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Thread: SLI or ILI?

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    Default SLI or ILI?

    Let's get to the point

    I am pretty sure I am either SLI or ILI, since I easily identify with Te-Fi axes and having Fe as POLR

    So the problem is mainly about Si vs Ni

    when it comes to Ni I identify with:
    1. have well-developed imaginative abilities and mental wanderings
    2.
    attuned to hidden connections between things
    3.
    easily recognize patterns of events
    but I don't identify with "the
    ability to see through time", true I can tell if for example a project is going to succeed or fail
    but it is not like I can tell if A happened then B will happen or something similar.

    and when it comes to Si I identify with:
    1.
    sensitive to sensations of internal discomfort and dissonance
    2. sensing if
    something is aesthetically out of place
    3.
    take the time to experience pleasurable and soothing sensations
    but I don't identify with being interested in maintaining healthy lifestyle or taking care of your body
    true anyone care about their health but still I prefer to enjoy tasty food plus being lazy makes me fat and I don't think that's a healthy lifestyle

    Also I read that SLIs are
    skeptical but in reinin dichotomies they are "Positivists" how can that be?

    That's all, so what are your thoughts?

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    maybe you could fill out this questionnaire? your answers might help in figuring out your type. welcome to the forum btw!

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...do=form&fid=10

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    my approach (and everyone knows it's done me much good, but actually it doesn't matter because it wouldn't change the results were this not my approach) is to focus on the information elements... not things like reinin.

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    Just from this I want to say ILI > SLI but yeah like @glam said...

    Welcome.

    P.S. ILI can be skeptical too.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    As far as positivism and negativism go, they're not really optimistic vs pessimistic or naive vs cynical or anything. Positivists are oriented more around conversational breadth and negativists to conversational depth. In that way, positivists direct a topic of conversation but have less to do with developing any thesis or argument, which is more the domain of negativists. In this way, positivists create conversational anchor points for the negativist to attach to and develop further.

    An example would be the positivist making an absolutist statement, "private school kids are pompous irritating asswipes", the negativist responding with "they're not all bad, what about Jimmy, Phil and Sandra?". The statement of the positivist may have taken account of that information but found the overwhelming majority of private school kids to be pompous, irritating and also asswipes. The negativist sees that statement from their perspective as lacking depth and 'fill in the gaps' left by the initial statement because of its method of delivery.

    I remember Radio remarking that when a positivist isn't talking (for bad mood or whatever reason), the negativist will provoke conversation in the way of a question like "What's wrong with you? You're awfully quiet." rather than just generating a new conversational topic, which the positivist would do in that situation with another positivist that's gone quiet. Seems like it's easier for two positivists to create conversation, but it'll essentially be two people generating conversational topics over and over at each other and not really ever reaching the point of a proper dialogue, more like two parallel monologues (I have a LSI friend I do this with), especially if both types are also declarers, whereas two negativists would be less talkative amongst each other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    maybe you could fill out this questionnaire? your answers might help in figuring out your type. welcome to the forum btw!

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...do=form&fid=10
    filled http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...onnaire-(Simo)

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    my approach (and everyone knows it's done me much good, but actually it doesn't matter because it wouldn't change the results were this not my approach) is to focus on the information elements... not things like reinin.
    why do you think it is better to focus on information elements not reinin?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Just from this I want to say ILI > SLI but yeah like @glam said...

    Welcome.

    P.S. ILI can be skeptical too.
    what made you think so?

    P.S. yes, but they are negativists so it makes sense

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    what made you think so?

    P.S. yes, but they are negativists so it makes sense
    I compared what you wrote about Ni and Si and the vibe was more Ni base since I could also relate to some of the Si and so did others who I confidently type ILI...iow, just a vibe. Si is the role function in ILI and IEI. You didn't seem to put much emphasis on it, in my perception.

    3. Introverted Sensing

    ILIs generally place moderate to minimal importance on such matters as cleanliness, comfort, and sensory stimuli. Some ILIs may consider them distractions. It is not atypical of ILIs to be completely uninterested by and unable to find any value in something like a fine piece of artwork. Different ILIs respond to different artistic stimuli in different ways; for example, an ILI might think painting is worthless but possess sufficient background to enjoy other media, such as sculpture or music.
    ILIs are often uncertain about the messages they receive from their bodies. An ILI might feel some irregularity in their own body and not realize its significance to the overall functioning of the body. An ILI will often try to determine the consequence of such symptoms through their own understanding of anatomy (or 'google it'), often blowing things out of proportion. An ILI's sense of self doubt may lead to such assumptions as the presence of a brain tumor as the result of a mere headache. In contrast to valuing types, ILIs are significantly less adept at making adjustments to their lifestyle to correct these minor ailments.
    Even so, ILIs are capable of placing a moderate focus on maintaining their physical comfort. ILIs often construct a lifestyle based on various activities that feed their own intellectual stimulation. Though attention to comfort is never a priority, it is not completely ignored, as some attention to it goes hand in hand with their inactive lifestyle. Still, ILIs often neglect the world around them and become consistently mired in their own inertia, and are unlikely to notice that anything is missing.
    ILIs are often hesitant or resistant towards lifestyle changes that threaten the commodiously constructed surroundings that they create for themselves. No one is better suited to opening the ILI for change than the hyperactive SEE, whose flurry of constant activity is seen by the ILI as refreshingly active.
    Edit: The reason I put "did" in italics is that the two ILI, I am confident about, are dead so I can't ask them but I know from years of observation.

    Edit2: "the ability to see through time" is a very arbitrary concept so I wouldn't use it as a deciding factor.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Narc View Post
    As far as positivism and negativism go, they're not really optimistic vs pessimistic or naive vs cynical or anything. Positivists are oriented more around conversational breadth and negativists to conversational depth. In that way, positivists direct a topic of conversation but have less to do with developing any thesis or argument, which is more the domain of negativists. In this way, positivists create conversational anchor points for the negativist to attach to and develop further.

    An example would be the positivist making an absolutist statement, "private school kids are pompous irritating asswipes", the negativist responding with "they're not all bad, what about Jimmy, Phil and Sandra?". The statement of the positivist may have taken account of that information but found the overwhelming majority of private school kids to be pompous, irritating and also asswipes. The negativist sees that statement from their perspective as lacking depth and 'fill in the gaps' left by the initial statement because of its method of delivery.

    I remember Radio remarking that when a positivist isn't talking (for bad mood or whatever reason), the negativist will provoke conversation in the way of a question like "What's wrong with you? You're awfully quiet." rather than just generating a new conversational topic, which the positivist would do in that situation with another positivist that's gone quiet. Seems like it's easier for two positivists to create conversation, but it'll essentially be two people generating conversational topics over and over at each other and not really ever reaching the point of a proper dialogue, more like two parallel monologues (I have a LSI friend I do this with), especially if both types are also declarers, whereas two negativists would be less talkative amongst each other.
    That's very informative, I really appreciate it.
    But it is different from the wiki where it says:

    Positivists

    1. More inclined to optimize already functional systems of things and processes.
    2. "This glass is half-full", "We have already collected $438,000 for that project"
    3. Usually more complimenting than reprimanding.
    4. Socially and intellectually more trusting.
    5. Explains what things are (irrationals) or should be (rationals).

    Negativists

    1. More inclined to solve problems in systems of things and processes.
    2. "This glass is half-empty", "We need $62,000 for that project"
    3. Usually more reprimanding than complimenting.
    4. Socially and intellectually more mistrusting.
    5. Explains what things are not (irrationals) or should not be (rationals).
    The description in the wiki seems to me as they're like optimistic vs pessimistic
    so what do you think?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I compared what you wrote about Ni and Si and the vibe was more Ni base since I could also relate to some of the Si and so did others who I confidently type ILI...iow, just a vibe. Si is the role function in ILI and IEI. You didn't seem to put much emphasis on it, in my perception.



    Edit: The reason I put "did" in italics is that the two ILI, I am confident about, are dead so I can't ask them but I know from years of observation.
    Ok fair enough but I have filled the questionnaire so I would like to see what you think about it

    btw, since you have years of observation, how old are you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    Ok fair enough but I have filled the questionnaire so I would like to see what you think about it

    btw, since you have years of observation, how old are you?
    Well, that is direct. lol

    One of the ILI was my stepdad and I knew him since I was 13. The other was a an ex who died young. You will have to buy me dinner or at the very least have a real conversation with me to get further information.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Well, that is direct. lol

    One of the ILI was my stepdad and I knew him since I was 13. The other was a an ex who died young. You will have to buy me dinner or at the very least have a real conversation with me to get further information.
    It is not like I am really interested to get further information, and you seems to have a curse to kill ILIs anyway so I should keep my distance until I confirm I am not ILI

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    The bitchiness confirms ILI. You are welcome.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    It is not like I am really interested to get further information, and you seems to have a curse to kill ILIs anyway so I should keep my distance until I confirm I am not ILI
    Sounds wise. I was a mortician in a past life so it influences heavily. Apparently I was very good at my work and when things were slow I had ways of drumming up new customers.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    The bitchiness confirms ILI. You are welcome.
    So SLIs aren't bitchy?

    then another reinin question as your punishment for saying I am bitchy:
    ILIs are Decisive but I Consider the working conditions more than the possible results and rewards, so wouldn't that makes me Judicious?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    So SLIs aren't bitchy?

    then another reinin question as your punishment for saying I am bitchy:
    ILIs are Decisive but I Consider the working conditions more than the possible results and rewards, so wouldn't that makes me Judicious?
    SLIs are grumpy bitchy. Your bitchiness seems more of the ILI arrogant bitchiness variety. But of course I have very limited information, so I will keep reading and re-assess later.

