

[marooned]

No, I treat these people positively and feel positively about them, and most people do.
Actually I can tell what culture a person is a part of pretty easily by observing them.
But even for what you're saying, we may know that statistically a person from a certain race is more likely to be involved in crime while simultaneously maintaining uncertainty about that and keeping an open mind. Many people I'm sure are subliminally aware that a specific race is statistically more likely to be involved in something. That is not racism, it's just using the brain. Racism is, by definition, the belief that race is the primary determinant of a set of inherent, negative traits. Not a belief that culture is a primary determinant which is then associated with a race. You can see that the definition makes this very clear.
We have a culture clash happening related to poverty and other things.

the reason why racism arises in the first place is because of using the brain. it maintains associations about different kinds of people. for instance "sales person" causes a lot of negative associations to arise in my mind at once and so i might "prejudge" a person who matches concepts of "sales person" in my mind. racism is similar, only your brain has an idea of a type of person based on skin color and other physical characteristics. and it collects associations about that too. but when you hear someone complaining about people of other races all you hear is all this stuff that isn't determined by skin color or biological factors (such as a person's dialect). this is because race isn't real; instead it is believed to be real. racism is in our culture, learned through it, and passed on. the dominant culture still sends the messages that whites are more significant than others.

if your brain flashes to "criminal" "danger" "deadly weapon" etc. when you see a black man, that is racist. the thing is that you don't have to *intend* to be racist to be so--you can in fact consciously not desire for racism to exist because you think it's wrong. in this case, the association (black = criminal) has been spread about quite a bit in the mainstream. and so through nothing but the brain categorizing and making associations you can "prejudge" someone.

the culture clash though is also related to racism. white culture is the dominant one in the u.s. (the mainstream); but what you see are *white people* as superior (i think the brain will connect this often on a subconscious level). as an example i mean take almost every blockbuster romance film. it's almost always about a white heterosexual couple: the main characters, or the important people who this story is about whose emotions and experiences count in the deepest most human way.

[Kim]

For the record, some of us choose black partners because we like the person, not the black thug dick...

[marooned]

i can interpret @Bullets entire post as bemoaning how he can't find enough black thug dick himself, doomed to only be taunted by the straight black male, while the bi and gay black male remains locked away in the closet.

[Kim]

i can interpret @Bullets entire post as bemoaning how he can't find enough black thug dick himself, doomed to only be taunted by the straight black male, while the bi and gay black male remains locked away in the closet.

Also a good example of racist thinking. The "the brute black man living in the present" narrative.

[rat200Turbo]

the reason why racism arises in the first place is because of using the brain.

No, racism is an irrational prejudice. One race is not inherently better than another race. And that is what a racist believes, and we can see the definition clearly states that. A belief in racism doesn't arise from a natural use of the intellect. It is linked to an evil, sadistic, and borderline delusional frame of mind.

it maintains associations about different kinds of people. for instance "sales person" causes a lot of negative associations to arise in my mind at once and so i might "prejudge" a person who matches concepts of "sales person" in my mind. racism is similar, only your brain has an idea of a type of person based on skin color and other physical characteristics. and it collects associations about that too.

Let's try an example. Imagine a man dressed in a suit walks into a bar and sits next to you. You associate his dress with salesmen. You have a negative, prejudicial reaction because of this, however, you also maintain skepticism and uncertainty about him. You treat him cordially. Because you do not know whether he is a salesmen yet. You start talking to him, and you find out he is not a salesmen. Instead he is a bridesgroom at a wedding nearby. Your negative disposition toward him completely disappears.
Were you prejudice towards people in suits? No, you were prejudice towards salesmen and you thought he might be one because he was wearing a suit. You maintained a possibly prejudicial disposition mixed with uncertainty.
Your argument is identical to this example.

In this example, wearing a suit is NOT thought to be the primary determinant of a shady character. Being a salesmen is. Likewise, in our discussion, race is NOT thought to be the primary determinant of the negative associations. Culture is. Do you understand?
What you are doing is abstractly babbling, muddying distinctions within the mind & mixing concepts.
Read the definition. For a prejudice to be a racist prejudice, race must be believed to be the primary determinant of the trait.
Who are you to overturn the definition of a word? And strip it away from its root word, then repeat this insanity: "Race does not exist.". What the fuck are you on?

Back when slavery was very popular, blacks were thought to be inferior ON THE SOLE BASIS of their skin color. They were actually propagandized as being beasts, it was said they did not have the same intellectual capacities or emotional capacity as whites... They were a SUBHUMAN SPECIES, Not considered to be human. It was the black skin itself, and the RACE ITSELF, that was widely taught to be INHERENTLY INFERIOR. Ok? That is the DEFINITION of racism. We can READ that definition. Ok? Now stop this.

but when you hear someone complaining about people of other races all you hear is all this stuff that isn't determined by skin color or biological factors (such as a person's dialect). this is because race isn't real; instead it is believed to be real. racism is in our culture, learned through it, and passed on. the dominant culture still sends the messages that whites are more significant than others.

Race is definitely real. I am getting frustrated with this nonsense statement... I have corrected you repeatedly. Racism is prejudice based on race. If race is not real, than racism is nothing. RACE... IS... REAL. Race is not identical to culture. Ok? Do not say this again.

if your brain flashes to "criminal" "danger" "deadly weapon" etc. when you see a black man, that is racist. the thing is that you don't have to *intend* to be racist to be so--you can in fact consciously not desire for racism to exist because you think it's wrong. in this case, the association (black = criminal) has been spread about quite a bit in the mainstream. and so through nothing but the brain categorizing and making associations you can "prejudge" someone.

That is being weary of a certain culture that is, statistically, made up of blacks. That is NOT a prejudice against the black race. It does not INCLUDE the entire black race. It is not about race. Race is not the primary determinant, like our definition demands. Ok?
The very same people will not react fearfully to a well groomed, socially successful black man. The same people will also be triggered by very poor looking white people hanging around gas stations at night. Ok? It is not RACE that is the issue.

the culture clash though is also related to racism. white culture is the dominant one in the u.s. (the mainstream); but what you see are *white people* as superior (i think the brain will connect this often on a subconscious level). as an example i mean take almost every blockbuster romance film. it's almost always about a white heterosexual couple: the main characters, or the important people who this story is about whose emotions and experiences count in the deepest most human way.

You are talking about American culture. You are not talking about white culture. There are many POOR WHITE PEOPLE. Go take a look at the whites living in Appalachia. This is WHY we bother to distinguish between racism, and other things like culture clashes. So that when we speak, we know what we are saying. We do not want to confuse ourselves / misidentify the problem / spread nonsense and conflict / waste our energy in the wrong direction.

I don't think I can explain this any better. If you give one more nonsense reply which fails to address these points I am just quitting with you. Make it good if you respond

[End]

It's interesting that you are making undocumented migration about race. Not surprising though.

It technically always is, though people tend to confuse the issue of "Ethnic Group" and "Race" as it were. Race is much more inclusive than Ethnic Group, yet time and again the various "Races" fight among themselves because of Ethnic tensions. Technically the "Hispanics" are "White" racially, given how most of them tend to have more European genetics over Mezo-American genetics (Thank ya very much you Conquistador rapists and religious in-group preferences!). Just as most of us "Americans" have some "Indian" genes flowing in our blood (which means the "genocide" we supposedly committed against them is BS as you don't interbreed with anyone you're trying to genetically purge from history. No SS officer/1488er worth his/her salt ever contemplated banging a Jew/Jewess y'know).

In the end, it is about race, but it really isn't. The whole immigration game is the same as the globalization game. It's all about the big megacorps securing a source of quasi-slave/peasant labor. White people, finding slavery abhorrent way faster and harder than any other race (and contributing most of the work towards making it a global taboo), just won't bow down to the whip. Thus the need to Genocide them among the upper echelons of our current society so that it can be a real thing again without some almost certainly white Spartacus figure uniting the slaves under a banner of Freedom. Can't have those hyper-moral white people ruin a good morally abhorrent scam!

