View Poll Results: type of Jordan Peterson?

Voters
42. You may not vote on this poll
  • ILE (ENTp)

    2 4.76%
  • SEI (ISFp)

    0 0%
  • ESE (ESFj)

    2 4.76%
  • LII (INTj)

    12 28.57%
  • SLE (ESTp)

    0 0%
  • IEI (INFp)

    2 4.76%
  • EIE (ENFj)

    6 14.29%
  • LSI (ISTj)

    5 11.90%
  • SEE (ESFp)

    0 0%
  • ILI (INTp)

    3 7.14%
  • LIE (ENTj)

    7 16.67%
  • ESI (ISFj)

    2 4.76%
  • IEE (ENFp)

    1 2.38%
  • SLI (ISTp)

    0 0%
  • LSE (ESTj)

    1 2.38%
  • EII (INFj)

    1 2.38%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Page 18 of 18 FirstFirst ... 81415161718
Results 681 to 703 of 703

Thread: Jordan Peterson

  1. #681
    xerx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    5,612
    Mentioned
    59 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    how do you think this relates? that IQ is a thing doesn't determine competence except in the sense that having no legs means you'll never be the best at soccer

    competence is primarily determined by work and in any case the product is evaluated by definition on its own merits, not based on the attributes of the person who created it. if you think denying IQ is the answer you've misidentified the problem and your solution is willfull blindness to boot. peterson never says we should turn IQ into a class rank, because we don't have to, it will naturally sort itself out. this is the difference between him and eugenics. charity and humanitarian work is necessary because of this fact, not pretense to deny this fact. in fact if IQ is not a thing then the conclusion is to deny extension of charity to people since they simply failed at what they were perfectly capable of (i.e.: competent to accomplish), or to simply reward lack of effort for being lack of effort. to fail to cognize inequity in distribution of ability and to make a system where merit is leveled at the point of outcome with incompetence is to destroy the productive and creative capacity of civilization. it creates utopia by stopping all progress and declaring the goal met artificially. its precisely what he's talking about with how communism and other schemes of that nature are illusory attempts to create heaven on earth and only result in hell. its like sure one way to reach "the endstate" is to induce apocalypse, but its declaring the patient cured by killing them (i.e.: destroying its future)

    in general the problem seems to be you call competent people you like, without realizing for much of the world it is reversed, people like people who are actually competent. in other words, competence is not a manufactured standard its the ability to do whatever the particular aim is well by objective standards. competence is not some gerrymandered thing where its like the bureaucracy declares people as competent as if it were an honorific (reminds me of kim jong un being the best at golf and so forth) , its a label that flows from actual work output judged impartially. of course this presupposes the ability to evaluate work, without which a bureaucratic substitute is perhaps necessary, but also completely meaningless except as a reflection of group reverence--this is of course why you assume I worship peterson, because you would if you were saying the things I am... but I'm not you

    Competence is important: aircraft mechanics should be selected on the basis of competence; so should brain surgeons; so should climate scientists-- sceptic bloggers & conservative think tanks don't understand the climate better than actual scientists. Where JP goes off the rails is when "clean your room" starts to mean STFU and don't protest against political & commercial hierarchies. If you think politicians & bankers are kept there necessarily because of their competence, then I don't know what to tell you.

    Incidentally, it's JP who violates his competence hierarchy maxim when he endorses climate change denialism. Maybe JP should go clean his room instead of trying to delve into topics way above his own competence.

    > https://twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/...574144?lang=en
    > https://twitter.com/aaronhuertas/sta...81749837475840 (he links to some pseudoscience-y think tank)

    Could it be that someone has a political bias that he's not telling us about..?
    Capitalism is the belief that the rich don't work hard when they don't earn enough, and that the poor don't work hard when they earn too much.

  2. #682
    heretic artificial hyena Troll Nr 007's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    surrounded by normal people! Help!
    TIM
    ILE-H 7(93?) sp/sx?
    Posts
    2,826
    Mentioned
    102 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Writes CO2 as C02 (yes, with zero).

    That is a crime against science.

