Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Weak Ni and substance abuse

  1. #1

    Default Weak Ni and substance abuse

    Is there any correlation between substance abuse and weak Ni? I ask because I know several Ni doms who have no difficulty quitting smoking, drinking, etc. They seem to be immune to addiction.

  2. #2
    Pookie's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    TIM
    IEI-Ni 6w5-9-2 So/Sx
    Posts
    2,125
    Mentioned
    89 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Definitely not immune, but I think IEI has odd advantages in stopping(even if addicted). For one, we are the laziest IP. We may be addicted to cigarettes, but we're even more addicted to just not leaving the house. Also, we dont make connections and network as prevelantly, so if we want to continue our illegal drug habits theres less people we can hit up to get it.

    Weak Ni on the other hand probably has many more options in getting it, and often feel like going out and doing stuff. That puts them right in the line of fire.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If it’s a disease, it’s nobody’s fault. Yay empiricism.

  3. #3
    Muddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    1,220
    Mentioned
    67 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Well I have strong Ni and I've taken absolutely zero drugs, so more reinforcement for your theory.
    Last edited by Muddy; 08-28-2015 at 11:00 PM.

  4. #4
    Adam Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Midwest, USA
    TIM
    ENTJ-1Te 8w7 sx/so
    Posts
    2,524
    Mentioned
    374 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    I'm only Ni-creative, but do have fairly strong Ni, and I've taken every drug you can imagine that is not administered through needles by amateurs. It was all just for the hell of it, to see how weird things could get. (Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas was hilarious. I could totally relate, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2pgWsYSyUA, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOmtVFQ3WF8) Once I took it to the limit and saw what was there, I simply stopped and went on to the next thing. That may be 8w7, tho.
    I will say that, in my experience, while I've quit everything (basically, because I ran out of stuff to try), not everything was equally easy to quit. The most powerful stuff was easiest, the weakest stuff the hardest. I don't plan to give up caffeine or oxygen.

    I talked to an ESI-Se (with weak Ni) about drugs, and she was fascinated by them but didn't do them. (Which is good. Not everyone is an experimentalist who needs to hit their hand with a hammer to figure out that nerves work.) When I asked her why she was fascinated by drugs, it turns out we were interested in them for the same reasons; that is, we both looked at them as a way to open a portal into a new world. (We both love to travel to other countries and immerse ourselves in strange cultures. She, because she is counterphobic, me, just for the hell of it.)

    I found that drugs do open a portal to a new world, but it is a world that is only visible because you are now viewing something that is very familiar through senses which are no longer functioning in the way they have evolved to see the world. Drugs take away your ability to perceive the world (of course! Circuits quit working, subroutines fall away, entire processing areas of the brain shut down - it is amazing to experience) but it is possible to infer from the standpoint of loss, what might exist if you had instead gained. In other words, they establish an axis, while most people believe they live on a point.

    It is obvious that we do not see the world as it is. (Even beyond the differences of type, although this forum gives you some hints as to how others see the world differently.) Quantum mechanics has been around since the dawn of time and works everywhere, and we absolutely cannot get an intuitive understanding of how it works. The equations work perfectly all the time and in every case, but our intuition does not give us a clue as to why they work. This is a case of a failure of our perceptions to see the world "correctly" (impartially, that is, rather than survival-optimized), not of the Universe hiding things from us.

    Toward answering your question, I've been thinking of all the types of people I know who have "abused" substances, and there doesn't seem to be a pattern that I can see. My SLI father chain-smoked all his life, then simply quit one day. Never seemed to miss it. My SLI ex-wife smoked a pack a day since she was 16, then tried to quit six times and succeeded on the seventh, but says she misses it every day. I, myself (Te-dom), seem to be immune to addiction.
    Finding a correlation (or not) between substance abuse and weak Ni and being able to quit on a dime may be a problem for the Ti-doms, who never met a rational correlation problem they didn't like.
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 08-02-2015 at 05:12 PM.

  5. #5
    Adam Strange's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Midwest, USA
    TIM
    ENTJ-1Te 8w7 sx/so
    Posts
    2,524
    Mentioned
    374 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddytextures View Post
    Well I'm Ni dom and I've taken absolutely zero drugs, so more reinforcement for your theory.
    Not starting is not the same as quitting.

  6. #6
    Muddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    1,220
    Mentioned
    67 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    In my experience Ep types seem the most likely to get addicted to drugs. SLEs are alcoholics, ILEs are potheads, IEEs do under-the-counter, SEEs take whatever the fuck they can get their hands on.
    Last edited by Muddy; 08-28-2015 at 11:00 PM.

  7. #7
    blue hummingbird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Indonesia
    TIM
    EII-Ne
    Posts
    45
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It's probably due to evolution-involution or process-result. Here's what Victor Gulenko says in "Forms of Cognition":

    Evolutionary types recover more slowly from stress than Involutionary types. Their inhibitory processes are less amenable to conscious control than their excitatory processes, hence their tendency to dwell on personal issues. After being pulled in by any process, they are often unable to get out of it. Which can lead to gambling, drug use, alcoholism, or other vices, even Internet-addiction.

    Consequently, susceptibility to conditioning is higher in Evolutionary types than in Involutionary types. Conditioned responses require movement along a single path, without possibility of turning around or deviating from the imposed route. One of the inhibitory mechanisms of conditioning is phobia (obsessive fear). Imagine not being able to rid yourself of thinking you will definitely fall on a slippery road. This is an example of a phobia. And then you actually do end up falling, even if wearing mountain-climbing boots. According to my observations, Involutionary types do not seriously suffer such phobias.

    Thus, Involutionary types more rapidly and less painfully get rid of illusions, imposed opinions, suggested thoughts, fanatic states, etc. It is because of Evolution–Involution differences that quadras are split rings of social progress are formed.
    I'm not a native English speaker. I apologise for any grammatical mistake, and feedback/correction is always welcome!

  8. #8
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    5,983
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    you could just as easily argue that strong Si (i.e. the correlate of weak Ni) is about not throwing poison into your body. an example of how people think they get away with claiming anything in this rickety shack of a theory.

  9. #9
    summerprincess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    US
    TIM
    IEI 4w3 sx/sp
    Posts
    517
    Mentioned
    35 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    Definitely not immune, but I think IEI has odd advantages in stopping(even if addicted). For one, we are the laziest IP. We may be addicted to cigarettes, but we're even more addicted to just not leaving the house. Also, we dont make connections and network as prevelantly, so if we want to continue our illegal drug habits theres less people we can hit up to get it.

    Weak Ni on the other hand probably has many more options in getting it, and often feel like going out and doing stuff. That puts them right in the line of fire.
    This resonates with me. If I am in fact IEI it would make sense in this case because I mean, I love going out/partying/having fun but I don't have a large social circle and I'd rather just relax than be doing drugs all the time. Also they make me really paranoid that I'm gonna die, even things like painkillers. I have done hard drugs once or twice before but I'm really too conscious of my well-being to do them more.

  10. #10
    Owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    TIM
    NF
    Posts
    784
    Mentioned
    84 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Well I am suppoused to have strong Ni and I tend to be fairly pleasure seeking and stimuli seeking. I've been trying to quit smoking for a while with no results really, I tend to always just choose the easiest, most comfortable way that produces most of the possible pleassure... So I am not really an addiction fighter, unless it's something really serious. I blame Si being my hidden agenda.
    INFP
    4w3-5w6-1w9
    Hyper introverted extrovert
    Melancholic

  11. #11
    The sleeping beauty Velvet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    302
    Mentioned
    13 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think both Ni egos and Ni seekers can turn out substance dependent, just in a different way.

  12. #12
    The Iniquitous inumbra's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    TIM
    954
    Posts
    5,989
    Mentioned
    70 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    whatever type i am, it's difficult for me to become substance dependent, and i think it's because i approach substances with a purpose, and one that they can only provide for so long. i haven't really tried many, but the point is always exploring my psychological and emotional depths... and substances eventually fail to give you as much as they did in the beginning, either because you gained the information sought, or because the body adapts to them to the extent that it's too much of a pain to continue to "indulge." they just short themselves out eventually.

    however, i avoid some because i fear their addictive powerz - generally the ones that seem to hook a lot of their users.

    cigarettes/tobacco, for example - it's been a never ending stream of "i'm trying to quit" throughout my entire life (it's so difficult for people to do that it even becomes a running gag). i know some people can just give them up really fast, but from what i've observed it's a small minority. this puts them on my 'do not try' list. and honestly, i can't think of any way i'd benefit from them.

    anyway, i guess i think anyone could use their functions to avoid addictions or to motivate/inspire themselves to break established addictions. my approach is to avoid reaching the point of addiction in the first place, but i wouldn't go so far as to say i cannot get addicted (the greater the pride, the greater the fall, after all...)

    i know from reading that the brain responds and molds its chemistry to substances... so it's also possible if one tries things here and there, and comes back to some of them again many years later, and this process just goes on... that addiction could settle in much later in time (like after about 20-30 years of these kinds of practices... and you might think you're "invincible" when you've been slowly going in the direction of addiction to something all along...)

    i suppose the other thing i run into is the question of if i really want to destroy myself. because there are less awful and more immediate ways to do it, if that's the case.

    lastly, ever since i learned about the concept of addiction as a child, i've paid a lot of attention to addiction stories, whether fictional or "real" because i knew i didn't want that to happen to me; building these associations is like building up a shield of protection.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •