Regions in which a certain quadra is majority

[1981slater]

Alpha

United States of America
Canada
Ireland
Korea

Beta:

Russia
Eastern Europe
South America
Africa

Gamma

Western Europe

Delta

Northern Europe
Japan
Australia

[Contra]

All I know is that it feels like Betas and Deltas are plentiful in the US. I'd say Alphas are a somewhat close runner up. Gammas seem sparse here, but maybe there is some sort of bias at work.

[Pookie]

I think culturally you can have the bias present. But amongst people themselves, I'd side with the law of averages and say its an even spread over a large population.

[darya]

Distribution of types has to be very similar across countries (form my observation delta ST's and alpha SF's are in abundance, while Beta NF's and gamma NT's seem very rare), it's more of a big city/rural area difference. And also values that are different from country to country, so as a whole the country has certain quadra spirit, not more individuals of said quadra.

Balkan region is very Beta in values. Si, Te and Fi are more devalued the more south you go.

[The Exception]

I always thought the United States was more beta/gamma, SLE/LIE like, Canada was more delta-ish.

North Korea- unhealthy beta LSI dictatorship

[strangeling]

United states is a pretty big place and varies from many different extremes to everything in the middle. So I'm sure you're all right.

[Words]

Alpha

United States of America
Canada
Ireland
Korea

Beta:

Russia
Eastern Europe
South America
Africa

Gamma

Western Europe

Delta

Northern Europe
Japan
Australia

I think you will find they are evenly distributed ahem.

Edit: Oh wait, I thought this was a joke, it's not.

What about Spain?

[ouronis]

I wouldn't say gamma are sparse...just not as immediately noticeable. They're all in their offices making power plays, navigating stupid rules, assuring their positions are good

Also I notice a trend where you've placed shitty places to live as Beta, and America's former lapdogs as Delta(assuming you include Germany as Northern Europe).

[darya]

Also I notice a trend where you've placed shitty places to live as Beta, and America's former lapdogs as Delta(assuming you include Germany as Northern Europe).

As a Beta I'd much rather live in "shitty" and chaotic South America than in Japan or US (except NYC), tyvm : )

[ouronis]

As a Beta I'd much rather live in "shitty" and chaotic South America than in Japan or US (except NYC), tyvm : )

Well, have fun with that. I wasn't really speaking about South America, though, as I don't know much about it. I do know there are some good places to live though,along with the slums. I'm sure that's true about all those places, but in general, in those places any one person is going to have less of a chance of having an affluent life(in some absolute standard, as opposed to relative).

[darya]

Well, have fun with that. I wasn't really speaking about South America, though, as I don't know much about it. I do know there are some good places to live though,along with the slums. I'm sure that's true about all those places, but in general, in those places any one person is going to have less of a chance of having an affluent life(in some absolute standard, as opposed to relative).

Lol, I'm having fun with it every day since I was born Yes, people are on average poorer in these areas. They don't seem any less happy or neurotic on average though.

Just don't see the supposed obvious correlation between shitty and poorer.

[ouronis]

Lol, I'm having fun with it every day since I was born Yes, people are on average poorer in these areas. They don't seem any less happy or neurotic on average though.

Just don't see the supposed obvious correlation between shitty and poorer.

Affluent means more than poor, I suppose. It has more to do with the standard of living you experience than the money in your pocket. Think important things like health, education, etc. I'm not saying you can't be happy with the place you've carved out for yourself in those societies, because trust me, I would kill to live in a less neurotic place(or just...be less neurotic lol). Affluence is not measured by how many Starbucks or Panera Breads there are, it's how much of the bullshit of life has turned positive. If you want to PM me, I'm actually pretty curious to hear what daily life is like in South America, but I think I'd rather not derail this thread further.

[darya]

Affluent means more than poor, I suppose. It has more to do with the standard of living you experience than the money in your pocket. Think important things like health, education, etc. I'm not saying you can't be happy with the place you've carved out for yourself in those societies, because trust me, I would kill to live in a less neurotic place(or just...be less neurotic lol). Affluence is not measured by how many Starbucks or Panera Breads there are, it's how much of the bullshit of life has turned positive. If you want to PM me, I'm actually pretty curious to hear what daily life is like in South America, but I think I'd rather not derail this thread further.

Agreed, basic needs have to be met otherwise life is pretty shitty. I'm not from S America though, unfortunately : ) I'm from Eastern Europe (or is it technically Central - well, not first world by gdp anyway).

[Pookie]

Theres some old thread on the quadra dominances per country.