[marooned]

Just as most of us "Americans" have some "Indian" genes flowing in our blood (which means the "genocide" we supposedly committed against them is BS as you don't interbreed with anyone you're trying to genetically purge from history. No SS officer/1488er worth his/her salt ever contemplated banging a Jew/Jewess y'know).

um whites and the native americans were both on the same land for over a century before the u.s. govt came into being. the u.s. govt is the one charged with genocide. i found an article to go in depth on whether or not it was genocide: http://americanhistory.oxfordre.com/...0199329175-e-3

White people, finding slavery abhorrent way faster and harder than any other race (and contributing most of the work towards making it a global taboo), just won't bow down to the whip.

lol. white people practiced slavery, but they stopped it. praise their nobility.

[rat200Turbo]

Lol, Indians and Africans came up with slavery. They would war with / conquer neighboring tribes, take half the tribe as slaves and kill the rest. The African slave trade spanned the whole African continent... Africans starting selling their extra slaves to all the countries of Europe. You act like the united states government is the one entity responsible for this. Actually the constitution was drafted long after the slave trade had really populated America. The US government / constitution moved society towards eliminating slavery, we fought a civil war over it just 90 years after the founding of the country. The constitution / American revolution; the idea that 'all men are created equal', is what started the abolitionist movement on a large scale.
There was alot of fighting between indians and settlers before the U.S. government was formed. Infact the Indians were the aggressors usually. It worked like this: the settlers would expand their encampments, pushing into native territory. Certain native tribes (not all) would attack the settlers, sparking an "Indian War". The settlers would purge them from the land. It's not this one sided victim ploy and crime by the evil government that you pretend it is. Over 90 percent of the Indians who were killed died of disease. There are only a couple scenarios where flat out genocide of innocent Indians occurred. If you're talking about the Indian wars, well many of these Indians actually rallied their people to war against the United States government. There were peaceful Indians who chose to integrate into society, like the Cherokee. We didn't just slaughter innocent Indians, try actually talking about the history. Now the Spanish, mostly in the south west, treated the Indians horribly... far worse than we (the British) ever did. The Spanish were actually a top down government structure very similar to socialism & communism, though. They would conquer and enslave the people to build up their infrastructure. The French up north actually traded and intermarried with the Indians on a large scale and had very good relations, and so did the British.

[marooned]

i don't want to evaluate the question of if it was genocide, though i strongly suspect i would probably see it as such. i don't understand why it matters "who started slavery." there's nothing to defend with this argument. the point is that humans started slavery, and it fits in perfectly well with the way humans form social structures. crediting a "race" with it makes no sense. there are no races.

i might mention "white people" in the context of slavery in the u.s. because i think that enough remnants of that culture still exist in people's thinking/in society, that it's still relevant.

[rat200Turbo]

Well no, the united states government and the constitution is what brought slavery to an end. That is the point.

[wacey]

Does being racist hold any merit? There has got to be a payoff or reality to it, otherwise it would cease to exist. Just ​a bad habit?

[rat200Turbo]

It is an obscure, ignorant, semi-delusional concept. I'm sure it has spawned from hateful feelings related to real things, but it distinguishes itself as being about race itself. Just read the definition:
racism

• 1: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race

[wacey]

What about white on white slavery? Very common in the middle ages.

[rat200Turbo]

Well the first 'slaves' that came to America were white Irish, actually. But they were not called slaves, they were called "indentured servants". They actually entered into 'slavery' as part of a contract. They were never considered sub-human or treated as such. They were not slaves for life either. They were well taken care of, never whipped etc.. It is technically slavery but it looked much different than the racism / slavery problem w/ Africa & the Indians.. I don't know much about slavery in the middle ages.

[The Exception]

Does being racist hold any merit? There has got to be a payoff or reality to it, otherwise it would cease to exist. Just ​a bad habit?

You actually raise a good point.


I suppose maybe back in the cavemen days, different 'tribes' competed with each other for resources like food. The opposite tribe could be seen as your enemy because they could threaten your valuable resources.

So maybe it comes from that even though we are more civilized now. We still have that self-preservation instinct that makes us wary of any perceived threats, rational or not, including different groups.

So that's my theory. I don't know how valid it is though.

[rat200Turbo]

Can't think of a historical landscape where competition between tribes could have led to natural selection and new strains of humans developing instincts like that. It would require alot of death and not much mixing of genes. Not sure how much the basic sense for competing over resources needs to be selected for, it's kind of a self-evident thing. Opposing tribes are often a resource for enslavement and reproduction, which leads to genes mixing.