    Only SLEs may punish me, sorry.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Sounds wise. I was a mortician in a past life so it influences heavily. Apparently I was very good at my work and when things were slow I had ways of drumming up new customers.
    sound interesting, why don't you share your ways of drumming up new customers, Ms. zombie mortician?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    SLIs are grumpy bitchy. Your bitchiness seems more of the ILI arrogant bitchiness variety. But of course I have very limited information, so I will keep reading and re-assess later.

    Only SLEs may punish me, sorry.
    I didn't know there were variety of bitchiness

    no need to apologize I will bring an army of SLEs to punish you if that's what it takes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    SLIs are grumpy bitchy. Your bitchiness seems more of the ILI arrogant bitchiness variety. But of course I have very limited information, so I will keep reading and re-assess later.

    Only SLEs may punish me, sorry.
    Aww, you not up for a little gamma roleplay?





    I am familiar with arrogance in both SLI and ILI. It comes out in their sense of humor too. SLI can be more goofy, I think, and in the ILI more ironic.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    sound interesting, why don't you share your ways of drumming up new customers, Ms. zombie mortician?
    I lure them into buying me dinner with promises of privileged information of course! AND THEN, the axe. I like to think of myself more like a Lizzy Borden than a zombie. Zombie is @End 's territory. I like my corpses dead and clean, displayed in a presentable fashion. This is not easy to achieve, after the axe, so trust that I have skillz.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    I clicked constructive for Narc's post, but I wasn't sure if it actually defined positivists vs negativists...according to his description I would be more positivist than negativist (which I'm not).
    I've also leaned towards the wiki description in my understanding of both. But truth be told I still get stuck on how to differentiate the two especially among gamma and delta quadras.

    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    That's very informative, I really appreciate it.
    But it is different from the wiki where it says:



    The description in the wiki seems to me as they're like optimistic vs pessimistic
    so what do you think?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    I didn't know there were variety of bitchiness

    no need to apologize I will bring an army of SLEs to punish you if that's what it takes
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    But in all seriousness, you vibe ILI. I will explain later.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I lure them into buying me dinner with promises of privileged information of course! AND THEN, the axe. I like to think of myself more like a Lizzy Borden than a zombie. Zombie is @End 's territory. I like my corpses dead and clean, displayed in a presentable fashion. This is not easy to achieve, after the axe, so trust that I have skillz.
    you definitely have skills. normally if you killed someone with an axe they will be cover in blood which wouldn't be clean, unless you go through to the trouble of cleaning them later
    But what about the dinner? if you killed the guy then do you eat it all by yourself? or do you just leave it? < seriously that would be a waste

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackburry View Post
    I clicked constructive for Narc's post, but I wasn't sure if it actually defined positivists vs negativists...according to his description I would be more positivist than negativist (which I'm not).
    I've also leaned towards the wiki description in my understanding of both. But truth be told I still get stuck on how to differentiate the two especially among gamma and delta quadras.
    I am negativist according to both description < I guess I am a negativist to the core

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    you definitely have skills. normally if you killed someone with an axe they will be cover in blood which wouldn't be clean, unless you go through to the trouble of cleaning them later
    But what about the dinner? if you killed the guy then do you eat it all by yourself? or do you just leave it? < seriously that would be a waste
    It is customary to allow a "dead (wo)man walking" one last meal, of their choice. Women are less expensive, since they eat a bit less, but I charge it to the company so it is a tax write off too.

    As for axing someone, I find one blow to the back of the head, with a smaller axe, sufficient and less clean up. Mortician, remember? It's all in the planning and timing. Wasting time fighting for an acquittal, in a court of law, would be a result of miscalculating on my part. It almost never happens.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    It seems everyone believe I am an ILI, then what do you think about the following?