    I must admit that news about dicarbon emissions are new to me.
    extrospection > introspection

    Head type as in being truly head type and probably 7>5. Too divergent, scattered and expressive for typical 5 and that is the preferred way although long term focus usually helps.

  3. #683
    ouronis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    ref to ptr to self
    Posts
    1,031
    Mentioned
    48 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ooo View Post
    @Adam
    why isn't this philosopher a national hero?


    I just fell a bit in love *-*
    He isn't?

  4. #684
    In Transition Raver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    TIM
    Ne-IEE 6w7 sp/sx
    Posts
    3,946
    Mentioned
    111 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Singu View Post
    He's too traditionalist on social issues. "We need strong hierarchies and order, men need to be men, women are chaos (and chaos/change is bad), traditional values like monogamy should be protected, etc".
    Quote Originally Posted by domr View Post
    I'm not extreme leftist but this guy is definitely a right winger, and in a lot of ways a really OG conversative e.g. religion.
    Out of curiosity, I looked up the general consensus online on JBP and classical liberalism and it seems to be that generally speaking aside from a few outliers that think he is a left or right winger that both classical liberalism and JBP are centrist nowadays.

    So I will concede that he is possibly not a left winger, but a centrist instead. However, to say he is a right winger, far right or even centre right is certainly a stretch. I might even possibly be a centrist myself despite having an ample amount of leftist views.

    Regardless, it displays the level of subjectivity and the arbitrary nature of the left wing - right wing dichotomy based on the differing viewpoints from a variety of political stances.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

    Ne-IEE
    6w7 sp/sx
    6w7-9w1-4w5

  5. #685
    In Transition Raver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    TIM
    Ne-IEE 6w7 sp/sx
    Posts
    3,946
    Mentioned
    111 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by domr View Post
    If you are going around talking about how bad the left is and promoting religion then you are right-wing and OG at that. Even the alt-right does not promote religion.
    Well, he is talking about the extreme left specifically and as for being pro religion, I agree that it is generally associated with conservative values and merging the state and religion.

    However, I don't see how even leftists are exempt being pro-religion so it is not a stretch for a centrist to be as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by domr View Post
    Classical liberalism was merely a response to the issues of their day. No one follows 19th century ideology anymore because we have 21st century issues.
    That is why I can buy classical liberalism as being centrist today as modern liberalism has shifted more to the left.

    However, to say classical liberalism is akin to conservatism is inaccurate as they are different.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

    Ne-IEE
    6w7 sp/sx
    6w7-9w1-4w5

  6. #686
    stronger, faster, weirder (BBL) niffer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    TIM
    SLE-Ti-H 8w9 SX/sp
    Posts
    2,159
    Mentioned
    238 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Troll Nr 007 View Post
    Writes CO2 as C02 (yes, with zero).
    LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

    amazing! nice catch!!!!!!
    [Today 07:57 AM] Raver: Life is a ride that lasts very long, but still a ride. It is a dream that we have yet to awaken from.

    It's hard to find a love through every shade of grey.

  7. #687
    In Transition Raver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    TIM
    Ne-IEE 6w7 sp/sx
    Posts
    3,946
    Mentioned
    111 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by domr View Post
    I would love to continue this conversation but I cannot talk to intuitive types that have not developed their sensation.
    By focusing on theory instead of reality, this conversation will not go anywhere.
    Well, my sensing used to be even worse in the past, lol. Anyways, this kind of topic is bound to develop into a theoretical circle jerk of one's own beliefs anyways so I agree that it is a fruitless endeavor for that reason. Almost everyone is guilty of that in some form.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

    Ne-IEE
    6w7 sp/sx
    6w7-9w1-4w5

  8. #688
    Bertrand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    4,534
    Mentioned
    355 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    he's pro religion in the same way Jung is, which is to say the religious establishment looks at him like a gnostic heretic. but he promotes the good side of religion which is to say to find the meaning in mythological interpretations and use it to better the self and the world

  9. #689
    In Transition Raver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    TIM
    Ne-IEE 6w7 sp/sx
    Posts
    3,946
    Mentioned
    111 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by domr View Post
    Again more out of control intuition. There is nothing inherently bad about intuition but you have to be sure that the assumptions you are making at valid, which you are not.
    Even if what you are saying is true, I don't see how that makes you more right than me in this argument. All it means is that you are a better debater, but regardless in the end this is a classic ad hominem distracting from the main point, which is the argument itself.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

    Ne-IEE
    6w7 sp/sx
    6w7-9w1-4w5

  10. #690
    Bertrand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    4,534
    Mentioned
    355 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    I mean the entire premise is that religion isn't bad, and if that appeals to conservatives that's not bad either, because his mode of interpreting religion and explaining why it isn't bad is itself a "liberal" i.e.: higher in openness version of religion, i.e.: a psychological approach to myth. in that way he stands to push religion in a progressive direction, so to characterize him as somehow capitulating or serving "conservative" religious agenda is not accurate. he is in fact planting the seeds for their annihilation inasmuch as the "conservative" agenda is a power structure rooted in the status quo. he doesn't need to "oppose" himself to religion per se, he's simply trying to capture what is good about it and cleave off the rest. this is far better than trying to simply deny the legitimacy of all religious thinking because it alienates a massive swath of people for no good reason (and abandons any accumulated wisdom in the tradition). this goes back to my thing about conflict for its own sake, and not being about that. you don't need to destroy religion when you can take whats good about it and bring it into the 21st century. that's only an "appeal" to conservatives on the most shallow level. its really an appeal to them not in their political capacity but as humans. there's an intersection of mindsets here, but the kill all religion way of thinking is just as conservative inasmuch as its rooted in an essentially 19th century mindset. true that mindset is opposed to a 14th century mindset so superficially appears more progressive, but what peterson stands for is an actual 21st century mindset. this is what people who assume he's just another televangelist get wrong about him

  11. #691
    Singu's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    2,317
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Raver View Post
    Out of curiosity, I looked up the general consensus online on JBP and classical liberalism and it seems to be that generally speaking aside from a few outliers that think he is a left or right winger that both classical liberalism and JBP are centrist nowadays.

    So I will concede that he is possibly not a left winger, but a centrist instead. However, to say he is a right winger, far right or even centre right is certainly a stretch. I might even possibly be a centrist myself despite having an ample amount of leftist views.

    Regardless, it displays the level of subjectivity and the arbitrary nature of the left wing - right wing dichotomy based on the differing viewpoints from a variety of political stances.
    There's no way that this kind of thing is "centrist". He wants to go back to the good ol' days of 50's traditional gender roles, where men were men and women were women, although he does it in a way to pretend that this is all "objective" and "academic" - such as that these traditional gender roles are based on timeless mythologies. Or worse, it somehow has to do with lobsters.



    Bertrand is an extremely confused individual, and that's why he continuously rambles about Socionics and Jordan Peterson on a forum such as this one.
    Inductivism (observation-based process) doesn't work, and cannot work. Things repeated in the past do not necessarily repeat indefinitely in the future.

  12. #692
    Bertrand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    4,534
    Mentioned
    355 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    worrying that he appeals to conservatives is itself a conservative viewpoint in light of peterson's actual message which is to rise above that way of thinking about the issue

    and yeah a 7 year old video of a intuitive thinking type is unhip, news at 11. if people want to disregard the insights he does have because of some corny video that's fine but lets not pretend they're meeting him on the field of ideas. if you watch his actual classroom lectures then you start to get an idea where all this is coming from

  13. #693
    ouronis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    ref to ptr to self
    Posts
    1,031
    Mentioned
    48 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    yeah he's totally a (center) right winger
    Who gives a shit what he is, I was clarifying for Raver since he seemed not to know JP was a racist bible-thumper.

  14. #694
    Bertrand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    4,534
    Mentioned
    355 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    yeah I personally don't care that he's racist or a bible thumper, the important thing is to accurately state where he lies on the right-left spectrum vis-a-vis "classic liberalism"

  15. #695
    ouronis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    ref to ptr to self
    Posts
    1,031
    Mentioned
    48 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bertrand View Post
    yeah I personally don't care that he's racist or a bible thumper, the important thing is to accurately state where he lies on the right-left spectrum vis-a-vis "classic liberalism"
    Gotcha. I don't get it, but there ya go, I suppose.

  16. #696
    stronger, faster, weirder (BBL) niffer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    TIM
    SLE-Ti-H 8w9 SX/sp
    Posts
    2,159
    Mentioned
    238 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Hm. I just voted LII for him earlier but I'm changing my typing of him to EII.

    I find it highly unlikely that an LII would write "C02" with a zero and consistently use data so poorly as squark pointed out earlier on in the thread. Fail Ti role IMO. EII final and confirm.
    [Today 07:57 AM] Raver: Life is a ride that lasts very long, but still a ride. It is a dream that we have yet to awaken from.

    It's hard to find a love through every shade of grey.

  17. #697
    Singu's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    2,317
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think the more you look into Jordan Peterson, the more you'll find that he's a typical chauvinist, a nationalist, a radical right-winger.

    Jordan Peterson quotes:

    “Men have to toughen up,” “Men demand it, and women want it.”

    “consciousness is symbolically masculine and has been since the beginning of time.”

    “the soul of the individual eternally hungers for the heroism of genuine Being.”

    “In the West, we have been withdrawing from our tradition-, religion- and even nation-centred cultures.”

    “Culture, is symbolically, archetypally, mythically male” “Chaos—the unknown—is symbolically associated with the feminine.”

    “feminists avoid criticizing Islam because they unconsciously long for masculine dominance.”

    “Maybe it’s not the world that’s at fault. Maybe it’s you. You’ve failed to make the mark.”

    “Compassion as a vice” “Toughen up, you weasel.”

    “@GreggHurwitz it’s good that you consumed the liquor this time instead of letting some Indian steal it . . .”

    http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/03...ist-mysticism/
    Inductivism (observation-based process) doesn't work, and cannot work. Things repeated in the past do not necessarily repeat indefinitely in the future.

  18. #698
    ooo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    TIM
    EII
    Posts
    1,210
    Mentioned
    83 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ouronis View Post
    He isn't?
    I mean... HE MAKES MUSIC TOO *_* how cool is this!

  19. #699
    fka lungs ashlesha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    TIM
    Fi/Te 6 sp/sx
    Posts
    13,176
    Mentioned
    678 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Default

    I had a couple videos sitting on my youtube front page for awhile with titles like "Peterson DESTROYS hysterical feminists!" that I was quickly scrolling past in disgust for weeks, and last night I finally watched them and wasn't really surprised to find that I didn't feel slapped by ideological bullshit by what he has to say in them, its just that his fanboys frame them in this annoying way and title the videos like that because they're just as assured about his right wing ideology matching theirs as lefties are. Not that there was nothing in those videos I disagreed with. Maybe I'm just so used to triggered and sandwich jokes that being able to mentally engage actual ideas makes me roll over lol.

    Probably where there's smoke there's fire but even if that's the case i don't even see what there is to gain by labeling him as an argument in and of itself.

  20. #700

    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Posts
    127
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Doesnt even find the time to shave before an interviene, cannot close his shit properly, never worked in business and never earned a cent in the real economy, still preaches perfect order and super hard work.
    facical stubble is extremely common in Canada and his facial hair is no-where near out of the common ordinary. so try again, bucko.

  21. #701

    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Posts
    127
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    bertrand, clean your room, bud.

  22. #702
    Hot Message FDG's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Freiburg im Breisgau
    TIM
    ENTj
    Posts
    15,910
    Mentioned
    176 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by timber View Post
    facical stubble is extremely common in Canada and his facial hair is no-where near out of the common ordinary. so try again, bucko.
    r u trying to justify your and peeperson´s laziness?
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  23. #703

    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Posts
    127
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    r u trying to justify your and peeperson´s laziness?
    haha! nooooooooo

    actually i clip my scruff with clippers as close to skin as possible these days.

Page 18 of 18 FirstFirst ... 81415161718

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •