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Thread: The woes of my work

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    Default The woes of my work

    Right now I'm feeling rather ambivalent about my work. I'm wondering what socionics implications this may have, especially in regards to the section about inequality between on-call part-timers and full-time benefitted employees.


    Iím a librarian. Right now Iím working three different part-time on-call jobs plus Iím getting paid a small amount of money to teaching basic computer courses to seniors through local community ed. Itís not finding a job thatís so much a problem as finding a full-time job with benefits in my field. The Librarian field is very competitive. Although the pay isnít great, people do find the work very fulfilling and stay in the field a long time.

    One of the places I have been employed at for 8.5 years now. I work about 20 hours a week there- the maximum number of hours I can get as an on-call employee. I really want to be full-time, not only for the money and benefits like paid insurance but also because full-time employees get to do some of the more interesting projects that part-time people donít get to do. Such as developing innovative programs and services for libraries, managing the libraryís collection of materials, in general just having more of a say in the direction the library will be going. Also, I just want a place I can call Ďhomeí and feel a sense of belonging and continuity.

    As an on-call librarian, itís analogous to a substitute teacher. I float around between different libraries in the public library system. So Iím not permanently at any one library. I go from place to place depending on where Iím needed. My work schedule isnít regular or predictable at all. Between all of my jobs, I work around 30-35 hours a week, but Iím putting in 6 and sometimes 7 day weeks because oftentimes the shifts are less than the typical 8 hours seen in full-time positions. Plus the libraries are sometimes close to an hourís drive from where I live. Donít get me wrong, I love the variety of working at different libraries, I love the flexibility of my work schedule- I can pick and choose the shifts I want so vacations are always easy to schedule. But itís not paid vacation. However, Iíve done this long enough now that I just want a place I can settle in and call home. I get tired of having to keep up with so many different libraries and how they do things and where they keep stuff. I go into the library prepared but then Iím asked questions I know nothing about because I donít regularly work at that location and then I end up feeling embarrassed. I feel like itís hard to have good solid work references because I donít always work in the same location. I have a wide network in terms of number of people I know and work with but I want quality, not quantity. And quality comes with time by working with the same people on a more continual basis.

    On-call employees are a bit Ďremovedí from the full-time employees and even the regular Ďpart-timeí employees. There is a Staff Directory on our Intranet that says it lists ALL of the employees but really it doesnít because only the employees with regular work hours are included. I proposed to HR that this be changed to include EVERYBODY, including the on-call people. Even though I know Iím less likely to be contacted because Iím on-call, itís an insult when you are just as much of an employee as everyone else and youíre not included in the list. HR wonít change it because they say they want to keep track of everyone with a defined number of FTE and the total amount of FTE and on-call people donít have a defined amount. Something stupid like that.

    Also the HR department puts out a newsletter each week that lists the new hires, people who got promoted or reassigned, and people who are retiring or resigning. Once again, on-call employees are not listed in this newsletter. Even though we may not work as many hours itís still an insult to be omitted from this. HR will do nothing to change this.

    Finally, itís just the little things that make it harder to do our jobs well. We arenít always informed like regular employees are when thereís things we should know. We aren't always invited to 'staff development days.' Although they are often boring, I still want to feel like I'm asked to go like the others and feel like I'm 'in the loop.' We donít have any office or cubicle space, many of the libraries donít have lockers designated for on-call staff. One library didnít have any designated place for substitutes to put their stuff. All of the lockers were padlocked so I couldnít just grab a free one. One of the library systems I work for wonít give on-call staff a key card so every time we need to enter the library we have to buzz someone to be let in. Again, minor thing but it does make things more inconvenient.

    Finally, on-call staff are not considered internal employees for hiring purposes. This means we are not eligible for many of the full-time benefitted positions that are posted if they are Ďinternalí only. When the positions are open to everyone to apply, people like me are not looked at anyway. Last time such a position was posted, I failed to even get an interview even though I know I do very good work and have worked a long time. Instead, they hire some stranger from the Ďoutside.í Someone who just completed library school. It just seems so unfair and that my dignity has been stripped away. Some days I just go home from work crying. Itís like the on-call librarians are the Ďadjunct facultyí of the library world. Except itís even worse.

    I should probably just quit but Iím not comfortable quitting unless I have another job lined up. I have no idea what to even do other than library work that would pay halfway decent. The only jobs I ever get are on-call or temporary contract type jobs. Nothing full-time benefitted thatís long-term. Plus I feel like a failure if I donít do what I set out to do, and thatís get a full-time position in my field and be reasonably successful in my career.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    i'm sorry to hear it, chips i agree that it's insulting for longtime employees of any kind to be treated as if they aren't part of the team. i have no idea how it works in your field, but when people are "excluded" like that from official records, there are usually monetary/budgetary reasons for doing so. that is, the institution/organization/business is saving money somehow by labeling you differently from "regular" employees.

    it sounds like you should be continuously applying for any full-time librarian position you can find, making sure to highlight your extensive experience working at many different libraries. but if things in your area aren't working out, maybe you could consider getting away, and moving elsewhere? there's got to be a library out there that wants an experienced librarian like yourself

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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    i'm sorry to hear it, chips i agree that it's insulting for longtime employees of any kind to be treated as if they aren't part of the team. i have no idea how it works in your field, but when people are "excluded" like that from official records, there are usually monetary/budgetary reasons for doing so. that is, the institution/organization/business is saving money somehow by labeling you differently from "regular" employees.

    it sounds like you should be continuously applying for any full-time librarian position you can find, making sure to highlight your extensive experience working at many different libraries. but if things in your area aren't working out, maybe you could consider getting away, and moving elsewhere? there's got to be a library out there that wants an experienced librarian like yourself

    The peoples' well-being should always be valued over the money. That's my motto.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    The peoples' well-being should always be valued over the money. That's my motto.
    i wish it were the case, but so often it isn't, unfortunately!


    would you consider moving to obtain another job? you sound like you are passionate about your work, and you want to be successful in it. for many people that could require relocating, which might be difficult depending on your circumstances, but could be well worth it in the end. it sounds like you need to get away from this situation in which you feel devalued and causes you to end your day in tears - it sounds truly awful. you deserve to have success and a fulfilling career, especially with your passion and experience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    i wish it were the case, but so often it isn't, unfortunately!


    would you consider moving to obtain another job? you sound like you are passionate about your work, and you want to be successful in it. for many people that could require relocating, which might be difficult depending on your circumstances, but could be well worth it in the end. it sounds like you need to get away from this situation in which you feel devalued and causes you to end your day in tears - it sounds truly awful. you deserve to have success and a fulfilling career, especially with your passion and experience.
    I've started to look. There aren't many suitable job postings in my area. Previously I haven't seriously considered relocation but now I'm willing to consider it.

    I would prefer not to have to relocate for family reasons but it may be my only option to get 'ahead' in my career.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    In warehouses/retail stores it is the opposite in that the part-time employees are the lucky ones because they don't get all these responsibilities dumped onto them like the full time employees do.

    I've just got out of high school a year and half ago and I've got to say I've been pretty disappointed with the quality of these jobs out there. Everywhere my brother and I have been to have been the same story. They all had dysfunctional management, uneven distribution of workloads amongst employees, high turnover rates, a co-worker who was a complete asshole/bitch, etc. When my brother was working at walmart a co-worker once told him the only way to make it in there was by "kissing a lot of ass and stabbing a lot of backs". Everything I've seen thus far has backed up that statement. Fuck this world and it's shit.

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    basically what glam has said.

    good luck.

    life is too short to not get what you want out of it, so go for it.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    What helps me is to put it in perspective. Alot of people can only get shitty Wal-Mart retail type jobs, they lack the education or skills to have much better prospects. I'm lucky that I've found something better. There are people who envy my job so sometimes I feel bad about complianing. I am doing okay financially. I don't have alot of money but I have enough to live comfortably. Basically, I want to be able to utilize my skills in ways that I can't in my current position and have a place I can call 'home' and really feel that sense of 'belonging' somewhere.

    I could just work for myself freelance but I worry how to succeed in it financially with no guaranteed amount of income. Plus I feel good about getting a job offer the traditional way. It makes feel like I'm valued by others, that someone 'wants me' and will take a chance on me.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Make a lot of noise by being a leader and improving the library where you work at. I wouldn't expect to be seen as more valuable than others unless you actually perform better than everyone else and you do more than the bare minimum that's on the job description. I am sure that you could get started right now on "developing innovative programs and services" and "managing the library's collection of materials". If you have good ideas, then start speaking up and show that you have good ideas. Present yourself and any plans you have to the higher ups. Show that you're willing to work to implement those plans and that you have enough forward understanding of libraries that you can rally the people around you to also make progress.

    (Is this advice too ? Too splashy? Too loud? I think that all types should be capable of making splashes.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    The peoples' well-being should always be valued over the money. That's my motto.
    You can't have people's well-being WITHOUT the money! Catch 22 .
    (hell, you can't have your own well being without the money either)

    From the experience I got in my country, money and order comes first. Trust me, if those two aren't set up properly, no amount of good will is going to do anything. So, they've to be set up properly. After that, we can talk about people's good will. Let people work, set up their families and prosper-that's the goal and you can't do that if the monetary(or employment) sector is in the shambles. So, yeah. Money comes first. As much as it pains me to say that(and it really does), unless we live as martyrs, there is no other way...

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    Also this is something that I find useful(it's kinda an amalgamation of what a Sith Warrior in SWTOR and Trump would say):

    Never let yourself be pulled apart and modelled by others. Also, don't quit. There is always a light in the end, trust me.

    Also, commendations for having the strength to confront this and publicly speak about. So, well done!

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    I agree that you shouldn't quit your current job until you have another more favorable job lined up. Although your current job isn't ideal for you, as you mentioned, it is still fairly cushy in some ways (like having flexibility to take vacation time!).

    One other suggestion I might offer, to add to the good advice that's already been given in this thread, is perhaps to branch out a bit in your job search and look at maybe other kinds of full-time jobs that might put your expertise to use, but may not be exactly the kind of librarian work you're used to doing. I'm not familiar with the librarian field so much, but e.g. like maybe doing librarian-like work in a museum, instead of only looking at the run-of-the-mill library librarian work. Or a position in a school or university (i'm sure you've thought of that though ), or something like that.

    p.s. just fyi, hospitals also have libraries and a lot of librarian needs (i'm sure you probably know, but thought i would mention just in case...)
    Last edited by Suz; 10-11-2015 at 03:24 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    Also, I just want a place I can call Ďhomeí and feel a sense of belonging and continuity.
    It's similar for me. I finished studying in September and have yet to find a suitable job offer (I've been looking since August). I wrote several applications to similar jobs, all negative. Well, I do have a job right now. I'm working at a factory, which is okay, but not very fulfilling as you can certainly imagine. The demand for (inexperienced) city planners is minimal, especially in the geographical region where I want to work. So moving to another place seems almost inevitable. But even then, the competition for every job is huge.

    I don't even care much about a great career or high pay. I would've been completely fine with a simple, 9-to-5 clerk job in my local area, but it seems as this is not even an option with my current education. This is a very frustrating and depressing situation and I'm not sure where things are heading towards. I'm even thinking about doing another (administrative) job training so I can at least have a (better) job and then, maybe, get into a local building authority to finally put my initial education to use.

    I don't want to take over your thread with my story, I just wanted to show you that you are not alone in your job-related search.
    ĄMan can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.ď
    Ė Arthur Schopenhauer

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    What kind of freelance would you do?
    salmon

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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    The peoples' well-being should always be valued over the money. That's my motto.
    I also believe in that. Tragically, the modern world has screwed everything so bad I swear to God it was all intentional. In today's world, money is ALL that matters. This is why there's so much "outsourcing" of jobs. The legal and tax benefits of hiring people overseas to do shit makes it more profitable to do so. I do not have issues with this, I am not xenophobic in the slightest. However, when I see articles like this: http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...k-hard-enough/ I want to shoot that person square between the eyes! The system is incentivizing screwing people over. Work hard enough? People here are working 2-3 jobs just to stay off the goddamned streets and you say that's not hard enough?! Please, from the bottom of my heart to anyone who thinks that about people who get laid off, go fuck yourself.

    People are suffering all over the world, yet for short term profits (because those wages WILL rise once a generation or two passes and realizes that the employer needs him quite badly) they screw over good, hardworking people in their own nations. Of course, we all know what the end goal is for the multinational corporations and the PTB. You wanna see corporate heaven? Look to Japan. Karoshi, death by overwork. Where people work so long and so hard they have practically zero time for friends, family, or any other meaningful relationships outside the company. It's gone from material enslavement to absolute social enslavement. You are your job over there, and that's just not right.

    Oh, and China is also a fun, wonderful place to work. So wonderful they have to install nets outside of the buildings to keep people from jumping out the window and killing themselves! Don't believe me? Proof:http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...t-suicide.html.

    That's the endgame they're going for sadly, and it makes me sick. Literally turning us all into mere cogs in their machine, true slaves, never really allowing us to be fucking human every once in a while. The plummeting birth rates in the first world are simply the manifestation of the collective ennui and sense of being robbed of all common decency and dignity by the PTB. They've figured it out, it's only a matter of time before the rest of the world catches up. With no more cogs to place in their machine the PTB will die alone and unloved and humanity will be just a cute but brief instance of intelligent life on this planet . I don't think they'll actually achieve their aims, but that is what they're going for. You, enslaved, to them, literally. Call me crazy all ya want, but, it is what it is. It ain't a "theory" if you can prove it.

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    Ordinarily, I would say that you should pursue your dreams and should just quit and dedicate yourself full time toward looking for the permanent position in a library. However, for most jobs, it is easier to get one if you already have one, and the US is heading into a recession now and will likely be there for at least a year or three, and jobs are soon going to be even harder to get.

    So instead of quitting, I would recommend that you keep your present jobs, try to make yourself more valuable at the place you like the most, and send out resumes in your spare time.

    Start by telling your most sympathetic supervisor that you want to do more work and be more useful and helpful, and ask how you can do that. Then work like crazy to do it. It may work out, it may not (library management, I have discovered, can be both political in the bad sense of the word and capricious), but in either case, it will be good training that you didn't have to pay for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Ordinarily, I would say that you should pursue your dreams and should just quit and dedicate yourself full time toward looking for the permanent position in a library. However, for most jobs, it is easier to get one if you already have one, and the US is heading into a recession now and will likely be there for at least a year or three, and jobs are soon going to be even harder to get.

    So instead of quitting, I would recommend that you keep your present jobs, try to make yourself more valuable at the place you like the most, and send out resumes in your spare time.

    Start by telling your most sympathetic supervisor that you want to do more work and be more useful and helpful, and ask how you can do that. Then work like crazy to do it. It may work out, it may not (library management, I have discovered, can be both political in the bad sense of the word and capricious), but in either case, it will be good training that you didn't have to pay for.
    I'd also remind them of the 33rd rule of acquisition "It never hurts to suck up to the boss". The most effective way around HR's bullshit is to go over their accursed bureaucratic weasel asshole heads and get someone at the very top to say "Hey, you know X? I like them and would like for them to be made a bigger part of this company. Could ya do that for me?". Bootlicking dickless assholes in HR will invariably comply with said request "from the top" as it were. I don't like that method of thinking nor do I condone those types of people. However, one cannot argue with results and that's a damn good way to get em' sadly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by esq View Post
    Make a lot of noise by being a leader and improving the library where you work at. I wouldn't expect to be seen as more valuable than others unless you actually perform better than everyone else and you do more than the bare minimum that's on the job description. I am sure that you could get started right now on "developing innovative programs and services" and "managing the library's collection of materials". If you have good ideas, then start speaking up and show that you have good ideas. Present yourself and any plans you have to the higher ups. Show that you're willing to work to implement those plans and that you have enough forward understanding of libraries that you can rally the people around you to also make progress.

    (Is this advice too ? Too splashy? Too loud? I think that all types should be capable of making splashes.)
    Maybe a little too Te. Ha!

    Sometimes it's difficult to take the initiative and start new endeavors. Especially when you have no idea if your initiative is wanted or the proper channels to go through to make it happen.
    Also, I do best when the expectations are clearly layed out for me. I am welcome to take the initiative and start new endeavors if I choose but I'm not required to.
    By nature I tend work hard quietly and do what people expect me to do. I tend not to 'put myself out there' or make splashes. That would probably be in the line more with Se.

    I am willing to work hard and go beyond the minimim but I feel like I need the okay from others to do so. I don't want to get in trouble or go over peoples' heads. I don't want some mistake to bite me in the butt later. I don't want to make some serious error that could jepordize my job success and make it even harder to find a job I want in the future.

    Maybe I should just stop making so many excuses and just implement some of my ideas already.

    I did have one really good idea that I submitted to a manager. I wrote a proposal on how the on-call employees could be better served. She was going to forward it to her boss but I don't think any action was taken on it. She really liked my proposal, thought it was very well thought out but she had to run it through to her boss and get her boss's approval. Plus it's an organization wide change so I don't know how easily implemented the change would be. When you work in a bureaucratic organization, some changes take very long to implement.

    On-call employees are not protected by a union. I've actually thought about collaborating with my fellow on-call employees and starting one of our own but I would have no clue how to even go about implementing that and what the ramifications would be. We are a significant portion (about 20%) of the employees. We deserve to be more heard than we are.


    Quote Originally Posted by nondescript View Post
    Also this is something that I find useful(it's kinda an amalgamation of what a Sith Warrior in SWTOR and Trump would say):

    Never let yourself be pulled apart and modelled by others. Also, don't quit. There is always a light in the end, trust me.

    Also, commendations for having the strength to confront this and publicly speak about. So, well done!
    People always say things to me like "your time will come", "never give up". "Eventually you will get that job you want."
    Well they've been saying that for years and I've been waiting for years and nothing has happened. It seems like it's getting harder and harder the more experience I have ironically. Kind of like, why are you still doing what you're doing after all this time? I think they look down on my experience and think I must not be very good at what I do if piecing together a bunch of miscellaneous part-time jobs is the best I can get.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by Suz View Post
    I agree that you shouldn't quit your current job until you have another more favorable job lined up. Although your current job isn't ideal for you, as you mentioned, it is still fairly cushy in some ways (like having flexibility to take vacation time!).

    One other suggestion I might offer, to add to the good advice that's already been given in this thread, is perhaps to branch out a bit in your job search and look at maybe other kinds of full-time jobs that might put your expertise to use, but may not be exactly the kind of librarian work you're used to doing. I'm not familiar with the librarian field so much, but e.g. like maybe doing librarian-like work in a museum, instead of only looking at the run-of-the-mill library librarian work. Or a position in a school or university (i'm sure you've thought of that though ), or something like that.

    p.s. just fyi, hospitals also have libraries and a lot of librarian needs (i'm sure you probably know, but thought i would mention just in case...)
    I am going to start branching out a little more beyond libraries. I have also applied for various librarian jobs in places like hospitals, museums, etc. but I never get job offers.


    Quote Originally Posted by Pa3s View Post
    It's similar for me. I finished studying in September and have yet to find a suitable job offer (I've been looking since August). I wrote several applications to similar jobs, all negative. Well, I do have a job right now. I'm working at a factory, which is okay, but not very fulfilling as you can certainly imagine. The demand for (inexperienced) city planners is minimal, especially in the geographical region where I want to work. So moving to another place seems almost inevitable. But even then, the competition for every job is huge.

    I don't even care much about a great career or high pay. I would've been completely fine with a simple, 9-to-5 clerk job in my local area, but it seems as this is not even an option with my current education. This is a very frustrating and depressing situation and I'm not sure where things are heading towards. I'm even thinking about doing another (administrative) job training so I can at least have a (better) job and then, maybe, get into a local building authority to finally put my initial education to use.

    I don't want to take over your thread with my story, I just wanted to show you that you are not alone in your job-related search.
    I understand completely. Why must we have to jump through so many hoops just to have something as mundane as a decent job? Is it too much to ask for? It seems like companies just want people who are 'proven' rather than those that maybe don't have quite as much experience but have alot of enthusiasm and potential plus the ability to work hard and get along well with most people. Also people who interview well which sometimes leads to hiring people who 'talk the talk' but don't 'walk the walk.'
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by ouronis View Post
    What kind of freelance would you do?
    I'm already doing some of it. Teaching computer courses through Community Education, private tutoring. But it's just a small supplement to my income. I don't know if I can solely do freelance. I need a secure source of income to feel comfortable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Ordinarily, I would say that you should pursue your dreams and should just quit and dedicate yourself full time toward looking for the permanent position in a library. However, for most jobs, it is easier to get one if you already have one, and the US is heading into a recession now and will likely be there for at least a year or three, and jobs are soon going to be even harder to get.

    So instead of quitting, I would recommend that you keep your present jobs, try to make yourself more valuable at the place you like the most, and send out resumes in your spare time.

    Start by telling your most sympathetic supervisor that you want to do more work and be more useful and helpful, and ask how you can do that. Then work like crazy to do it. It may work out, it may not (library management, I have discovered, can be both political in the bad sense of the word and capricious), but in either case, it will be good training that you didn't have to pay for.
    t
    Early on in my library career I was naive and thought that if I just worked there long enough, eventually I would get to take on the responsibilities and challenges. Eventually I would be 'asked' to do things and to be shown the ropes. And of course I expected to get a full-time job after working on-call for a year or two. But it never happened.

    It took me a few years to realize that I have to make things happen myself rather than waiting for them to happen to me. So I have been explicit about telling the manager of the library the types of experiences I want to gain more of. The gaps in my skillset that I need to fill. While the managers are usually understanding of my situation, there still isn't much they can do themselves to make it a reality. My work situation is unique in that I don't have just one work location or manager I work under. It's hard to take on some larger projects when I keep going from library to library.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    Maybe a little too Te. Ha!

    Sometimes it's difficult to take the initiative and start new endeavors. Especially when you have no idea if your initiative is wanted or the proper channels to go through to make it happen.
    Also, I do best when the expectations are clearly layed out for me. I am welcome to take the initiative and start new endeavors if I choose but I'm not required to.
    By nature I tend work hard quietly and do what people expect me to do. I tend not to 'put myself out there' or make splashes. That would probably be in the line more with Se.

    I am willing to work hard and go beyond the minimim but I feel like I need the okay from others to do so. I don't want to get in trouble or go over peoples' heads. I don't want some mistake to bite me in the butt later. I don't want to make some serious error that could jepordize my job success and make it even harder to find a job I want in the future.

    Maybe I should just stop making so many excuses and just implement some of my ideas already.

    I did have one really good idea that I submitted to a manager. I wrote a proposal on how the on-call employees could be better served. She was going to forward it to her boss but I don't think any action was taken on it. She really liked my proposal, thought it was very well thought out but she had to run it through to her boss and get her boss's approval. Plus it's an organization wide change so I don't know how easily implemented the change would be. When you work in a bureaucratic organization, some changes take very long to implement.

    On-call employees are not protected by a union. I've actually thought about collaborating with my fellow on-call employees and starting one of our own but I would have no clue how to even go about implementing that and what the ramifications would be. We are a significant portion (about 20%) of the employees. We deserve to be more heard than we are.




    People always say things to me like "your time will come", "never give up". "Eventually you will get that job you want."
    Well they've been saying that for years and I've been waiting for years and nothing has happened. It seems like it's getting harder and harder the more experience I have ironically. Kind of like, why are you still doing what you're doing after all this time? I think they look down on my experience and think I must not be very good at what I do if piecing together a bunch of miscellaneous part-time jobs is the best I can get.
    Let me ask you this:

    Which people judge you so harshly? If they are not close kin...why do you care about a bunch of dogs exactly? Or indeed monkeys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post

    On-call employees are not protected by a union. I've actually thought about collaborating with my fellow on-call employees and starting one of our own but I would have no clue how to even go about implementing that and what the ramifications would be. We are a significant portion (about 20%) of the employees. We deserve to be more heard than we are.
    I agree you should be better heard, and starting a Union would do that, but if you are not good at implementing your ideas independently, you will not be successful at organizing a Union, and management will secretly blackball you for your efforts. Unions generally succeed when there is so much work that management loses too much money through work stoppages and can't easily get new workers at the old price. From what you described, that is not the library system today. (That's why there are public employee unions.)

    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    People always say things to me like "your time will come", "never give up". "Eventually you will get that job you want."
    Well they've been saying that for years and I've been waiting for years and nothing has happened. It seems like it's getting harder and harder the more experience I have ironically. Kind of like, why are you still doing what you're doing after all this time? I think they look down on my experience and think I must not be very good at what I do if piecing together a bunch of miscellaneous part-time jobs is the best I can get.
    That could be true. Certainly, the longer you accept second-class treatment, the more likely it is that people will hand it out to you. I think this is actually the hardest part of getting a better job. Managing your image to be someone they need to hire in order to save their collective and individual asses, that is. I don't have a solution for you, but I know a woman who has worked in a library for many years, and is pretty high up. I'll see if she has any suggestions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    I'm already doing some of it. Teaching computer courses through Community Education, private tutoring. But it's just a small supplement to my income. I don't know if I can solely do freelance. I need a secure source of income to feel comfortable.


    t
    Early on in my library career I was naive and thought that if I just worked there long enough, eventually I would get to take on the responsibilities and challenges. Eventually I would be 'asked' to do things and to be shown the ropes. And of course I expected to get a full-time job after working on-call for a year or two. But it never happened.

    It took me a few years to realize that I have to make things happen myself rather than waiting for them to happen to me. So I have been explicit about telling the manager of the library the types of experiences I want to gain more of. The gaps in my skillset that I need to fill. While the managers are usually understanding of my situation, there still isn't much they can do themselves to make it a reality. My work situation is unique in that I don't have just one work location or manager I work under. It's hard to take on some larger projects when I keep going from library to library.
    Yeah that is not sufficient for full time most likely, unless you work up the tutoring.
    salmon

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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post

    It took me a few years to realize that I have to make things happen myself rather than waiting for them to happen to me. So I have been explicit about telling the manager of the library the types of experiences I want to gain more of. The gaps in my skillset that I need to fill. While the managers are usually understanding of my situation, there still isn't much they can do themselves to make it a reality. My work situation is unique in that I don't have just one work location or manager I work under. It's hard to take on some larger projects when I keep going from library to library.
    That's why I suggested you concentrate on the one job you like the best, or on the one manager who is most sympathetic and helpful to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nondescript View Post
    Let me ask you this:

    Which people judge you so harshly? If they are not close kin...why do you care about a bunch of dogs exactly? Or indeed monkeys.

    Well I don't think people are necessarily judging me harshly. It's more a case of the hiring committee keeps overlooking me- the competition is really stiff.

    I think it's more a fear in my case. I do need to be on good terms with my boss. I need to have strong references in order to get a job offer. If my boss thinks poorly of me, I could get fired. If I'm fired, it makes it that much harder to find the next job.
    So ultimately, being on good terms with people is important for job security.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    That's why I suggested you concentrate on the one job you like the best, or on the one manager who is most sympathetic and helpful to you.
    I am doing that. I've worked long enough now that I'm familar with most of the libraries in the library system and who their managers are. I know which ones I like the best and which ones to stay from. I can pick and choose the shifts (and libraries) I want to some extent.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by chips and underwear View Post
    I am doing that. I've worked long enough now that I'm familar with most of the libraries in the library system and who their managers are. I know which ones I like the best and which ones to stay from. I can pick and choose the shifts (and libraries) I want to some extent.
    I meant, pick one to concentrate on for getting a full-time job. Not to just go to that day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I meant, pick one to concentrate on for getting a full-time job. Not to just go to that day.
    Ironically, the library system I just started working at 3 months ago is probably my best bet. They seem to really like me. There's the least divide between on-call and full-time employees, but still an obvious divide. Plus I haven't been wounded by rejection countless times as I have the others.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    I think you would be on the right track by trying to surpass any prior timidity. You mention that you're aware of the weakness of being quiet instead of being the initiator. You mention that you're trying to break those habits. I give a thumbs up to this endeavor.



    Regarding mistakes and not giving up.

    Mistakes don't matter. They show that you're learning and that you're moving faster than other people who don't make mistakes because they're not trying. You make mistakes but you also make successes. Mistakes do matter, but that's why you just do your best at all times. You do what you can to not make mistakes. Everyone can see when you're trying versus when you're lazy, even for a job that you just legitimately don't have experience for. Nobody reasonable who knows the truth is going to toss you for your mistakes as long as you're always trying to make things good, and you keep trying to improve. Furthermore, you want to execute perfectly, but sometimes it's best to just get your ideas into the open, into people's minds, onto paper, and into reality.

    People say things like 'never give up'. Never give up does not mean to stay where you are and to wait, enduring a bad situation, and hoping it'll turn out okay on its own. It does not mean to keep your head down. Never give up means that you keep attacking the problem from different approaches until you break the problem and you get what you want. Never give up means that you keep fighting for the best possible outcome.

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