I believe USA was gamma and now is transitioning to delta. Makes a bit of sense with Delta having the sustainment notion associated with them. Beta had the revolutions in the 60-70's. Moved into Gamma before and during the economic boom (bubble?) and now we seem to be moving away from growth economically and into the sustainment of our quality of life. I think Obama put in some good work economically for the future (ESI I believe) but I think the next Republican in office will try to dismantle alot of that in favor of immediate benefit, which is more of a judicious thing. Probably fall right back into delta.



I believe it goes something akin to -
Alpha pushes ideas into the cultural consciousness to improve society
Beta uses that as fuel to restructure the system and quo
Gamma sharpens and refines the system to get the maximum benefit
Delta sustains the system to keep it functional for as long as possible.

Then something like widespread racism or some other giant problem fuels Alpha back into motion and starts the cycle anew.

[Myst]

I wouldn't say gamma are sparse...just not as immediately noticeable. They're all in their offices making power plays, navigating stupid rules, assuring their positions are good

Also I notice a trend where you've placed shitty places to live as Beta, and America's former lapdogs as Delta(assuming you include Germany as Northern Europe).

Germany is Western/Central Europe

Agreed, basic needs have to be met otherwise life is pretty shitty. I'm not from S America though, unfortunately : ) I'm from Eastern Europe (or is it technically Central - well, not first world by gdp anyway).

You are in Central Europe like me

[ouronis]

Germany is Western/Central Europe



You are in Central Europe like me

I've seen it referred to as either

[Suz]

Theres some old thread on the quadra dominances per country.

I believe USA was gamma and now is transitioning to delta. Makes a bit of sense with Delta having the sustainment notion associated with them. Beta had the revolutions in the 60-70's. Moved into Gamma before and during the economic boom (bubble?) and now we seem to be moving away from growth economically and into the sustainment of our quality of life. I think Obama put in some good work economically for the future (ESI I believe) but I think the next Republican in office will try to dismantle alot of that in favor of immediate benefit, which is more of a judicious thing. Probably fall right back into delta.



I believe it goes something akin to -
Alpha pushes ideas into the cultural consciousness to improve society
Beta uses that as fuel to restructure the system and quo
Gamma sharpens and refines the system to get the maximum benefit
Delta sustains the system to keep it functional for as long as possible.

Then something like widespread racism or some other giant problem fuels Alpha back into motion and starts the cycle anew.

Curious, pookie, now 3 years later, do you still think the US is transitioning to delta?

[Pookie]

Curious, pookie, now 3 years later, do you still think the US is transitioning to delta?

Yes. Though Trump is doing some beta things fed off of the fuel of people's resentment, the status quo is virtually impossible to break at this point short of a widespread desire for restructuring.

But the alpha notion with the greatest push is resentment, and that's feeding into the status quo.

[Spermatozoa]

Some countries I've been to

Alpha: (Merry, Judicious)
Portugal
USA (West)

Beta: (Merry, Decisive)
Australia
Italy
Russia

Gamma: (Serious, Decisive)
Austria
Netherlands
USA (Northeast)

Delta: (Serious, Judicious)
Canada
New Zealand
USA (Midwest & South)

[wasp]

these are sociotypes, not quadras, but they're interesting nonetheless. I think it was @HERO who pointed out that most of the country-sociotype connections people were making on their own, matched up with what the website below suggested for best-fit sociotypes for the same countries.

Americans: logical-intuitive extravert [ENTj]
Armenians: ethical-sensory extravert [ESFj]
Arabs: ethical-intuitive extravert [ENFj]
Argentina: ethical-sensory extravert [ESFj]
Australians: sensory-logical introvert [ISTp]
Azeri: sensory-ethical introvert [ISFp]
Belarussians: ethical-intuitive introvert [INFj]
Brazilians: sensory-ethical ...vert [?SFp]
Bulgarians: sensory-ethical introvert [ISFp]
Canadians: logical (or ethical)-intuitive introvert [IN?j]
Chechens: sensory-logical extravert [ESTp]
Czekh: logical-intuitive introvert [INTj]
Chinese: logical-sensory introvert [ISTj]
Danish: ethical-sensory introvert [ISFj]
English: logical-sensory extravert [ESTj]
Finns: sensory-logical introvert [ISTp]
French: ethical-sensory extravert [ESFj]
Georgians (Caucasus): sensory-ethical extravert [ESFp]
Germans: logical-sensory introvert [ISTj]
Indians (Hindu): intuitive-ethical introvert [INFp]
Irish: intuitive-ethical introvert [INFp]
Italians: sensory-ethical extravert [ESFp]
Jews (Europe, USA): intuitive-logical extravert [ENTp]
Jews (Israel): intuitive-ethical extravert [ENFp]
Koreans: ethical-sensory introvert [ISFj]
Mexicans: intuitive-ethical introvert [INFp]
Norwegians: logical-intuitive extravert [ENTj]
Poles: ethical-intuitive extravert [ENFj]
Portuguese: sensory-ethical introvert [ISFp]
Romanians: intuitive-ethical extravert [ENFp]
Russians: intuitive-ethical introvert [INFp]
Serbians: sensory-logical extravert [ESTp]
Spanish: intuitive-ethical extravert [ENFp]
Swedes: logical-intuitive introvert [INTj]
Swiss: ethical-sensory introvert [ISFj]
Turks: sensory-logical extravert [ESTp]
Ukrainians: ethical-sensory introvert [ISFj]

(thanks to @HERO on this thread who borrowed it from this source)

[Delilah]

Interesting. I know the US has been mostly pegged as LIE, but i read Startiyevskaya (sp?) or someone who said EII for the US. This author (if it was her) discussed a bit how the EII authors like Dostoevsky are popular in the US among others things that i don't recall.

[The Reality Denialist]

Lots of Turks what I have seen seem to have this SLE like style
Russians do have IEI style and illogical actions. They also like powerful people.
Certain Germans seem to be quite LSI regardless of type.


I have similar strenghts and weaknesses as Jews regarding cognitive profile. I'm not related.

[Tim]

Some countries I've been to

Alpha: (Merry, Judicious)
Portugal
USA (West)

Beta: (Merry, Decisive)
Australia
Italy
Russia

Gamma: (Serious, Decisive)
Austria
Netherlands
USA (Northeast)

Delta: (Serious, Judicious)
Canada
New Zealand
USA (Midwest & South)

I would switch Australia and the American South. I would typed Australia as Delta with some SEE elements (Mateship + Gamma Individualism). Meanwhile, I would typed the American South as Beta with some ESE elements (Aristocratic Social Hierarchy + ESE Southern Hospitality). I think LSI + Fe lead makes sense for the Deep South. They're nothing like the Midwest. Emotional expression is encouraged in the Deep South as opposed to the polite and hardworking Delta Midwest.

The Deep South is full of military volunteers, religious fanatics, Q-Anon conspiracy theorists, and are known to be more violent than the rest of America. It was founded as a slave-based feudal aristocratic regions with a revenge-based culture of honor (a European Christian version of Pashtun and Chechen culture of honor) and the effect of this lasted to this day. To Midwesterners and even those in the West Coast, we're perceived as very emotionally expressive and this indicate Fe valuing. The African-American community (who is Southern in spirit) became Se base because of the rednecks and the planters in the Deep South.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

US as a whole is obviously very Gamma, "listen to this LIE because they are a LIE" type of thing. Although I agree with Pookie that we are moving more into a Delta era of stability. Cancel culture seems really Delta, if something is a little bit Satanic/'The Abyss' it's not allowed although now that might be changing and maybe we are kinda transitioning into Alpha again but nahhh I still think we are in the Delta phase. Biden's team of Alphas is trying to move it towards Alpha but I don't think he's there yet. US is so goddamn Gamma- they are so outnumbered!

If you wanna talk about 2D Te, a lot of businesses with those sorta half-heartedly valuing Fe kooky Simpsons-y names on the side of a road that are semi-successful are the epitome of 2D gamma Te, and America just has tons of those. It doesn't have much of 'true beauty' and magic- which is what Beta really is, the pure romance quality- so we are like pure magic and the best. It does have like the 4d Te corporate business buildings in the big city that are gray and lifeless but 'efficient' - but also in smaller towns it's filled with like 2D Te laundromats and stuff- I just saw a bunch of SEEs at the 2D Te laundromat myself.

USA also has a lot of rural Delta crap where literally nothing at all is happening, it's just dead inside but people are still strongly believing God is going to make it right one day so they don't care that it's nothing like I would. Just endless cornfields of heterosexuality and grim blackness and people praying for Trump. Jesus Fucking Christ, how moronic- but to each their own. It makes Mel Gibson cry deeply in a patriotic way. It makes me throw up and run away to the city where something- anything- is actually happening.

There's not much Beta at all, so no wonder I don't like to go out exploring much- but I mean, some college towns are at least kinda cutsey Alpha Fe in a way that I can somewhat tolerate and stomach, but I wish they were allowed to be more edgy and Beta like without getting into legal trouble for it lol.

[Braingel]

US as a whole is obviously very Gamma, "listen to this LIE because they are a LIE" type of thing. Although I agree with Pookie that we are moving more into a Delta era of stability. Cancel culture seems really Delta, if something is a little bit Satanic/'The Abyss' it's not allowed although now that might be changing and maybe we are kinda transitioning into Alpha again but nahhh I still think we are in the Delta phase.

If you wanna talk about 2D Te, a lot of businesses with those sorta half-heartedly valuing Fe kooky Simpsons-y names on the side of a road that are semi-successful are the epitome of 2D gamma Te, and America just has tons of those. It doesn't have much of 'true beauty' and magic- which is what Beta really is, the pure romance quality- so we are like pure magic and the best. It does have like the 4d Te corporate business buildings in the big city that are gray and lifeless but 'efficient' - but also in smaller towns it's filled with like 2D Te laundromats and stuff- I just saw a bunch of SEEs at the 2D Te laundromat myself.

USA also has a lot of rural Delta crap where literally nothing at all is happening, it's just dead inside but people are still strongly believing God is going to make it right one day so they don't care that it's nothing like I would. Just endless cornfields of heterosexuality and grim blackness and people praying for Trump. Jesus Fucking Christ, how moronic- but to each their own. It makes Mel Gibson cry deeply in a patriotic way. It makes me throw up and run away to the city where something- anything- is actually happening.

There's not much Beta at all, so no wonder I don't like to go out exploring much- but I mean, some college towns are at least kinda cutsey Alpha Fe in a way that I can somewhat tolerate and stomach, but I wish they were allowed to be more edgy and Beta like without getting into legal trouble for it lol.

I hate being American.. I would not if I resided in small mountain town or in some spiritual haven, though.

[Braingel]

I would not hate living here if I lived in say, Sedona..

When I get older and gain self-sufficiency, I want do away with where I currently and am to about, reside.

[Braingel]

I hope by 25-26, I can live where wanting to. And by then hope have all my books publicized.

[Braingel]

People are quick say how lucky one is to not have live in third-world country.. But our nations are not well, either. To me, it is like comparing cancer to shingles. Cancer may be "worse", but some still may live with cancer, and some may decease from their shingles. Both can kill, just in differential way.

[AWellArmedCat]

Lol I'm glad I'm not the only one convinced Japan is a Delta society

[Braingel]

Lol I'm glad I'm not the only one convinced Japan is a Delta society

It most certainly is delta. Delta and maybe IEI... I always have viewed IEI as the least beta-like of any beta Quadra.

[AWellArmedCat]

I always have viewed IEI as the least beta-like of any beta Quadra.

I think it depends. I feel like I'm maybe more stereotypically beta than a lot of IEIs are, but generally I think you're correct

[ContractedCriminalboy]

Why is every Beta country a shithole, minus the LSI ones?

[FreelancePoliceman]

Why is every Beta country a shithole, minus the LSI ones?

Hard times make hard people?

[Aster]

Hard times make hard people?

I like this. It’s very true.

[Braingel]

Why is every Beta country a shithole, minus the LSI ones?

LSI is most organized. The extroverted betas are more intense and want exude more stimulation which can make issue, and then IEI with Te PolR and 1D Se is too gentle and cannot assert with as much ease, unless there are other factors at stake like enneagram type or subtype.

[Braingel]

I think it depends. I feel like I'm maybe more stereotypically beta than a lot of IEIs are, but generally I think you're correct

Well, IEI has the weakest Se, and Se is integral part of the beta Quadra. This probably is of why.. But Fe and contact subs of IEI can be more stereotypically beta, and even appear as superficially EIE, as my own self.

SO many people mistype me EIE, until they actually get know me or meet me in person.

My Sedecology is testimonial to this:https://www.sedecology.com/subjects/8530

But I am not one.. I am not process, I am not 1D Ti, and I do not ignore Fi..

Only people really skilled in Socionics right away catch me as IEI, or people who have met up with me in person:
Skilled Socionist.png

[Adam Strange]

Why is every Beta country a shithole, minus the LSI ones?

Selection bias.

[Baqer]

There's a whole lotta ways you can type countries, but the best way would probably be looking at general cultures or culture groups. The general thing with assigning types/quadras to big entities like states is the fact that you have to more or less translate the jungian functions into something that actually makes sense for something like a state or culture. There are definitely functions that translate reasonably well, at least for the modern world, like Se being centered around the strength of the military or general predisposition towards violence. The reason I'd personally say socionics is more applicable to culture than states is the fact that countries are made of interlocking systems which don't really have much of a basis in human psychology or interaction, meaning that any connections is does have are extremely flexible and surface level. Something like culture on the hand is directly made through the general consciousness of a group of people, making it based on what outside influences do to influence different parts of the individual people and the culture as a whole. A war for example, in terms of the function of a state has no obvious connection to human psychology other than something like game theory or strategy, which don't lie within socionics at all, but for a culture which in inside a war, the course during/before the war could cause people to either support it or be against it, and be easily tied to the level of Se.

Important Notes:
1: Cultures typically have states or nations to organize and rally around, meaning that while these will functions can run through a state, they originate in the cultural consciousness
2: These traits can show up inside a culture between smaller groups, and inside those groups, until eventually reaching the final level of individual. These describe how they appear in a large group like a culture, but how clear cut they are depends on the social cohesion of the group(which is naturally higher in smaller groups like a family, and further dependent on how united the group is able to through outside pressure or internal gravity)
3: Definition for culture/group which this applies and how they can have types: A group of people who would have certain functions accentuated when they act as a group because of variations in how much a function from individuals can show itself inside the wider culture.

So, for actual definitions of each function and their representation in a culture:

Se - Predisposition to violence/Physical means of protection, dependent on perceived danger from outside forces, low point would be the complete lack of any protection(think somewhere like Iceland or new Zealand, isolated and basing all protection off the US), high point would be intense focus on force and protecting themselves(Think Switzerland for defensive through fear of strong neighbors, and and Nazi Germany for off offensive through the idea of Lebensraum)
Si - Health of individuals, general attention to the functioning of smaller sectors of the culture(Basically anything that can be described health, be it institutional, social, or literal, and awareness of how well they're functioning), low point would be an emphasis on workaholism(as in the case of a LIE Si polr society, how an EIE Si polr culture exists would take looking into specific subcultures, as I don't think there are any major nations which have a culture predominantly EIE), high point would be somewhere with a welfare state(at least in a higher in come culture)

(Bonus talanov functions because I like them and want everyone to use them)
De - Tolerance for other cultures, general not giving a shit about them. General wish for equality between all cultures, open to mixing and merging with other groups and cultures.
Di - Subservience culture, preference for hierarchy, will typically be strengthened in urban civilizations(Such as china or Latin America, where power is concentrated mostly in cities) as opposed to more rural civilizations(such as northern colonial america and nomadic horse tribes, where central control, and therefore hierarchy, made less sense.)
Qe - Intolerance for other groups or cultures, superiority complex and general feeling of disgust towards other cultures. Strengthened through something like nationalism, common trait of western European empires, such as Britain, in which the people in the homeland were placed above all other ethnic groups(as opposed to previous empires, in which a small elite would rule over a home people who wouldn't be much richer on average than outsiders)
Qi - "Guilt" based culture, ability to reflect critically upon the culture, low point being somewhere like China, where after thousands of years of dominance have developed a superiority complex for themselves, and the high point being the general Western European culture.(Note, Guilt vs. Shame based culture technically is a separate system which has to do with personal guilt/shame, there does seem to be a connection that guilt cultures tend to criticize their own cultures, which could be seen as an extension of the self, more than shame based cultures, which would see it as "attacking" their culture/community)

Uhhh, so i did these functions out of order, so i've gotten these 6 done for tonight. I'll do the other 6 tommorow and might analyze a nation or two with it.

[FreelancePoliceman]

I don't know about "majority," but my impression is that the dominant culture in the States has been traditionally Delta, and has been shifting or have shifted to Gamma. That is, there used to be much more moral authoritarianism combined with a more communal mentality that's been slowly receding for decades in favor of a more tolerant, but colder society where communal ties aren't valued. I don't think hardly anyone particularly takes pride in their nationality anymore, for instance, and there's a sense of overwhelming cynicism in pop culture.

Unvalued Ne for sure -- again, look at pop culture: movies, music, whatever; it's all the same shit over and over. Star Wars, Star Trek, The Simpsons are all still going despite a general acknowledgement that they've become shit, and there's no indication they'll ever stop. The same cookie-cutter apartments and homes keep getting built out of shitty materials that are designed to break down in, at most, 10 years. No new ideas in politics either; it's widely acknowledged that all levels of government are corrupt and no one seems to believe the situation will ever improve. The idea of Congress holding an inquiry on COINTELPRO or any other illegal intelligence ops, for instance, seems absurdly far-fetched.
@BandD I am very curious how you see the States becoming more stable.

[Rebelondeck]

The spread is equivalent across all societies and cultures with S-types forming the biggest grouping followed by F-types. The questions that should be asked are: what particular sets of behaviours do various cultures or sub-cultures hold in high regard, and what types do these behaviours match? These types would likely have the highest statistical probability of becoming leaders, idols and or role models in that culture, and the majority of people will try to imitate many of the behaviours due to social pressure.

a.k.a. I/O