    In games either strategic or rpg, I usually play more defensively or to be precise a not risk taker
    In strategic games I prefer to build my defenses first and ensure my survivability then start attacking
    In RPGs even though I like classes like assassins but since they have weak defense and HP, so I prefer to use long-range (mages/hunters) or a fighter which is balanced attack/defense
    my brother always say my playing style is very cautious
    so wouldn't that better fit the "Si planning against the future" description?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    It is customary to allow a "dead (wo)man walking" one last meal, of their choice. Women are less expensive, since they eat a bit less, but I charge it to the company so it is a tax write off too.

    As for axing someone, I find one blow to the back of the head, with a smaller axe, sufficient and less clean up. Mortician, remember? It's all in the planning and timing. Wasting time fighting for an acquittal, in a court of law, would be a result of miscalculating on my part. It almost never happens.
    how generous of you then if you are planning to kill me I want a pizza as my last meal, but if I killed you first it is not my problem

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    This is not a cinema, if you have time then I am waiting your explaination

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    This is not a cinema, if you have time then I am waiting your explaination
    Make me.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    It seems everyone believe I am an ILI, then what do you think about the following?

    In games either strategic or rpg, I usually play more defensively or to be precise a not risk taker
    In strategic games I prefer to build my defenses first and ensure my survivability then start attacking
    In RPGs even though I like classes like assassins but since they have weak defense and HP, so I prefer to use long-range (mages/hunters) or a fighter which is balanced attack/defense
    my brother always say my playing style is very cautious
    so wouldn't that better fit the "Si planning against the future" description?
    I think that's actually an N trait. When I play strategy games I do the same thing, and I connect that to ; my impulse is to realize my own potential, rather than outdo the other guy. would probably do a similar thing, but do it because of a focus on avoiding negative outcomes, rather than realizing potential.
    Valued | Devalued
    < | < | Conscious
    < | < | Unconscious

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    Quote Originally Posted by tejing View Post
    I think that's actually an N trait. When I play strategy games I do the same thing, and I connect that to ; my impulse is to realize my own potential, rather than outdo the other guy. would probably do a similar thing, but do it because of a focus on avoiding negative outcomes, rather than realizing potential.
    but wouldn't Si also try to avoid negative outcomes?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    but wouldn't Si also try to avoid negative outcomes?
    3. Introverted Intuition

    SLIs cannot stand being hurried and prodded by other people to do things faster. If there is a real reason to move faster, they want to be told the reason rather than be fed feelings of anxiety, which paralyses them rather than spurring them to action. SLIs know that sometimes there is more to something than meets the eye, and are aware of their intense focus on the immediate present moment.

    SLIs try to reject all feelings of anxiety and insecurity about the future and simply accept what is. They often entertain doubts and worries about what the future might bring, but they try to keep them to themselves and present a positive, optimistic facade. SLIs tend to simplify the future, putting less importance about what is to come. As a result they can be oblivious to the consequences of their actions. They appreciate people who are genuine optimists and are able to make provision for many different outcomes even as they enthusiastically pursue just a few opportunities (leading types).

    as a role (3rd) function (SEI and SLI)

    The individual is able to turn his attention to longer-term implications and personal imagination but only for brief periods; his natural preference is to concentrate on the immediate surroundings and sensations, or on the job at hand. If poorly developed, this function can lead him to extensively plan his future while failing to evaluate his reasons for doing so.

    http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=SLI

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    Make me.
    If you have useful information you would have said it already but I guess you mainly depend on your gut feeling or vibe like Aylen does

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    Quote Originally Posted by tejing View Post
    I think that's actually an N trait. When I play strategy games I do the same thing, and I connect that to ; my impulse is to realize my own potential, rather than outdo the other guy. would probably do a similar thing, but do it because of a focus on avoiding negative outcomes, rather than realizing potential.
    I see.

    I know that I suck with excessive micro and that's why I almost always play annoyingly defensive. My first instinct is to always outlast the enemy.

    With that said, wouldn't that be Se rather than Ne? Meaning, you spotted the reality about yourself, rather than potential. Maybe I've been wrong the whole time, who knows?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    If you have useful information you would have said it already but I guess you mainly depend on your gut feeling or vibe like Aylen does
    I was actually just too busy to do a write-up, but now I think I don't want to bother anymore. I am sure you will figure it out.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I was actually just too busy to do a write-up, but now I think I don't want to bother anymore. I am sure you will figure it out.
    too busy looks like an excuse to me if you said lazy I would have believed you, but are you sure you are an IEE? I think EIE fits better

    P.S. I am going to sleep so see you tomorrow

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simo View Post
    too busy looks like an excuse to me if you said lazy I would have believed you, but are you sure you are an IEE? I think EIE fits better
    I wish
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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