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Thread: How to develop Se

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    Default How to develop Se

    How can someone with inferior Se or otherwise develop it?

    By "Se" I mean Extroverted Sensing.

    I'm an INTp / ILI.

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    There was a thread about this recently (http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...ngthen-your-Se) and another not-so-recently (http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...ng-for-Se-PoLR).

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    Shopping and socializing

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    this reminds me of that 'secret life of walter mitty' movie.

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    Well, since your Se suggestive, everytime you sorta wanna do something or think you should but dont have the willpower to get yourself to do it... just do it anyway. Hilariously enough, it is the only way you can.

    Practice makes perfect. If your Se sucks, its because you dont do it enough. Good luck Ni base user, your life will now be an existential crisis.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Develop Si first, so that your physical health and memory for sensory details is reliable. Then use Ni to envision a goal in mind, ignore any distractions (the realm of Ne) and take appropriate action (Se). The key is really Si, the role function for all types is a limiting factor in the development of the inferior function (dual-seeking function).
    Last edited by ConcreteButterfly; 09-26-2015 at 04:14 AM.

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    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    Well, since your Se suggestive, everytime you sorta wanna do something or think you should but dont have the willpower to get yourself to do it... just do it anyway. Hilariously enough, it is the only way you can.

    Practice makes perfect. If your Se sucks, its because you dont do it enough. Good luck Ni base user, your life will now be an existential crisis.
    For all those who truly understand what you are saying here about socionics, I thank-you.
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    For all those who truly understand what you are saying here about socionics, I thank-you.
    I dont even know if we're thinking the same thing, but if my life advice has reached the level of sardonic satire... well I think I can say ive won at something in life.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    I dont even know if we're thinking the same thing, but if my life advice has reached the level of sardonic satire... well I think I can say ive won at something in life.
    No way take credit where credit is due!
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Se develops when you respond to the most striking aspects of the environment, firstly by looking at them. eg a bird flying over head. Turning your head as it appears, following its trajectory as it moves, moving your own body to stay in sight of it. If it's close, reaching out and touching it. Feeling the sensations internally will develop Si too, but it's hard to concentrate on both aspects at once unless the outer stimuli is perfectly in sync with the inner. So to develop Se specifically, it would help to ignore your inner reactions, including any pain and pleasure. Keep your focus external, and try to modify your inner preferences to be compatible with the external forms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    Se develops when you respond to the most striking aspects of the environment, firstly by looking at them. eg a bird flying over head. Turning your head as it appears, following its trajectory as it moves, moving your own body to stay in sight of it. If it's close, reaching out and touching it. Feeling the sensations internally will develop Si too, but it's hard to concentrate on both aspects at once unless the outer stimuli is perfectly in sync with the inner. So to develop Se specifically, it would help to ignore your inner reactions, including any pain and pleasure. Keep your focus external, and try to modify your inner preferences to be compatible with the external forms.
    So, I'm supposed to keep myself totally detached from the inner world and try to become a passive observer of my own body? Or perhaps I'm supposed to just try and turn my brain off and allow my body free reign? Both sound rather difficult if not impossible. Can you put what you're saying in a different way that's more understandable/feasible?

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    By chasing experiences around. That's what Se is ultimately about: about acquiring stuff. Not only material, mind you. Here is how you strengthen your Se(it's not that you should, just act as you do):

    STOP BEING PASSIVE! BECOME ACTIVE!
    (and active active, not even reactive will do ie INITIATE stuff)

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    So, I'm supposed to keep myself totally detached from the inner world and try to become a passive observer of my own body? Or perhaps I'm supposed to just try and turn my brain off and allow my body free reign? Both sound rather difficult if not impossible. Can you put what you're saying in a different way that's more understandable/feasible?

    No don't detach from your inner world totally (that's not possible anyway), just stay with the real object moment by moment without giving undue attention to changes in your inner world. Don't let your mind wander too much, don't go extrapolating on the meaning of what you're seeing and hearing, etc. just experience it, moment by moment. The greater external focus will help you judge your inner reactions more accurately, distinguishing between true physical responses (Si) from what is merely imaginative extrapolation (Ni), making it much easier to take appropriate action (Se). Also, to the same end, avoid making imaginative leaps in conversations or in decision making, stick to the facts, to the literal, use your senses to verify everything down to the last detail. Put more faith in physical evidence than in likely possibilities.
    Last edited by ConcreteButterfly; 09-28-2015 at 07:48 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    No don't detach from your inner world totally (that's not possible anyway), just stay with the real object moment by moment without giving undue attention to changes in your inner world. Don't let your mind wander too much, don't go extrapolating on the meaning of what you're seeing and hearing, etc. just experience it, moment by moment. The greater external focus will help you judge your inner reactions more accurately, distinguishing between true physical responses (Si) from what is merely imaginative extrapolation (Ni), making it much easier to take appropriate action (Se). Also, to the same end, avoid making imaginative leaps in conversations or in decision making, stick to the facts, to the literal, use your senses to verify everything down to the last detail. Put more faith in physical evidence than in likely possibilities.
    I see, that's gonna be quite difficult as my really likes to kick in whenever it gets the chance but I can give it a shot .

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    I see, that's gonna be quite difficult as my really likes to kick in whenever it gets the chance but I can give it a shot .
    The plus side of doing this even for a little while is it'll make your a lot stronger, since it depends on Se "data points" to form its patterns.
    Last edited by ConcreteButterfly; 09-29-2015 at 08:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theodor Berza View Post
    How can someone with inferior Se or otherwise develop it?
    Physical training. Manual work with forms. Painting.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    Physical training. Manual work with forms. Painting.
    Pffffft. Any easier ways?
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by Theodor Berza View Post
    How can someone with inferior Se or otherwise develop it?

    By "Se" I mean Extroverted Sensing.

    I'm an INTp / ILI.
    1. Fight or flight.
    2. Generate explosive emotions.
    3. Spin in circles till you're dizzy then run around the house trying not to hit anything very hard
    3. Play fight with people (physically)
    4. Drink coffee and Watch kung fu movies, preferably Jackie Chan.
    5. Go to the shooting range
    6. Go to the gym
    7. Get mad
    8. Do cart wheels
    9. Turn on loud music and jump around
    10. Have some sex's
    11. Let yourself really really really want something, then go get it
    12. Look at yourself in the mirror, stare into your eyes, and ask yourself, who am i? Be honest with yourself, what do i want, what makes me strong.
    13. Do annoying things like bang on the table at dinner time
    14. Get mad when people tell you what to do
    15. Tell people what to do
    16. Walk around scratching your back on any angular surfaces
    17. Say everything that you think (avoid thinking really hard)
    18. Demand that people hear your opinion
    Lastly,
    Yell really loudly.
    I recommend only starting out with 5 minutes a day at first. Your tender heart probably needs time to adjust.
    Last edited by carrina; 10-03-2015 at 07:22 PM.

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    And claim everything in your environment..preferable not to pee on everything, but if that's what it take, go pee in the yard. Do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    I see, that's gonna be quite difficult as my really likes to kick in whenever it gets the chance but I can give it a shot .
    People with the most se unfortunately don't use ni. There's a reason you're needed. But yeah when ni kicks in, you doin it wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    People with the most se unfortunately don't use ni. There's a reason you're needed. But yeah when ni kicks in, you doin it wrong
    Problem is it can't not kick in. The program function cannot be suppressed or denied. Especially if your subtype favors it. It's omnipresent, it always activates. This could be a good thing as, if dom types don't use it then it's a good thing people like me do and they apparently like it enough to pursue us. One researcher said a humorous scene is an dom male running away from a gaggle of girls hunting him down because they sense his inner peace and want that badly. Badly enough that they break traditional gender roles and pursue him aggressively as if he were prey. Ain't that the man's job? To chase down the target of his affections?

    Just putting that out there. God, this'd be so much easier if I was a girl .

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    Problem is it can't not kick in. The program function cannot be suppressed or denied. Especially if your subtype favors it. It's omnipresent, it always activates. This could be a good thing as, if dom types don't use it then it's a good thing people like me do and they apparently like it enough to pursue us. One researcher said a humorous scene is an dom male running away from a gaggle of girls hunting him down because they sense his inner peace and want that badly. Badly enough that they break traditional gender roles and pursue him aggressively as if he were prey. Ain't that the man's job? To chase down the target of his affections?

    Just putting that out there. God, this'd be so much easier if I was a girl .
    Hmm. Guys who don't let me prey on them get friend zoned

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    You can use other stuff other than ni. Just like i can choose to not think about my personal sentiments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nondescript View Post
    By chasing experiences around. That's what Se is ultimately about: about acquiring stuff. Not only material, mind you. Here is how you strengthen your Se(it's not that you should, just act as you do):

    STOP BEING PASSIVE! BECOME ACTIVE!
    (and active active, not even reactive will do ie INITIATE stuff)
    This

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    No don't detach from your inner world totally (that's not possible anyway), just stay with the real object moment by moment without giving undue attention to changes in your inner world. Don't let your mind wander too much, don't go extrapolating on the meaning of what you're seeing and hearing, etc. just experience it, moment by moment. The greater external focus will help you judge your inner reactions more accurately, distinguishing between true physical responses (Si) from what is merely imaginative extrapolation (Ni), making it much easier to take appropriate action (Se). Also, to the same end, avoid making imaginative leaps in conversations or in decision making, stick to the facts, to the literal, use your senses to verify everything down to the last detail. Put more faith in physical evidence than in likely possibilities.
    And this

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    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    Hmm. Guys who don't let me prey on them get friend zoned
    How do you separate the "chaff" from the "wheat" as it were? I mean, I'm the mirror of your dual here. I look similar, talk similar, and even think in similar terms. Yet my dual is your mirror. How do you tell the two apart? How do you zero in on my mirror when I'm still right there? These relations, so easy to make a grave error. How do you know that you've hit the jackpot? We can both easily fuck up here and if @Adam Strange and his experience has any weight we'd both ultimately make each other unhappy somehow. We were so close! Yet so very far away from the Nirvana of duality...

    And the friend zone, how do you go about that? Inquiring minds wish to know. I'm sure I'm an E5 so yeah, feed me info, I can't not like that. I need to know... What went wrong?

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    How do you separate the "chaff" from the "wheat" as it were? I mean, I'm the mirror of your dual here. I look similar, talk similar, and even think in similar terms. Yet my dual is your mirror. How do you tell the two apart? How do you zero in on my mirror when I'm still right there? These relations, so easy to make a grave error. How do you know that you've hit the jackpot? We can both easily fuck up here and if @Adam Strange and his experience has any weight we'd both ultimately make each other unhappy somehow. We were so close! Yet so very far away from the Nirvana of duality...

    And the friend zone, how do you go about that? Inquiring minds wish to know. I'm sure I'm an E5 so yeah, feed me info, I can't not like that. I need to know... What went wrong?
    To be honest, I'm hardly looking for a relationship. Even if i were, it would be with someone i already had known for a while and liked a lot. So, separating the two isn't significant in that way to me. I hardly prefer LIE over ILI to begin with. For instance, LIE is more combative. In that way, ILIs can be easier to get along with.
    That said, the difference isn't that hard. LIEs react quicker and offer up more information. ILIs seem more avoidant. Their judgments about relations are more thought out but they are easier to persuade. LIEs have a sensitivity to social groups. They'll go out of their way to tell people what to do if it disrupts what they think is appropriate, especially if they think someone else in the group that they respect thinks they should. ILIs have duals that are ti polr. So they might criticize someone for acting out, they don't really care. They criticize activities and LIEs criticize logic. ILIs just direct the logic and are more likely to direct (help people) with thinking while LIEs are more likely to help people with which activities are better. ILIs might say "don't do that, it's a waste of time while LIEs say. "if you're looking for the best way, do this thing).
    As for the friend zone, all people get friend zoned by me eventually. Generally by being too pushy and ignoring my preferences. I'm very direct so if i want something I'll say so. Also, i want to be the one to control my relationships. Sometimes the person does nothing wrong and I'm just bored.

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    I know plenty of duals and activity partners. Duality isn't overrated. It's blissful. But activity is just as good to me. But I'm not speaking about relationships I'm speaking about friendships. I'm genuinely pleased when i talk to the gamma nt's because they almost always teach me something i would have never learned on my own.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    To be honest, I'm hardly looking for a relationship. Even if i were, it would be with someone i already had known for a while and liked a lot. So, separating the two isn't significant in that way to me. I hardly prefer LIE over ILI to begin with. For instance, LIE is more combative. In that way, ILIs can be easier to get along with.
    That said, the difference isn't that hard. LIEs react quicker and offer up more information. ILIs seem more avoidant. Their judgments about relations are more thought out but they are easier to persuade. LIEs have a sensitivity to social groups. They'll go out of their way to tell people what to do if it disrupts what they think is appropriate, especially if they think someone else in the group that they respect thinks they should. ILIs have duals that are ti polr. So they might criticize someone for acting out, they don't really care. They criticize activities and LIEs criticize logic. ILIs just direct the logic and are more likely to direct (help people) with thinking while LIEs are more likely to help people with which activities are better. ILIs might say "don't do that, it's a waste of time while LIEs say. "if you're looking for the best way, do this thing).
    As for the friend zone, all people get friend zoned by me eventually. Generally by being too pushy and ignoring my preferences. I'm very direct so if i want something I'll say so. Also, i want to be the one to control my relationships. Sometimes the person does nothing wrong and I'm just bored.
    I see. That actually makes sense. I never much gave a damn about what people thought they were doing, but anytime I detect a mismatch between "what they want" and "what they're doing" I get very annoyed. They're wasting their time at best and working counter to their own stated interests/goals at worst. The latter is what really friggin' annoys me. Working counter to your own stated purpose not only wastes time, it's an embodiment/form of stupidity. I am not one to suffer fools lightly. Do what ya want, but if you want X please put in the time to research how to acquire it. It'll save you a lot of time and effort, and isn't that something we all like? Not having to spend as much time and effort to get what we want?

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    Be more impulsive, less anxious. You have to stop doing what you naturally do, stop anticipating and following your vision.

    Enjoy the present, each breath, each smell, taste. Leave your subjective realm and deal with what's in front of you.

    Make decisions that you wouldn't make, experience ans seek the thrill of the moment. Appreciate the physical form of things around you, try to push yourself beyond your limits.

    Don't give up on your dreams, fight for them even if you have to die for them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    I see. That actually makes sense. I never much gave a damn about what people thought they were doing, but anytime I detect a mismatch between "what they want" and "what they're doing" I get very annoyed. They're wasting their time at best and working counter to their own stated interests/goals at worst. The latter is what really friggin' annoys me. Working counter to your own stated purpose not only wastes time, it's an embodiment/form of stupidity. I am not one to suffer fools lightly. Do what ya want, but if you want X please put in the time to research how to acquire it. It'll save you a lot of time and effort, and isn't that something we all like? Not having to spend as much time and effort to get what we want?
    This is very ILI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    This is very ILI.
    Why thank you .

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    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    12. Look at yourself in the mirror, stare into your eyes, and ask yourself, who am i? Be honest with yourself, what do i want, what makes me strong.
    Haha good list, but, this one sounds more Fi than Se.


    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    You can use other stuff other than ni. Just like i can choose to not think about my personal sentiments.
    How do you choose to stop focusing on your Fi base? I find I can let go of the Ti focus for a second here and there (Fe instead then) but I'm instantly "pulled back" to Ti.


    Quote Originally Posted by carrina View Post
    To be honest, I'm hardly looking for a relationship. Even if i were, it would be with someone i already had known for a while and liked a lot. So, separating the two isn't significant in that way to me. I hardly prefer LIE over ILI to begin with. For instance, LIE is more combative. In that way, ILIs can be easier to get along with.
    That said, the difference isn't that hard. LIEs react quicker and offer up more information. ILIs seem more avoidant. Their judgments about relations are more thought out but they are easier to persuade. LIEs have a sensitivity to social groups. They'll go out of their way to tell people what to do if it disrupts what they think is appropriate, especially if they think someone else in the group that they respect thinks they should. ILIs have duals that are ti polr. So they might criticize someone for acting out, they don't really care. They criticize activities and LIEs criticize logic. ILIs just direct the logic and are more likely to direct (help people) with thinking while LIEs are more likely to help people with which activities are better. ILIs might say "don't do that, it's a waste of time while LIEs say. "if you're looking for the best way, do this thing).
    As for the friend zone, all people get friend zoned by me eventually. Generally by being too pushy and ignoring my preferences. I'm very direct so if i want something I'll say so. Also, i want to be the one to control my relationships. Sometimes the person does nothing wrong and I'm just bored.
    Yeah I find IEI's have that advantage, easier to dominate them Though.. combativeness keeps things interesting longer. You have very good points about how ILI and LIE differ btw, I thought my recent ex bf was ILI before realizing he was actually just a reclusive E5-fixed LIE He was good at telling people what not to do to avoid wasting time but seemed to love talking more about what to do for the best way of doing things.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    Well, since your Se suggestive, everytime you sorta wanna do something or think you should but dont have the willpower to get yourself to do it... just do it anyway. Hilariously enough, it is the only way you can.

    Practice makes perfect. If your Se sucks, its because you dont do it enough. Good luck Ni base user, your life will now be an existential crisis.
    Easier way to get there: when you think of the thing you want to do, remind yourself that it will not get real if you don't do anything. Let yourself taste how it feels when you focus on it being real. Let the desire come up from that and then you go and do it.


    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    The plus side of doing this even for a little while is it'll make your a lot stronger, since it depends on Se "data points" to form its patterns.
    Can you tell me in the same fashion how that works for Ti/Fe?

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    Also, Yoga came to my mind. Would Yoga be Se or Si?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Easier way to get there: when you think of the thing you want to do, remind yourself that it will not get real if you don't do anything. Let yourself taste how it feels when you focus on it being real. Let the desire come up from that and then you go and do it.




    Can you tell me in the same fashion how that works for Ti/Fe?

    I don't know, it might be more practical to get an Ni out of his head than to tell him to focus. Just do it > Thinking about it. Thinking stagnates action for us in general.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    I don't know, it might be more practical to get an Ni out of his head than to tell him to focus. Just do it > Thinking about it. Thinking stagnates action for us in general.
    The focus is an Se focus, it is not thinking or ruminating at all, it is this clear focus where you have the real world as tangible around you. Where things matter for real. And that's what supports the strong desire for action essentially. I guess it's hard to explain :|

    ...it's also possible my advice would be more useful for Se HA

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