[ashlesha]

I'm watching the movie 13th on Netflix right now. It's pretty interesting if anyone is curious and has the time. So far it's discussing the transitions between slavery, Jim Crow, the civil rights movement, and the current state of the prison system and presenting a case for how they are all linked thru time.

Edit: the movie quotes Atwater discussing how to get the votes of racists in 1981. (the "southern strategy")

"You start out in 1954 by saying, “******, ******, ******.” By 1968 you can’t say “******”—that hurts you, backfires. So you say stuff like, uh, forced busing, states’ rights, and all that stuff, and you’re getting so abstract. Now, you’re talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you’re talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is, blacks get hurt worse than whites.… “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, uh, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “******, ******.”

This illustrates how racism doesnt just manifest in blatant hatred.

[End]

I'm watching the movie 13th on Netflix right now. It's pretty interesting if anyone is curious and has the time. So far it's discussing the transitions between slavery, Jim Crow, the civil rights movement, and the current state of the prison system and presenting a case for how they are all linked thru time.

Identity politics never changes, the thing is that the left never expected it to backfire on them. Turns out that once "White" people are truly threatened with the prospect of becoming a loathed, hated, vilified minority among a tide of people they (at least in the current generation) didn't do jack shit to they understandably circle the wagons and vote for the White guy who isn't going to lead them into a "Holocaust 2.0: Revenge of the Commies (Die White Boy Die!)".

Seriously, people think Fascism was bad yet they never consider the fact that the commies killed over 8 times as many people. Six million Jews ain't jack shit compared to 50 million Russians and Slavs who died under the likes of Stalin. I'll take the Fuhrer over that any day of the week.

[marooned]

and so you both feel personally under threat... it will supposedly take until 2050 for whites not to be the majority in the u.s. you have at least 33 years until 'the cleansing.'

[End]

and so you both feel personally under threat... it will supposedly take until 2050 for whites not to be the majority in the u.s. you have at least 33 years until 'the cleansing.'

Unfortunately I foresee that Whitey will win in a "RaHoWa" scenario. The black and brown have the numbers yeah, but whitey has all the guns, ammo, and his as of yet suppressed dark side most exquisitely described by Rudyard Kipling in his poem "The Wrath of the Awakened Saxon". White European people are the NICEST people you will ever meet... until they're not. And believe you me once that worm turns History does indeed count from the date that the Saxon (i.e. White Man) began to hate.

Again I say, please don't make us become those monsters again. We can, and we will, but only if we're forced to do so somehow. Trying to kill us all off just because of "muh microaggressions" and other such bullshit? Yeah, ya couldn't be more stupid for trying that on us as a long term strategy. We're trying to get along with you other people, spurn our olive branch offerings at your own peril. For if being nice just gets us hated, then we may as well earn that hatred now ought we not? After all, if it's a choice between being hated and surviving vs. being hated and dying then the choice is pretty obvious wouldn't ya say?

[Kim]

So whites die out. Who cares?

[End]

So whites die out. Who cares?

If you like "Western" civilization and all its fruits then you ought to care. If you celebrate the end of "White" people, well, let me tell ya that your progeny will never, EVER, leave this blue, podunk, backwater rock without a sci-fi ball and chain around their ankles. Tons of smart people out there, but once you see that most major inventions that broke paradigms were the result of "White" people you kinda start to understand the gravity of the situation. If Whitey dies out, you're reduced to one paradigm shift every Millennia. Good luck not getting conquered and enslaved by some xeno empire (that kept its version of "white people" alive and well mind you) given those odds. Just saying y'know...

[wacey]

I know he is the worst and the whole situation/system sucks. But, you gotta hand it to him. There is just something admirable in what he accomplished. The whole "just watch me". Hats off to the son of a bitch.

[Kim]

If you like "Western" civilization and all its fruits then you ought to care. If you celebrate the end of "White" people, well, let me tell ya that your progeny will never, EVER, leave this blue, podunk, backwater rock without a sci-fi ball and chain around their ankles. Tons of smart people out there, but once you see that most major inventions that broke paradigms were the result of "White" people you kinda start to understand the gravity of the situation. If Whitey dies out, you're reduced to one paradigm shift every Millennia. Good luck not getting conquered and enslaved by some xeno empire (that kept its version of "white people" alive and well mind you) given those odds. Just saying y'know...

Nah.

[marooned]

If you like "Western" civilization and all its fruits then you ought to care. If you celebrate the end of "White" people, well, let me tell ya that your progeny will never, EVER, leave this blue, podunk, backwater rock without a sci-fi ball and chain around their ankles. Tons of smart people out there, but once you see that most major inventions that broke paradigms were the result of "White" people you kinda start to understand the gravity of the situation. If Whitey dies out, you're reduced to one paradigm shift every Millennia.

the only part i could agree on is that civilization generates these kinds of discoveries - and some civilizations will generate more than others depending on various factors.

in a lot of ways western civ was born out of the mediterranean region consisting of a lot of people (high population) from a lot of different cultures competing and cooperating together (and by different "cultures" i mean also that these were individual civilizations surrounding the mediterranean--interactions between them created massive idea exchange). although i think each civilization is unique, the overall trend of humanity seeking to understand itself and the universe (the spirit behind these discoveries) is overriding. it's shown up it seems in every ancient human civilization. as long as we don't lose our knowledge or cripple ourselves through over-consumption of resources, it will continue. with or without the fairer skinned, i might add.

i would also add that western civilization is unlikely to fully die; the body of knowledge and culture will survive to some probably large extent and humanity will use it moving forward. all civilizations eventually "die" or change into other things.

anyway, i don't think there is going to be a "race war." at least i hope few are so stupid. as time goes on i would expect lighter skinned people to diminish in numbers, because of globalization. the genes that generate lighter skin are recessive.

[rat200Turbo]

Just sitting here realizing how insane you people are anyway.

[The Exception]

Just sitting here realizing how insane you people are anyway.

And you're not?

[rat200Turbo]

I don't think so, no.

[End]

anyway, i don't think there is going to be a "race war." at least i hope few are so stupid. as time goes on i would expect lighter skinned people to diminish in numbers, because of globalization. the genes that generate lighter skin are recessive.

Recessive genes are not necessarily "inferior" as it were. It is often pointed out that Evil has the advantage over Good. This would only be another manifestation of it. "Diversity" is also a good point of inference here. Most "brown" people have a pretty damn uniform color scheme. If the skin is brown, than the eyes and hair tend to match. If the skin is "white" however, well, then we're off to the races. White skin is the base, but the hair and eye color combination possibilities explode. I got brown curly hair and gunmetal blue-grey eyes. Weirder still, when I was but a boy I had bleach blonde hair.

Not sure how to explain all that, but I can tell ya that if I had more POC heritage that wouldn't have been the case. Dominant genes are not necessarily superior genes. Don't look at me though, look at a random Somalian Refugee. I can bet that their genes are hella dominant, yet I don't see those genes in any theoretical circumstance leading to better offspring on any objective standard. Mother Nature's a bitch, she only wants us to eat dirt and like it. Escaping her grasp by moving out unto the stars is something her crazy cat obsessed ass is very intent on preventing. That genetics reflects this is thus no surprise. Dumb genes beat out smart genes, just as that lonely cunt would want as she gets first say. She'd rather be surrounded and worshiped by black Somali idiots than quasi-abandoned by white celestial explorers that may not keep her company as much as she'd like yet venerate her as their ancestral homeworld on every planet they colonize.

[marooned]

Recessive genes are not necessarily "inferior" as it were.

um. well, not only are recessive genes not inferior, but they aren't superior either. and the world expands. because not only is that true, but it's also true that a straight forward link between skin color or eye color or hair color and "intelligence" will never be found. nor will anything ever be found that can clearly divide humans up into distinct racial groups. but i see i am taking away from your anime lisa frank fantasy. *clears throat and gets back to the important stuff*

It is often pointed out that Evil has the advantage over Good. This would only be another manifestation of it. "Diversity" is also a good point of inference here. Most "brown" people have a pretty damn uniform color scheme. If the skin is brown, than the eyes and hair tend to match. If the skin is "white" however, well, then we're off to the races. White skin is the base, but the hair and eye color combination possibilities explode. I got brown curly hair and gunmetal blue-grey eyes. Weirder still, when I was but a boy I had bleach blonde hair.

whites are superior because they have more color combinations.

Not sure how to explain all that, but I can tell ya that if I had more POC heritage that wouldn't have been the case. Dominant genes are not necessarily superior genes. Don't look at me though, look at a random Somalian Refugee. I can bet that their genes are hella dominant, yet I don't see those genes in any theoretical circumstance leading to better offspring on any objective standard.

feeling jealous?

Mother Nature's a bitch, she only wants us to eat dirt and like it. Escaping her grasp by moving out unto the stars is something her crazy cat obsessed ass is very intent on preventing.

well, cats have more color combinations than humans, so it's only natural she would favor them. did your mom pay more attention to the house cats than to you?

That genetics reflects this is thus no surprise. Dumb genes beat out smart genes, just as that lonely cunt would want as she gets first say. She'd rather be surrounded and worshiped by black Somali idiots than quasi-abandoned by white celestial explorers that may not keep her company as much as she'd like yet venerate her as their ancestral homeworld on every planet they colonize.

your mom, cats, and the colored people are keeping you from escaping earth in a spaceship. i feel for you.

[rat200Turbo]

Lol, white genes are not recessive. A child of a black and white person is mixed. Skin color is a 'polygenic trait', it's controlled by many genes and it expresses itself on a continuum. Then there is something called 'hardy weinberg equiibrium' which basically shows how recessive genes still exist in high numbers even within completely genetically mixed populations without outside factors (such as plague) influencing the frequency.

[marooned]

there are 6 pigment genes, according to woman on quora.

[wacey]

Recessive genes are not necessarily "inferior" as it were. It is often pointed out that Evil has the advantage over Good. This would only be another manifestation of it. "Diversity" is also a good point of inference here. Most "brown" people have a pretty damn uniform color scheme. If the skin is brown, than the eyes and hair tend to match. If the skin is "white" however, well, then we're off to the races. White skin is the base, but the hair and eye color combination possibilities explode. I got brown curly hair and gunmetal blue-grey eyes. Weirder still, when I was but a boy I had bleach blonde hair.

Not sure how to explain all that, but I can tell ya that if I had more POC heritage that wouldn't have been the case. Dominant genes are not necessarily superior genes. Don't look at me though, look at a random Somalian Refugee. I can bet that their genes are hella dominant, yet I don't see those genes in any theoretical circumstance leading to better offspring on any objective standard. Mother Nature's a bitch, she only wants us to eat dirt and like it. Escaping her grasp by moving out unto the stars is something her crazy cat obsessed ass is very intent on preventing. That genetics reflects this is thus no surprise. Dumb genes beat out smart genes, just as that lonely cunt would want as she gets first say. She'd rather be surrounded and worshiped by black Somali idiots than quasi-abandoned by white celestial explorers that may not keep her company as much as she'd like yet venerate her as their ancestral homeworld on every planet they colonize.

No. She encourages it. Earth is not an enclosed system. The creatures here only have the appearance of being bound to it, because genes have not yet evolved the capacity to escape it, but they will leave one day. The reason for this is the sun. The sun is the ingredient of evolution that inspires genes to seek outside the bubble. Nature seeks itself among the harmful radiation waves bathing the cosmos. She just needs a vehicle to get there.

[ashlesha]

Can we stop pretending end isn't just a run of the mill racist yet? I called it? You're welcome.

[rat200Turbo]

Well I think he is caught up in an argument which has channeled him into taking on the role of a racist, but I doubt he even had these kinds of thoughts before the election. Maybe I'm wrong, I'd love to hear from End on this.

[marooned]

Well I think he is caught up in an argument which has channeled him into taking on the role of a racist

so now i am responsible for what @End says?

[Kim]

so now i am responsible for what @End says?

It's always the evil pussy that brings out the bad in men.

[rat200Turbo]

so now i am responsible for what @End says?

He is responsible, and I'd like to hear his response. The way he types is so discombobulated it makes me think he is under the age of 18 and possibly very impressionable. But yeah, you are responsible for what you say and how it effects people. This election has probably increased racism by 20x what it used to be.

[Adam Strange]

It's always the evil pussy that brings out the bad in men.

Hmmm, Evil Pussy. Now I'm intrigued. Wasn't she a Bond girl?